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Amourshipping Thread V3

KungFuMaster

KungFu Zen Mode
I think you are taking this too seriously when it comes to Ash and Serena relationship because their relationship is made to not really interact if you know what I mean because Ash always said that he doesn't need to be worry about Serena because she is strong and that show how they trust each others , don't need to talk a lot when you trust and have confidence in a person.

Don't forget that Serena started to travel with the group in XY005 and leaves in XY140 so she got "only" 135 episodes when OS got 275 episodes , AG 191 episodes , D/P 191 episodes + all the cameos stuffs, don't forget in the Team flare arc and Kalos league they couldn't really interact because of the situation.

Now I'm going to talk about all the times they were alone and interacting :

They literally interacted first in XY005 when Serena started to say that she got a Fennekin but she doesn't know what to do , then Ash already did cheer her up and said "don't worry you will found something to do" then Alexia even spotted them and noticed how their relationship were and how Serena can help Ash when he needs to.

After all the fillers and the build up you got XY040 with the river scene when they got almost 3 minutes of screentime together talking about goals and stuffs and Ash told Serena that she needs to found a dream with her Pokemon, again , a serious talk without anything about comedy or stuffs like that to show that their relationship is really serious.

Before the gym battle against Korrina she helped him but all the stuffs were offscreen , but he even said in his mind "Serena was right" when looking at her and that helped him to win the gym battle...

In the date episode , they got again 3 minutes of screentime in the train and Serena helped Ash again and this time he gave the ribbon to thanks her , again serious moment with fireworks and stuff.

After her failure in the showcase , Clemont was worried but Ash told him "Serena is strong , don't worry for her" that mean again that he trusts her and he doesn't need to interact with her that much because he knows she will be fine and he was right because she got over it (that's why I always said that they know each others really well).

Then in XYZ 16 he moved his own last gym battle for her master class , correct me if I'm wrong but I never saw Ash putting his dream at the second plan for a Pokegirl before.

Again a serious moment after the Master class when they are at night together and Ash trying to cheer Serena up for her next performance, next , the Snowball scene , I don't think I need to talk about it because you mentioned it.

Then after all the plot things you got XYZ 44 when he said "I believe in you" to Serena , I don't think Ash ever said this in front of a girl before with that much of confidence.

Finally , you got the XYZ 45 when that was the first time Ash was excited to do shopping stuffs with a girl and he even noticed that Serena was not feeling that well and helped her (again , a hint that they know each others really well) you got almost 3min of screentime with these two together talking and he even said that all of Serena's Pokemon are strong and that he will always rooting for her , again correct me if I'm wrong but I never saw Ash said this to a Pokegirl, you can disagree with me but at the end , I don't think they needed to interact that much because of their relationship , I didn't even talk about the fist bump they did without saying any words, that proves that their relationship don't need too much interactions because they know each others really well and the confidence between them is insane and again don't forget that Serena didn't get too much episodes compared to the others Pokegirls (except maybe Iris).


Oh and I hope you understand all the things I meant because I'm french and I'm trying to do my best , nobody is perfect right ? xD

Mais non, votre anglais est parfait! J'ai tout compris! (my French isn't perfect lol)

The early translations you and AshSerena did gave me the idea that the writer wanted to have their fans the impression of Ash and Serena might become a couple one day. I hope we can get, if not 100%, the closest to the exact interview. No offense to plxtreme, I appreciate the translation you shared but it kinda confused me as well seeing AshSerena and Dephender's prior to the one you gave.


After reading those lines multiple times (I had to make sure, lol XD), it was clear to me that the scene was meant to be ambiguous yet clear that Ash and Serena kissed. It was meant to be left ambiguous for the sake of their actual audience (which are children) and not having it too bold for the show, leaving an impression of "Did they really kissed or not?". Yet it should also be meant that the scene had the two kissed. This was similar to how Harvest Moon: Hero of Leaf Valley was done with one of the bachelorette there and this game was also meant for young ages as well.




Well, well, well and here's something that would clear up the shipping's development. It's nice to know that the ship was planned from the start, I mean, I already have that impression from the start but this pretty much confirms it.



