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Best Pokemon Walls?

Discussion in 'Older Gens' started by Its Prime Time, Jun 26, 2011.

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  1. Its Prime Time

    Its Prime Time Hit fast, Hit Hard

    Hopefully everybody here knows what a wall is but for those of you who don't the official description of a wall goes as follows:
    Walls are Pokémon with great Defense or Special Defense or both. Their job is to defend against Sweepers and their hard-hitting attacks. Many walls have Rest or other recovery moves, because this helps them survive longer. Walls are also good with moves like Thunder Wave and Will-o-wisp that cause status effects because this cripples Sweepers even more by lowering their Speed or Attack stats. In my opinion many walls should also be able to provide entry hazards such as Stealth Rock and Spikes.

    In your opinion, past expirences, and likes/dislikes, what are the best wall pokemon?
     
  2. Blue Harvest

    Blue Harvest Banned

    My favorite is Skarmory. Its typing is perfect, movepool does EXACTLY what it needs to and it even has some other options like Taunt to screw up its counters. It can even run a Specially Defensive spread. Skarmory has been OU ever since its creation, a testimate to how good it is.
     
  3. NeohopeSTF

    NeohopeSTF Sol Badguy

    For the best of 5th gen i'd say Ferrothorn has great Defenses can work with Paralyses
     
  4. kaiser soze

    kaiser soze Reading ADWD

    Im not usually a fan of walls, but Ive had good experience with eviolite porygon2. I tried it mostly because I needed a versatile dragon counter for random matchups and it does wonders against pretty much anything without a fighting move (rotom-w resists beambolt, but it does have toxic). it also screws a lot of things like anyone with intimidate or if they have an ability offering an immunity (its fun to switch into an earthquake from flygon or fire blast from flash fire chandelure)
     
  5. Porgon-XYZ

    Porgon-XYZ Wut are you saying?

    Porygon2 for me. It's a wall that can actually deal some nice damage, unlike some walls. It has a huge support movepool and BoltBeam coverage + 105 base satk. With it's evoilite, it's defiently a powerful wall.
     
  6. Specially defensive Jirachi. Ok, it's not really a wall, but calling it a tank is an understatement. It's great at keeping powerful Dragon moves in check, and it's instrumental in countering key Pokemon like Reuniclus.
     
  7. ChaosBlizzard

    ChaosBlizzard Crit Happens.

    I recognize Skarmory as a common wall that a lot of people love, but I've never understood the appeal of it. The only good stat it has is Defense, and unfortunately for it, its two counters are almost always Special. I personally have never had trouble with Skarmory, although I recognize it as well loved. One good Flamethrower or Thunderbolt tends to be enough to take it down for me.

    In 2008 I made my first ever competitive team. It had a Blissey on it. That Blissey is the best Pokemon I have ever raised in 12 years of playing Pokemon.

    Blissey @ Leftovers
    Nature: Bold
    Ability: Serene Grace
    EVs: 255 HP / 255 Defense (I had never EV'd before -_-)
    -Softboiled
    -Ice Beam
    -Toxic
    -Psychic

    I LOVE this thing. She has had more clutch moments... she's awesome.
     
  8. Rezzuréct

    Rezzuréct Allez Les Bleus!

    I think Blissey can be a good walls... because it has very high HP
     
  9. Final

    Final I Submit to No One

    Of course it has its weaknesses. Every Pokemon does. Well the likes of Spiritomb and Eelektross don't have any actual typing weaknesses but Eelektross isn't that bulky and Spiritomb lacks actual resistances. Those can be considered weaknesses too. The fact Skarmory has great Defensive typing means that it doesn't have a lot of weaknesses to attack. Its sheer Defense means that it can take most Physical moves like they're nothing. It will still get pretty hurt by a strong neutral or Super Effective one though. Its typing affords it the luxury to run a Specially Defensive EV spread and with that, it can even take Special Attacks to an extent. There's also Sturdy (which all Skarmory should have as their ability) which got boosted this generation so at full health, I'm pretty sure nothing in OU can actually outright OHKO it (and I'm including Mold Breaker Pokemon too. Well if for some stupid reason you let Haxorus get to +6 then LO Outrage will probably kill it).
     
  10. ChaosBlizzard

    ChaosBlizzard Crit Happens.

    You're right, everything has a weakness. You are right, it has stellar Defense. The problem is that it has a much bigger Achilles' heel than most other walls. Sure, it has stellar Defenses and typing, but it has UU levels of every other stat; no Speed, no Attack, no HP, etc. If you see a Skarmory, don't be a dolt and hit it head-on with physical attacks, just go to your special sweeper. You make Skarmory out to be this great Defensive monster, and while that is true, no one would actually attack it head-on with physical sweepers. It basically just forces a switch.
     
  11. Sabertooth1000000000

    Sabertooth1000000000 Nostalgic Guy

    I've had some fun with Dusclops. Will-o-Wisp is the best move ever.

    I love Skarmory, but I have to agree with this. It's like all those Rock/Ground Pokemon from Generation 1 who have awesome defense but crap special defense. It's like, what's the point when you gave it a titanic weakness to Surf? Not to mention they're slow as all get-out.
     
