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A different Hail Team OU (I guess this counts as a Christmas team too)

Black Murder Heavangelon

Ow! Ow! Harder! Ow!
So I ran a Sandstorm team for a while. You've all seen it before. It was that other thread with the Hippowdon and the Corsola. And the Mandibuzz.

Well, I then wanted to test out a plausbile SkarmBliss core in Hail, but without the Skarm Bliss. The team has been doing pretty effective since I swapped out the lead for Forretress. It's an OU team, but I've been using it for fun. A Hail team shouldn't be winning this often.

So here's the team for you. At a glance.


---

Ballistiks@Air Mail
Impish
Overcoat
252 HP/252 Def/4 Atk
-Stealth Rock
-Rapid Spin
-Earthquake
-Rest

The team did much better when I started using this guy. Maxing out HP and Def makes him reliably wall physical threats like Machamp and Scizor. His job is to lay down Stealth Rock and stay in until he needs to switch out.

Overcoat is used over Sturdy as he lives long enough to see a second switch in. Air Mail is the item since the team is under Item Clause and I've been ruined more than once by Trick users. You can call me paranoid. Stealth Rock is an important entry hazard as it harms Fire types that threaten the team. Rapid Spin is to blow away opposing Stealth Rock since the team is very SR weak. Earthquake is his offensive move of choice as it gets a lot of coverage. Although it may be replacable with Gyro Ball. I need to test that. Rest is stupid. But he's half of the core with Mismagius, who not only blocks Rapid Spin, but carries Heal Bell to cure Forretress of sleep.


Santa Claus@Choice Scarf
Hasty
Snow Warning
252 Spe/200 Sp.Atk/56 Atk
-Blizzard
-Rock Slide
-Giga Drain
-Focus Blast

Abomasnow functions as the revenge killer of the team, packing Choice Scarf and frequently makes reappearances and summons Hail. He's Hasty instead of Naive because he has better Sp.Def than Def, so he can switch in more often. Blizzard is the STAB of choice, never missing and even potentially bypassing Protect. Rock Slide is the only attack to maim Fire types who screw this team over. Giga Drain is another STAB attack that Abomasnow uses to gain HP. He's surprisingly bulky so he makes full use of this. Focus Blast is the last attack of the set used mainly for Steels, as the team often has trouble dealing with.


BoneNapper@Lum Berry
Impish
Overcoat
252 HP/252 Def/4 Spe
-Toxic
-Knock Off
-Roost
-Flatter

I've posted this set before, which was the inspiration for the team as a whole. Mandibuzz is an excellent physical wall who can counter many physical threats for the team. Toxic is a fun stall move to wear them down as Hail eats away their HP. Knock Off removes items like Leftovers so that Hail damage is to the full effect. Roost is for healing and is ever so useful to remove the Flying Type. And lastly, Flatter screws with physical attackers and boosting sweepers by confusing them and making them likely to KO themselves. Lum Berry is the item due to the clause, but it can also be a helpful save from confusion.


Jack Frost@Leftovers
Calm
Levitate
252 HP/252 Sp.Def/4 Spe
-Rapid Spin
-Recover
-Toxic
-Ice Beam

The third part of this foursome core. Cryogonal packs Rapid Spin in case Forretress couldn't keep them off of the field. As he is a special tank, Recover keeps him in on special attacks and is extremely resilient to even super effective Fire attacks. There are some pokemon he won't be able to damage with Ice Beam, so he uses Toxic instead to wear them down. As the team runs under an item clause, he is the one to hold the Leftovers.

I'm thinking about switching his items with Mandibuzz, though.


Ghost of Christmas Past@Bloom Mail
Calm
Levitate
252 HP/252 Sp.Def/4 Spe
-Heal Bell
-Pain Split
-Shadow Ball
-Power Gem

I just realized I had two Air Mails on this team. So I swapped it out for a Bloom Mail. It still counts, right?

Anyway, Mismagius offered a very grateful Fighting resist for the team, and even comes with the utility move Heal Bell. Having two spinners on the team and four defensive cores all together, this is much needed. Pain Split is her form of recovery, as even though she lacks an immunity to Hail, it can also further sap HP from foes to benefit her. Shadow Ball is for STAB. Power Gem, however, is an important attack against Fire types that threaten this team.


Christmas Tree@Eviolite
Careful
Snow Warning
252 HP/252 Sp.Def/4 Def
-Leech Seed
-Substitute
-Ice Shard
-Swagger

I'm not silly enough to leave the Hail storm up to Abomasnow. To get an edge over the Sun and Rain teams, Snover brings out the Hail once again should Abomasnow fall.

Snover possesses the classic Leech Seed and Substitute combo. With a specially defensive EV spread and Eviolite, Snover can easily wall special attackers. He's susceptible to Fire attacks still, though. Ice Shard is his main STAB attack, useful for revenge killing. Swagger gives him a similar function as Mandibuzz, as he can confuses special attackers he may have trouble walling.

---

So, that's my Hail team. It's much different in its own way from having multiple cores here and there. I only made it for fun in OU, but it's surprisingly effective at what it does.

The team has problems with boosting sweepers like Volcarona. If Abomasnow doesn't get in and KO it with Rock Slide, I'm swept. A lot of my losses have turned out like this, losing to opponents who have gained too many boosts. Scrafty is a pain to the team and Cloyster is hard to stop. But those pokemon are the only ones that give me a hard time.

So. Any suggestions? Feel free to suggest alternate attacks or EV spreads, or items. You can suggest a pokemon like Walrein but it'll be very difficult to replace any team member here. If you're going to suggest a pokemon, give me a good set of reasons before you do.

