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Amourshipping General Discussion - V.2 *Spoiler Warning*

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Lorde

Banned
View attachment 14468
Look at that that, they are so close too each other!! I totally ship backpackshipping

While it's neat that they're literally close to each other during the forest fire, I don't take that as a real shipping hint; I wish Serena had grabbed Ash's hand or something instead. That would've been way more AmourShippy in my opinion. Anyway, I didn't even consider the next episode as having any shipping moments if I'm being honest since it seems less about Serena and Ash and more about Ash and Tierno. :c
 

Ikcatcher

Firebird Phoenix
This one is very easy to answer yet very tough at the same time. I say this because you are asking for the emotions that we have for amourshipping and unless we are all trolling one another (which would be hilarious), most of us are going to have the same emotions: we are excited for it, we ship it, we find it to be adorable, and we hope it goes canon from both sides. Now, if you had asked the question of What is your favorite Amourshipping-based meme, then my answer is this: http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2014/213/4/9/serena_meme_by_lunadude1996-d7t9t72.jpg. Sadly, you and Ikcatcher answered the question you asked (off topic, anyone notice that Ikcatcher's skeleton image has TWO mouses yet ONE keyboard. Just an observation)

Now, I have a question for all of you. Imagine you are in this scenario: a friend or some random stranger comes up to you. They have been into the Pokemon anime for a very long time (let's say they have been there since the original series, like most of us on here have been) yet they were hesitant to ship Ash with anyone, because they didn't give any thought into shipping. Now, said person comes to you and says, "I want to get into shipping Ash with a female companion" Note that he/she does not specify which female companion he/she wants to ship Ash with. That means they are willing to ship Ash with any of Ash's female companions (yes, even Iris...Okay, I do apologize that I hate on Iris as much as I do, but she made me hate BW so she is getting her just desserts). As an amourshipper, your goal is to make this person an Amourshipper/choose SerenaxAsh over all the other possible pairings. So now the question: What would you do to convince this person to become an amourshipper? Would you show them a specific scene? A specific episode? A Youtube video? Artwork (i.e. the poster from Animedia Magazine)? Remember, your job is to get them hooked into Amourshipping.

Edit: I should make it important that you only need to give one thing. You do not have to give an individual scene, an episode, a video, and a piece of artwork plus anything else you can think of. Just think of one and briefly explain why you would use it. Or you can make an essay out of it, your choice

Well,obviously I would show them the flashback scene (in Japanese because it has Love Her City's theme for extra “magical effect").Because it's something completely different than any other Pokemon series.
Trust me I showed that scene to two of my friends and they both really like it
 
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Everlasting

Everything stays.
While it's neat that they're literally close to each other during the forest fire, I don't take that as a real shipping hint; I wish Serena had grabbed Ash's hand or something instead. That would've been way more AmourShippy in my opinion. Anyway, I didn't even consider the next episode as having any shipping moments if I'm being honest since it seems less about Serena and Ash and more about Ash and Tierno. :c

Who said it had to be a hint ? It's just fun to watch them being this close and see people go crazy for it. I know I am :D
Though I agree this episode probably won't be all that shippy, I'm hoping either one of them does something to protect the other from the fire before Sliggoo/Wartortle stops it.
 

_Dog

Well-Known Member
It's been a while since I've made a post here. Perhaps I thought I'd give a few thoughts on what past posts have said.

First, to Mewtario: welcome to the forum! I'm glad you've given a whole lot to contribute since coming here two weeks ago. I would like to comment on some of your posts though.

The classification system is well-thought out, but I can't say it is without flaws. Personally, there are some "hints" that I don't find hints at all, such as the so-called animators' hints (sorry Sp1derP1g, but a lot of what you've written just aren't hints at all; someone could do something similar for any other shipping, including failed ones--can those animators' hints really be valid for something like Advanceshipping, a pairing that didn't happen and is extremely unlikely to happen?). Instead I feel that they are just people spinning something ordinary into something it's not supposed to be.

