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Ash needed better Pokemon to win Kanto League, or even certain gym leaders...

Psajdak

Well-Known Member
But which?

...

IMO, at the very least he needed starters to evolve, even if Venusaur meant one role less for Megumi Hayashibara.
 

PokemonBattleFanatic-

Standby for Battle!
The Kanto League was a joke,some jabroni named Ritchie made it all the way to the top 8.Ash was too much of a novice to win but he made it pretty far on his first try.He didn't start taking training seriously until around Hoenn and he reached his pinnacle as a skilled trainer in Sinnoh/Kalos.His best chances of winning the League were Hoenn/Unova,he lost those conferences because he didn't bring in his biggest powerhouses.

This is who he should've used,

Ever Grande Conference
-Charizard
-Snorlax
-Bulbasaur
-Glalie
-Swellow

-Kingler
-Squirtle
-Pikachu
-Grovyle
-Torkoal




Vertress Conference
-Charizard
-Sceptile

-Pikachu
-Krookodile
-Heracross
-Gible
-Noctowl
-Staraptor
-Corphish
-Pignite
-Palpitoad
-Leavanny


---------------------------------------------------------------------
: BONUS

Lumiose Conference
-Greninja
-Charizard
-Infernape
-Sceptile
-Pikachu
-Snorlax
-Bulbasaur
-Gliscor
-Talonflame
-Hawlucha
 

PokemonBattleFanatic-

Standby for Battle!
I'm still not sure that Ash could defeat Virgil with his best reserves.
Why not?Yh Virgil has a balanced strong team and still had 3 pokemon remaining against Cameron but he was down to only 1 when he faced Dino in the finals.I don't see any of Virgil's pokemon easily defeating Charizard,Infernape and Sceptile especially 1 on 1,it would require a group effort to defeat them.

Charizard swept half of Gary's team including his ace Blastoise,had an intense 1 on 1 matchup with Harrison's Blaziken.Outlasted an Articuno,toyed around with Iris's Dragonite before N stopped the battle.

Infernape swept half of Paul's team including one of his strongest Electivire while being poisoned by Drapion's Toxic Spikes Entry Hazard.When Hax Blaze activates you're pretty much screwed unless you're a champion or E4.

Sceptile was one of Ash's biggest powerhouses in AG/Battle Frontier,it defeated both Spenser's Claydol/Shiftry and did some damage to Brandon's Regirock regardless of Ash being possessed by an evil spirit. It's ability Overgrow comes in handy whenever it's on the verge of fainting,at the Sinnoh League it managed to KO an undefeated Darkrai.
 

Psajdak

Well-Known Member
IMO:

- force evolve Pikachu into Raichu, or abandon / put him aside him for Electabuzz, or Jolteon

- abandon Charizard for some obedient fire type, like Arcanine, or simply another Charizard

- Scyther, because best bug in gen 1

- Blastoise, or Gyarados

- Venusaur, Vileplume, or Exeggutor

- Dragonite, or Gengar


That is, if legendary Pokemon were still reserved for movies primarily in that timeline.
 

DankOverlord

Komodo Dragons Rule!
IMO:

- force evolve Pikachu into Raichu, or abandon / put him aside him for Electabuzz, or Jolteon

- abandon Charizard for some obedient fire type, like Arcanine, or simply another Charizard

- Scyther, because best bug in gen 1

- Blastoise, or Gyarados

- Venusaur, Vileplume, or Exeggutor

- Dragonite, or Gengar


That is, if legendary Pokemon were still reserved for movies primarily in that timeline.
Pikachu has bested a Gym Leader's undefeated Raichu and did well during the League, there's no need to toss him aside purely because of shallow strength seeking. Also abandoning his starter and long-time partner would be entirely out-of-character for Ash, he's not some cruel social darwinist

Abandoning Charizard would be entirely OOC for him.
 
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Pokemonfan5

Well-Known Member
There is no problem with Ash's Pokemons in kanto but rather Ash himself, he didn't take training or other important stuffs seriously instead fooling around for useless things.

If he take things seriously he would've won indigo league even with just one season experience because the competition is so low that we didn't see any trainer who is actually can be considered strong, a so called 8 badge trainer lose to Krabby who never battle in his entire life before or Richie who somehow reach top 8.
 

