Ash Reckless

[Prakhar]

Hello everyone!!!

The old ones might get what i am saying.
Here goes-

Isn't ash becoming reckless after the original series,

Imagine,
Ash forfeits when Brock's Onix squeezes Pikachu or
when Ash forfeits when Blaine's Magmar's Fire Blast got Pikachu burned.

Now imagine,
Ash ordering his pokemon to continue in almost all other series.

Isn't it showing that Ash is getting more about winning and less about caring.

Also, why does he leave all his pokemon behind when starting a new region,
if so then his chikorita's opinion on Ash's partiality on Pikachu is right, right?

Soooo, what's you take on this?

 

[CowNorris]

He also gained the ability Oblivious

 

[X Drake]

He doesn't bring his old pokemon with him since he wants to start anew.I think this has been explained before.

Also he keeps bringing Pikachu with him to each region because :

1)Pikachu is his best friend
2)Pikachu is his first pokemon

Also compared to the original season Ash has gotten smarter a in terms of tactics and strategy, and is also more used to battling, which is why he doesn't forfeit whenever he is going to lose a match.

 

[PokemonNation2000]

He's always been reckless: he just had an actually interesting character there, wittiness, sarcasm, and was full of depth in the OS, unlike in XY.

 

[Lord Trollbias]

Because he isn't as inexperienced so he's not afraid of just plain out losing or his Pokemon taking some damage here and there.

 

[Stoateyez]

Hello everyone!!!

The old ones might get what i am saying.
Here goes-

Isn't ash becoming reckless after the original series,

Imagine,
Ash forfeits when Brock's Onix squeezes Pikachu or
when Ash forfeits when Blaine's Magmar's Fire Blast got Pikachu burned.

Now imagine,
Ash ordering his pokemon to continue in almost all other series.

Isn't it showing that Ash is getting more about winning and less about caring.

Also, why does he leave all his pokemon behind when starting a new region,
if so then his chikorita's opinion on Ash's partiality on Pikachu is right, right?

Soooo, what's you take on this?

I think that Ash has always been reckless, but to be honest, Pokemon nowadays seems somewhat more lighthearted than it was in the first few seasons. Going back and looking at Onix choking out Pikachu almost looked like Pokemon Origins. Back then, his recklessness actually had consequences. Now - maybe not so much. To me, the battles just seemed a bit darker back then, and I loved it!

Because he isn't as inexperienced so he's not afraid of just plain out losing or his Pokemon taking some damage here and there.

If one were to go off of an "experience/inexperience" standpoint, wouldn't Ash technically be a world champion?

 

[Lord Trollbias]

I think that Ash has always been reckless, but to be honest, Pokemon nowadays seems somewhat more lighthearted than it was in the first few seasons. Going back and looking at Onix choking out Pikachu almost looked like Pokemon Origins. Back then, his recklessness actually had consequences. Now - maybe not so much. To me, the battles just seemed a bit darker back then, and I loved it!



If one were to go off of an "experience/inexperience" standpoint, wouldn't Ash technically be a world champion?

No because he's not the only one going on a journey. Characters like the Champions, E4, and League Winners have been doing it for far longer and are stronger and more experienced than Ash.

 

[Stoateyez]

No because he's not the only one going on a journey. Characters like the Champions, E4, and League Winners have been doing it for far longer and are stronger and more experienced than Ash.

Oops, let me reword it then. If we were to go off of a "experience/inexperience standpoint", then why does Ash manage to lose to new, inexperienced trainers, despite the fact that he has over forty badges?

 

[Lord Trollbias]

Oops, let me reword it then. If we were to go off of a "experience/inexperience standpoint", then why does Ash manage to lose to new, inexperienced trainers, despite the fact that he has over forty badges?

The only real major case of that was Trip in BW (and even then he beat him at the League) and well BW had issues... But it should also be noted that Ash gets a new team every region

 

[CowNorris]

Oops, let me reword it then. If we were to go off of a "experience/inexperience standpoint", then why does Ash manage to lose to new, inexperienced trainers, despite the fact that he has over forty badges?

Another argument for Ash is that Pikachu is already very weak from the encounter with Zekrom. In addition to that Pikachu also has to deal with the handicap of not being able to use electic attacks, 2 of his best moves gone.

 

[PokemonNation2000]

Another argument for Ash is that Pikachu is already very weak from the encounter with Zekrom. In addition to that Pikachu also has to deal with the handicap of not being able to use electic attacks, 2 of his best moves gone.