So in other words, the majority of what some feel are Class D hints really belong to Class F--can we really use something like Serena seeing a Luvdisc or her Pokevision video having 44k views as hints? I think not. Stuff like this reminds me of why I've disliked shippings for so long--I am not going to defend Amourshipping against its detractors by stating that Korrina has very long hair!

In all honesty, what is labeled as Class E hints is stronger than the vast majority of Class D hints. The relationship charts show direct evidence of Serena's crush on Ash, which is much more convincing than the fact that their backpacks are together inside the show.

The remaining four classes is alright, but personally I would classify them like this:

Class C would be the equivalent of "circumstantial evidence". A girl being very worried for a boy while the boy is playing in a soccer game isn't necessarily a sign of love, but if she had been showing signs of attraction and feelings towards him in the past, then that makes her worrying a powerful sign that she likes him. This is the same case with Serena when she worried about Ash during his fight against Grant, or when she was on the point of crying when she thought she lost him in the mirror episode, or when she called Ash "an amazing person". Anyone can call anybody amazing, but with the other, stronger hints in play, it makes her case particularly powerful.

Class B would be equivalent of "direct evidence". This is where stuff like Serena's blushes and jealousies belong. Signs like this are not up to interpretation--they're practically indisputable. Hence, hints such as Serena's sudden worry that Ash was referring to Aria when she heard the word "cute", the redness she went through at the end of XY026, or her attempt at hand holding at the "date" episode--such is a direct sign of Serena's crush on Ash.

Class A is something I agree with you on. Like with Class B hints, Class A hints are also direct evidence, but to me we have not received any yet. An example of a Class A hint would be something like these:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTodUxEh-RE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=YyszVlW8I1E#t=1141

As mentioned in your sig, it's a direct statement from either side in the pairing. We have yet to receive one of these, but hopefully we can see a confession come out of Serena.

As for Class S, I am in full agreement here--this is for ships that become canon. The big elephant in this thread is to see if Amourshipping will become canon, but the great obstacle is whether or the S.S. Amour will survive the Bermuda Triangle--the status quo that has cursed the show for so long, putting a dense Ash in an endless cycle of new companions, new Pokemon, getting eight badges, getting stalked by Team Rocket, and ultimately destined for failure at the end of each saga. I've had enough of it, and therefore XY is my last chance at getting this anime a go--if they screw this up I am done with the show for good.

Now, concerning your analysis, I honestly think you're overthinking it here. Though the Japan population crisis problem is true, I doubt they're putting Amourshipping into the show as a result of it and of natalist politics in general. While the show is created and written by Japanese people, you need to keep in mind that Pokemon's fanbase and viewers and the target audience is worldwide, and not every place will suffer a population crisis in the future (we in the U.S. are doing alright in this regard, though many countries in Europe might have a problem in the future). While the idea might sound appealing to some, I doubt Pokemon will become some sort of political tool, and this is coming from a natalist myself.

And now I'd like to give my personal Top 5 hints:

5. The moment during XY040, climaxed when Serena calls Ash "an amazing person". In this episode their chemistry improved.
4. The glorious flashback at the Pallet Summer Camp. If the pairing ultimately becomes canon, the flashback will be viewed as its foundation of promises.
3. The deep red blush Serena gave at the end of XY026. Serena knows she has strong feelings for Ash, and a message is given to her that she must do something out of it.
2. Ash giving the gift of the blue ribbon to Serena at the end of XY059. The reason why it makes me have some joy is because it is a possible cracking of the dense fortress Ash is, and I seriously hope something more can come out of this.
1. Serena's blue ribbon in her outfit as of XY060 and Ash's subsequent reaction. It has become a powerful symbol of her love for Ash, one that remains alive as ever.

As for memes, I got nothing.
 
