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Amourshipping General Discussion - V.2 *Spoiler Warning*

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AshSerena

Well-Known Member
i want to share this, its not gives anything regarding amourship but this can add to the list of Ash and Serena similarities,
when both of them said samethings,
Before Ash going to Kalos Region
[IMGSIZE=500]http://i.imgur.com/yJdXvFU.jpg[/IMGSIZE]
Before Serena cut her hair
[IMGSIZE=500]http://i.imgur.com/xqb4LKA.jpg[/IMGSIZE]

i hope this is a hint that she might go to other region as challenger like how Ash decided to go to Kalos Region, its nothing big but they have lots of similarities imo, like the opening,Serena giving cookies to Ash,Ash giving blue ribbon to Serena, the foot tap, stretching their hand to the sun and i think there's more
 

yuoke

Treasure huntin'
i want to share this, its not gives anything regarding amourship but this can add to the list of Ash and Serena similarities,
when both of them said samethings,
Before Ash going to Kalos Region
[IMGSIZE=500]http://i.imgur.com/yJdXvFU.jpg[/IMGSIZE]
Before Serena cut her hair
[IMGSIZE=500]http://i.imgur.com/xqb4LKA.jpg[/IMGSIZE]

i hope this is a hint that she might go to other region as challenger like how Ash decided to go to Kalos Region, its nothing big but they have lots of similarities imo, like the opening,Serena giving cookies to Ash,Ash giving blue ribbon to Serena, the foot tap, stretching their hand to the sun and i think there's more

The difference was that she said that right before really starting her arc. Now she is not just a challenger anymore.
 

Minios

Smoke weed everyday
The difference was that she said that right before really starting her arc. Now she is not just a challenger anymore.
"Challenger" here is not necessary to be an "arc". It can be the one journey where he/she will becomes the best. Has Serena won any MC? Has Ash won any League? Serena is still on the road to become the very best, similar to Ash. For me, when a veteran like Ash still admit he's just a challenger, Serena will always be a challenger until she defeats Elle
 

sky7s46

Well-Known Member
I've watched the newest episode on Thursday, and I wanted to collect my thoughts for a few days, and I got to say I almost thought Serena was going to win the whole thing. Ash and Serena had a cute moment under the moonlight, I have my fears that Serena may be leaving after XY&Z ends because of Yashio. But I truly believe this time Serena will stay for an extra region. Now hear me out. Serena has given the biggest opportunity to either Go with Ash to the 7th Region or Leave and go with Yashio. I also believe that there may be a confession involved at the end of this XY&Z season after the League. I also believe Ash may actually end up in the top 2 or win the whole thing, because they made him so powerful this season that I may not be surprise if he wins it, in fact in a preview Ash is suppose to face Diantha with her Gardivoir against Ash-Greninja. Which brings me to my three questions:

After all that's happened how do you think XY&Z will end? Do You Think Ash will win the Kalos League? And if Serena confesses to Ash, how do you think Ash Ketchum will respond to Serena
 

_Dog

Well-Known Member
The off-topic posts will stop now. Stop talking about the anime's ratings, if you're going to keep watching it, how well-developed the girls were or why Ash should win a league. It's irrelevant.

This thread is for Amourshipping only. That is the only topic you will talk about in this thread, period.

In all due respect Sushi, I cannot agree with you. The discussion on Ash's performance, Serena's fate, the fates of other characters, character development, new regions, whether you or I will watch the show in the future, the ratings, etc. all tie back to the status quo and what it can cause to the show and to individuals. A great discussion was going on on whether or not the status quo, which includes writing Serena off, will hold up. And plenty of people were involved in the discussion before you interrupted.