Take your time, ;)
I don't think I can take all these information in one day. I'll die of heart attack with all these interviews, lol. So far, I'd like to take these information one at a time. It's making me thrilled and get excited for more. XD

I think they started it because France/Paris is the country/city of love. Also a reason why shipping wasn't started in other regions. Maybe they wanted to show a bit of the French culture to the kids in Japan? xD, like they showed many food and buildings from France.
 

Heekful

Well-Known Member
I think they started it because France/Paris is the country/city of love. Also a reason why shipping wasn't started in other regions. Maybe they wanted to show a bit of the French culture to the kids in Japan? xD, like they showed many food and buildings from France.

From my french view , I don't think that was the reason why it started because it's a "cliché" from others country , France is not the country of love it's Paris who is the city of love and when you are french and you really live in Paris all the time you can't really have this feeling.
There is probably only the strangers who feel like that when they are in Paris so they could have just put some little hints when Ash and Serena were in Lumiose city without added the childhood backstory and all the romance things, it's probably one of the things but I don't think that was the main reason you know.
 

Epicocity

Well-Known Member
Take your time, ;)
I don't think I can take all these information in one day. I'll die of heart attack with all these interviews, lol. So far, I'd like to take these information one at a time. It's making me thrilled and get excited for more. XD

I second this. You guys who can do all this translating are like MVPs to us, allowing us to know things we would otherwise never know. If we have to wait a day, week, or even a month, I'd say it would all be worth it in the end and really keep that feeling a zeal for Amour alive.
 

Citronic Gear On

やれやれだぜ…
I think they started it because France/Paris is the country/city of love. Also a reason why shipping wasn't started in other regions. Maybe they wanted to show a bit of the French culture to the kids in Japan? xD, like they showed many food and buildings from France.
I think this bit of the interview refutes that idea or at least suggests there's no evidence to support it:
Q: From the very beginning, XY comes across as if we're looking at Satoshi from Serena's point of view. Whose idea was this?
A: I believe this originated from something Shukichi Kanda said at a planning meeting; "Wouldn't it be interesting to have a female lead like this?". It was then proposed that we could do a scene where Satoshi and Serena met in the past that had romantic implications, and then we went off that and developed things from there.
Basically, the fact that it happened in a France-themed region seems to be purely coincidental.

Well, I did already revise it slightly a couple times.
That "hopefully" bit, though... he's talking about how the viewers are meant to feel here, not about his own personal hope. When you watch this scene, you're supposed to assume they'll end up together. It's meant to give you this "they have to, don't they? It would be a colossal shame if they didn't, because came on, look at this" feeling - it's not just a "hey, it'd be cool if they did, but who knows" thing.
I think that right there says it all.
 

Dephender

Gizakawayusu
Staff member
Moderator
I looked at that "ambiguity" bit, and yeah, he's clearly saying that she's meant to be kissing him, but that it's also meant to be ambiguous, so he's very clearly talking about what's you're supposed to assume vs what you're actually seeing here.

Or in other words, "she kissed him, but we couldn't actually show that, so we had to make it look slightly ambiguous in order to actually get it into the episode".

Also, here's a bunch of other very interesting tidbits from the interview. They're not SatoSere-related, so you should take the discussion about this stuff to that thread, though.
 

AshSerena

Well-Known Member
I looked at that "ambiguity" bit, and yeah, he's clearly saying that she's meant to be kissing him, but that it's also meant to be ambiguous, so he's very clearly talking about what's you're supposed to assume vs what you're actually seeing here.

Or in other words, "she kissed him, but we couldn't actually show that, so we had to make it look slightly ambiguous in order to actually get it into the episode".

Also, here's a bunch of other very interesting tidbits from the interview. They're not SatoSere-related, so you should take the discussion about this stuff to that thread, though.

Fast translating! :D thanks for this,
btw sir did you manage to translate the one that i send to you? the one i said it is written on front page before the interview?
this one "[XY] と[XY & Z ] で の サトシは 凛々しく . 頼り が い の ある 少年 として 描か れ て おり, それも新鮮 な 魅力 の ひとつ だっ た 。 , ー緒 に 旅 を 始める より も 前 から セレナ にとって サトシ は 憧れ の 人 で あり, 淡い恋心 を 抱い て い た 。[XY&Z]の「 終わり なきゼ口!また逢う日まで!!」 における サトシ と セレナ の 別れ の シーン は 、 そんな 彼ら だ から こそ 成立 し た 名場面 で ある."

specially the last word here, i think amourshipper people will like it :)
 
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Epicocity

Well-Known Member
I looked at that "ambiguity" bit, and yeah, he's clearly saying that she's meant to be kissing him, but that it's also meant to be ambiguous, so he's very clearly talking about what's you're supposed to assume vs what you're actually seeing here.