Feel free to give a critique as well.
 

chuckeroo777

#1 Bug Type Fan
As forretress's item is to counter trick, an iron ball might work better, as he is already so slow, and then it hinder's the opponent, as well as rendering trick using levitaters and flyers weak to his earthquake. Misdreavous could use the leftovers, as he is not immune to hail.
You also seriously need a fire counter. Power gem helps, but you need more.
 

Xenevix

Some Guy
As forretress's item is to counter trick, an iron ball might work better, as he is already so slow, and then it hinder's the opponent, as well as rendering trick using levitaters and flyers weak to his earthquake. Misdreavous could use the leftovers, as he is not immune to hail.
You also seriously need a fire counter. Power gem helps, but you need more.
I agree with him. Since the most common Trick users are Latios and Rotom this would come in handy.

If you're going to replace something for Walrein I would consider getting rid of Cryogonal. As a Spinner he has his function but he loses 25% health to the most common hazard, Stealth Rock, and is way too weak to physical attacks. Walrein could also be a Fire counter due to the ability Thick Fat. You could still have it act as a special wall as well, but recovery would be an issue.


Walrein @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Nature: Careful
EVs: +252 Special Defense +252 HP +4 Attack
- Curse
- Rock Slide
- Aqua Tail
- Avalanche / Aqua Ring

This could be your answer to set up Volcarona. Nice bulk and Rock Slide make him formidable but bulky versions of Volc can escape his low power Rock Slide. Curse for needed boosts (mostly defense), Rock Slide for countering fire types and other Ice types taking advantage of the Hail, Aqua Tail for STAB Fire killin, and the last move is your choice, Avalanche for STAB and amazing power if Walrein's hit or Aqua Ring for additional reliable recovery. This set would also add a little more offense to your team.
 

Black Murder Heavangelon

Ow! Ow! Harder! Ow!
As forretress's item is to counter trick, an iron ball might work better, as he is already so slow, and then it hinder's the opponent, as well as rendering trick using levitaters and flyers weak to his earthquake. Misdreavous could use the leftovers, as he is not immune to hail.
You also seriously need a fire counter. Power gem helps, but you need more.
That's a good idea, but if the item were Iron Ball, I may as well run Gyro Ball for more damage. And even then, if he gets a Choice Scarf, he's restricted to one attack for the rest of the match.

Also, Mismagius can't have Leftovers since the team is under Item clause.

I'll test out Walrein later. I can't believe I forgot about Thick Fat.
 

destructo

Well-Known Member
Having snover with abamasnow is a bad idea. You need the extra space for a poke that can wall or sweep. Snover is neither of these. This team falls against Heatran also, so I would suggest switch Mismaguis for Jellicent
 

Black Murder Heavangelon

Ow! Ow! Harder! Ow!
Having snover with abamasnow is a bad idea. You need the extra space for a poke that can wall or sweep. Snover is neither of these. This team falls against Heatran also, so I would suggest switch Mismaguis for Jellicent
Snover can wall. He walls special attacks. He's only there because a depending on a Choice Scarf user for Hail is a risky idea already. And he is pretty good at switching in on special attacks.

As for Jellicent, Jellicent doesn't have Heal Bell, which is what Forretress really needs if I'm switching out Cryogonal for Walrein. I would've gone for Clefable, but that just adds another Fighting weakness to the team. Unless you know of a cleric with a Fight resist, Mismagius is staying.
 
So.. this team needs a lot of work.

Roost SD Scizor basically 6-0s without trying. It comes in on Forretress (or anything really) and sets up.. at which point nothing will beat it.

DD Dragonite 6-0s.

Tyranitar with Fire Punch or Fire Blast will KO your whole team with minimal danger to itself. Choice Band Stone Edge alone OHKOs your whole team barring Forretress, who is 2HKOed.

Heatran laughs at your team.. 1-2HKOing your whole team even Mismagius / Vulture WITHOUT AN ITEM.

Terrakion.. Well I'm sure you know what Terrakion does.

Sp def Jirachi with Fire Punch 6-0s.

Specs Latios or LO Latios that runs Psyshock crushes everything.

Gengar hits 4/6 Pokemon Super-Effective while one of your two is incapable of hurting it and the other's best attack is.. Knock Off.

Volcarona 6-0s.

Reuniclus 6-0s. Misdreavous 3HKOs it after a Calm Mind so barring a crit or confusion hax you will never beat it.

Lucario 6-0s pretty much just by coming out of its Pokeball.

LO or Specs Ninetales kills everything. Specs Overheat OHKOs even Mismagius.

Incredible problems with Infernape.. Nothing really takes its hits well. It will probably kill itself with LO + Hail but not before wiping out half your team.

Conkeldurr sets up a Bulk Up then 6-0s pretty much regardless of what you do.

Cloyster sets up Shell Smash somewhere (maybe Scarf Blizzard or Forretress) then just 6-0s pretty much regardless of the set.

Pretty much any team that is able to shrug off a few turns of Blizzard spam beats you.



I see two options here.

One is to drop most of the team and start from scratch.. either as a serious full on OU Hail or a more joke driven Christmas team (needs more Delibird).

Other option is to remove Forretress and use this in lower tiers where weather doesn't exist (besides sand and you crush it with ice) and where Heatran / Scizor don't go.


If you want to use this in OU drop Cryogonal, Mismagius and Snover.. Maybe for Reuniclus / Jellicent / Lucario.. this should let you do significantly better against virtually everything you are weak to.

Spikes > Rest on Forretress.
Earthquake > Rock Slide on Abomasnow
Brave Bird somewhere on Vulture so you can at least have a chance of TOUCHING Volcarona.

Get rid of the last three Pokemon.
 
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