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ej02

Australia Amourship
We next have a episode with tierno in it
that might mean he going fanboy over serena like in episode 39 and mabye ash gets somwhat jealous? Mabye
also the fact that ash and serena are together in the ring of fire and also running from a robot together might mean that for some of the episode they could be together now wouldnt that be nice.
Also people say that amour is unique to other ships
I would like to know why we say that and what makes amour unique to others
 

ShadowForce720

Well-Known Member
We next have a episode with tierno in it
that might mean he going fanboy over serena like in episode 39 and mabye ash gets somwhat jealous? Mabye
also the fact that ash and serena are together in the ring of fire and also running from a robot together might mean that for some of the episode they could be together now wouldnt that be nice.
Also people say that amour is unique to other ships
I would like to know why we say that and what makes amour unique to others

Well if I had to guess why it's unique when compared to other ships is a combination of 1. That Serena is the first female traveling companion to have a confirmed canon crush on Ash and by that I mean that it's not just implied like some of the other ships but is actually confirmed. 2. The fact the writers acknowledge it and are even pushing it. 3. The fact that she new Ash from their childhood. and 4. The fact that he specifically invited her to join the group and also how he tends to go out of his way to be nice to her and so far hasn't gotten into any real arguments with her.

Oh I have a question what do you think would happen if Serena meets Ash's Bayleef do you think that Bayleef would realize that Serena has a crush on Ash and would get jealous?
 

Mewtario

"Shipping" Navigator
It's been a while since I've made a post here. Perhaps I thought I'd give a few thoughts on what past posts have said.

First, to Mewtario: welcome to the forum! I'm glad you've given a whole lot to contribute since coming here two weeks ago. I would like to comment on some of your posts though.

The classification system is well-thought out, but I can't say it is without flaws. Personally, there are some "hints" that I don't find hints at all, such as the so-called animators' hints (sorry Sp1derP1g, but a lot of what you've written just aren't hints at all; someone could do something similar for any other shipping, including failed ones--can those animators' hints really be valid for something like Advanceshipping, a pairing that didn't happen and is extremely unlikely to happen?). Instead I feel that they are just people spinning something ordinary into something it's not supposed to be.

So in other words, the majority of what some feel are Class D hints really belong to Class F--can we really use something like Serena seeing a Luvdisc or her Pokevision video having 44k views as hints? I think not. Stuff like this reminds me of why I've disliked shippings for so long--I am not going to defend Amourshipping against its detractors by stating that Korrina has very long hair!

In all honesty, what is labeled as Class E hints is stronger than the vast majority of Class D hints. The relationship charts show direct evidence of Serena's crush on Ash, which is much more convincing than the fact that their backpacks are together inside the show.

The remaining four classes is alright, but personally I would classify them like this:

Class C would be the equivalent of "circumstantial evidence". A girl being very worried for a boy while the boy is playing in a soccer game isn't necessarily a sign of love, but if she had been showing signs of attraction and feelings towards him in the past, then that makes her worrying a powerful sign that she likes him. This is the same case with Serena when she worried about Ash during his fight against Grant, or when she was on the point of crying when she thought she lost him in the mirror episode, or when she called Ash "an amazing person". Anyone can call anybody amazing, but with the other, stronger hints in play, it makes her case particularly powerful.

Class B would be equivalent of "direct evidence". This is where stuff like Serena's blushes and jealousies belong. Signs like this are not up to interpretation--they're practically indisputable. Hence, hints such as Serena's sudden worry that Ash was referring to Aria when she heard the word "cute", the redness she went through at the end of XY026, or her attempt at hand holding at the "date" episode--such is a direct sign of Serena's crush on Ash.

Class A is something I agree with you on. Like with Class B hints, Class A hints are also direct evidence, but to me we have not received any yet. An example of a Class A hint would be something like these:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTodUxEh-RE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=YyszVlW8I1E#t=1141

As mentioned in your sig, it's a direct statement from either side in the pairing. We have yet to receive one of these, but hopefully we can see a confession come out of Serena.

As for Class S, I am in full agreement here--this is for ships that become canon. The big elephant in this thread is to see if Amourshipping will become canon, but the great obstacle is whether or the S.S. Amour will survive the Bermuda Triangle--the status quo that has cursed the show for so long, putting a dense Ash in an endless cycle of new companions, new Pokemon, getting eight badges, getting stalked by Team Rocket, and ultimately destined for failure at the end of each saga. I've had enough of it, and therefore XY is my last chance at getting this anime a go--if they screw this up I am done with the show for good.

