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A Birdacious Battle! Brave Bird VS Sky Attack!! (1076)

Lord Starfish

Fond of owls
Imagine being this far in SM and expecting anything but a comedy battle. I feel the only serious battle this serious was Ash vs Misty and it could be due to they never had a serious battle in OS so that was to take up for it. If SM had more serious and legit battles and saved the comedy for outside of battles maybe people would be more into it. Sadly battles are season 1 style this series.
Sure. Sun & Moon has nothing but gag battles...
That is, aside from both matches between Satoshi and Kapu-Kokeko, all the Trials and Grand Trials (maybe except the Dekagoose one, I honestly forgot how that went), both his previous fights with Gladio, every battle with Sauboh in the Aether arc before the character became pure comic relief, Lilie & Gladio VS Totem Jararanga, all the Ultra Space battles except the one with Hissatsu no Moku Shoot, the battles with Necrozma, Satoshi VS Guzma, Guzma VS Ilima, Suiren VS Mao, Mamane VS Matsurika, Gladio VS Kojiro...

Just off the top of my head. While not all of these fights may have been all that good, the story did still treat them appropriately seriously.
 

Mag Prime

The Pokemon Avenger
But Ash never made any contact with Rowlet.

I guess I should rewatch this bit, I thought Ash was the one who flipped Rowlett over.

EDIT: You are correct, Rowlett flipped on its own. My bad there.

...then Ash ran up to him and woke him up.

And that's a problem. Before the battle was interrupted Ash was yelling at Rowlett to get up but Rowlett couldn't hear him. Rowlett only responded when Ash yelled at it from up close. If the battle was never interrupted then Ash couldn't have ran up to Rowlett, he'd have to continue yelling from a distance and Decidueye might have scored a free attack which - in Rowlett's condition - could have ended the match.
 

Soniman

Break the Limit
Man I was mildly annoyed by how things played out but people are furious here LOL.

It was a fun battle with a rollercoaster of wtf moments to keep things interesting. Imo Hau being treated like this is in line with his amine appearances so it's less of a shock to me. The writers don't give a **** about him and just needed another recognizable face for Ash to stomp at the League. As a Hau fan it breaks my heart but none of this is Ash's fault. I just wish they didn't even bother introducing Hau if this were how things were gonna play out
 

Sceptile Leaf Blade

Nighttime Guardian
Cruel to Hau... meh, Hau is a fictional character. It's not like they're being cruel to an actual person. Sometimes life just sucks, the writers also screwed over Lillie by pairing her up against one of the strongest competitors in the first round and then screwed her over again by severely cutting her battle short so that neither Gladion nor Lillie could actually show what they were capable of in that battle. It wasn't even mean-spirited towards Hau, he already got over the fake out during the battle. He was upset afterwards because he lost, not because he was cheated or anything. I think it would have been mean-spirited or cruel had they actually made fun of Hau thinking he won for a minute there. They didn't. Ash even apologised to Hau over his Rowlet being weird.

This was a very close battle. Ash had the better strategy, and had a tad more luck, while Decidueye had more battling power. Hau banked too much on just his battling power and Spirit Shackle to prevent Rowlet from getting into an advantageous position, but it was noticeable that every time Rowlet had the high ground Decidueye got in trouble, Hau didn't really have a solid backup strategy for that case. That said, Hau did battle really well and his strategy was sound. Rowlet is just very unpredictable and hard to pin down. This battle truly could have gone either way and Hau has sufficient karma points to be a potential candidate to knock Ash out of the league (which Guzma clearly doesn't). To me this was a tense battle, I wasn't completely sure who was going to win because I've been doing my best at avoiding spoilers. The writing suggested that Ash was going to win as there are other opponents for him left to battle in the league, but when Rowlet was in so much trouble early on and especially when Hau was declared winner I honestly thought Hau had won. It was a good misdirect and a good and satisfying comeback victory. I think it was a great battle.

