TheWanderingMist
Paladin of the Snow Queen
Because it isn't precious Sinnoh/Kalos continuity, so they refuse to acknowledge it as such.
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Ash VS Bea! Overcome Octolock! (1128)
- Thread starter Serebii
- Start date
mysticalglacia
Alola Shill
The Bea stock footage was egregious.
Ofherwise, really great battle. While Ash is always tactical, he was especially on his A-game here. The strategies all seemed fresh and effective and it a was very in-command battle for him; I liked it. The Electroweb Strategy reminded me of Chocolate Disco from Jojo with how it created a sort of checkerboard on the field, I thought that was cool. I also appreciate how it ended on a draw as I thought it was way too early for him to defeat Bea. The best option was a draw, and that’s exactly what they did. I hope they battle in her actual Gym in Stow-on-Side for the next rematch, Dynamax included.
That segment with the sweets was adorable. Riolu was cute, Bea was cute, everyone was cute.
Ofherwise, really great battle. While Ash is always tactical, he was especially on his A-game here. The strategies all seemed fresh and effective and it a was very in-command battle for him; I liked it. The Electroweb Strategy reminded me of Chocolate Disco from Jojo with how it created a sort of checkerboard on the field, I thought that was cool. I also appreciate how it ended on a draw as I thought it was way too early for him to defeat Bea. The best option was a draw, and that’s exactly what they did. I hope they battle in her actual Gym in Stow-on-Side for the next rematch, Dynamax included.
That segment with the sweets was adorable. Riolu was cute, Bea was cute, everyone was cute.
Last edited:
Ignition
We are so back Zygardebros
People do this with every series lol. If it's not what they're a fan of, it might as well not exist.
LilligantLewis
Bonnie stan
I'm gonna split up this post into 5 parts:
First, I'm going to talk about the overall structure of Journeys which the conclusion of this arc pissed me off on.
Second, I'll talk about things in the episode that I did not like, which was quite a lot of it.
Third, I'll talk about the couple things I did like.
Fourth, I'll mention some thoughts I had live while watching the episode, which I took notes on. Sometimes those initial reactions can be quite different to my later thoughts, and they are interesting.
Fifth, I'll respond to other people whose posts I have thoughts on.
1)
The episodic format preventing arc-based storytelling in Journeys, most likely due to the new Sunday timeslot the show started with, is hurting it: (I know the timeslot is gone now, thank Arceus)
Kanto: Ash loses, spends rest of episode training Pikachu, Pikachu learns Agility, Ash wins
Johto: Ash loses, spends the full next episode coming up with a new combination move with all 3 of his Pokémon, Ash wins
DP: Ash loses after watching his rival beat the same gym leader, then spends the third episode in the arc training for the rematch, then beats the gym leader in 4th ep of arc
Best Wishes! Ash loses, teaches Tepig and Oshawott new moves, then beats Lenora with said new moves
XY&Z: Ash loses 4 times in the span of 5 episodes, then addresses the issue in the very next episode, and is immediately able to win in the very next episode after that
SM: Ash loses, addresses Lycanroc’s issue and teaches Pikachu a new move in the next episode, and in the 2 immediate subsequent episodes, is able to win the Trial and Grand Trial
On the other hand compared to all the tightly constructed proper arcs mentioned above,
Journeys: Ash loses, unrelated Pikachu episode, Ash loses 2 more times + issue is addressed, 2 unrelated Alola & Fossils episodes, rematch
He doesn’t even mention the losses or the issues in any of the fillers/other episodes either.. it’s just weird/jarring
It's not the first time where there's a gap before the main conflict is resolved, but even that time just felt like an extended arc, not random fillers
In AG, Ash lost to Brawly, the next ep they addressed the issue. The rematch was 9 episodes later, but Ash still trained and kept mentioning the fact that he had lost to Brawly
The episode before the rematch, Brawly appears again
So the transition before the rematch is more seamless
2)
This specific episode. I was so excited at the beginning that the battle started right away, thinking it would last the whole episode, since I'm usually used to the part of an episode before the battle being the part to have a bunch of fluff, not the last 5 minutes. I was shocked when the battle just ended, because there was so much time left, and the ending itself was anticlimactic. Riolu vs. Grapploct barely lasted for any time, and didn't give me a satisfying feeling that Riolu had overcome octolock, despite that being the title of the episode. The episode's ending also just felt weird, it felt like it was going to end multiple times, first at the end of the battle, then at the end of the sweets, then at the end of the lab convo, before finally ending on the flashback. And yeah, as others have said, if the battle were only going to last 12 minutes, then the beginning of the episode should have had "fluff" showing how Ash got to Super Class, or as it's called in the dub, Great Class (which I like better).
3)
I liked that this episode confirmed Bea as Ash's first female main rival, he's had Bianca before but she wasn't his main rival.
I liked that Chuck, the most recent gym leader to only appear in one episode, reappeared. Now the title of most recent gym leader to only appear in one episode shifts to Bugsy.
4)
The way Chuck said "Could that be a message from the World Coronation Series" was so robotic.
They should have stuck with the title of Overcome Octolock! from the Japanese.
Bea actually noticed human emotion, when she saw Ash smile.
5)
People on both sides of it confuse me.
