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A hypothetical Gen 6 PMD game

Discussion in 'Pokémon Spinoff Discussion' started by Sunset Star, Aug 28, 2014.

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  1. Kyrix

    Kyrix Glitch Hunting Freak

    When people talk about the Pokemon Mystery Dungeon games, and what they want to see, they usually go for things I, personally, find obvious: "all the pokemon, improved AI, better music, personality quizzes, a game closer to Sky than GTI, etc."

    But, something that I've been thinking about: why not delve a bit deeper and make the games more true to their Mystery Dungeon roots?

    I'm a huuuuuge fan of Rogue-Likes, so it was no surprise that I fell in love with this series, but truth be told...the PMD games are bit on the simplistic side, as far as games in the genre go. Now, I know, I know. It's because it's Pokemon, but imagine the potential.

    -Berries found on the ground are simply labeled "berry" until you eat one. Then for the rest of the dungeon, all berries of that type are automatically identified for you. And, of course, any that you get out of the dungeon stay identified forever. Once your IQ becomes high enough, you get "berry master" which allows your character to be able to identify berries just by picking them up. This kind of system is a call back to the classic Rogue, by far. You would find random potions, some good, some bad, and until you drank it, you would have no idea what that color of potion did. Was that red potion a Potion of Healing, or was it a Potion of Blindness? This rule, of course, applies for ALL items, not just berries. You just found a scarf on the ground. Is it a pecha scarf? A power band? Or is it a dreaded whiff scarf. More on this in the next.

    -Add "equipment." Now, I don't mean give Pokemon swords, and armor, and stuff. But consider what a Pokemon adventurer would wear, and remove that 1 hold item limit. Let's have our power bands, our x-ray specs; those crazy capes, and reintroduce the species items from TDS. With more "wearable" slots, you could make the items a bit more useful to have in the field, and thus, give them purpose. Of course, the identity would be a mystery until you equipped and used the item a bit. If it's an item that alters your stats, it automatically identifies itself when you wear it. If it's an item that activates under certain conditions (pecha scarf curing poison, whiff scarf making you miss thrown items), then it'll become identified when you activate its ability.

    -'Look-alike' items and the classic "cursed" item. Another classic of the genre is the cursed item, and it is what the look-alike items from sky were based off of. They were items that appeared as any other, but often with the opposite effect, and in the case of a piece of equipment, they become stuck to you until you could lift the curse. A cursed pecha scarf? Wear it and become poisoned on every floor until you can get it removed. A look-alike oran berry? Eat it and take damage. They add to the challenge and danger, and make you always ask the question when you find a new item, "Do I experiment now, or do I wait until I'm closer to heading back to town before trying it out?" Of course, there will be a pokemon in town who helps you remove these "cursed" items...by using knock-off on you. Savvy players would then realize that if they get a pokemon with knock-off, they can remove the items themselves in dungeons, at the cost of a painful hit.


    ~~~~~~

    Ultimately, these are just a few of the ideas that have popped into my head. But I would LOOOOOVE for the PMD series to introduce more of the "hardcore" mechanics that Rogue-Like games are known for. And in the end, I believe it could work.




    Oh, and make weather not completely crap like in Gates. Holy cow. People praised the weather mechanic because it replaced hunger, but they failed to realize that it made weather based teams completely worthless. Wow. Oh, my team that uses weather boosts to gain ability buffs and damage boosts? Hope you guys don't like health regen. Ever.
     
  2. Sunset Star

    Sunset Star The DS Gamer

    ^ Most of that stuff sounds a bit too difficult, but the second one sounds like a good idea, as long as it's not like Children of Mana where every piece of equipment is just a more powerful version of the previous one. Bringing back the trade items would also be an amazing idea.
     
  3. Kyrix

    Kyrix Glitch Hunting Freak

    Fair enough. I could see how some of that stuff could get a bit out of hand, especially cursed items. It would certainly need balancing. But keep in mind - part of the goal of Mystery Dungeon games is to start small and build up stocks up items that you keep in the bank, so that when you go into the large dungeons you rely on the items you have, rather than the items you find, to get yourself through to the end. The items that you find along the way - items that would be "unidentified" would, then, be identified by the various shops around town, or even by yourself if your IQ skills are high enough to do so. It's not so much about being gung-ho and rushing about so much, but about coming into every dungeon prepared.


    But yeah, as for the equipment, I was thinking about keeping them more like how they currently are, rather than implementing a more "traditional" system. Rather than equipment being "more powerful versions of a previous tier piece of equipment," everything can be considered a side-grade - an item that is equal in potential value, but gives different benefits at different costs.

