Amourshipping Thread V3

[Power Up]

It really doesn't matter whether or not Grace was there or not. It was a gift that had a ton of sentimental value to Serena, and she even got teary eyed over it when she contacted her mother to thank her for it.

...Yes, yes it does. The sentimental value is tied to the fact that it was Grace's gift, if she doesn't appear in the episode at all, there's no need for it to be brought up. It's literally impossible to address everything about Serena's character all at once. That was the point of when I said this wasn't XY. Serena and Amour doesn't have the luxury that XY did in having a bunch of episodes to showcase the full breadth of her character, especially her relationship with Ash and the complex nuances that comes with it.

You can say it's bad writing, and I say no, she's NOT obligated to wear it, even for this single episode nor are the writers obligated to show a character with an established love for fashion not change up their appearance.

I literally never implied that she would be obligated to wear it, I said if the show didn't address what happened to it, that would be bad writing if Grace was a part of the episode.

At the end of the day though, we both want the same thing...more interaction between them. If people really just want Serena to turn into a tomato again around Ash (which I suspect deep down most do), the only way that's happening at this point is if someone teases her, or brings their relationship into question.

I wasn't lying when I said this episode would have been good if Serena had wore the ribbon. People are acting like I have these unbelievably high standards when in reality they're incredibly low.

 

[Akkipeddi]

People are acting like I have these unbelievably high standards when in reality they're incredibly low.

Having low standards implies still having some bare minimum standards...which is still too high for this anime.

 

[Hyuuga28]

...Yes, yes it does. The sentimental value is tied to the fact that it was Grace's gift, if she doesn't appear in the episode at all, there's no need for it to be brought up. It's literally impossible to address everything about Serena's character all at once. That was the point of when I said this wasn't XY. Serena and Amour doesn't have the luxury that XY did in having a bunch of episodes to showcase the full breadth of her character, especially her relationship with Ash and the complex nuances that comes with it.

I literally never implied that she would be obligated to wear it, I said if the show didn't address what happened to it, that would be bad writing if Grace was a part of the episode.

I wasn't lying when I said this episode would have been good if Serena had wore the ribbon. People are acting like I have these unbelievably high standards when in reality they're incredibly low.

No, it doesn't. She could have just had it on, and people who have stuck around since XY would pick up on it immediately without needing a bunch of details regardless if her mother appeared or not. But she didn't have it on and that's fine, because you can be sure she loves her mother just as much. If you want to believe that the ribbon is the be all end all, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

I'm not trying to be mean here, but the TRUE value that Serena received from Ash was wanting to be a person like him and embodying that to pass on to others. The ribbon is the least concerning thing about how their reunion was handled, that being how it was purposely avoided almost entirely and having the ribbon on her hat or wherever wouldn't have really helped a 30 second exchange of "how do you do's/it's been a while/welp time to go!" Because then there'd still be, "why didn't she blush when she saw him??" "Why didn't they mention the kiss? Was it retconned!?".

 

[Morax]

Are people actually content with the fact that the reunion lasted 30 seconds?

Lmao, could your standards hit any lower?

 

[Heekful]

I don't think it's a good idea to expect any real Amour moments as long as Tomiyasu is the director tbh.

We'll see at the end of Journey if he stays as the director or not because I don't expect Serena to come back again when there's Iris , Dawn and maybe even Misty set to reappear in the span of 20-25 episodes left.

If Yajima could be back to work for the main anime again that would be good for us (he still did storyboards of some recent JN episodes so he has been involved in JN somehow) but if he's back directing the movies after JN, I feel like Ash and Serena relationship will never progress further (and it's fine, at the end of the day shipping is for fun, it's really just the haters and some minority of Amourshippers that take this shipping really seriously lol).

Don't forget that the main problem here is that the writers themselves pushed this ship to the max with a kiss to then give us a 30 seconds reunion after almost 6 years of waiting... They didn't help us at all and the lack of Serena marketing is also very frustrating, they really treated her like she never existed before AND after the episode.

I would have prefered them to just confirm that their relationship will never be serious right away than just give us an ambigious ending like they did in JN105 and make us wait for another 5 years because that's most likely what's going to happen now.

 

[Spider-Phoenix]

@PotSmuggle I talked with my teacher yesterday and after showing her the Iwane tweet, she thinks he might have forgotten to put something before the second "ないので" as well.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1509894069350432768

And the lady even bothered using english names. And she didn't have to. What a legend!

And in case nothing happens then I can only conclude that their intentions is to clearly remove any signs of romance and considering how Ash is being treated this season, it's obvious they are trying to make this anime as kid-friendly as possible (not that it makes any sense in the first place considering the amount of romance that have been introduced in the anime and considering that other child-friendly anime has handled romance better).

