A League of His Own! (928)

[Alexander18]

I always consider Mega Charizard X the strongest of the two and Alain showed us that Y stood no chance against X. Trevor's other two pokemon could have at least gotten a hit in but I guess Mega Charizard X was too good even for them.

 

[NitraMania]

I was mostly disappointed by the fact that we didn't get any reactions of Ash-Greninja - just a simple shout-out from the commentator, one surprised look from Tierno and a Trevor who thinks it's a mega.

I would've really loved to see Sycamore's reaction, and maybe some other cameos like Alexa, the Ninja Village (where the legend about the Hero Greninja comes from) and so on.

Maybe they'll show flashbacks of Sycamore's reaction (or him going to the bathroom while it happens).

But maybe there'll be more of that in the next episode.

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

I was mostly disappointed by the fact that we didn't get any reactions of Ash-Greninja - just a simple shout-out from the commentator, one surprised look from Tierno and a Trevor who thinks it's a mega.

Two words:

Talking Meowth.

 

[DS0308]

I was mostly disappointed by the fact that we didn't get any reactions of Ash-Greninja - just a simple shout-out from the commentator, one surprised look from Tierno and a Trevor who thinks it's a mega.

I would've really loved to see Sycamore's reaction, and maybe some other cameos like Alexa, the Ninja Village (where the legend about the Hero Greninja comes from) and so on.

Maybe they'll show flashbacks of Sycamore's reaction (or him going to the bathroom while it happens).

But maybe there'll be more of that in the next episode.

The commentator did react... and the whole crowd did too. I'd hope Sycamore comes later.

 

[dman_dustin]

Well, from the subs I saw it was implied that Trevor wanted to save his mega for later rounds as he says "fine I'll bring out my mega from the start."

The only issue I take with this perspective, is that Trevor sent out Charizard first, which unless your saying his OTHER Pokemon in their base forms is stronger than Charizard, he still sent out Charizard his mega capable Pokemon first.

Sure he may have wanted to save Mega Charizard Y for maybe after he defeats some of Alain's Pokemon and as a LAST resort.

But he still sent out Charizard first even before Alain sent out his. So he still technically sent out his strongest Pokemon most likely because he wanted to show it off. I can understand Trevor felt FORCED to use his Mega Evolution SOONER in the battle, and maybe he didn't want to have to mega evolve Charizard against Alain, but he still ultimately did.

However with Tomo, there was literally no reason for him to use Altaria first.

Are you saying reason from the point of view of the audience, or from the point of view of the character?

If from the point of view from the audience, he was dressed like an Altaria. Usually, CotD/Random Trainer No. 52345 are often dressed like the pokemon they're most associated with, or their ace. In this case, Tomo was dressed like an Altaria, so it's safe to assume Altaria's his strongest.

Um....I disagree with this. Tomo had only a slight color scheme relation to Altaria. If you didn't already know Tomo had Altaria, there's no way to assume he would've had an Altaria. Especially when his undershirt looks like Chandelure. Can we assume he also had Chandelure even though it wasn't confirmed.

If from the point of view from the character, Tomo just saw Alain and Trevor pull out their strongest right off the bat.

Except he'd only assume it was their starter Pokemon. Perhaps strongest because they can mega evolve. But it didn't looks like Altaria's trainer could mega evolve his Altaria. If he could and couldn't activate it and it was confirmed, then I would buy Altaria as his strongest. The issue is Altaria doesn't come off as a very strong Pokemon, not saying it couldn't be his strongest, but still comes off as strange, especially when a lot of other evolved Pokemon are stronger than it, even Flygon. If it is his strongest, fine, it just wouldn't make sense for it to be or to assume it to be unless it could mega evolve and we didn't get that.

 

[potat_lasaro]

The only issue I take with this perspective, is that Trevor sent out Charizard first, which unless your saying his OTHER Pokemon in their base forms is stronger than Charizard, he still sent out Charizard his mega capable Pokemon first.

I understand that he still sent Charizard out first, but I was arguing your point that he did it to show off his Mega which wasn't the point. He wanted to use his strongest first and get off to a good start while also keeping Charizard's mega evolution as an ace up his sleeve for later on. Trevor didn't think Alain would probably be that strong and tried to throw some muscle around with his Charizard only to be shocked by how strong his opponent actually was.

 

[Mrs. Oreo]

Can't say this was my favourite league opener cuz we didn't even see Ash's whole battle against the Altaria guy, tho I did like that Greninja won fast against Altaria and impressed the audience. And Alain vs Trevor was over quick as well, which made me feel sorry for Trevor especially since his mega Charizard Y hardly did anything. :[

 

[p96822]

Hey we have a refence to Iris in this episode or her catchphrase.

Bonnie called Ash a little kid

 

[Epicocity]

Um....I disagree with this. Tomo had only a slight color scheme relation to Altaria. If you didn't already know Tomo had Altaria, there's no way to assume he would've had an Altaria. Especially when his undershirt looks like Chandelure. Can we assume he also had Chandelure even though it wasn't confirmed.