    The obvious analogy would be the power band versus the special band. One gives a nice bonus to your physical attacks, the other a nice bonus to to special attacks. Cut and dry. Then, of course, are your status immunity items, which don't give a stat boost, but that's the trade off for being immune to poison, or burn, or sleep. Of course, some can be seen as more powerful by some (I don't think anybody would disagree that X-Ray Specs are items of choice for end game play, and Mobile Scarves are great for backup), but even those have their drawbacks - the former gives no combat advantage other than knowledge of enemy locations, and the latter drains your belly as you traverse through walls. Of course, you probably remember all these, but I'm just reiterating why they already feel quite balanced, and there's no need to mess with the items too much, other than improving the stat buffing items.
     
  4. jolteonjak

    jolteonjak *swoons for Noland*

    Pretty much all of these. Bolded the ones I liked the most. I'd personally like to see them make three games instead of two.
     
  5. High Priest Reuniclus

    High Priest Reuniclus Active Member

    Pretty sure the other humans were murdered by the villains. There were more than one death euphemisms used my Kyurem and the partner describing what happened to them.


    That being said, I actually hope the starter quiz stays away, but that being said, it baffles me how people make such a big deal about it. It lasts for two minutes at the most as is no longer relevant when 'you' and the partner are already locked in. I'd rather just choose my pokemon and get to it.

    It also seems to be that after Explorers of Darkness/Time, they learned how to write decent stories with solid characters ala Sky's special episodes/Gates to Infinity, so I hope they keep that up as the only good source of decent stories within the pokemon franchise.

    Aside from that, the generic fixes people have mentioned would be good.
     
  6. Rakurai

    Rakurai Well-Known Member

    He was more referring to what happened to the humans before more of them were summoned into the world.

    They never bother explaining why the Pokemon in each game even know what a human is. PMD2 is the most confusing about it for the fact that they don't state that you came from another world like in the other games.
     
  7. Sunset Star

    Sunset Star The DS Gamer

    *She

    Not to mention, at the start of GTI, your partner says that "humans only exist in fairy tales". This is never touched upon again.
     
  8. tommytoe

    tommytoe Well-Known Member

    Maybe the PMD games are set in an alternate continuity where Mewtwo carried out his plans to wipe out humanity. That would explain why Pokemon know about humans but there aren't any around in the PMD world. Although, that doesn't explain the player character being human before the game starts. Maybe time travel?
     
  9. gamer2332

    gamer2332 Explorer of the Sky

    Everything BUT the hunger mechanic, please...
    Also, if the storyline is seriously going to be darker than GTI... I'm shooting myself! SERIOUSLY, just, the storyline...
    Make it at least a LITTLE bit lighthearted, but not AN Excuse Plot, like the Wiiware titles.
     
  10. Superteletubbies64

    Superteletubbies64 MAHINA-PEEEAAA!!!

    I've never player mystery dungeon, I wanted to but GTI but it's a bit late beacuse XY is released soon after so I didn't buy it and wait for the next mystery dungeon game
     
  11. Pink Harzard

    Pink Harzard So majestic

    I just want the natural healing in weather conditions back. I love to make weather explorations teams, but without natural healing it is just not smart to do.
    I was actually glad that in GTI the end boss wasn't a Pokémon. I have trouble to imagine Kyurem as plain evil.
     
  12. TheCharredDragon

    TheCharredDragon Blue Frog Ninja Gal

    To try and extend the time it takes to finish the whole game, as far as I know from a favorite author of mine who's played it because I haven't actually played Gates to Infinity. I have no idea what you said really, but ome of the things I liked in Sky was the headshots when they spoke was added for all Pokémon, not just the important characters, so I'd personally miss it unless they could possibly make it like Kingdom Hearts' headshots. XP

    That can explain why, but Bolt the Cat already said, 2015 or, in my opinion, in the middle of 6th generation sounds more like when it'll be released or at least announced.

    That certainly is an interesting idea. But like said before, it'll certainly a bit too hard if they don't balance it. But all of that makes sense in terms of story because, if I remember correctly, a mystery dungeon is more like a cursed area that a bit mild in terms of curses, so cursed items would make some sense.

    The wearable stuff I'd most want to see 'cause Pokémon can obviously wear more than one thing, seeing that's the closest thing you can do dressing up your members XP, but not carry more than one item, for limb and battle manuaver reasons.

    Like everyone else, I want the obvious stuff, especially more recruitable Pokémon (it's fun pretending characters from your story are really in the game) but I won't be too upset if they're not added. Except maybe making all of the dungeons too easy. XP
     
  13. Akiyama

    Akiyama Awake me if Ash wins

    I don't know what is shared between the worlds of the PMD games in terms of their history. It seems like the three worlds seen so far are different. After all, why should they be the same world? Each story had a save the world plot. We haven't had a sequel or prequel of any game. Then again, I'm not sure if PMD would want to go for something like Final Fantasy did with its endless series.