That discussion/debate happened because the status quo is the biggest adversary to Amourshipping. Some people like Red and Blue know this and say that the status quo is what will end Amourshipping, where Serena would get axed out of the show and where Ash would apparently go to the region represented in Sun and Moon. Others contend that it's not too late that the status quo can still break, and yet others believe that staying the course would not be beneficial in terms of getting more viewers and getting good ratings, and hence it would be unwise to write off Serena and Amourshipping. Plenty of Amourshippers do not merely want the pairing to become canon, they, like plenty of non-shippers (neutrals) and even some anti-shippers want the show to break out of the status quo. We believe Amour becoming canon would break the status quo after years of having no romance whatsoever involving Ash (though some say otherwise), and Serena has an actual canon crush with a plethora of hints, far more than any other Pokégirl has ever had. If the status quo remains intact (and is quite likely to happen), then Amourshippers will feel like they were trolled by Omode and other writers/producers as they were lured into watching the show in hopes of change when there really wasn't going to be any whatsoever.

Personally I think it would be foolish for the writers/producers to continue the status quo even if we put Amour aside. I also feel it will be somewhat of a downgrade to Serena if she decides to join Palermo as I feel that for any competitive career (and competition in general), fun (that is, enjoying what you're doing) should always take precedence over success and victory. If one cannot enjoy what he does as his profession, then he should quit and seek something else in its stead. I also feel that the Pokémon are essential for the showcases--of course a performer should be dependent on them and vice versa! If anything, Jessie's loss at her debut demonstrated that being a pretty girl alone isn't going to win you princess keys. For all this it's really going to be disappointing if Serena decides to use her ticket out of the anime, for I feel it'll throw away lots of the things she learned in her journey, as well as remove the very factor that caused her to leave her home in the first place--Ash. I know that winning is important (after all, we all want Ash to win a league for once as it's been about twenty years now), but some things are not worth sacrificing to achieve competitive victory.

I really hope that something good can come out of all these hints and build-up (is Miette correct when she said that Serena was making progress?). But I just can't trust the writers...
 

JigglyScrub

DoriDori Pawaa
In all due respect Sushi, I cannot agree with you. The discussion on Ash's performance, Serena's fate, the fates of other characters, character development, new regions, whether you or I will watch the show in the future, the ratings, etc. all tie back to the status quo and what it can cause to the show and to individuals. A great discussion was going on on whether or not the status quo, which includes writing Serena off, will hold up. And plenty of people were involved in the discussion before you interrupted.

That discussion/debate happened because the status quo is the biggest adversary to Amourshipping. Some people like Red and Blue know this and say that the status quo is what will end Amourshipping, where Serena would get axed out of the show and where Ash would apparently go to the region represented in Sun and Moon. Others contend that it's not too late that the status quo can still break, and yet others believe that staying the course would not be beneficial in terms of getting more viewers and getting good ratings, and hence it would be unwise to write off Serena and Amourshipping. Plenty of Amourshippers do not merely want the pairing to become canon, they, like plenty of non-shippers (neutrals) and even some anti-shippers want the show to break out of the status quo. We believe Amour becoming canon would break the status quo after years of having no romance whatsoever involving Ash (though some say otherwise), and Serena has an actual canon crush with a plethora of hints, far more than any other Pokégirl has ever had. If the status quo remains intact (and is quite likely to happen), then Amourshippers will feel like they were trolled by Omode and other writers/producers as they were lured into watching the show in hopes of change when there really wasn't going to be any whatsoever.

Personally I think it would be foolish for the writers/producers to continue the status quo even if we put Amour aside. I also feel it will be somewhat of a downgrade to Serena if she decides to join Palermo as I feel that for any competitive career (and competition in general), fun (that is, enjoying what you're doing) should always take precedence over success and victory. If one cannot enjoy what he does as his profession, then he should quit and seek something else in its stead. I also feel that the Pokémon are essential for the showcases--of course a performer should be dependent on them and vice versa! If anything, Jessie's loss at her debut demonstrated that being a pretty girl alone isn't going to win you princess keys. For all this it's really going to be disappointing if Serena decides to use her ticket out of the anime, for I feel it'll throw away lots of the things she learned in her journey, as well as remove the very factor that caused her to leave her home in the first place--Ash. I know that winning is important (after all, we all want Ash to win a league for once as it's been about twenty years now), but some things are not worth sacrificing to achieve competitive victory.

I really hope that something good can come out of all these hints and build-up (is Miette correct when she said that Serena was making progress?). But I just can't trust the writers...