Sophocles vs Kiawe is off to a great start too. Sophocles chose the right pokémon to go up against Charizard, as Togedemaru would have been at a huge disadvantage against a flying pokémon that can attack from a distance, while Togedemaru can't fly and has to make contact to attack. Sophocles also knows well where his strengths lie with Vikavolt and knows to avoid Kiawe drawing him into close-ranged combat where Charizard is at an advantage. At least in the opening I'd say his positioning game is better than Kiawe's, although Kiawe knows that he needs to get close because Vikavolt fights best firing attacks from a distance while Charizard can fight up close with Fire Punch, he doesn't seem to really have a plan to achieve that. It's a bit similar to Mallow vs Lana, where Mallow had to get close but Lana knew well how to avoid Tsareena from getting close as Primarina would have been helpless had Tsareena attacked up close from a blind spot with Trop Kick. Sophocles uses Vikavolt's agility and nimbleness to avoid Charizard's Flamethrower and to get into a good position, which resulted in him managing to land Zap Cannon and open up the opportunity for a Z-Move. Unfortunately for Sophocles he doesn't have an Electrium Z, otherwise the battle could already be over right there, but Sophocles managing to score Zap Cannon for damage, and using the paralysis and stunned Charizard as an opening for his Z-Move is a solid fighting plan.
 

Spider-Phoenix

#ChespinGang
You know, my headcanon is that Rowlett had Rest and no one knew. After the clash, Rowlett used Rest and recovered to full health. Then, later it just replaced Rest with Substitute.

And I'm calling that Substitute. There's no way that was Feather Dance lol

As much as I hated the episode, Hau wasn't robbed and Ash might be written as a crappy trainer for picking Rowlett against Decidueye in the first place, but the "fake out" isn't a reason to warrant him getting kicked off the top 8.

Ash picked Rowlett because Rowlett wanted to fight. Even in the episode people mentioned it wasn't the best choice, right down to mentioning he should have used Torracat instead.

Thing is part of being a trainer in the show is try to bring out his pokémon potential and respect its desires. Rowlett wanted to battle and Ash respected that. Had Rowlett not randomly picked itself, I could see Ash using one of the others.

I think Ash's choice shows him just as he's always been shown: a kind trainer who respects his pokémon and puts their needs beyond his own.

The match as a whole is mediocre, like a lot of things in SM. Ash's handling in this particular battle is just fine and consistent with his character.

By the way, I love that even Ash - the paragon of virtue and boyscout-ism - was tired and sick of Rowlett's garbage. One of the few times the meme faces were actually useful.

Well Ash/Rowlett did slightly cheat during the battle (I'll get to the details below). One could argue that they made several mistakes prior to and leading up to the battle:
  1. Not training the spontaneous sleeping out of Rowlett was bad. It's a horrible trait for a pokemon to randomly fall asleep during a serious league battle in the first place and typically something exclusive to disobedient pokemon in the games if you don't have enough badges. This could have easily cost Ash the league legitimately if Decidueye had taken the opportunity to land a free hit (more on this below).
  2. Actually selecting Rowlett despite being both Decidueye's first form, the pokemon Hau specifically trained to beat and with the random sleep thing going. Ash shouldn't have used Rowlett at all, but especially in a 1v1 format where you only get one shot or you're out...
Fair with point 1 but with 2, well, Rowlett did have a rivalry with Decidueye. Terribly written but it existed. The point made is that Rowlett wanted to fight again, win and finally settle their score. On Hau's introduction, they battled twice with one being Hau's and other being Ash's. Rowlett wanted the final victory so I understand Ash's decision.

Did he risk everything on it? Yes, he did but at least he did what he could. I mean, after Rowlett made it clear his desire to be the one in the match, Ash went to train it.