Or in other words, "she kissed him, but we couldn't actually show that, so we had to make it look slightly ambiguous in order to actually get it into the episode".

Also, here's a bunch of other very interesting tidbits from the interview. They're not SatoSere-related, so you should take the discussion about this stuff to that thread, though.

Thanks for everything (we're saying this a lot) to the both of you for the fast translating. Those other tidbits were just as interesting as the Amour related stuff.
 

Satoshi no masara

Professional couch potato
*The kiss scene is indeed meant to be Serena kissing Satoshi, and his reaction to it is surprised awe, any ambiguity the scene has is so they could get it on TV in the first place.

I think this clear things on Ash's side. ;)

Any more doubts?

*The idea to have a romance subplot apparently came from producer Shukichi Kanda, who came up with the idea of portraying things through a female lead's admiration for Satoshi, which then led to the suggestion that they'd have a flashback to a childhood meeting with romantic implications.


Well, kudos to Shukichi-san for coming up with the idea. I like how they started with an admiration to the point that it led to a romantic subplots with development. I just wish that this really bears fruition in the future because I don't see how they'll be able to use the same concept again.
 

Heekful

Well-Known Member
*The kiss scene is indeed meant to be Serena kissing Satoshi, and his reaction to it is surprised awe, any ambiguity the scene has is so they could get it on TV in the first place.

I think this clear things on Ash's side. ;)

Any more doubts?

*The idea to have a romance subplot apparently came from producer Shukichi Kanda, who came up with the idea of portraying things through a female lead's admiration for Satoshi, which then led to the suggestion that they'd have a flashback to a childhood meeting with romantic implications.


Well, kudos to Shukichi-san for coming up with the idea. I like how they started with an admiration to the point that it led to a romantic subplots with development. I just wish that this really bears fruition in the future because I don't see how they'll be able to use the same concept again.


Yeah but remember that people seems to know more how Ash reacted than the director himself.

The funny thing is that Shukichi Kanda was the producer of the first movie and the first season, so that's actually pretty cool that a guy who was there since the beggining of Pokemon had a thought about this. After knowing that it was him I have even more confidence that Serena will perhaps be the end game for Ash because (no offense) they could had easily used Misty instead when they started to think about a romance plot.
 

Dephender

Gizakawayusu
Staff member
Moderator
Fast translating! :D thanks for this,
btw sir did you manage to translate the one that i send to you? the one i said it is written on front page before the interview?
this one "[XY] と[XY & Z ] で の サトシは 凛々しく . 頼り が い の ある 少年 として 描か れ て おり, それも新鮮 な 魅力 の ひとつ だっ た 。 , ー緒 に 旅 を 始める より も 前 から セレナ にとって サトシ は 憧れ の 人 で あり, 淡い恋心 を 抱い て い た 。[XY&Z]の「 終わり なきゼ口!また逢う日まで!!」 における サトシ と セレナ の 別れ の シーン は 、 そんな 彼ら だ から こそ 成立 し た 名場面 で ある."

specially the last word here, i think amourshipper people will like it :)

Oh right, I forgot.

One of the things that makes XY and XY&Z feel so new and refreshing is how Satoshi is depicted as a very gallant and dependable boy, one that Serena admired and had a crush on even before they started traveling together. It's precisely because of these people that Satoshi and Serena's farewell scene in "No End to the Zeros! Till the Day We Meet Again!!" has become so famous.
 
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AshSerena

Well-Known Member
Oh right, I forgot.

One of the things that makes XY and XY&Z feel so new and refreshing is how Satoshi is depicted as a very gallant and dependable boy, one that Serena admired and had a crush on even before they started traveling together. It's precisely because of these people that Satoshi and Serena's farewell scene in "No End to the Zeros! Till the Day We Meet Again!!" has become so famous.