Now, concerning your analysis, I honestly think you're overthinking it here. Though the Japan population crisis problem is true, I doubt they're putting Amourshipping into the show as a result of it and of natalist politics in general. While the show is created and written by Japanese people, you need to keep in mind that Pokemon's fanbase and viewers and the target audience is worldwide, and not every place will suffer a population crisis in the future (we in the U.S. are doing alright in this regard, though many countries in Europe might have a problem in the future). While the idea might sound appealing to some, I doubt Pokemon will become some sort of political tool, and this is coming from a natalist myself.\

Thank you for your thorough feedback! A minor note: the relationship chart rates higher than Class E because it "tie into the continuity of the anime." This is a wording change from the original definition which indeed would have placed such relationship charts at Class E, but this issue was pointed out to me by a user some replies later and I adjusted the definitions accordingly.

My intention with Class D (outside of the whole "spacial proximity" thing, which is expounded upon in the next paragraph) is that there are indeed some instances in the anime where some event happens merely in the background, and you can't help but figure that at some point off-screen or internally between the characters, something shippy may have happened to lead to the result. The best example that comes to mind for me right now is the scene from the Diancie movie that ballzeh has in his signature. Serena hops onto the log, then simply stands there and clasps her hands together as if she's waiting there and expecting Ash to do what he ends up doing. It's certainly an unusual behavior, but it's never directly mentioned in the scene, and is treated casually. Also unusual is Ash's form in taking her hand: in one of the episodes in the serial itself, Ash helps her across rocks on a river by taking her hand in a handshake like fashion, but here it's a fashion more typical of ballroom dancing, which is an odd choice for a way to hold someone's hand to say the least, unless he's being deliberately (and unusually) gentlemanly towards her.

I split circumstantial evidence into Class C and Class D, though I rather liberally also include spacial proximity of people and items in Class D. My reasoning for allowing things like "they're standing closer to each other than any other characters are to either of them" as Class D is purely because of the already well-established canonical crush from one of them to the other, which mean that things like the backpacks leaning on each other or her sitting at tables directly next to him are notably more likely to be deliberate acts than if there weren't any notable crush, especially given the overwhelming frequency of some of these actions. Namely, I would estimate that Serena sits either directly across from or directly besides Ash approximately 90% of the time. It's extremely infrequent to see the two either sit diagonally across from each other or on perpendicular sides of a table. Likewise, I can't think of a single time where the backpacks were shown laying down to rest in any position other than directly leaning on each other, in an even closer proximity than the two siblings keep theirs, and in fact it was noticed that in Clemont's last episode being in the group, the two pairs of belongings were nearly on opposite corners of the mat, with Ash and Serena keeping their things rather conspicuously far away from Clemont's and Bonnie's things. I list this as Class D hint because this seems like it would need to be the result of a deliberate action out of Serena each and every time they put their things down.

I will agree with you that the episode-by-episode list of "animator's hints" seems overactive. I mean no offense towards Sp1derP1g in saying this.

I will also agree that the post regarding Japan's socioeconomic state was me overthinking it. I tend to overthink things a lot, from bizarre angles, and sometimes I convince myself, but either way I occasionally put these overthought ideas into the open to start well-thought-out discussion, and to see whether I'm onto anything or if I'm completely heading down the wrong track.
 
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Dinomeyt

Well-Known Member
Now, I would like to talk shortly about Mewtario's idea of the Pokemon writers of possibly writing romance into Ash's character as a means to tell the younger and teenage population (the ages that watch Pokemon the most) to help save Japan's declining population by, in a sense, repopulating/getting a girlfriend. Is he somewhat overlooking this? Possibly, but it does not mean he isn't bringing up a valid point. One change that I have seen from BW to XY is how the people of the region view Ash based on the fact that he is from Kanto. In BW, we have knowledge and verification that Trip thinks of Ash as a "hillbilly"; in a sense, Trip is the in-anime personification of the Japanese viewpoints on people from regions not their own. Now in Kalos, Professor Sycamore in the second episode is excited by the fact that Ash is from Kanto and even the guy in charge of the Battle Chateau is "honored" to have someone come from as far from Kanto to the Battle Chateau. Now, why the sudden change in opinions about people from Kanto? This could be the anime writers attempt to tell the people who watch their show in Japan to maybe lighten up on people from other countries.