Interesting that Yokai Watch didn't shy away of showing Nate harbor a crush on Kate, who was both his neighboor and classmate. And that show was overcoming Pokémon when its popularity peaked.

some of the cringiest and or most arrogant people in the fandom, just so happen to like Dawn and or Pearlshipping.

I like Dawn and felt offended

I dug up the tweet (which took me a while to do, lol and this sure has been a trip down memory lane as I scroll all the way back to early 2016.)

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/692698980279414784

Some clarification, Omode tweeted this as to make it clear that the dance party episode was supposed to be Eevee's progression and not Ash and Serena's. It seems that her message for the episode was misunderstood overseas as she wanted this to be a focus for Eevee but fans from overseas see the episode as a focus between Ash and Serena (quite possibly for them to dance together) and that's what she apologized for. Still, she wasn't apologizing here because she was bullied but rather, there was a language barrier that caused some misunderstanding.

I'd blame that more on the episode title than anything. Maybe if that focused more on the Eevee then people wouldn't have gotten their hopes up way too much

 

[Shadao]

Are people actually content with the fact that the reunion lasted 30 seconds?

Lmao, could your standards hit any lower?

You really don't know how romance tropes work, do you?

30 seconds is typical, beautiful romance. Ever last one counts. Romance is not defined by how much time you spend with person, but rather how you use that time. And how willing you are to wait for the next meeting. Like cherry blossoms.

That's why a lot of romance drama hinges on "Will They or Won't They?" and why the writers love to keep them apart rather than together during these stories.

 

[Heekful]

Are people actually content with the fact that the reunion lasted 30 seconds?

Lmao, could your standards hit any lower?

Japanese fans are very satisfied with how the reunion played from what I've seen and that's hard for us because that's... Their main target audience.

Like I said I will not wait another 5 years for ANOTHER 30 seconds reunion so let's see how JN ends and we'll see where we will be at that point because no one can predict what the next anime is going to be, remember the XY -> Sun&Moon switchover ? Nobody expected that back in 2016.

 

[Hyuuga28]

Japanese fans are very satisfied with how the reunion played from what I've seen and that's hard for us because that's... Their main target audience.

Are they? I actually don't know the whole picture. Most I've heard is that they liked Serena, but wish the reunion was longer.

 

[Shadao]

Are they? I actually don't know the whole picture. Most I've heard is that they liked Serena, but wish the reunion was longer.

Wishing the reunion to be longer is what makes the romance all the more sweeter. They love the 30 seconds and want more. And if they want more, then they'll have to milk those 30 seconds and speculate for the next meeting.

You never want to overstuff the episode with romance and risk people getting sick of it. You want it to be enticing enough for people to look forward for the future.

 

[Heekful]

You really don't know how romance tropes work, do you?

30 seconds is typical, beautiful romance. Ever last one counts. Romance is not defined by how much time you spend with person, but rather how you use that time. And how willing you are to wait for the next meeting. Like cherry blossoms.

That's why a lot of romance drama hinges on "Will They or Won't They?" and why the writers love to keep them apart rather than together during these stories.

Wishing the reunion to be longer is what makes the romance all the more sweeter. They love the 30 seconds and want more. And if they want more, then they'll have to milk those 30 seconds and speculate for the next meeting.

You never want to overstuff the episode with romance and risk people getting sick of it. You want it to be enticing enough for people to look forward for the future.

The problem here is : typically in anime they do this yes but in most anime they will not make fans wait 6 years for the two characters to meet again and that's my issue with Amourshipping. I know a 30 seconds romance reunion is something that could be meaningful and well written in a lot of cases but if they want to play it like this again, they'll just bore the fans and make them move on imo, that's maybe what their plan is seeing how popular the shipping is and how vocal most of these fans are.

Are they? I actually don't know the whole picture. Most I've heard is that they liked Serena, but wish the reunion was longer.

Again, it's from what I've seen, I don't know the bigger picture, this is just my experience from checking "サトセレ" on Twitter. I suppose there's probably a few Japanese fans upset that it was short but the majority might be satisfied.

 

[Shadao]

The problem here is : typically in anime they do this yes but in most anime they will not make fans wait 6 years for the two characters to meet again and that's my issue with Amourshipping. I know a 30 seconds romance reunion is something that could be meaningful and well written in a lot of cases but if they want to play it like this again, they'll just bore the fans and make them move on imo, that's maybe what their plan is seeing how popular the shipping is and how vocal most of these fans are.