Yeah, he really should have worked the whole sleeping out thing mentioned by point 1 but... what if he did try? We got several episodes where Ash was training with his pokémon and there were several instances where he had do wake Rowlett up. Maybe Ash tried to do it but it just didn't work out? Recalling the few times outside this battle where he had to wake Rowlett up, one could see he looked somewhat frustrated. Who's to say he didn't try and we just didn't see it because the staff thought pancake racing, Dugtrio singing and Eevee fake outs were more interesting?
That said, Ash did kind of cheat unwittingly through the revised decision. If everyone was initially aware that Rowlett was asleep then Decidueye could have taken advantage of that and landed a free hit on Rowlett. Clearly, Ash was standing too far from Rowlett and even though he was shouting at it to stand up Rowlett didn't hear him. It was only after Ash went over to check on Rowlett, flipped it over and yelled at it to wake up that he actually got through. So technically, going over to your pokemon, physically interacting with it during battle and helping it out of a status condition is cheating. Obviously it wasn't intentional but Ash should have returned back to his position without waking Rowlett up and they should have resumed the battle with it still asleep. That would have been the honorable thing to do. However, strictly speaking, the battle was interrupted at the point when Ash woke Rowlett up so it's debatable whether that was an actual rule violation.

It's probably the later. The match was put on hold which gave a window of opportunity for Ash to do something. It's not really cheating as much as Ash using lemons to make lemonade. Nanu's screw up gave Ash an opportunity and he made best use of it.
 

xinfernapex

Sinnoh Champion
I actually like this battle up until the point they actually declared Hau the winner. The battle felt tense and you do wonder how Rowlet will turn it around. But to actually go that far was just cruel and unnecessary. It wouldn’t have been so bad if Nanu was about to give the win to Hau but stops to realise Rowlet is just asleep. That would have been enough of a gag and would’ve given more screen time to the actual battles. To spend that long for a gag was ridiculous.
 

MidnightMelody

Hopeful for Gen 8
Sure. Sun & Moon has nothing but gag battles...
That is, aside from both matches between Satoshi and Kapu-Kokeko, all the Trials and Grand Trials (maybe except the Dekagoose one, I honestly forgot how that went), both his previous fights with Gladio, every battle with Sauboh in the Aether arc before the character became pure comic relief, Lilie & Gladio VS Totem Jararanga, all the Ultra Space battles except the one with Hissatsu no Moku Shoot, the battles with Necrozma, Satoshi VS Guzma, Guzma VS Ilima, Suiren VS Mao, Mamane VS Matsurika, Gladio VS Kojiro...

Just off the top of my head. While not all of these fights may have been all that good, the story did still treat them appropriately seriously.

The UB battles were not serious at all.....
 

Lord Starfish

Fond of owls
The UB battles were not serious at all.....
The Ultra Space battles. aka the battles against Lusamine's possessed team and Utsuroid. Mao, Mamane and Suiren's fight was a gag battle, but the rest of them were not.
 

Evanibble

Well-Known Member
Flaming/Insulting Other People
I don't get why everyone is getting so butthurt over this battle. I thought it was hilarious. If you didn't get spoiled by the semifinals episodes, then you got seriously trolled. Or, even if you did, you might've been tricked into thinking that the episode titles were false, for some reason (like I was, LOL), and that's awesome. It isn't often that the writers punk their audience like that, at least in a show like this one. Or, you could be one of those few people that was like "oH i DeFiNiTeLy SaW tHaT cOmInG." Granted, the writing could have been better, but nothing happened to earn this episode the hate it's getting. Rowlet and Ash won, Hau and Decidueye lost, and that's it.

Y'all seriously need to get over it and enjoy the rest of the battles, since it's not like these league battles are all the time. Kiawe v. Sophocles looks exciting so far, and I'm personally looking forward to Ash v. Guzma.
 

AznKei

Dawn & Chloe by ddangbi
I don't get why everyone is getting so butthurt over this battle. I thought it was hilarious. If you didn't get spoiled by the semifinals episodes, then you got seriously trolled. Or, even if you did, you might've been tricked into thinking that the episode titles were false, for some reason (like I was, LOL), and that's awesome. It isn't often that the writers punk their audience like that, at least in a show like this one. Or, you could be one of those few people that was like "oH i DeFiNiTeLy SaW tHaT cOmInG." Granted, the writing could have been better, but nothing happened to earn this episode the hate it's getting. Rowlet and Ash won, Hau and Decidueye lost, and that's it.