Thanks alot for this translation! me and i know most people here are really thankful to you :) thanks again!
Atleast they know that last episode is 1 of the famous episode of XY and XYZ :)
 

Satoshi no masara

Professional couch potato
Yeah but remember that people seems to know more how Ash reacted than the director himself.

At least this clears out to those who doubt and say that Ash didn't react at all and just went "lol, wut?" after the kiss. Even though he didn't blush, the scene made him realize Serena's feelings.
Oh right, I forgot.

One of the things that makes XY and XY&Z feel so new and refreshing is how Satoshi is depicted as a very gallant and dependable boy, one that Serena admired and had a crush on even before they started traveling together. It's precisely because of these people that Satoshi and Serena's farewell scene in "No End to the Zeros! Till the Day We Meet Again!!" has become so famous.

Yeah, I really love the transition they made with Ash in XY. He was your ideal heroic and dependable boy. He was so matured compared to his previous personalities in the past and the chemistry he and Serena had together is almost perfect to me. The only thing left is for these two is to become a couple and it'd be perfect! :D
 

Navin

MALDREAD

I said way long ago, but I wanted more natural banter, and not always serious moments (about goals and stuff), which felt were the brunt of their interactions (maybe I'm wrong, but it just felt that way).


Oh and I hope you understand all the things I meant because I'm french and I'm trying to do my best , nobody is perfect right ? xD

Je suis etonne que vous puissiez ecrire l'anglais si bien =)
 

KungFuMaster

KungFu Zen Mode
I said way long ago, but I wanted more natural banter, and not always serious moments (about goals and stuff), which felt were the brunt of their interactions (maybe I'm wrong, but it just felt that way).




Je suis etonne que vous puissiez ecrire l'anglais si bien =)

That's why she returns in SM for for more funny and natural moments.

I'm actually quite surprized that the community is active again after 2 months of silence :)
 

TTNH03

Pokemon Researcher
Wow, this thread is back in action again and it's all thanks to the people who are helping with the translation and giving us the info on it.
Thank you to Dephender, AshSerena and plxtreme for that!!!

Oh right, I forgot.

One of the things that makes XY and XY&Z feel so new and refreshing is how Satoshi is depicted as a very gallant and dependable boy, one that Serena admired and had a crush on even before they started traveling together. It's precisely because of these people that Satoshi and Serena's farewell scene in "No End to the Zeros! Till the Day We Meet Again!!" has become so famous.

That's very interesting. So one of the main reasons why they gave Ash that personality in XY was to give Serena a strong impression of him and her admiration of her crush.

It's probably one of the reasons why the SM anime would be a bad setting for Serena to return right now.

At least now we know that the kiss was intentional and on the lips too. Except that it was made ambiguous in the anime since it was a kids show. Just like other people have been saying all along but I'm glad that we got clarification of that.
 

Pokegirl Fan~

Liko>>>>>Ash
Wow, this thread is back in action again and it's all thanks to the people who are helping with the translation and giving us the info on it.
Thank you to Dephender, AshSerena and plxtreme for that!!!



That's very interesting. So one of the main reasons why they gave Ash that personality in XY was to give Serena a strong impression of him and her admiration of her crush.

It's probably one of the reasons why the SM anime would be a bad setting for Serena to return right now.

At least now we know that the kiss was intentional and on the lips too. Except that it was made ambiguous in the anime since it was a kids show. Just like other people have been saying all along but I'm glad that we got clarification of that.

They could always change things when Serena returns like make their moments have more slapstick comedy in them or something. Besides SM has shown to have serious moments too, so serious moments can still happen.

It's nice to know that it is confirmed that Serena kissed him and that Ash apparently enjoyed it I guess, though it doesn't really matter to me if the shipping is officially canon or not.
 

Navin

MALDREAD
That's very interesting. So one of the main reasons why they gave Ash that personality in XY was to give Serena a strong impression of him and her admiration of her crush.

Is that not...weird?

I remember getting a lot of flak for saying they conveniently wrote in a flashback where younger Ash behaved almost exactly the same as XY Ash, and now it seems that was intentionally done. Like imagine if Serena showed up in Kanto, or Unova, or Alola, would the ship not have worked at all?
 

