A Challenge to myself

[Novan_Hero]

Ohai, I'm new to the Serebii Forums (Gamefaqs Users were being extremely rude) and I'm posting one of my Most Successful teams (Blah Blah It's on PO idc) anyway feel free to criticize and post suggestions.

(M) @

Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
- Spikes/Toxic Spikes
- Gyro Ball
Standard Hazard Setter/Spinner. Sets up the ever so broken Stealth Rocks and if he has a chance, Spikes. Gyro Ball is for the taunters and STAB. Now I'm stuck whether I want Toxic Spikes or just Spikes because, Forretress is an awesome Example of a Pokemon with 4 Move Syndrome.

(M) @

Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 200 HP / 252 Atk / 56 Def
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Rock Polish
- Swords Dance
It's an Effective Physical Tank and is able to become a Sweeper in about 2 moves. Sadly due to Gliscor's Double Weakness to Ice, it becomes useless pretty fast. Simple set Earthquake as obvious Ground STAB and Ice Fang against Dragons and other Gliscors that try to wall me. After 1 Rock Polish it reaches a nice 435 Speed that's w/o Speed Investment. Found out recently that Toxic Orb heals far more than Leftovers XD so yeah

(M) @

Trait: Flame Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Quiver Dance
- Fiery Dance
- Bug Buzz
- Rest
Pretty Obvious about what it does Quiver Dance until it can't Quiver Dance no moar and then Chesto-Rest to completely Heal it. Fiery Dance for a Chance to boost SAtk and STAB and Bug Buzz for another STAB move. Obviously a Tank especially if it sets up. Even though it's Stealth Rock Weak, It can be an effective Sweeper if it can setup at the right time (even though I usually try to switch it in before they Set Up Stealth Rock)

(F) @

Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Def / 16 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Taunt
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Recover
The first of my Troll Duo. Taunticent is an awesome Stall-Staller (Especially THIS thing -->;242 Scald for STAB and Ice Beam just for coverage, Recover just to help survive hits and Taunt as above. It an Awesome Mixed wall able to survive a lot of hits. The reason for 240 HP is to make sure she gets the Least SR/Weather Damage and the most Leftovers Recovery (I didn't do the Calculations)

(F) @

Trait: Volt Absorb
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Shadow Ball
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Sunny Day
The last of my troll set, the point of it was to Troll Pokemon with Water Moves and Electric Moves (*cough*Starmie*Cough*) not much of a Sweeper the point of Jolteon is my Weather Stopper (I like prefer sun on this team, Except Jellicent) Volt Switch for STAB move allowing it to switch unto a Suitable Pokemon and Hidden Power Ice for Coverage especially Pokemon who are Earthquake Happy and Shadow Ball for Coverage. Choice Specs increase Jolteon's Special Attack to a 450+ (iirc) making it a Capable Revenge Killer at times.

(M) @

Trait: Guts
EVs: 200 HP / 56 Atk / 252 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Bulk Up
- Drain Punch
- Rock Slide/Stone Edge
- Mach Punch
The MVP of this team, Specially Defensive allowing it to Wall it's Weakness. HP stat is for the same reason as Jellicent. I chose Rock Slide because of Flinch chance and better Accuracy (2 Friends of mine Like Spamming Snow Cloak Frosslass/Mamoswine) also to help it handle Volcarona's, Flyers etc and the other Moves for Good Recovery and Priority, Both STAB making it a Dangerous opponent.

The Challenge was to make a Team that's not Stall/Gimmick* and It eventually worked out in the end as making this team one of my most Useful teams.

*The Troll duo is the Gimmick I found XD

 

[Novan_Hero]

bumpsies :3 Forgot to add that after A LOT of battles, I did have a Gimmick - Jolteon and Jellicent Trolling. XD hahah anyway, would appreciated some help.

 

[Scizorisnotcool]

First thing that jumped out at me. A pokemon with poison heal and he has leftovers over toxic orb? Leftovers is 1/16 HP recovery, while poison heal gives 1/8, along with your pokemon effectively being immune to status thanks to already being poisoned. I understand that you might be thinking that if he gets poisoned, the leftovers is worth it, but the chances of someone trying to poison him is nil. The only way you would get him poisoned would be predicting a toxic, and switching in, which could be done, but I'd recommend toxic orb on Gliscor anyways.

Also, I dislike your idea of having Jolteon (not a water type) with rain dance, and no thunder. Thunder gets boosted to 100% accuracy under rain dance, but maybe you just cant spare a move slot. It's your decision, but Jolteon is frail enough already without having to set up a rain dance that serves no purpose for your team besides boosting Jellicents Scald.

 

[Novan_Hero]

lool I didn't know that (Poison Heal > Leftovers) I thought they both healed the same XD I'll change it immediately (Though I've predicted Poison before *cough*Stallers*Cough*) And I could probably change Volt Switch to Thunder because I might as well make my weather counter Benefit as well . TY for your input.