Now, to the romance itself. As someone mentioned after Mewtario posted his viewpoint, other major animes are starting to get into the romantic aspect. If Oda is starting to add romance to One Piece, that is a major turning point in that manga/anime because One Piece is well known for having a very light if any views on the romantic aspects of life. One Piece has been always about the joy of adventure and the obstacles that come along in the journey. Kids typically emulate their favorite characters and try to either perform their actions or try to replicate their personality. We all like Goku and I am sure all of us performed the motions of creating a Kamehameha at some point in our childhood. When we learned that we couldn't pull it off, we instead looked at his personality: cool under pressure, willing to put himself on the line to save those he loves, hard-working. Kids see these personality traits and say to themselve, "I will try to be just like that".

Kids will do this with Ash; while we cannot have Pokemon like he does, we can try to be like him personality-wise: brave, willing to do anything for his friends, kind to everyone even his rivals. However, with the positive sides of Ash's personality, kids will also absorb his negatives: an unwillingness to mature, he seemingly loves food and Pokemon more than people, his bleak view on romance, he is quite stubborn. All these positives and negatives get taken in by people who see him as a role model. Remember, kids tend to imitate their role models actions and personalities. If the writers are as concerned about the population decline in Japan as the government is, then I could see this being the reason that Ash is slowly maturing and I think he will slowly start to develop "more than just friends" feelings for Serena because of this. There is enough evidence in the XY anime to see this happening. Am I saying Amourshipping canonship confirmed? Absolutely not. But I think we are going to see it happen, just to tell the viewers in Japan that "falling in love with someone is okay, just look at Ash". Again, Ash's development is going to be slow, just like the development of feelings are for another person in real life.
 

Lorde

Banned
So apparently Tierno will really like Serena's new design in the next episode, going as far as to get on his knees for her and with hearts in his eyes. While it's a small thing that'll likely be a gag, will it affect AmourShipping at all? I hope Ash gets a little jealous or something at the very least and has a reaction. It'd be a solid hint from him imo.
 

Mewtario

"Shipping" Navigator
So apparently Tierno will really like Serena's new design in the next episode, going as far as to get on his knees for her and with hearts in his eyes. While it's a small thing that'll likely be a gag, will it affect AmourShipping at all? I hope Ash gets a little jealous or something at the very least and has a reaction.

My guess is that this will either deflect right off and not change anything like Ash's "huh?" or actively help to reinforce the ship against this sort of thing in the future.

It's pretty entertaining watching Serena slowly back away as Tierno approaches.

This makes you wonder if the ribbon will get mentioned to ward Tierno off?

Still, I'm surprised that the people who talked about Tierno being a "love rival" were actually onto something.
 
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calvinhobbesliker

Well-Known Member
Hmm, maybe Tierno will say that the ribbon looks really good on her, and she will tell him that Ash gave it to her. Then, Tierno will understand the situation and challenge Ash to a battle for Serena (sort of, like how Kenny challenged Ash for Dawn)? Ash will accept because a battle is a battle/he doesn't quite know what's going on...though this is veering into bad fanfiction territory, and I can't really think of a good way to write such a scenario without it being problematic (since battling over a girl is not really acceptable).
 

Mewtario

"Shipping" Navigator
Hmm, maybe Tierno will say that the ribbon looks really good on her, and she will tell him that Ash gave it to her. Then, Tierno will understand the situation and challenge Ash to a battle for Serena (sort of, like how Kenny challenged Ash for Dawn)? Ash will accept because a battle is a battle/he doesn't quite know what's going on...though this is veering into bad fanfiction territory, and I can't really think of a good way to write such a scenario without it being problematic (since battling over a girl is not really acceptable).