Mrs. Oreo

Banned
I think they started it because France/Paris is the country/city of love. Also a reason why shipping wasn't started in other regions. Maybe they wanted to show a bit of the French culture to the kids in Japan? xD, like they showed many food and buildings from France.

I could see how the whole Kalos being based on France thing might've inspired Amourshipping's basis, but if the writers were intending on giving us a romance subplot for three years, I do wish that they had given us some kind of endgame to make it all worthwhile. I liked that Serena kissed Ash at the end of XYZ cuz it was really sweet of course, but it just feels to me as if Amour was a ploy by the writing staff that they had no intention of finishing. :[
 

TTNH03

Pokemon Researcher
They could always change things when Serena returns like make their moments have more slapstick comedy in them or something. Besides SM has shown to have serious moments too, so serious moments can still happen.

It's nice to know that it is confirmed that Serena kissed him and that Ash apparently enjoyed it I guess, though it doesn't really matter to me if the shipping is officially canon or not.

Yeah, I can agree with that. Serena could come back to Sun and Moon series and scold Ash for doing something stupid or hit him with a fan.

The only problem with that is what we think of it then. They've set Ash as a serious person in XY someone who will strive to not give up. With SM, Ash still has that but can be somewhat comedic which feels awkward for us who have seen what he does in XY.

Is that not...weird?

I remember getting a lot of flak for saying they conveniently wrote in a flashback where younger Ash behaved almost exactly the same as XY Ash, and now it seems that was intentionally done. Like imagine if Serena showed up in Kanto, or Unova, or Alola, would the ship not have worked at all?

If Serena was in the other series then the ship could still work but it would be different.
E.g. if Serena was in BW, she'd always be questioning herself like:
"Why did I fall for this kid in the first place?"
"Why did you do such things?"
"Sigh, I can't believe you, Ash."
Serena goes to kiss Ash in BW would be awkward. I can even hear Ash thinking of why she kissed him even though she always thinks of him as childish.

It feels like the writers catered Ash's personality more towards his gallant and serious type for XY. I guess it has a stronger impact with Ash's personality like that since we can watch moments between him and Serena and take it seriously. That's why the kiss scene gave us a big impression in the end too. Heck, even if he does stupid stuff, it would be adjusted towards more of like a reckless but brave type of stunt.

I hope that makes sense...
 

Epicocity

Well-Known Member
Yeah, I can agree with that. Serena could come back to Sun and Moon series and scold Ash for doing something stupid or hit him with a fan.

The only problem with that is what we think of it then. They've set Ash as a serious person in XY someone who will strive to not give up. With SM, Ash still has that but can be somewhat comedic which feels awkward for us who have seen what he does in XY.



If Serena was in the other series then the ship could still work but it would be different.
E.g. if Serena was in BW, she'd always be questioning herself like:
"Why did I fall for this kid in the first place?"
"Why did you do such things?"
"Sigh, I can't believe you, Ash."
Serena goes to kiss Ash in BW would be awkward. I can even hear Ash thinking of why she kissed him even though she always thinks of him as childish.

It feels like the writers catered Ash's personality more towards his gallant and serious type for XY. I guess it has a stronger impact with Ash's personality like that since we can watch moments between him and Serena and take it seriously. That's why the kiss scene gave us a big impression in the end too. Heck, even if he does stupid stuff, it would be adjusted towards more of like a reckless but brave type of stunt.

I hope that makes sense...

I take a slightly different opinion: at his core, Ash is a very kind and gallant person. Perhaps his seriousness came from the natural progression of maturation, but Ash can have his moments of bravery in any series. Heck, the opening of DP has him climbing a TRio mecha to save Pikachu. The problem that brings out some of his attitude problems is when people essentially push his "inferiority button" as I like to call it. Iris and Misty did it the most while Serena undoubtedly did it the least.

In other words, I think that Serena, being who she was, would have still loved Ash for being "gallant" as it were because she would never push to button to make him feel inferior and thus snappy. Dawn was similar; most of Ash's outbursts were either over stupid things or Paul. I guess what I'm trying to say is that Ash has always been a kind-hearted and gallant soul from Episode 1 (and therefore the flashback is simply a reiteration of that), but certain circumstances can make him not be. Serena is not one of those circumstances.
 
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