Eh, I'm kind of ok with that whole discussion being deleted. Youke has been trolling here for days, and is really only here to agitate and make people upset.

Though I do agree with you about the status quo. I mean, it's quite literally status quo vs Amourshipping; that's really the only threat to it, and it's a powerful threat indeed. I guess we just have to wait and see what happens. We can sit here and talk about status quo, but none of us can say we know for sure what will happen.
 

Red and Blue

Well-Known Member
I don't see how becoming a apprentice and learning more about preforming means tossing away everything she learned in XY. She isn't soley defined by Ash you know.

Personally, I think it would be a good sign of character growth and maturity to take yashio's offer at the end
 

Commander Wrex

Well-Known Member
A lot being talked about Serena's potential leave, I see.

Well, after a few days since the recent episode's release, my personal feelings on the subject hasn't changed much. I do agree with those that feel that, in good chance, that Serena may actually leave the show by the time XYZ ends (though not going to go off and say it's all written in stone). However it does not mean the end of Amour either - or at least again, be the indefinite signal to basically suck all the optimism of it. I still think that, at least for the near future, there will be some sort of compromise that will satisfy the parties involved here. BUT I do feel that the status quo stuff is rather distasteful and if much of it is applied in the coming future, then whether Amour is dead or not I'm probably just going to lose interest and drop out of following the show myself. And I think I'm not alone on that thought - it's more than enough that we had to see the same old "rinse-and-repeat" for 20 years.

Now, to make sure I don't get into trouble for talking off-topic...I think some of us are panicking over the prospects of Serena leaving because of Yashio's offer a bit too much. Consider this thought: many of us (not me though) have been with Amourshipping since 2013 and stuck with it through thick and thin. This is likely the final year of the XYZ saga - and who knows if Serena will leave for sure? She might, she might not. OR she might leave but her presence will hang around somehow...I mean, the writers could NOT have gone through all this trouble to push Amour for nothing?

The point is, we don't know...so let's just relax and try to enjoy the coming months leading up to fate of Amour. At the end of the day, many of you have supported this shipping for 2 or so years now. What's another few months (or a bit longer)? Keep the faith, but steel yourself in the event that things might not come true.
 

lilgreninja

Amourshipping fan
I think we should take a little break from all this pessimism. We should not concentrate on the future while the present is still ongoing. Like what others said, enjoy the ride while it lasts.

So I found this bit on twitter that contains a bit of the plot from the Serena becomes Satoshi episode.
the gang comes across a musician trainer who has a pikachu as well and seems to take an interest in serena (can someone confirm if this is part of the real plot?) edit: This is fake since it's part of the pokemon wiki. Sorry i didn't research too in depth
I think that Serena may be oblivious to this rocker trainer's pursuits like she is with Tierno if the line above is true. But the one thing I do not understand is Serena becoming Satoshi part. I think the mind-swap may be unlikely. I think that she uses Pikachu to battle this rocker but otherwise I have no other ideas. Now I know that we should not expect too much but may it be a possibility that Ash may become slightly jealous(maybe not, but maybe his denseness slightly deteriorates?) and this episode may be part of the development between Ash and Serena's relationship? I mean Serena really has no big arc coming up until maybe the end. I hope Omode wrote this episode because then we may have some hints.
 
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Trublsmbob

Crap, not again!
Eh, I'm kind of ok with that whole discussion being deleted. Youke has been trolling here for days, and is really only here to agitate and make people upset.

Though I do agree with you about the status quo. I mean, it's quite literally status quo vs Amourshipping; that's really the only threat to it, and it's a powerful threat indeed. I guess we just have to wait and see what happens. We can sit here and talk about status quo, but none of us can say we know for sure what will happen.

Be careful about what you say. The mods see all. XD
And this whole status quo debate seems interesting so I'd like to join in but, what exactly does "status quo" mean? I feel like an idiot for asking that, I looked up the definition and it doesn't seem to have any relation to Amour. ?