 

[Scizorisnotcool]

No problem, two more thoughts I might share with you.
Iron Fist > Guts on Conkeldurr IMO, Drain Punch becomes monstrous if you can get a hold of a DW Conkeldurr. Flame Orb also works great on Conkeldurr if you want to keep Guts, as drain punch (along with all his other attacks) gets 50% stronger, providing 50% more recovery to you (although I'm not sure if that recovery would compensate for lack of leftovers + burn damage)

Also, I would run an attack nature on the same conkeldurr unless you really feel you need the special defence nature. +10% to a base stat of 140 is more than double the boost you would get from 10% to a measly 65. I think just EVing special defence would be a better investment, as Conk would get quite a large damage boost (again, a recovery boost from drain punch) from the nature switch.

 

[Aldieb]

This team has several key flaws which will prevent it from performing well i the current metgame. I do not how well you did on PO, but this team wouldnt be usable on Smogon. Let us go over each pokemon one by one, and then look at the team overall...


1. Forretres: Nothing wrong with this set, though I would consider running Gyro Ball instead of spikes. Its mostly personal preferance though. You mentioned that you were considering changing the item to shed shell. I would personaly suggest you dont do this. Lefties can help get you back to full health for sturdy after taking a minor hit or entry hazard damage, ad Magnezone isnt common enough and can be dealt with by prediction when present.


2. Gliscor: As someone mentioned before me, change the item to a Toxic Orb. In adition I would highly recomend using Protect inpalce of Rock Polish or Sword dance so you could stall for extra recovery. Barring that, toxic could also be an option, since it would let you deal with some pokes that you otherwise cant touch (bulky waters).


3. Volcanora: If you are trying to make it bulky so it could set u multiple Quiver Dances, I would sujest changing the nature and ev spread. Its bse special defese is already decent, and without investmet it quickly falls to most phisical attacks. You ould try somethig like this...

Volcanora - Bold - 252Hp/252D/4SDf - Chesto
Flame Body

Fiery Dance
Bug Buzz
Quiver Dance
Rest

What bothers me here most though is that your team offers little support to help this sweeper. Jolteon in particular may harm it by setting up the rain dance.


4. Jellicent: Overall the set is fine, but I would recomend giving this thing toxic (possibly inplace of taunt or ice beam) so that water types cant set up all over you.


5. Jolteon: If this set works for you, feel free to use it. A weather changer is usefull to have in the current metagame, especialy if you can remove the opposing weather setter early in the game. I would however suggest changing the weather move to Sunny Day if you insist on keeping the set. Forretress cant take fire attacks anyways so it doesnt harm him much, and it helps Volcanora.


6. Conkeldurr: Nothing wrong with this set, but I would recomend changing Rock Slide to Payback. Even after a Bulk Up you currently wouldnt be able to 1hko a Gengar, nevermind ay other ghost type. Payback still deals a good amount to fliers considering Conk's speed.



Overall... there are several problems with the team currently. Rain completely demolishes all your pokes, with only Jellicent having a chance to give them pause. And even then Thunderus could come in and threaten you out. Against Sun you run into simular problems, with only Volcanora being able to hold its own for a bit (Jellicent loses to the multiple grass attacks those teams run). And against sand you run into the problem of having two pokes that Excadrill can set up on, while sporting only 1 check (Forretress, Jolteon, and Gliscor respectivly).

To fix these problems I would recomend few changes... First off give Gliscor Protect and Toxic Orb. This will alow him to stall for more recovery when needed, and make taking Excadrill's hits multiple times easier on him. As he is right now he would be quickly worn down. To help with rain and sun, I would recomend changing your Volcanora to a bulky dragon dancer, possibly Salamence.


Salamence - Careful - 252Hp/148SDf/108Spe - Lum/Yache Berry
Intimidate

Dragon Claw
Earthquake
Dragon Dance
Roost


The ev spread gives you maximum health, and raises your special defence to 256 to help take resisted fire and water attacks (from sun and rain). Intimidate helps you take phisical hits from the poke you switch on. Lum berry can help ith status, while Yache lets you eat an ice attack if needed. The 108 speed evs let ou outrun Jolteon after one Dragon Dance. Dragon Claw and Earthquake for coverage, Dragon Dance to boost, and Roost to heal and help deal with Stealth Rocks if you failed to spin.

Another change that might help would be switching Jolteon to a choice set, which would help him when dealing with rain.