That's for BW, though: doesn't explain why Ash lost to Gary's Eevee at the end of OI when he beat Drake's Dragonite, or why Ash lost to Paul's Elekid at the beginning of DP when he beat Brandon's Regice beforehand.

(Among other instances I haven't brought up, of course)

 

[CowNorris]

Because both Gary and Paul are similar in experience at time of their battle, so a loss to them isn't anything peculiar.

The outcome of a battle in the anime is more about how the Pokemon is commanded than the Pokemon's power, if there was a tiering system for the anime, then:
1: Champion's Pokes, all Legendary Pokemon
2: Stronger gym leaders (Volkner for example), Frontier Brains, League Winners, Sinnoh and Hoenn Ash
3: Most gym leaders, Rivals like Barry, Kanto, Johto and Unova Ash
4: Other patzers

 

[Lord Trollbias]

Because both Gary and Paul are similar in experience at time of their battle, so a loss to them isn't anything peculiar.

The outcome of a battle in the anime is more about how the Pokemon is commanded than the Pokemon's power, if there was a tiering system for the anime, then:
1: Champion's Pokes, all Legendary Pokemon
2: Stronger gym leaders (Volkner for example), Frontier Brains, League Winners, Sinnoh and Hoenn Ash
3: Most gym leaders, Rivals like Barry, Kanto, Johto and Unova Ash
4: Other patzers

I like this tier idea so I'll try my hand
1. All Champions
2. Stronger Elite Four Members (Final Two E4s)
3. Weaker Elite Four Members (First Two E4s), Tobias, Peak Brandon
4. Peak Ash (DP and AG IMO), Paul, Remaing Frontier Brains, Stronger Gym Leaders (Volkner Clair), Other League Winners
5. Remaining Gym Leaders, Remaining League Rivals, OS and BW Ash, Drake (OI)
6. Weaker Trainers

The only real major gap exists between Tiers 3 and 4

 

[PokemonNation2000]

Because both Gary and Paul are similar in experience at time of their battle, so a loss to them isn't anything peculiar.

The outcome of a battle in the anime is more about how the Pokemon is commanded than the Pokemon's power, if there was a tiering system for the anime, then:
1: Champion's Pokes, all Legendary Pokemon
2: Stronger gym leaders (Volkner for example), Frontier Brains, League Winners, Sinnoh and Hoenn Ash
3: Most gym leaders, Rivals like Barry, Kanto, Johto and Unova Ash
4: Other patzers

Drake and Brandon are just as (if not more) experienced as Gary and Paul, so no-- also, a loss to weak Pokemon after facing legendaries under any circumstance is peculiar.

I agree with that, but the Pokemon's power is a huge factor as well-- you yourself put 2 in the same category as 3 just now.

What's a patzer?

 

[CowNorris]

Ash got lucky with Brandon for his victory, not to mention he lost twice beforehand anyways.
Drake's subpar ability as a trainer is reflected when the weak Kanto Ash had the decisive advantage for the most parts of the battle, his only saving grace was a hacked Dragonite with like 10 moves. Besides, Pikachu only delivered the final blow, Charizard and Tauros (iirc) wore it down beforehand.

Take James' Cacnea for example, it was only after residing with a different trainer, Gardenia did he score any victories. Shining example for the trainer having more of an impact than the Pokemon.

Patzer is a weak player in a strategy game.

 

[Kuvario]

Ash got lucky with Brandon for his victory, not to mention he lost twice beforehand anyways.
Drake's subpar ability as a trainer is reflected when the weak Kanto Ash had the decisive advantage for the most parts of the battle, his only saving grace was a hacked Dragonite with like 10 moves. Besides, Pikachu only delivered the final blow, Charizard and Tauros (iirc) wore it down beforehand.

Take James' Cacnea for example, it was only after residing with a different trainer, Gardenia did he score any victories. Shining example for the trainer having more of an impact than the Pokemon.

Patzer is a weak player in a strategy game.

Yes, the first can be said as lucky, but he did use his original Pokémon for it. And they're good Pokémon. Drake, subpar? Yeah, I don't think so. It was a very intense battle, OS Ash has actual skill, there wasn't much in strategy, but it was a hard-earned victory. And, I fail to see how OS Ash had much of an advantage in the battle mostly like you say, after all I can see how much he struggled in the match. And the anime always show Pokémon with more than four moves, how is this hacked?