Except he'd only assume it was their starter Pokemon. Perhaps strongest because they can mega evolve. But it didn't looks like Altaria's trainer could mega evolve his Altaria. If he could and couldn't activate it and it was confirmed, then I would buy Altaria as his strongest. The issue is Altaria doesn't come off as a very strong Pokemon, not saying it couldn't be his strongest, but still comes off as strange, especially when a lot of other evolved Pokemon are stronger than it, even Flygon. If it is his strongest, fine, it just wouldn't make sense for it to be or to assume it to be unless it could mega evolve and we didn't get that.

Okay, but what about the puff around his collar? Are you really going to tell me they aren't reminiscent of an Altaria? Maybe he did have a Chandelure, but his clothes struck me as Altaria right from the off, even from the preview. Or maybe I'm color blind and fashion-blind and don't know it...

The thing is, both Alain and Trevor Mega Evolved their first Pokemon. A Mega would usually imply the strongest on the team. And not everyone has a Mega. It doesn't look like Tierno does and Blastoise is his strongest (presumably), so we can assume that Tomo didn't have a Mega, Altaria was his strongest, and he sent it out because he saw both trainers in the first match send out their strongest and may have figured his opponent would do the same. Logically, it makes sense.

 

[CupidKirby]

I saw the episode with subs as well and I must say, it is a lot better when you know what's going on. I liked Ash repeatedly declaring nationally that he'll win the Kalos League. And it looks like it's confirmed that Greninja did indeed one-shot everything to mirror Alain's victory. Haha, when Ash was late to his first league match, James made a jab about how he's always doing stuff like this. It was like he contained the 19-year old exasperation of the entire random within that one line.

While I still don't approve of how they handled Trevor's character, the rest of this episode gets better the more I watch it.

A bit out-of-the blue, but I can see Sawyer's role in this saga adapting to Wally a lot better. Especially since there is no anime-counterpart for Wally, the sudden jump in power to be ahead of the main until the very last second would be in line with the games (thus resulting in less complaints), him appearing at around the sixth gym would've been good ORAS promotion, and the additional "OC rival" complaints would be quelled. It would've been nice to showcase Mega Gallade too. Oh well.

Hey we have a refence to Iris in this episode or her catchphrase.

Bonnie called Ash a little kid

...

I will forgive you this time, Bonnie.

 

[InfernoApe]

Just for discussion's sake: what would moving all of this changed?

Had we expanded on the Tomo battle and seen all of it, by the implication that was made of Ash saying he'll "oneshot every one", all we would have been seeing is Greninja sweeping quickly. Then we would complain that Ash's other pokemon didn't get the chance to shine.

Now, say that we had a whole episode to feature the Top 32 and Top 16 together, sure we would see more from Ash's team, but what would be the value? Seeing him curbstomp? Sounds like a waste of an episode in a small way, doesn't it? It all comes down to a double-edged sword. If you want one thing, you have to be willing to sacrifice another. Personally, I'm more willing to sacrifice curbstomp battles in favor of a cohesive storyline.

I guess, what I'm trying to say, at the risk of rambling and sounding repetitive, is that XY has always been a different series. This League isn't like other Leagues. It's not a battle fest with only one meaningful battle (if we even get that), but a story with four meaningful ones for Ash as a character. When one stops seeing it that way...holy crap, the episode becomes a LOT more enjoyable. Maybe it's the writer in me, but I guess I'm trying to help everyone who disliked the episode come to see it in a different light so that they can enjoy the remainder of the League with positivity rather than relegating it to "worst League ever" based off of one episode, some summaries, and an expectation that the writers may not be trying to fulfill (or are fulfilling in a different way).

You're still not giving any reasons for the previous episode. Would the storyling have suffered without the Clemont filler? In my opinion the storyline would have been fine with an episode showing the top 32 and 16.

I don't think you're trying to help others see the positives. I think you're trying to justify the episode and league for yourself.

 

[Epicocity]

You're still not giving any reasons for the previous episode. Would the storyling have suffered without the Clemont filler? In my opinion the storyline would have been fine with an episode showing the top 32 and 16.

I don't think you're trying to help others see the positives. I think you're trying to justify the episode and league for yourself.

Nah, I've already admitted an extra episode wouldn't have been bad, but I'm saying that it's not bad as it is. All I'm saying is that the thematic tones they used in the episode made it far more solid than people care to admit, or they just don't understand Japanese and are going solely on what they see (which is never a proper way to judge things). What I am saying is that, assuming Ash wastes these opponents in the Top 32 and Top 16, do we need to see them? It would be incredibly boring to watch. Then we'd get complaints of wasting an episode on seeing Ash sweep pointlessly with next to no tension. How is that batter than just getting through them quickly? Because you want the battles? That seems pointless from a storytelling perspective.

Honestly, I'm not trying to justify it. I've had numerous moments where I was disappointed with a raw version...then I saw the subs and it absolved it because I understood what was really happening. But to each their own. If people want to be disappointed and not look at the bright side...more power to them. And I'm trying to mean this in the kindest way possible while realizing I probably sound like a jerk.