Jolteon - Timid - 252Sa/252Spe/4Hp - Choice Specs
Volt Absorb

Volt Change
Thunderbolt
Hp(ice)
Shadow Ball

After Ferrahorn has been eliminated this set is capable of doing massive damage to rain teams, and is still useful (to an extent) againt sun and sand. Volt Change ad Hp(ice) complete the bolt beam combo while shadowball hits Reuniclus hard (who at the moment can freely deal with your entire team for the most part). Thunderbolt is there for when you need more power than Volt Change provides.

Also... PLEASE give Forretress Earthquake or Gyro ball (or both). At the moment it is set up fodder for Excadrill (among others).

No problem, two more thoughts I might share with you.
Iron Fist > Guts on Conkeldurr IMO, Drain Punch becomes monstrous if you can get a hold of a DW Conkeldurr. Flame Orb also works great on Conkeldurr if you want to keep Guts, as drain punch (along with all his other attacks) gets 50% stronger, providing 50% more recovery to you (although I'm not sure if that recovery would compensate for lack of leftovers + burn damage)

Also, I would run an attack nature on the same conkeldurr unless you really feel you need the special defence nature. +10% to a base stat of 140 is more than double the boost you would get from 10% to a measly 65. I think just EVing special defence would be a better investment, as Conk would get quite a large damage boost (again, a recovery boost from drain punch) from the nature switch.

As for the quote above... DO NOT change you Conkeldurrs nature. Guts is one of the ebst abilities a phisical sweeper can have, and Iron Fist doesnt even come close. The minor boost from Iron Fist isnt worth becoming vulnerable to burns. In adition Careful nature is better for you with the spread you are using.

 

[Novan_Hero]

@Scizorisnotcool: ._. I'm disregarding your 2nd post Completely, not because of what Adlieb posted but because:
1:iirc this would change my tier to DW OU and Iron Fist Conkledurr isn't even out yet, "(Haven't played DW in like freaking months)
2:The point of the Special Defence investments is to make it another Mixed Tank.
3.Guts ups Attack if it get's burned.
If I offended you I'm deeply sorry, but this is my honest opinion.

@Adlieb:I'm gonna use the Numbers as well, but first: I don't like Smogon (in my mind they are too ban-happy) So yeah.
1:That's decided Volt Switch is changing to Gyro Ball.
2:Gliscor becomes a Tank after Rock Polish and Swords Dance and I like making original sets :3 so no, I'm not gonna change Rock Polish to Protect/Toxic/Taunt
3:hahaha I must have been really tired when i put the EV's on, otherwise yeah sure.
4:I would have to Again say no, because how would they setup with Taunt? For Jellicent Taunt>Toxic because I've seen how better Taunt is on Jellicent (though only 1 battle)
5:lol yeah, I put Rain Dance because: Volcarona used to be Surf Latios and because I fixed this set during the PO temporary Wifi and DW OU ban on Politoed. So I will change it.
6:Stone Edge/Rock Slide>Payback. Why? Gyarados, Volcarona, Dragon-Flying etc and if you didn't know Payback got Nerfed so it doesn't get Double Damage on the Switch. That is my Reasoning.
Ummm Conkledurr? As Excadrill sets up He put Stealth Rock and then Gyro Balls (yesm if you didn't know, i'm gonna add it) dealing a Good Amount of Damage and the next turn Excadrill attacks and forretress survives another turn guaranteed, then forry dies next turn I switch in conkledurr and mach punch it to oblivion :3

Otherwise, you guys both Helped a lot.

 

[Aldieb]

@Scizorisnotcool: ._. I'm disregarding your 2nd post Completely, not because of what Adlieb posted but because:
1:iirc this would change my tier to DW OU and Iron Fist Conkledurr isn't even out yet, "(Haven't played DW in like freaking months)
2:The point of the Special Defence investments is to make it another Mixed Tank.
3.Guts ups Attack if it get's burned.
If I offended you I'm deeply sorry, but this is my honest opinion.

@Adlieb:I'm gonna use the Numbers as well, but first: I don't like Smogon (in my mind they are too ban-happy) So yeah.
1:That's decided Volt Switch is changing to Gyro Ball.
2:Gliscor becomes a Tank after Rock Polish and Swords Dance and I like making original sets :3 so no, I'm not gonna change Rock Polish to Protect/Toxic/Taunt
3:hahaha I must have been really tired when i put the EV's on, otherwise yeah sure.
4:I would have to Again say no, because how would they setup with Taunt? For Jellicent Taunt>Toxic because I've seen how better Taunt is on Jellicent (though only 1 battle)
5:lol yeah, I put Rain Dance because: Volcarona used to be Surf Latios and because I fixed this set during the PO temporary Wifi and DW OU ban on Politoed. So I will change it.
6:Stone Edge/Rock Slide>Payback. Why? Gyarados, Volcarona, Dragon-Flying etc and if you didn't know Payback got Nerfed so it doesn't get Double Damage on the Switch. That is my Reasoning.
Ummm Conkledurr? As Excadrill sets up He put Stealth Rock and then Gyro Balls (yesm if you didn't know, i'm gonna add it) dealing a Good Amount of Damage and the next turn Excadrill attacks and forretress survives another turn guaranteed, then forry dies next turn I switch in conkledurr and mach punch it to oblivion :3

Otherwise, you guys both Helped a lot.