Well, I see your point with James though. But this isn't always the case.

 

[CowNorris]

By the time Drake's last Pokemon Dragonite was sent out, Ash had Pikachu, Squirtle, Tauros and Charizard to wear it down, if that's not a crushing advantage I don't know what is.

What sort of strategy is 'aim for the horn'? How exactly is legitimately winning 2/8 (iirc) of his badges a reflection of any skill? (Come to think of it, not having WON enough badges is probably why Charizard disobeyed.)

So, any examples of a Pokemon doing as well under a bad / incompatible trainer as it does under a gym leader? There's a lot other examples of this for example Paul and Ash's Chimchar; Jessie and James commanding Aggron and Charizard.

 

[PokemonNation2000]

Ash got lucky with Brandon for his victory, not to mention he lost twice beforehand anyways.
Drake's subpar ability as a trainer is reflected when the weak Kanto Ash had the decisive advantage for the most parts of the battle, his only saving grace was a hacked Dragonite with like 10 moves. Besides, Pikachu only delivered the final blow, Charizard and Tauros (iirc) wore it down beforehand.

Take James' Cacnea for example, it was only after residing with a different trainer, Gardenia did he score any victories. Shining example for the trainer having more of an impact than the Pokemon.

Patzer is a weak player in a strategy game.

The thing is that he won the third match, with the very Pokemon he lost to Paul later on with: Pikachu. That's the part that bothers me: in his first match, he used Sceptile, and in the second, Torkoal.

So Paul's subpar ability when he got trounced by Cynthia is an exception to this.
Good points on Drake, but that's not because of Kanto Ash (or to actually be accurate, OI Ash)-- OI Ash was actually very skilled in that match, so I disagree.

I agree on James and Cacnea, though, but then James was pathetic in AG and DP as a trainer (esp. DP).

Thanks for clarifying that.

 

[Kuvario]

By the time Drake's last Pokemon Dragonite was sent out, Ash had Pikachu, Squirtle, Tauros and Charizard to wear it down, if that's not a crushing advantage I don't know what is.

What sort of strategy is 'aim for the horn'? How exactly is legitimately winning 2/8 (iirc) of his badges a reflection of any skill? (Come to think of it, not having WON enough badges is probably why Charizard disobeyed.)

So, any examples of a Pokemon doing as well under a bad / incompatible trainer as it does under a gym leader? There's a lot other examples of this for example Paul and Ash's Chimchar; Jessie and James commanding Aggron and Charizard.

It takes a while to wear it down, and last I checked they all got KO'd other then Pikachu. And so what? Drake's Dragonite was very powerful, and it was permitted in the rules to do it. It wasn't a crushing advantage at all.

That's not what I meant. I said there wasn't much in strategy for this match and most of OS. That's not why, game =/= anime. Charizard just had an ego after evolving, Ash couldn't handle it until they both earned each other's trust.

I see your point there. The latter was because TR are idiots who can't handle any decent Pokémon. But the first thing is valid, but Chimchar obviously didn't trust Ash back then, in fear of getting berated by Paul.

 

[PokemonNation2000]

By the time Drake's last Pokemon Dragonite was sent out, Ash had Pikachu, Squirtle, Tauros and Charizard to wear it down, if that's not a crushing advantage I don't know what is.

What sort of strategy is 'aim for the horn'? How exactly is legitimately winning 2/8 (iirc) of his badges a reflection of any skill? (Come to think of it, not having WON enough badges is probably why Charizard disobeyed.)

So, any examples of a Pokemon doing as well under a bad / incompatible trainer as it does under a gym leader? There's a lot other examples of this for example Paul and Ash's Chimchar; Jessie and James commanding Aggron and Charizard.

That IS an advantage, but that's most likely because OI Ash battled very well against the rest of Drake's Team, and to be frank, an Eevee is not as strong as a Gengar, Electabuzz, etc. to say the least.

I never said Ash was a genius battler in the OS, but that's not in OI-- difference there, and not Kanto-- he won 4/4 of his OI badges fairly. That latter point is true, though. Plus, to add to that, I think it shows more skill, character, and courage to walk into a flaming building plus rescue a Gloom at the risk of killing yourself, or the ability to smile in the face of getting lucky and telling Brock that he would come back winning the Boulder badge fair and square, with Brock himself giving it to Ash.

I agree, BUT, Brandon and Drake are far more skilled than Jessie and James, so that comparison's not fair.