 

[InfernoApe]

Yeah you kinda do, but so do I. So it's fine

I agree with you that they shouldn't show every battle in full. But maybe in the way they showed the 2nd and 3rd round in the Indigo league. That would have made all the difference. I don't see why people should see the positive in everything. If the writers screw up they should be called out for it.

But you want desperately to like and defend the anime and that's your opinion. You're entitled to have it.

 

[Epicocity]

Yeah you kinda do, but so do I. So it's fine

I agree with you that they shouldn't show every battle in full. But maybe in the way they showed the 2nd and 3rd round in the Indigo league. That would have made all the difference. I don't see why people should see the positive in everything. If the writers screw up they should be called out for it.

But you want desperately to like and defend the anime and that's your opinion. You're entitled to have it.

But whether the writers screw up. In some cases, sure, it's objective, but in other cases...well, that's your opinion. So, let's just agree to disagree. You wanted a string of battles shown that you didn't get, and you're disappointed. Totally understandable. I want a cohesive narrative story with battles to emphasize it, so I'm happy. Of course...I hated the episode just as much as everyone else until I saw it with subs, so...Don't know what that says about me, exactly.

 

[InfernoApe]

But whether the writers screw up. In some cases, sure, it's objective, but in other cases...well, that's your opinion. So, let's just agree to disagree. You wanted a string of battles shown that you didn't get, and you're disappointed. Totally understandable. I want a cohesive narrative story with battles to emphasize it, so I'm happy. Of course...I hated the episode just as much as everyone else until I saw it with subs, so...Don't know what that says about me, exactly.

It says that at first you disliked it. But after multiple watches you were justifying the episode more and more because you want to like the anime.

FYI I watched with subs too. You are talking in extremes. I think there is a middleground between 'a string of battles' and this monstrosity.

 

[Epicocity]

It says that at first you disliked it. But after multiple watches you were justifying the episode more and more because you want to like the anime.

FYI I watched with subs too. You are talking in extremes. I think there is a middleground between 'a string of battles' and this monstrosity.

I'm not, though. I only watched it twice. Once to watch. Once to understand with the subs. Once I understood what was being said, it changed everything in mind. I don't consistently rewatch things just to justify them.

For example, I watched the last Ash vs. Sawyer battle at least three times, trying to see if I could enjoy it, even with subs. I still can't excuse the crap writing that was Clawitzer, to me. Even if I want to justify it, I can't. Maybe there is a middle ground, but what do you think should have been done to meet that middle ground while making the point they wanted to make? Genuinely interested. Let's say we're stuck with the pointless filler episode the week before, still, how would you have written the episode to convey the points they wanted to make while still making it what you wanted?

 

[InfernoApe]

I'm not, though. I only watched it twice. Once to watch. Once to understand with the subs. Once I understood what was being said, it changed everything in mind. I don't consistently rewatch things just to justify them.

For example, I watched the last Ash vs. Sawyer battle at least three times, trying to see if I could enjoy it, even with subs. I still can't excuse the crap writing that was Clawitzer, to me. Even if I want to justify it, I can't. Maybe there is a middle ground, but what do you think should have been done to meet that middle ground while making the point they wanted to make? Genuinely interested. Let's say we're stuck with the pointless filler episode the week before, still, how would you have written the episode to convey the points they wanted to make while still making it what you wanted?

No that's the whole point. It can't be done. They need the extra episode before the semi finals. If they show parts of battles I'd rather see the ending. Maybe they could have at least confirmed that Greninja sweep.

I'm sorry man, but every 'argument' you make is just you grasping at straws to justify what the writers are doing with this league.

 

[Epicocity]

No that's the whole point. It can't be done. They need the extra episode before the semi finals. If they show parts of battles I'd rather see the ending. Maybe they could have at least confirmed that Greninja sweep.

I'm sorry man, but every 'argument' you make is just you grasping at straws to justify what the writers are doing with this league.

All right. If that's how you feel, that's fine. Your point about confirming Greninja's sweep is fair, though. They tried to imply it, but an outright statement would have, indeed, been better.

To you, I can understand why you think I'm grasping at straaws, but I think that just comes from the dissonance in our opinion. I enjoyed it for what it was; you didn't. Therefore I feel like you don't want to look at it in a positive way while you feel like I'm grasping at straws. So, that said, agree to disagree? Both have our separate opinions on the episode and leave it at that?

 

[InfernoApe]

All right. If that's how you feel, that's fine. Your point about confirming Greninja's sweep is fair, though. They tried to imply it, but an outright statement would have, indeed, been better.

To you, I can understand why you think I'm grasping at straaws, but I think that just comes from the dissonance in our opinion. I enjoyed it for what it was; you didn't. Therefore I feel like you don't want to look at it in a positive way while you feel like I'm grasping at straws. So, that said, agree to disagree? Both have our separate opinions on the episode and leave it at that?

Yeah I think that would be best. I'm just hoping the full battles will make up for this a little.

 

[Epicocity]

Yeah I think that would be best. I'm just hoping the full battles will make up for this a little.

I'm with you there. Granting, I can't see them screwing those up, but if they do...yeesh...you won't see me defending it, either. Though, I won't judge them until the battles are complete, either way.