Like 11 years for Misty?

Or 9 years for Dawn?

Or 8 years for Iris?

Just saying, Pokémon fans are a patient bunch considering the years passing by. And it's a good thing that part of the appeal of Amourshipping is based on Ash being an exceptionally great trainer and good person, with every victory and rank climb up enhancing such status for Serena when they reunite.

I mean, she'll be proud that the love of her life is now considered to be one of the Top 8 Pokémon Trainers in the world. And Master Class no less.

 

[Satoshi no masara]

Are people actually content with the fact that the reunion lasted 30 seconds?

Lmao, could your standards hit any lower?

Obviously not, lmao. I still want more interactions between Ash and Serena and for them to address all of our questions. But considering that JN105 is a Chloe episode, I think we get enough. We'll just have to wait if we're still getting more in the coming episodes

If Yajima could be back to work for the main anime again that would be good for us (he still did storyboards of some recent JN episodes so he has been involved in JN somehow) but if he's back directing the movies after JN, I feel like Ash and Serena relationship will never progress further (and it's fine, at the end of the day shipping is for fun, it's really just the haters and some minority of Amourshippers that take this shipping really seriously lol).

lmao, I'm not as crazy as those in 4chan but I still kinda wanted to take the ship seriously, especially now that Ash and Serena has shared their first kiss. Hadn't that happened, I would have already moved on from this anime back in 2016 since I kinda expected that the writers will have Serena bid Ash farewell without addressing her feelings. But alas, here we are. Seeing Ash and Serena ending up together is still something I'm hoping for to happen one day (but holy Arceus, I'm not gonna go around boards and SNS just to go on a war as if my life depends on it lmao)

I'd blame that more on the episode title than anything. Maybe if that focused more on the Eevee then people wouldn't have gotten their hopes up way too much

True. XY was notorious for having baity titles and marketing back then. (e.g. Serena becomes Satoshi! The ultimate Pikachu battle and while the Serena becomes Satoshi happened, the "ultimate" Pikachu battle ended up being such a lackluster battle, plus that annoying TRio introduction that took almost 4 minutes just to finish (okay maybe shorter than that but it was still far too long that it was such a drag). Then you have that Ash vs. Alain which lead to a lot to believe that it is Ash's chance to be a league champion. Still leaves me salty to this day, ugh).

I like Dawn and felt offended

As a non-Dawn fan (but doesn't hate her in particular) I sympathize with you. Unfortunately, some Dawn fans are getting dragged into this mess. It's the same with Serena fans who are quietly supporting the character but are still getting pointed out for being part of the toxic fandom.

Are they? I actually don't know the whole picture. Most I've heard is that they liked Serena, but wish the reunion was longer.

If we're talking about the Japanese viewers, they are satisfied and at the same time, hoping for more interactions with Ash and Serena. Most casual viewers are not aware of the leak that happened before the episode aired so just imagine their surprise of seeing Serena. Of course, some have already put two and two together when they saw the Sylveon and the ribbon that Chloe's Eevee was wearing.

The problem here is : typically in anime they do this yes but in most anime they will not make fans wait 6 years for the two characters to meet again and that's my issue with Amourshipping. I know a 30 seconds romance reunion is something that could be meaningful and well written in a lot of cases but if they want to play it like this again, they'll just bore the fans and make them move on imo, that's maybe what their plan is seeing how popular the shipping is and how vocal most of these fans are.

Well, in that regards, I'd say they succeeded in the way that it shows how popular the ship still is despite the 6 years gap. Considering that Satoshi & Serena has been a trending topic at that time shows that their chemistry has been well supported by fans even to this day.

Again, it's from what I've seen, I don't know the bigger picture, this is just my experience from checking "サトセレ" on Twitter. I suppose there's probably a few Japanese fans upset that it was short but the majority might be satisfied.

I wouldn't say upset but rather curious, especially with the lack of the blue ribbon which many Japanese fans have noticed for its absence. I know it's just a piece of cloth that Serena can just replace anytime the moment she changes outfit but it is still something that many fans incorporate with the ship.

Wishing the reunion to be longer is what makes the romance all the more sweeter. They love the 30 seconds and want more. And if they want more, then they'll have to milk those 30 seconds and speculate for the next meeting.

You never want to overstuff the episode with romance and risk people getting sick of it. You want it to be enticing enough for people to look forward for the future.

I really really hope all of these will bear some fruition in the coming months because all these speculation and waiting is just painful lmao.

A Buchimaru plushie.

Wait, wrong Universe. Then again, she does have a Panda Pokemon.