Red and Blue said:
I don't see how becoming a apprentice and learning more about preforming means tossing away everything she learned in XY. She isn't soley defined by Ash you know.
From a certain perspective she would be giving up on her crush on Ash. Though you're correct she isn't soley defined by Ash, and I could see a scenario in the future where she has to decide between her crush and moving her dream foward. If this did happen though, I think somehow eventually a choice would come to light that let's her pick both. Obviously I'm really going into theoretical territory here, but that's what this thread is for in a sense isn't it?

Commander Wrex said:
Now, to make sure I don't get into trouble for talking off-topic...I think some of us are panicking over the prospects of Serena leaving because of Yashio's offer a bit too much. Consider this thought: many of us (not me though) have been with Amourshipping since 2013 and stuck with it through thick and thin. This is likely the final year of the XYZ saga - and who knows if Serena will leave for sure? She might, she might not. OR she might leave but her presence will hang around somehow...I mean, the writers could NOT have gone through all this trouble to push Amour for nothing?
Just keep shoving logic into the thread, eventually people'll calm down.

lilgreninja said:
I think we should take a little break from all this pessimism. We should not concentrate on the future while the present is still ongoing. Like what others said, enjoy the ride while it lasts.
I agree we need to get out of this pessimism somehow, but ignoring possible obstacles for Amour is not the way to do it. Possible obstacles create good discussion, sometimes better than assets to Amour. I mean, sure right now half this thread is just some people whining about how Amour is dead and being pessimistic to an extent where it's annoying and useless, but the other half is having heated debates and excellent discussions.

Beatle said:
I really hope that something good can come out of all these hints and build-up (is Miette correct when she said that Serena was making progress?). But I just can't trust the writers...
I'm guessing you were around for the GS Ball right? I don't blame you for not trusting them if so. But I really think they learned their lesson. Why would they tease Amour in the same episode that they start the beginning of the end for it? I mean that's just cruel. And no one can disagree that Amourshipping hints are increasing in Amoury-ness and frequency. We're getting Class B hints every other week at this point. Anyway, I'm going to put up another topic, because we need something to talk about that isn't depressing. Why do you like Amour, or if you don't like it and you're here to argue against it, why not?
 

Mrs. Oreo

Banned
Personally, I think it would be a good sign of character growth and maturity to take yashio's offer at the end

It would count as growth on Serena's part if she continues her own dream of becoming Kalos queen but even if she does eventually accept Palermo's offer, I doubt she'll get over her crush on Ash. I think she'll keep liking him even when they go their own ways. So if she ever comes back for a short arc appearance or whatever in the next saga, I think we'd get Amourshipping hints again and that the ship will live on no matter what Serena decides to do. ^^
 

JigglyScrub

DoriDori Pawaa
Be careful about what you say. The mods see all. XD
And this whole status quo debate seems interesting so I'd like to join in but, what exactly does "status quo" mean? I feel like an idiot for asking that, I looked up the definition and it doesn't seem to have any relation to Amour. ?


From a certain perspective she would be giving up on her crush on Ash. Though you're correct she isn't soley defined by Ash, and I could see a scenario in the future where she has to decide between her crush and moving her dream foward. If this did happen though, I think somehow eventually a choice would come to light that let's her pick both. Obviously I'm really going into theoretical territory here, but that's what this thread is for in a sense isn't it?


Just keep shoving logic into the thread, eventually people'll calm down.


I agree we need to get out of this pessimism somehow, but ignoring possible obstacles for Amour is not the way to do it. Possible obstacles create good discussion, sometimes better than assets to Amour. I mean, sure right now half this thread is just some people whining about how Amour is dead and being pessimistic to an extent where it's annoying and useless, but the other half is having heated debates and excellent discussions.


I'm guessing you were around for the GS Ball right? I don't blame you for not trusting them if so. But I really think they learned their lesson. Why would they tease Amour in the same episode that they start the beginning of the end for it? I mean that's just cruel. And no one can disagree that Amourshipping hints are increasing in Amoury-ness and frequency. We're getting Class B hints every other week at this point. Anyway, I'm going to put up another topic, because we need something to talk about that isn't depressing. Why do you like Amour, or if you don't like it and you're here to argue against it, why not?