    Oh yeah, I just had this idea that PMD could have a trilogy of games for some special, long story. You could pull off something like Mass Effect did with its three games did, or the three games in the Metroid Prime series (from Nintendo).

    The problem is in how long it takes to write a series like that. I'm not sure if they do this, but it would make sense that they review concepts for the story before they approve it for production. If they do this like Pixar, they would have to go through hundreds of short ideas to see what interests them, and then build some of them, and see how it feels in story form. As for examples of PMD stories that are that long, I have not seen such a story. Oh well, they're paid to write, so we can only hope that they steal the good stuff from fanfiction stories. And would it be awesome to have a trilogy for PMD? If you have a good story, it would be amazing.

    Your children will probably play this trilogy while you play it at your job. If you can pull that off, Nintendo and Chunsoft, I would be so impressed.

    Gameplay mechanics mentioned in this thread are very important, but I have no more to add on that.

    Nah.

    It's a nice theory of the history of the worlds of PMD, but it doesn't really matter. I just imagined that the playable character will somehow defeat Mewtwo as some baby starter pokémon.

    I'm not sure why I was okay with my characters in PMD defeating legendary pokémon so easily. I mean, yeah, I spammed the sleep seeds, but they seem like chumps now that I think about it. Oh well, it works because I don't want to grind until level 90. If I had to grind that long until I could beat an enemy, it better be the last boss.

    I think I'll make a bet with somebody about the release date of this PMD game.

    The idea about animated headshots is interesting, but it would take a lot more time to put them in. I admit that that would be pretty awesome though.

    As for slow text scroll speed, the skip button should always be in the game.

    And if anyone's going to bring up open world gameplay like Elder Scrolls had, I guess that would be pretty sweet. On a 3DS? Maybe. On a PC or console? I would buy a Wii U for that. One problem with that is in how to tell who's a wild or dangerous pokémon when not in a mystery dungeon. This may also fail because it's a big jump from what PMD was in the past. You had one civilized town in each game so far. However, an open world would be more complex that what PMD-U (Deviantart RP) turned into. . .

    For now, I expect the next PMD to continue like it has. Or maybe I'll be surprised.
     
  14. TheCharredDragon

    TheCharredDragon Blue Frog Ninja Gal

    Trilogy? I would definitely try to get all three, probably only for the sake of completeness though. XP Like why I wanna get Gates to Infinty. But in all seriousness, that would be super awesome.

    It certainly would if it is like that, annoying, yes, but interesting for someone who likes to write PMD fanfics. XP Well, I personally think it's silly there's only one town on the whole continent when letters are coming from all over it. Lots of towns might be pushing it a bit but three or four towns are more reasonable than only one.

    Also, Mega Evolution is totally possible seeing as they said in the Mega Evolution special episode that humans only draw out the power from the Pokémon, not give it to them. But it'll be very difficult to activate it. My first thought is certain levels or I.Q. (if they add it) in order to access it but I'm starting to doubt it.
     
  15. Akiyama

    Akiyama Awake me if Ash wins

    From a sales point, you would likely have more and more gamers buy from the series as the first, then the second, and finally the third game is released. From a story writing point of view, it's a pain to write that much. The amount of characters goes up, and the possibility of plot holes goes up, and it just takes longer. Wow, given a great story with how prominent the franchise is, you would have a very popular trilogy. Add this to the mainstream pokémon games's sales, and you have two great sellers instead of one. I wouldn't mind giving them like three years to plan out their story if they are actually doing such a trilogy. In addition to being paid well, I think a good incentive for such a team of writers would be a percentage of game sales going to them.

    The idea of having only one accessible town did make me care a lot more about the characters in the town. It's not something that bothered me too much while I played the game. Having more than one town should have a reason behind it like growing the plot, characterization, and gameplay events like quests. It would, however, be really stupid to have open world gameplay and only one town to visit. (However, I liked the traveling system seen in PMD: Explorers of Time, it's not needed to go open world unless the writers have a ton of ideas to put into the setting.)

    Really depends on the story if you need more that one town, too. Let's see, ScytheRider, Knightfall, you, I, Vulpi, and so many PMD fanfic writers make up our own regions. In my case, it would be a disaster to put my story in any of the settings of the PMD games so far. Thus it's possible you'll see different towns in the next game.

    Which brings up some really bad story ideas in my head (cheesy use of Mega Evolution). Throughout PMD's series, it hasn't allowed evolution until after the main storyline. I think this is done so that gamers stay attached to their cute pokémon selves. It worked for me, at least. Mega evolution is an unseen power level in PMD, but it might be a powerful plot device to have the human hero in the story draw out that power from other pokémon, which makes me wonder if the human hero can mega evolve from his or her own will in this potential game. As for IQ, sure, we could use that leveling system, but other requirements like a certain level may be needed.