Leonhart

Imagineer
I suppose that we're just ignoring the fact that Satoshi would've lost regardless of which Pokemon he had on-hand in the Sekiei League because of the plot getting in the way? Hypothetically, he would've stood a better chance if his Lizardon had listened to him for starters. His Pigeon, Zenigame, and Fushigidane evolving would've also provided Satoshi with a more balanced team.

But then again evolutions aren't everything, as we saw that Sayuri was using un-evolved Pokemon such as Onisuzume or Menokurage, and she still managed to beat Hiroshi despite him making Top 8 compared to Satoshi's Top 16 position.
 

DankOverlord

Komodo Dragons Rule!
I suppose that we're just ignoring the fact that Satoshi would've lost regardless of which Pokemon he had on-hand in the Sekiei League because of the plot getting in the way? Hypothetically, he would've stood a better chance if his Lizardon had listened to him for starters. His Pigeon, Zenigame, and Fushigidane evolving would've also provided Satoshi with a more balanced team.

But then again evolutions aren't everything, as we saw that Sayuri was using un-evolved Pokemon such as Onisuzume or Menokurage, and she still managed to beat Hiroshi despite him making Top 8 compared to Satoshi's Top 16 position.
See also Bulbasaur defeating things bigger than itself over and over. Evolving wouldn't necessarily make it better
 

Psajdak

Well-Known Member
I suppose that we're just ignoring the fact that Satoshi would've lost regardless of which Pokemon he had on-hand in the Sekiei League because of the plot getting in the way? Hypothetically, he would've stood a better chance if his Lizardon had listened to him for starters. His Pigeon, Zenigame, and Fushigidane evolving would've also provided Satoshi with a more balanced team.

But then again evolutions aren't everything, as we saw that Sayuri was using un-evolved Pokemon such as Onisuzume or Menokurage, and she still managed to beat Hiroshi despite him making Top 8 compared to Satoshi's Top 16 position.
Please, speak English.
 

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
I suppose that we're just ignoring the fact that Satoshi would've lost regardless of which Pokemon he had on-hand in the Sekiei League because of the plot getting in the way? Hypothetically, he would've stood a better chance if his Lizardon had listened to him for starters. His Pigeon, Zenigame, and Fushigidane evolving would've also provided Satoshi with a more balanced team.

But then again evolutions aren't everything, as we saw that Sayuri was using un-evolved Pokemon such as Onisuzume or Menokurage, and she still managed to beat Hiroshi despite him making Top 8 compared to Satoshi's Top 16 position.
Yeah, I mean sure he didn't train, but they kinda skimmed past showing the effects of that when having tons of outside forces be out to MAKE him lose, such as a ridiculously persistent Team Rocket keeping him from the conference, and officials having zero sympathy for his Pokemon being worn out and even disqualifying his Pokemon for being asleep. Even the whole disobedient Pokemon thing wavers because we've seen plenty of Pokemon be disobedient even with advanced trainers. Ash wasn't a great trainer back then, but the consequences he suffered weren't from being a poor trainer, they were from everything and everyone around him wanting to prove he was.

It's like the referee had a date that night and Ash suffered because he wanted to hurry it along. :p
 

Yuugis Black Magician

Namaikina Imouto
The Sekiei League wasn't really about showing Satoshi being some mature trainer, it set out to paint him as immature and bound to lose because of that. Yuyama, Hidaka and Shudou didn't want his battles to be big pride matches. While I would prefer otherwise and have more exciting battles leading up to the end his actual loss is still a really good one.
 

Applecorp

Well-Known Member
He could've stood a better chance if Charizard listened to him and I'll never get why the writers were so adamant about keeping Charizard as a jerk for so long.

Squirtle should've evolved too I mean unlike Bulbasaur he wasn't against evolving so why not go for it. Also Ash needed a 6th Pokemon not counting Oak'd reserves.
 

Mr.Munchlax

Great Ball Rank Trainer
He didn't start taking training seriously until around Hoenn and he reached his pinnacle as a skilled trainer in Sinnoh/Kalos.
You forgot Alola. Yes he wasn't portrayed as strong in that league as he did in Sinnoh and Kalos, but Ash's battling strategies were still just as consistent and it was the first time it didn't feel like he was reset in terms of skill & experience. Plus, while his team started off weak in the Alola League, by the end of the tournament it became his strongest & most memorable roster since Sinnoh
 
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