The preview suggests that Tierno's infatuation comes shortly before the battle, which then leads to Team Rocket arriving and setting the place on fire, with Ash and Serena being separated from Tierno and Bonnie, so this idea has merit to it, assuming the preview places the scenes in chronological order.
 

Citronic Gear On

やれやれだぜ…
My guess is that this will either deflect right off and not change anything like Ash's "huh?" or actively help to reinforce the ship against this sort of thing in the future.

It's pretty entertaining watching Serena slowly back away as Tierno approaches.

This makes you wonder if the ribbon will get mentioned to ward Tierno off?

Still, I'm surprised that the people who talked about Tierno being a "love rival" were actually onto something.

Part of me thinks this could just be another occasionally recurring running gag, just for laughs, since the way they're showing it is over-the-top a la Brock falling in love with every Nurse Joy or Officer Jenny he meets. Shauna even said in XY039 that Tierno gets crushes easily. I'll be curious to see what Ash does here (if anything), in addition to what Serena does. I think as long as it stays like that, it could add an interesting, cute dynamic to Amour, especially if we see Serena get all bashful whenever Tierno gets too friendly and we see her getting a bit uneasy. That would be an obvious opportunity for her to reaffirm her feelings for Ash (to the viewers, of course).


I read that Fujita (who's written some of the shippier episodes thus far in XY) will be the writer for the Tierno episode, for what it's worth. Also, I read that Tomioka (who wrote key Amour episodes) will be writing the BroBowl episode, XY067 GET HYPE. Not a huge shocker, since he's done most of the gym battles so far (the only exception so far being the Ramos gym battle, written by Yonemura). I'll be curious to see whether we'll get some spaghetti, during the battle itself or somewhere else in the episode. Also, all XY gym battle episodes have featured at least some Amour moments, so that's another reason I wouldn't be shocked if we got something in XY067.
 
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ShadowForce720

Well-Known Member
Hmm, maybe Tierno will say that the ribbon looks really good on her, and she will tell him that Ash gave it to her. Then, Tierno will understand the situation and challenge Ash to a battle for Serena (sort of, like how Kenny challenged Ash for Dawn)? Ash will accept because a battle is a battle/he doesn't quite know what's going on...though this is veering into bad fanfiction territory, and I can't really think of a good way to write such a scenario without it being problematic (since battling over a girl is not really acceptable).

Yeah although if it does happen do you think that Serena might get a little mad at Ash that he accepted Tierno challenge without fully realizing what Tierno meant or That Serena might think that Ash knew what Tierno ment and be touched but then when she finds out that Ash had accepted without fully knowing what Tierno meant she might be a little tick off at him?
 

Lorde

Banned
I never really thought that we'd see another character take an interest in Serena, but it's kind of fun that Tierno will imo, even if it'll be for a few seconds. I've been wanting to see how bothered Serena would be since she only has eyes for Ash, plus Ash possibly noticing would be refreshing as well given his usual obliviousness. I do hope something shippy happens.
 

AshSerena

Well-Known Member
I never really thought that we'd see another character take an interest in Serena, but it's kind of fun that Tierno will imo, even if it'll be for a few seconds. I've been wanting to see how bothered Serena would be since she only has eyes for Ash, plus Ash possibly noticing would be refreshing as well given his usual obliviousness. I do hope something shippy happens.

lol saw the preview, i wonder if tierno gonna use the "bonnie gag marry my brother and use instead Marry meee" XD after seeing him kneeling
 

Citronic Gear On

やれやれだぜ…
lol saw the preview, i wonder if tierno gonna use the "bonnie gag marry my brother and use instead Marry meee" XD after seeing him kneeling

It kind of just looks like Tierno pulling a Brock. He even has the same heart-shaped eyes that Brock often got when he fell in love and started serenading a woman, and he is kneeling in a similar way to Brock. I don't know if we'll see him pull marriage card, especially since Bonnie has full ownership of KEEPU right now, whereas nobody has been going full Brock on us.

Is it just me, or is anyone else mildly disturbed by Tierno's ambiguous actions in the upcoming episode?

What about them is ambiguous? I guess they're disturbing, but no more disturbing than what Brock used to do.
 
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