Y'all seriously need to get over it and enjoy the rest of the battles, since it's not like these league battles are all the time. Kiawe v. Sophocles looks exciting so far, and I'm personally looking forward to Ash v. Guzma.
To me, it was the outcome of the match, it's like they made a parody of the real life sport event scandals, which could do serious headaches/damages for those affected, but the writers made it look too lighthearted. It's just tasteless, not outraged, but I do get over with over time.
 

Leonhart

Imagineer
I didn't mind the end of Satoshi versus Hau as much as I thought I would. I didn't like the fake-out when it seemed like Mokuroh had fainted against Junaiper, but it could've been much worse. I was more bothered by Kaki versus Maamane since that Z-Move at the end was overly dramatic for something that won't affect Lizardon much.
 

Shneak

this is a Nessa x Sonia stan account ✨
I admit, the fakeout got me. Mostly because I was worried Best Bird would get the backlash for being the sole reason Ash lost the Alola League.
 
I don't get why everyone is getting so butthurt over this battle. I thought it was hilarious. If you didn't get spoiled by the semifinals episodes, then you got seriously trolled. Or, even if you did, you might've been tricked into thinking that the episode titles were false, for some reason (like I was, LOL), and that's awesome. It isn't often that the writers punk their audience like that, at least in a show like this one. Or, you could be one of those few people that was like "oH i DeFiNiTeLy SaW tHaT cOmInG." Granted, the writing could have been better, but nothing happened to earn this episode the hate it's getting. Rowlet and Ash won, Hau and Decidueye lost, and that's it.

Y'all seriously need to get over it and enjoy the rest of the battles, since it's not like these league battles are all the time. Kiawe v. Sophocles looks exciting so far, and I'm personally looking forward to Ash v. Guzma.
We all need to get over ourselves? I think everyone can decide that for themselves just fine.
 

Almighty Zard

He has returned.
I admit, the fakeout got me. Mostly because I was worried Best Bird would get the backlash for being the sole reason Ash lost the Alola League.

The best bird is still coming under fire, because despite "the call" people are also unhappy it won without at least evolving into "Crotch Punch Me" to do it.

Even though it can clearly get away with it unlike any other known starter lines.
 

Red and Blue

Well-Known Member
Well at the very least Rowlet didnt evolve. That's the one good positive I can say about this episode

On a side note how will the other Meltan arrive at the stadium? Are they just going to swim there?
 

mehmeh1

Not thinking twice!
Well at the very least Rowlet didnt evolve. That's the one good positive I can say about this episode

On a side note how will the other Meltan arrive at the stadium? Are they just going to swim there?
Well, we first saw them underwater
 

Mag Prime

The Pokemon Avenger
This is gonna be insta-slapped down as wishful thinking but what are the odds of Greninja coming back for the league?

With Pikachu's exclusive Z-move, a Melmetal, Ash-Greninja and hopefully Ash getting an Incineroar maybe there could be some hope to get a good final battle against Gladio/Guzma and maybe win this league.
 

Doppelgänger

Superancient Member
The Z-Move cutscene doesn't impact the effect in the games, but the visual has an influence on the move's logic in the anime.

All-Out Pummeling is a barrage of punches, which could be individually dodged.
Let's Snuggle Forever involves blanketing the opponent, so if the cannot be blanketed the move fails.
Savage Spin-Out involves wrapping the opponent in silk, so the user needs a move that uses silk like String Shot to depict it as an upgrade.
Malicious Moonsault looks like a Fire-type move, so it's super effective against Steel?

I'd imagine Kiawe overcoming the trap easily will be because of Savage Spin-Out's execution, not because of type effectiveness. In the preview, Wild Charge is parrying Supersonic Skystrike. That kind of tactic could never happen in the games.
 
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