You would be correct in saying that the status quo does not relate to Amour because Amour is not part of it. Status quo in the context we use here refers to how this show has a very predictable formula that is almost never deviated from.

I'll try to help you visualize it:

Ash begins his journey with nothing but a new change of clothes and his trusty Pikachu. Very early on, Ash meets a girl, who is shocked by his Pikachu just prior to him meeting her. This girl is very cold towards Ash at first but eventually she gets along better with him. Not too long after Ash and his new female friend begin travelling together, Ash meets a gym leader who offers to travel with Ash; Ash agrees. Now, Ash begins his journey across the region battling gym leaders, fending off Team Rocket, helping out random strangers, and catching Pokemon. Eventually, Ash reaches the Pokemon League where all his hard work in obtaining the gym badges is out to the test. After a valiant effort, Ash is defeated. Ash returns home to Pallet Town after saying goodbye to his friends, and is set to begin another journey.

Now, can you say you know which series I'm describing? Probably not, because they're all the same. It's an oversimplification, but I think it works. Serena is the only one to really challenge the status quo. She has a crush on Ash which is the main selling point, and there's some minor details like her not being shocked by Pikachu, she's always nice to Ash, and joined the group after meeting the gym leader. So when I say it's Amourshipping vs status quo, that's what I'm talking about. She'll be cast into eternal irrelevancy if things go the way of the status quo, just like all the other girls before her.
 
I don't see how becoming a apprentice and learning more about preforming means tossing away everything she learned in XY. She isn't soley defined by Ash you know.

Personally, I think it would be a good sign of character growth and maturity to take yashio's offer at the end

Bias aside, I don't see how would it be an absence of character growth if she decided to travel herself; along with Ash or without. Isn't it a big decision to decide to throw away such an offer to do things her own way, and learn from the mistakes made and experiences she gets along the way? IMO either way, it doesn't make a difference, character development-wise.

Now, to make sure I don't get into trouble for talking off-topic...I think some of us are panicking over the prospects of Serena leaving because of Yashio's offer a bit too much. Consider this thought: many of us (not me though) have been with Amourshipping since 2013 and stuck with it through thick and thin. This is likely the final year of the XYZ saga - and who knows if Serena will leave for sure? She might, she might not. OR she might leave but her presence will hang around somehow...I mean, the writers could NOT have gone through all this trouble to push Amour for nothing?

The point is, we don't know...so let's just relax and try to enjoy the coming months leading up to fate of Amour. At the end of the day, many of you have supported this shipping for 2 or so years now. What's another few months (or a bit longer)? Keep the faith, but steel yourself in the event that things might not come true.

This is a good point. Especially those who have been active shippers for so long, what's the point of throwing the towel now? Might as well wait and watch till the end. For all you know, it may just go our way! Nothing suggests that Amour is dead, and everything suggests in its contrary.

Be careful about what you say. The mods see all. XD
And this whole status quo debate seems interesting so I'd like to join in but, what exactly does "status quo" mean? I feel like an idiot for asking that, I looked up the definition and it doesn't seem to have any relation to Amour. ?

From a certain perspective she would be giving up on her crush on Ash. Though you're correct she isn't soley defined by Ash, and I could see a scenario in the future where she has to decide between her crush and moving her dream foward. If this did happen though, I think somehow eventually a choice would come to light that let's her pick both. Obviously I'm really going into theoretical territory here, but that's what this thread is for in a sense isn't it?

I'm guessing you were around for the GS Ball right? I don't blame you for not trusting them if so. But I really think they learned their lesson. Why would they tease Amour in the same episode that they start the beginning of the end for it? I mean that's just cruel. And no one can disagree that Amourshipping hints are increasing in Amoury-ness and frequency. We're getting Class B hints every other week at this point.

Okay so firstly, by saying "status-quo", they mean the rinse and repeat formula that has been going on for so long. Ash goes to region, meets girl, battles gyms, staves off TR, loses in league, girl loses in her dream, they part ways, and Ash gets reset.

Not necessarily giving up her crush, firstly. Like I said, the two cases are not necessarily mutually exclusive. We could still get a time-skip, in case Serena does leave. Or red string of fate. But it does mean that she gives up on "having fun" and learning from her own experiences. That's part of her character, definitely.