  12. Final

    Final I Submit to No One

    There are some Physical sweepers that are quite capable of overpowering it with powerful STABed neutral or Super Effective moves. ie Infernape with Flare Blitz, Lucario or Terrakion with Close Combat (at +2 their Close Combats actually OHKO it after factoring in Stealth Rock).

    Its base 80 Attack stat is compensated somewhat by STAB Brave Bird which makes frail stuff or things weak to it think twice before switching in or trying to take it head on and Whirlwind means you can't use it as setup fodder unless you're carrying Taunt and that's no good if you can't take Brave Bird. The recoil sucks but he has Roost which helps offset it and he gets plenty of opportunities to use it.

    A wall like Skarmory doesn't need to be fast unless it is running Taunt to shut down opposing walls or to outstall slower crap with like ThunderPunch Metagross. Base 70 Speed is still better than a lot of Defensive Pokemon too.

    For a Special Attack to be able to overpower him, it needs to be Super Effective and pack at least half decent power. It has no 4x weaknesses so it doesn't have to worry about them and its typing leaves it with few weaknesses and a ton of resistances. Don't expect to 2HKO it with a weak Thunderbolt from something like an uninvested Blissey. If Skarmory is running a Specially Defensive spread, it needs to pack even more power to be capable of overpowering him.
     
  13. Blue Harvest

    Blue Harvest Banned

    I'll put it a different way on why Skarmory is my favorite wall (IMO the best)

    Blue Harvest switched in Skarmory!
    Opponent's Scizor used Bullet Punch! It did almost nothing!

    Opponent sent in Zapdos!
    Skarmory used Spikes!

    Skarmory switched to Gastrodon!
    Zapdos used Thunderbolt. lol.


    One layer of Spikes early on can do a TON of damage to a team over a long game. Repeat this a few more times, then start using Whirlwind. Bad teams can be ravaged by a lone Skarmory even if they have numerous ways of dealing with it.
     
  14. ChaosBlizzard

    ChaosBlizzard Crit Happens.

    You both are describing something that is very conditional. Final, the first half of your post is describing ways to beat it, and Harvest, what happens if you get out-predicted or your Gastondon is already gone? That's the thing, it only has one thing going for it: defense. It has excellent defense and above average typing, but it is so easy to counter, it isn't as reliable as Blissey or Jirachi or the like.
     
  15. Final

    Final I Submit to No One

    You said no one would actually attack it head on with Physical Attacks. I was proving that point wrong. There are things that can break it from the physical side.

    With outprediction. It's the chance you take when playing the prediction game. You may be able to predict your opponent perfectly the first time round but get outpredicted if you tried it the second time. Also, if for some reason the Zapdos was running HP Grass (not likely since Zapdos typically packs HP Ice nowadays but not impossible), you'll get Gastrodon in on Thunderbolt once but the next time, it'll switch in and eat a HP Grass. Luckily for Gastrodon, HP Grass doesn't OHKO but it'll die if you were stupid enough to leave it in unless using it for death fodder. If it has Toxic, Gastrodon, will get in safely the first time and will eat a Toxic on the switch. There's also team preview now so a smart player could catch on quickly. See. Nearly everything is conditional.

    Lastly, you proved yourself wrong. You see. It doesn't have just 1 thing going for it. Great Defense, great Defensive typing, the moves it needs (Spikes, Brave Bird, Taunt, Roost, Whirlwind, etc). As for counterability. That's what the rest of your team is for. To beat out the stuff your other team members lose against.

    Ok. I'm done.
     
  16. Regarde

    Regarde Banned

    lol ChaosBlizzard. have you heard of switching out? that's what you do when they send in a special attacker against skarm. then they have to deal with a layer of spikes like bh said. your statement is just as 'conditional' as hers. you say "what if you get outpredicted and your gastro is gone" well what if you outpredict the opponent and their zapdos is gone? prediction doesn't work for an argument sorry. skarmory is the best physical wall, one of the best spikes user, and a great pokemon for just about any team
     
  17. Tony32

    Tony32 Member

    Skarmory, Blissey, Chansey. I also love Ferrothorns typing and its a real help when it comes to taking out water types.
     
  18. Psycho Cut

    Psycho Cut Well-Known Member

    I've been trying out a ferrothorn recently, and it's done really well for me. I've also hd good experience with some special walls that can also deal a heck ofa lot of damage e.g. mismagius, virizion.
     
  19. Fortunato

    Fortunato Sic Transit Gloria

    Skarmory is a personal favorite of mine but I think my all time favorite is probably Jirachi. Quite simply because it pisses so many people off. I love flinching things to death and seeing my opponent throw all kinds of stupid insults and/or rage quitting. I like steel types in general for walls because they're usually fantastic at the job.
     
  20. cookies kill you

    cookies kill you Like a boss

    not the best but one i love to pull for my red team when the game is about halfway or more to an end deoxys d time with cosmic power toxic and night shade
     
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