People who loved it: I don't get it. It didn't affect the episode at all for me. If it weren't there, I would have hated the episode just as much, and if you made it even better (let's say, a real animated flashback instead of just still image) I would have hated the episode just as much. It didn't improve or make worse the episode in any way. Chuck appearing and recognizing Ash is continuity, not some still image.
People who are saying their priorities are odd: how is his voice actor connected with a still image of Bayleef? They're unrelated. Animating a still image of Bayleef is a decision that was TOTALLY UNRELATED to contacting his voice actor. The effort required was less too, btw.
First, I'm going to talk about the overall structure of Journeys which the conclusion of this arc pissed me off on.
Second, I'll talk about things in the episode that I did not like, which was quite a lot of it.
Third, I'll talk about the couple things I did like.
Fourth, I'll mention some thoughts I had live while watching the episode, which I took notes on. Sometimes those initial reactions can be quite different to my later thoughts, and they are interesting.
Fifth, I'll respond to other people whose posts I have thoughts on.
1)
The episodic format preventing arc-based storytelling in Journeys, most likely due to the new Sunday timeslot the show started with, is hurting it: (I know the timeslot is gone now, thank Arceus)
Kanto: Ash loses, spends rest of episode training Pikachu, Pikachu learns Agility, Ash wins
Johto: Ash loses, spends the full next episode coming up with a new combination move with all 3 of his Pokémon, Ash wins
DP: Ash loses after watching his rival beat the same gym leader, then spends the third episode in the arc training for the rematch, then beats the gym leader in 4th ep of arc
Best Wishes! Ash loses, teaches Tepig and Oshawott new moves, then beats Lenora with said new moves
XY&Z: Ash loses 4 times in the span of 5 episodes, then addresses the issue in the very next episode, and is immediately able to win in the very next episode after that
SM: Ash loses, addresses Lycanroc’s issue and teaches Pikachu a new move in the next episode, and in the 2 immediate subsequent episodes, is able to win the Trial and Grand Trial
On the other hand compared to all the tightly constructed proper arcs mentioned above,
Journeys: Ash loses, unrelated Pikachu episode, Ash loses 2 more times + issue is addressed, 2 unrelated Alola & Fossils episodes, rematch
He doesn’t even mention the losses or the issues in any of the fillers/other episodes either.. it’s just weird/jarring
It's not the first time where there's a gap before the main conflict is resolved, but even that time just felt like an extended arc, not random fillers
In AG, Ash lost to Brawly, the next ep they addressed the issue. The rematch was 9 episodes later, but Ash still trained and kept mentioning the fact that he had lost to Brawly
The episode before the rematch, Brawly appears again
So the transition before the rematch is more seamless
2)
This specific episode. I was so excited at the beginning that the battle started right away, thinking it would last the whole episode, since I'm usually used to the part of an episode before the battle being the part to have a bunch of fluff, not the last 5 minutes. I was shocked when the battle just ended, because there was so much time left, and the ending itself was anticlimactic. Riolu vs. Grapploct barely lasted for any time, and didn't give me a satisfying feeling that Riolu had overcome octolock, despite that being the title of the episode. The episode's ending also just felt weird, it felt like it was going to end multiple times, first at the end of the battle, then at the end of the sweets, then at the end of the lab convo, before finally ending on the flashback. And yeah, as others have said, if the battle were only going to last 12 minutes, then the beginning of the episode should have had "fluff" showing how Ash got to Super Class, or as it's called in the dub, Great Class (which I like better).
3)
I liked that this episode confirmed Bea as Ash's first female main rival, he's had Bianca before but she wasn't his main rival.
I liked that Chuck, the most recent gym leader to only appear in one episode, reappeared. Now the title of most recent gym leader to only appear in one episode shifts to Bugsy.
4)
The way Chuck said "Could that be a message from the World Coronation Series" was so robotic.
They should have stuck with the title of Overcome Octolock! from the Japanese.
Bea actually noticed human emotion, when she saw Ash smile.
5)
I feel like the lower-ranked trainer should gain some points, about half as much as a win. The problem with the ranking system in WCS is that unlike a real world sports ranking system, like the ones golf and tennis use, it doesn't have "points" that you gain and lose, and in turn those points form a ranking. It instead just seems to arbitrarily go up and down, and in that system, I guess it makes sense that you pretty much pretend the match never happened, but it would be more accurate to have a points system, and have players gain half the points they would have won in a win.
Why would we get rid of her? She's Ash's main rival
I read this whole thread and all the debates about this flashback.
People on both sides of it confuse me.
People who loved it: I don't get it. It didn't affect the episode at all for me. If it weren't there, I would have hated the episode just as much, and if you made it even better (let's say, a real animated flashback instead of just still image) I would have hated the episode just as much. It didn't improve or make worse the episode in any way. Chuck appearing and recognizing Ash is continuity, not some still image.
People who are saying their priorities are odd: how is his voice actor connected with a still image of Bayleef? They're unrelated. Animating a still image of Bayleef is a decision that was TOTALLY UNRELATED to contacting his voice actor. The effort required was less too, btw.
RafaSceptile
Well-Known Member
Reviewing the Pokémon anime in 10 words or less:
"I'm glad Bea is finally a serious female rival"
Episode: 8/10
"I'm glad Bea is finally a serious female rival"
Episode: 8/10