1. Wether you like Smogon or not, at this current moment any halfway decent sun or rain team would go through your team with ease. Sand would only need to remove Conkeldurr to be able to sweep the rest of your team (with how much you rely on him that wouldnt be a problem).

2. Also you are forgeting Jellicent is incredibly slow, so taunt on him is only usable against a few things like Blissey.

3. Yes, Payback got nerfed, I am well aware of that. But it still usualy gets double damage because of Conkeldurr's abysmal speed.

4. Gliscors ability to tank anything is largely dependant on the healing he gets from poison heal. With your current set his ability to take hits is compromised because his recovery is so limited.

5. Forretress will take 2 hits from a SD Excadrill only if you are asuming it hasnt been damaged before. Conkeldurr can revenge kill it ONLY if it stays in. And note that you are relying on him excessivly, since he is also your only check to mix ttar, another very popular pokemon in sandstorm. Also remember that Excadrill can just as easily set up on your Jolteon.

6. Original sets are nice, but they also need to be workable. You will get either a sword dance on gliscor, or a polish before a counter is sent in. So its likely that you either wont be able to KO, or wont outspeed.

 

[Novan_Hero]

There's no point arguing about this so I'm making Plain and Simple. Most of your advice was good, but there is reasoning (That I possibly can't explain) that some of the changes you tell me to make, I'm not. But TY anyway. If this offends you I'm sorry (I'm not a Smogon-Lover, I play by Pokemon Online Rules eg The Metagames maybe entirely different)

 

[Aldieb]

There's no point arguing about this so I'm making Plain and Simple. Most of your advice was good, but there is reasoning (That I possibly can't explain) that some of the changes you tell me to make, I'm not. But TY anyway. If this offends you I'm sorry (I'm not a Smogon-Lover, I play by Pokemon Online Rules eg The Metagames maybe entirely different)

Im not offended, but rather felt that it would be good to explain my reasoning just one more time. Hope your team works out.

 

[Novan_Hero]

okay TY well one last time, anymore ideas?

 

[Scizorisnotcool]

Just noticed this: As your Volcarona is a Chesto Rester, (exact same moveset as mine) definitely sink some EVs into HP, to get the most effective rest you can.
My Volcarona was modest with an EV spread was 252 HP, 152 SpA, 80 Defence, 20 Speed (allows it to outspeed a few key pokemon without a Quiver Dance).
I was going for a bit of regular defence to even things up, but you could try 252 HP, 100 SpA, 158 SpD if you wanted to keep him a special tank. That spread would actually greatly increase hit taking capabilites in both defences (run some calculations if you want), making him more of a wall at the cost of some power. But IMO (sorry Grammar Nazis), he gets so many boosts to special attack (mmm... Fiery Dance...) he doesn't suffer too badly from the loss in power. Alternatively, you could go swap the special attack and special defence EVs if you really can't lose that much power.
Hope this helps.

 

[Chandelure181]

For me this Conkeldurr doesnt have the right item.
If he has Guts why dont you go for the Flame Orb?
AND with Drain Punch he doesnt lack recovery

 

[Novan_Hero]

@Scizor: I've already changed the EV's XD but ty anyway!
@Chandelure: My Conkledurr is terms of being a Tank is more of a Wall then a Sweeper (though after a few bulk ups...) so yeah.

 

[Scizorisnotcool]

@Scizor: I've already changed the EV's XD but ty anyway!

No you didn't? Those are the same as the first time I saw it I believe, maybe you forgot to save your edit? Or did you mean you have changed them once before and don't want to again? Also, if you feel like doing a rate I'm shamelessly self promoting my UU Phazing team if you are interested...

 

[Novan_Hero]

I forgot to Edit and I was reading your UU Thread will be posting in it soon.

 

[Scizorisnotcool]

I forgot to Edit and I was reading your UU Thread will be posting in it soon.

Excellent...
(Taps ends of fingers together)

EDIT: By the way, I also think Flygon is awesome.

 

[Scizorisnotcool]

You still haven't edited those Volcarona EVs!
Also, are you still looking for more input on this team? I notice your Jolteon is still lacking in Thunder despite having Rain Dance.

 

[Scizorisnotcool]

You still haven't edited those Volcarona EVs!
Also, are you still looking for more input on this team? I notice your Jolteon is still lacking in Thunder despite having Rain Dance.

 

[DWbulba]

I know what you mean about Gamefaqs user being rude. when you disagree with them they lash out at you. oh and your team looks pretty good!