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American Politics: THANKS OBAMA

Discussion in 'Debate Forum' started by ccangelopearl1362, Dec 16, 2012.

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  1. John Madden

    John Madden resident policy guy

    Maedar, you may want to emptyquote this post.

    You are presupposing two things:

    1) that this insurance company in question isn't participating in Iowa's exchanges, and
    2) that the law's cost estimates are reliant only on exchange/Medicaid participation - specifically, that increased participation in private insurance outside the exchanges would not also drive down costs.

    Your first presupposition is already incorrect given that Wellmark Blue Cross and Blue Shield is a participant in the federal exchanges for the state of Iowa and is running this campaign to encourage direct enrollment by phone/mail rather than using healthcare.gov; ergo we don't need to deal with the second presupposition.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  2. Maedar

    Maedar Banned

    Hurting his party? Stopping the GOPs from abusing the filibuster and blocking every judicial nominee and Democrat-proposed bill, ending the obstructionist strategy will "hurt the party"?
  3. BigLutz

    BigLutz Banned

    Lets pretend its the future, three years from now. The Republicans have a slight majority in the House and Senate, and Ted Cruz is being sworn in as President. Now do you want to allow Ted Cruz and the Republicans and the House and Senate to have free reign over any bill or judicial nominee they propose?

    This is the problem I had when Republicans tried to do it in 2005. Just because it helps you in the short term, does not mean it will help you in the long term. Because eventually the Democrats will be in the minority and with the filibuster gone they will have only themselves to blame.
  4. John Madden

    John Madden resident policy guy

    Presupposing that Ted Cruz, a GOP Senate and a continued GOP House were democratically elected (note: it's the Cruz part that's so vanishingly unlikely so as to immediately suspect foul play), I see no reason why I should oppose Senate reform such that the body actually functions with majority up-and-down votes for nominees like it's supposed to.
  5. WizardTrubbish

    WizardTrubbish much more beastly

    You don't necessarily have to completely end to filibuster, just put limits on its use. For example, limit the amount of times it can be used per congressional session, o prevent abuse. That way, it would only be used in extreme circumstances like it was originally intended for
  6. BigLutz

    BigLutz Banned

    That merely means the party only has to reintroduce the same version of the bill enough times that it causes the filibuster limit to end.
  7. John Madden

    John Madden resident policy guy

    Interestingly, the last PPP poll toward this end found widespread support for limiting how many times a bill can be filibustered as well as the conditions under which that filibuster can persist.
  8. Queequeg

    Queequeg Well-Known Member

  9. John Madden

    John Madden resident policy guy

    Yes, perhaps the President should rehire the people he already fired so he can fire them again.

    (And I hate to post this with that forum announcement still in place, but it's probably saying something that I can't find anyone at all posting about this outside of the anarcho-capitalist fringe - even left-libertarians and other pro-military types haven't been posting about it.)
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  10. Maedar

    Maedar Banned

    Yeah, Lutz, that's why Reid and the other influential Democrats caved all the previous times they threatened to do it, because they were afraid that the Republicans might gain a majority in 2014.

    I think that NOW, after all that's happened, they think that they're safe. The influential and important Democrats who are still afraid that it's a serious threat are getting fewer and fewer by the week, and most - if any - doubt it will happen at this point.

    "Let's pretend" you say? That's all the Republicans can do now with any of their ambitions, pretend.

    Ted Cruz as President? Only in the dreams of the most fanatic and most unrealistic members of the Tea Party, Lutz.

    By the way, getting back to the issue of fundraising:


    Wow, a record-breaking $7 million in October, and 2014 is still a year a way. The Tea Party supporters are still trying to convince others (and themselves more than ever) of "the worst bloodbath for the Democrats in history" come 2014, but fewer and fewer people are believing it with each passing day.

    Oh, I should add that my own $50 are included in there.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  11. BigLutz

    BigLutz Banned

    Lets look at some facts shall we?

    President Obama is now at 37% Approval Rating, with support for Obamacare dropped down to 31 percent, both a new record on CBS' poll


    On the Congressional Generic Ballot Republicans are either tied or ahead in it, with young people favoring them as well.


    Young people also trust Republicans in Congress on issues like: The Economy, Health Care, Immigration, and the Federal Budget


    Quotes from Democrats on Obamacare are saying this

    “Here we are, we’re supposed to be selling this to people, and it’s all screwed up,” one chief of staff ranted. “This either gets fixed or this could be the demise of the Democratic Party.

    “It’s probably the worst I’ve ever seen it,” the aide said of the recent mood on Capitol Hill. “It’s bad. It’s really bad.”


    Now, what in all of that makes you believe Democrats think they are going to hold on in 2014?
  12. Peter Quill

    Peter Quill star-lord

    No, you completely missed the point.

    They're calling you a liar because you were trying to present your personal opinions as facts and had absolutely no sort of evidence to back up claims like "Ban all Muslims from entering the United States". You're free to have your opinion, but you also have to realize that... people will call you out if you say something really stupid? Because as much as I dislike many republicans that has to be one of the stupidest things I've ever read. You're completely in the wrong and I hope you think about it before trying that again.

    (And yes it's still a free bloody country you're not going to get put in jail for having a contrary opinion)

    You can direct questions to my inbox. I was just dealing with reports/pms and clearing things up :)
  13. Maedar

    Maedar Banned

    To be honest, it was a reference to this:


    Many Tea Party members, Bachmann especially, have concocted wild conspiracy theories about Muslims that seem to suggest that they think the words "Muslim" and "terrorist" are synonyms, and also suggest - or rather prove to most Democrats - that they are bigots.

    That's what I meant by that part.
  14. BigLutz

    BigLutz Banned

    So.. how did you get from the Muslim Brotherhood, a political group in Egypt to Republicans wishing to ban all Muslims? Furthermore how did you get from one speech by Michelle Bachmann to the idea that this immigration blocking idea you pulled out from thin air is now a platform of the Republican party? And finally where do you get in there that Tea Party members think "Muslim" and "Terrorist" are synonymous?
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  15. LDSman

    LDSman Banned

    Talks about why some gov't groups need to go away.


  16. BigLutz

    BigLutz Banned

    Oh just too good not to post...

  17. bobjr

    bobjr It's Fusion, I don't have to expalin it. Staff Member Moderator

    This thread is getting to be a mess, and it's clear that just giving warnings won't do anything, so the thread will be closed for the time being.
    Maedar likes this.
  18. Peter Quill

    Peter Quill star-lord

    Just to expand upon:

    Sogeking and I discussed this together. It's getting clear that us giving infractions and telling people to stop doing antagonizing behavior hasn't really helped the situation in this thread at all. What it boils down to is that it's too much of a pain to moderate right now. It's also really hard because I haven't set up a set of concrete rules yet - that and the fact this thread gets pages of pages a day which is basically HERE HAVE A LINK with one liner discussion (Which then goes into OBAMA SUX or REPUBLICANS SUX HARDER) it's just... tiring. We're sick of it.

    It's clear that you guys can't handle the discussion.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
    Canada likes this.
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