Maybe a Teddiursa doll? Too bad May already beat Serena in that regard

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

So I missed some fireworks this morning eh?
Regarding the dance thing: I know that it wasn’t the focus of the episode, but why would you have Ash dance with MIETTE of all people and not Serena. Plus the scene they did it was trolly and baity.
I really want to watch XY again but I feel like I take things a little too seriously (cough Kalos League). I just don’t know how I’ll fit it into my schedule too. Last summer I watched OS the whole time and would only get outside when my parents made me too.

 

[Satoshi no masara]

Regarding the dance thing: I know that it wasn’t the focus of the episode, but why would you have Ash dance with MIETTE of all people and not Serena. Plus the scene they did it was trolly and baity.

The thing about that is Serena initially wanted Ash to be her dance partner but Eevee, was still not comfortable around any of the Pokémon with the exception of Bunelby which unfortunately belongs to Clemont. Of course, Serena not wanting to be rude and for the sake of her Eevee, decided to go along with it. Then Miette comes in to troll Serena and swoops Ash for herself. As you can see throughout the episode, Serena still feels frustrated that she didn't get to have Ash as her partner but she had no choice. The title is click-baity to the point that it confuses many viewers with the partner choices but it kinda makes sense in context of the episode as it was supposed to develop Eevee's personality.

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

The thing about that is Serena initially wanted Ash to be her dance partner but Eevee, was still not comfortable around any of the Pokémon with the exception of Bunelby which unfortunately belongs to Clemont. Of course, Serena not wanting to be rude and for the sake of her Eevee, decided to go along with it. Then Miette comes in to troll Serena and swoops Ash for herself. As you can see throughout the episode, Serena still feels frustrated that she didn't get to have Ash as her partner but she had no choice. The title is click-baity to the point that it confuses many viewers with the partner choices but it kinda makes sense in context of the episode as it was supposed to develop Eevee's personality.

Well Ash could’ve just borrowed Eevee or they could have time for both Ash and Miette and Ash and Serena to dance. And I hate Miette so that’s why I was so pissed (and this episode made me hate Miette for robbing Ash and Serena’s dance)

 

[Satoshi no masara]

Well Ash could’ve just borrowed Eevee or they could have time for both Ash and Miette and Ash and Serena to dance. And I hate Miette so that’s why I was so pissed (and this episode made me hate Miette for robbing Ash and Serena’s dance)

lmao, that dance party was for Performers only plus one partner of their choice so it wouldn't make any sense if Ash was Eevee's partner and, again, Eevee was uncomfortable around others other than Bunelby so obviously, that won't work. They did almost dance though but Omode being a troll, had to interrupt their supposed dance. But at least during a match-up, Ash and Serena became partners in battle against James and Miette so there's that. Besides, Ash didn't have any plans on participating in the dance party until Miette asks him. Had he not been invited by Miette, Serena still wouldn't have the chance to dance with him anyway.

 

[masdog]

Are people actually content with the fact that the reunion lasted 30 seconds?

Yes. I actually enjoyed the reunion. It did a lot with very little.

Lmao, could your standards hit any lower?

There is no bottom here.

I don't think it's a good idea to expect any real Amour moments as long as Tomiyasu is the director tbh.

I don’t think the issue is Tomiyasu. I think the issue is two-fold. One - the show is built to market the games and other merchandise and it prioritizes this over story. Two - the characters are still 10, and any “romantic” interactions will be in the context of 10 year olds.

Any SatoSere story can’t progress until the end of the series because of these two factors.

Besides, Ash didn't have any plans on participating in the dance party until Miette asks him.

And that is the only part of the episode I didn’t like. Ash just happily accepted Miette’s invitation without any second thoughts.

But we got to see Ash and Serena battle together and Eevee evolve into Sylveon.

And it gave me a writing prompt for (unfinished) fan fiction. So it all worked out in the end.

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

Besides, Ash didn't have any plans on participating in the dance party until Miette asks him. Had he not been invited by Miette, Serena still wouldn't have the chance to dance with him anyway.

He still could’ve gone. That episode not only should have been an Eevee episode, but an episode that further develops Ash and Serena’s relationship.
I feel like Amourshipping had so much squandered potential... but unfortunately Yajima couldn’t further develop it because this is a kids show (though that can’t prevent other shows like Naruto from showing kisses on the lips)

 

[SatoSereFan224888]

Well I was thinking Ash was staying in a hotel suite during the Masters 8. The night before the final against Leon, he starts to feel nervous but wants Serena to come over and talk with her. He feels she’s the only girl who would comfort him before his matches. Also, when Ash wins, Serena will be the first to congratulate him on his victory.