    Speaking of him or her, if I recall correctly, PMD: Gates to Infinity had a dialogue issue with how it didn't use gender pronouns. That's what I noticed by watching people play it. It's not a big deal, but it's awkward to try reading dialogue when I have no idea if they're male or female.

    There's also the silent protagonist issue throughout all the PMD games. I guess it had to be there in order for the story to continue without too many choices throwing the story everywhere. We'll likely see it again if the story needs it. However, my gosh, it is still awkward to almost never talk when I want to interact. Like, where is my character's dialogue, and why is he letting my partner talk all the time? (btw, save the voice acting for the anime, if you ever produce that from PMD's inspirations.)
     
  16. Pink Harzard

    Pink Harzard So majestic

    I was actually thinking about that one big main town gets missions from the whole region. The smaler towns only get missions from nearby dungeons. If those villages can't or won't do all the missions they get (sometimes they can get more missions than they can handle), it will be send to the main town. Also missions regarding strong criminals or very dangerous dungeons would be send to the big main town.
    Well that's how I think about it.^^
     
  17. TheCharredDragon

    TheCharredDragon Blue Frog Ninja Gal

    @Akiyama

    (The more than one town)

    Okay, it's a good idea from that standpoint. But that doesn't mean I won't be happy if they really do it. XP

    (About Mega Evolution)

    You got a point there, especially if Mega Evolution can be accessed rather early in the game. That's really the main reason I can see it being added, so much chaos can be made from Pokémon trying to figure out what happened to a bad guy that made then change form. Yeah, that's a better idea.

    (About Gates to Infinity and the silent protagonist)

    I haven't played Gates to Infinity but that is certainly awkward, especially for gender exclusive Pokémon.

    Um... I think get you mean. Another thing that makes the silent protagonist reasonable for the first few PMD games is the personality test, and since it's basically you in that world, it'd be weird saying something you wouldn't say (plus, more work for them if they make choices for each personality aspect). But Gates to Infinity? I see less of a reason. But still agree that it's super weird, the silence of the hero... Well, except maybe Bumblebee of the Trasformers movies. XP

    @Pink Hazard

    Okay, that makes sense. Still wonder where all those little-r towns are though. XP

    Oh, and, to no one in particular, I think ot'll be interesting on the lore they'll make for Xerneas, Yveltal and Zygarde. I just hope they don't make Yveltal evil. X/ Death is just a part of life, it's not neccessarily evil. But nobody really likes death so yeah...
     
  18. Pink Harzard

    Pink Harzard So majestic

    The small towns aren't just showed in-game, I guess. I also think that those little towns sustain theirself with effective and ecological agriculture or permaculture gardens to provide food and medicines.

    It sounds interesting, but I'm afraid that they make Yveltal evil or Mr Misunderstood. Let's look at the villians in the previous games: The first games had to deal with natural disasters ans an incoming meteor. I haven't done postgame because the emulater broke down (I could't get the original) so I don't know more about it.
    Explorers of Time/Darkness/Sky had to cope with preventing planet paralysis. But the one was caused all this was Darkrai. He didn't show any guild or remorse about his doings, so that make him quite the evil villian. But well, he got away but will suffer memory loss, so that was solved.
    Gates to Infinity had as the last boss the bittercold and was protected by Kyurem. Kyurem was just influenced by the negative feelings emmited from the bittercold and decided for himself that the future of destruction have to be protected. And well, the bittercold itself is a manifestation of negative feelings from all Pokémon.

    So yeah, if there comes a PMD game with Xerneas, Yveltal and Zygarde I'm afraid that Yveltal ends up as ''the misunderstood Pokémon''
    Or they pull of a Gates to Infinity and only Zygarde will have a main role in-game, being the number three that balances out the other two.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2014
  19. Rakurai

    Rakurai Well-Known Member

    Considering how they decided to break out of cliches by making a seemingly obviously evil Pokemon a good guy along with the opposite in GtI, I'd be surprised if they went with the obvious choice of making Yveltal the main antagonist or something like that.

    I'm also curious as to how they intend to go about handling Mega Evolution in the next game, considering how much they love having your hero and partner remain incapable of evolution until the story is completely finished. I suppose they could just make it a gameplay element instead of anything with any major plot importance.
     
  20. Bolt the Cat

    Bolt the Cat Bringing the Thunder

    I think it serves as a clever compromise between having a silent protagonist and actual dialogue, I really wish the main games would pick up on that.

    I could see them making Yveltal some kind of pseudo-villain turned anti-hero or something like that. Maybe the protagonist believes he's responsible initially, confronts him, and then finds out that he wasn't the one causing the problem (maybe with the Primals being the real villains in the games).

    That was still kind of cliche though, because they also did a villain switch in Explorers with Grovyle and Dusknoir.
     
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