And lastly, you don't have to look as far as the GS Ball. Malamar is one such example too! To date, we don't know what those Malamars were going about. Of course, this could very well change, but as it stands, this is the case. The GS Ball is actually a very weak example because all said and done, the GS Ball wasn't referenced to much. Whereas AmourShipping on the other hand, you see it very regularly. The longest we have gone without a single hint; or a single reference to AmourShipping is 13 episodes. And of late, it has been growing in frequency too! So this is not something that will be dropped unceremoniously. I think we can be sure about that.

And one last thing. I do feel that the anime is slowly starting to deviate from the games. I mean, we have the Zygarde forms, Ash-Greninja, and such things which are very evidently spin-offs from the game, but are not at all referenced in the game. Serena now looks different from the generic Serena in XY.

Now if I'm proven wrong because Sun and Moon features the Zygarde forms, then it is still good for us because that would mean they have every reason to carry Serena forward!
 
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--VIRGO--

Well-Known Member
There's one more thing. After challenging his/her goal a character almost never stays with it. I mean. May is win Hoenn GF. After she didn't she challenged Kanto GF. After it didn't worked out, she tried Johto GF. The same Dawn. Ash is the best example of that. After loosing each league instead of trying it one more time he challenged another region's league. So there's pretty high chance Serena will do the same. Therefore Ash and Serena might try S/M league and S/M master class. Why trying to beat Kalos master class over and over again. Serena might always be redesigned to match S/M female counterpart like they always do with Ash. Serena hasn't been given up yet. It's too soon to make an assumptions. So I propose let's focus on Amour which is here and now. Because focusing on S/M arc already is pointless. I believe in amour. Besides mirror cave episode hinted to us, that Serena might be more than just regional traveling companion.
 

Shooti

Uber Trainer
I don't see how becoming a apprentice and learning more about preforming means tossing away everything she learned in XY. She isn't soley defined by Ash you know.

Personally, I think it would be a good sign of character growth and maturity to take yashio's offer at the end

Personally, I think Serena can defeat Aria either way. If she decides to be an apprentice of Yashio then she would have the best teacher she could wish for to teach her about performances so she could reach to a whole new level and beat Aria the next time they compete.

The second approach would be to follow Ash to a new region rejecting Yashio's offer. How this would help her, you ask? Well, Ash is the best motivation Serena could ever find. It has been shown many times in anime that Serena has used Ash's advice, his words of encouragement to overcome obstacles she faced during performances. Ash would help her indirectly through inspiring her to come up with her own moves in performances. She did manage to reach to the finals of Master Class without Yashio's help, she could as well beat Aria too without Yashio's help.

Yes, it's true that it's more likely that Serena would leave towards the end of this season. But, that's not confirmed yet.
 

04n70n10

Well-Known Member
Writers couldn't ignore the great amount of hints that they gave to us so far. And still continue after the end of Tripokalons arc, indeed we have good hints in the master class episodes. So far the series have a decent continuity for the events occurred in XY and XYZ, so... i hope for something a bit sadisfactory in the end, not necessarily a canonisation but something good a least. Master class ended, but AS still continue, and Miette remarks to Serena to somewhat achieve that other thing also...

Yashio offer could be the real prize for all serena's efforts on Tripokalons and/or a ticket for her departure at the end of this series. It's hard to predict this time, we doesn't know many things, how Sun and moon will incide in the anime, etc. Normally all characters arcs ended near each other, this time the great arc for Serena ended early, we have many months ahead. So writers could develop a bit more other aspects of Serena, so even the Amour part i suppose, a subplot that it's longer than the performance quest.

Only time will tell, so in the meantime i will enjoy the ride as always.
 
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tomyno

Well-Known Member
Personally, I think Serena can defeat Aria either way. If she decides to be an apprentice of Yashio then she would have the best teacher she could wish for to teach her about performances so she could reach to a whole new level and beat Aria the next time they compete.

The second approach would be to follow Ash to a new region rejecting Yashio's offer. How this would help her, you ask? Well, Ash is the best motivation Serena could ever find. It has been shown many times in anime that Serena has used Ash's advice, his words of encouragement to overcome obstacles she faced during performances. Ash would help her indirectly through inspiring her to come up with her own moves in performances. She did manage to reach to the finals of Master Class without Yashio's help, she could as well beat Aria too without Yashio's help.

Yes, it's true that it's more likely that Serena would leave towards the end of this season. But, that's not confirmed yet.

But to be honest, don't you feel trolled or even betrayed after all of this? Because, I heard people complaining about losing 3 years of life in returning to watch pokemon XY saga. They feel like they've been robbed of three years when writers made reason for them to believe Amour will end up posive way ( another thing is these people don't care about development or fanfiction and the result is the only thing which is important) Personaly, I don't think I was ever positive about this shipping, but since the last months I also started to think the writers made differences in convetions ( mega evolution, all pokemon fully evolved and even strong water type in Ash's party). Unfortunatelly, writers are a little bit too much keen on keeping children audience, even when they create minority these days. To sum up, we cannot blame them for that, we still have the hope for time skip and a new main hero even if Serena will decide to go with Yashio (or Palermo). Correct me if I'm wrong, but it wasn't even comfimed Ash will stay being the main protagonist of the seventh generation as well, was it?
 

Sonic Boom

@JohanSSB4 Twitter
A girl accomplishes something big that works towards her goal, still gets shipping hints with Ash after her main arc is completed, as well as episodes surrounding her goal after the big event, but is still projected to leave at the end of the series, but not without a not-insignificant shippy scene expected at the end.

Did I just describe the context of Serena's potential departure, or Misty's run through the Johto series post Whirl Cup? Or May and the Terracotta ribbon and Movie 9? Or Dawn and how she elected to travel with Ash over Kenny after the Grand Festival?

It's fine to hold a degree of a faith for Serena here, but just know you're experiencing the same growing pains every other main girl shipper/fan had in their respective series when it came time for her to go. No matter the significance of the ship from her end, Serena's post-arc....arc is following the same tread pattern.

Don't be a stone-thrower in a glass house, is all I'm saying.
 

Trublsmbob

Crap, not again!
pokesrini said:
Okay so firstly, by saying "status-quo", they mean the rinse and repeat formula that has been going on for so long. Ash goes to region, meets girl, battles gyms, staves off TR, loses in league, girl loses in her dream, they part ways, and Ash gets reset.

Not necessarily giving up her crush, firstly. Like I said, the two cases are not necessarily mutually exclusive. We could still get a time-skip, in case Serena does leave. Or red string of fate. But it does mean that she gives up on "having fun" and learning from her own experiences. That's part of her character, definitely.

And lastly, you don't have to look as far as the GS Ball. Malamar is one such example too! To date, we don't know what those Malamars were going about. Of course, this could very well change, but as it stands, this is the case. The GS Ball is actually a very weak example because all said and done, the GS Ball wasn't referenced to much. Whereas AmourShipping on the other hand, you see it very regularly. The longest we have gone without a single hint; or a single reference to AmourShipping is 13 episodes. And of late, it has been growing in frequency too! So this is not something that will be dropped unceremoniously. I think we can be sure about that.

And one last thing. I do feel that the anime is slowly starting to deviate from the games. I mean, we have the Zygarde forms, Ash-Greninja, and such things which are very evidently spin-offs from the game, but are not at all referenced in the game. Serena now looks different from the generic Serena in XY.

Now if I'm proven wrong because Sun and Moon features the Zygarde forms, then it is still good for us because that would mean they have every reason to carry Serena forward!

Well yes, but in her eyes it might be seen as giving up on her crush. Of course she would be giving up on her fun experiences and such, but that is much less referenced in the show, whereas Amour is pretty obvious. A kid can recognize romance at a fairly young age, but character qualities that aren't explicitly stated not so much. Oh, and thanks for explaining the status quo!

Eh, I don't count Malamar because that's still an open book. If it doesn't get closure, then I would actually consider that more of a blow to Amourshipping than Yashio's offer.

The anime was already pretty deviated from the games. And Zygarde's forms were shown in CoroCoro and it seems that it will be in the games. As for Ash-Greninja, something like that could definitley be in the games.

04n70n10 said:
Writers couldn't ignore the great amount of hints that they gave to us so far. And still continue after the end of Tripokalons arc, indeed we have good hints in the master class episodes. So far the series have a decent continuity for the events occurred in XY and XYZ, so... i hope for something a bit sadisfactory in the end, not necessarily a canonisation but something good a least. Master class ended, but AS still continue, and Miette remarks to Serena to somewhat achieve that other thing also...
Well, the problem with the "the writer's can't ignore all the hints arguement" is that they could just give Amour decent closure, but not canonize it. For example, having Serena tell Ash her feeelings for him but Ash saying he has no interest in her and Serena accepting that. And honestly, IMO that is a threat to Amour, because that would please enough people to not get a ton of backlash, whereas if they canonized it there would be a ton of backlash and same if they didn't canonize it. So decent closure is a pretty good way to end Amourshipping from a writers perspective. The hole in this way of thinking is that this a non-Japanese point of view, the way a Japanese person is going to think about decent closure is different than a non-Japanese person's view of it. The Japanese twitter was super happy with the Date and Dance episodes, but we weren't. And I would imagine that the writers are going to think differently than I would imagine they would. So thankfully, this makes the whole "decent closure" agruement somewhat irrelevent, at least until I have a complete understanding of an average Japanese person's mindset. XD

JigglyScrub said:
You would be correct in saying that the status quo does not relate to Amour because Amour is not part of it. Status quo in the context we use here refers to how this show has a very predictable formula that is almost never deviated from.

I'll try to help you visualize it:

Ash begins his journey with nothing but a new change of clothes and his trusty Pikachu. Very early on, Ash meets a girl, who is shocked by his Pikachu just prior to him meeting her. This girl is very cold towards Ash at first but eventually she gets along better with him. Not too long after Ash and his new female friend begin travelling together, Ash meets a gym leader who offers to travel with Ash; Ash agrees. Now, Ash begins his journey across the region battling gym leaders, fending off Team Rocket, helping out random strangers, and catching Pokemon. Eventually, Ash reaches the Pokemon League where all his hard work in obtaining the gym badges is out to the test. After a valiant effort, Ash is defeated. Ash returns home to Pallet Town after saying goodbye to his friends, and is set to begin another journey.

Now, can you say you know which series I'm describing? Probably not, because they're all the same. It's an oversimplification, but I think it works. Serena is the only one to really challenge the status quo. She has a crush on Ash which is the main selling point, and there's some minor details like her not being shocked by Pikachu, she's always nice to Ash, and joined the group after meeting the gym leader. So when I say it's Amourshipping vs status quo, that's what I'm talking about. She'll be cast into eternal irrelevancy if things go the way of the status quo, just like all the other girls before her.
Ok, thanks! :D
 

Shadao

Champion GETTO DA ZE!
Well, the problem with the "the writer's can't ignore all the hints arguement" is that they could just give Amour decent closure, but not canonize it. For example, having Serena tell Ash her feeelings for him but Ash saying he has no interest in her and Serena accepting that. And honestly, IMO that is a threat to Amour, because that would please enough people to not get a ton of backlash, whereas if they canonized it there would be a ton of backlash and same if they didn't canonize it. So decent closure is a pretty good way to end Amourshipping from a writers perspective. The hole in this way of thinking is that this a non-Japanese point of view, the way a Japanese person is going to think about decent closure is different than a non-Japanese person's view of it. The Japanese twitter was super happy with the Date and Dance episodes, but we weren't. And I would imagine that the writers are going to think differently than I would imagine they would. So thankfully, this makes the whole "decent closure" agruement somewhat irrelevent, at least until I have a complete understanding of an average Japanese person's mindset. XD

In all fairness, the date episode as well as the dance episode all reaffirmed that Serena is indeed still in love with Satoshi. And Serena failing to seize the moment to confess her feelings or just have a romantic time with him is kinda normal for an anime to do. I've seen it many times in several anime shows before.
 
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