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Cameron's Secret Weapon (768)

matt0044

Well-Known Member


My thoughts exact, General Zod.

Also this post below sums up my feelings:

Finally got around to watching the dub of this, and I'm still as bitter about this episode as I was with the original.

Anyone remember the Ash vs. Paul battle... how there was a ton of strategy involved with decent improvised moves and battle plans. Yeah, none of that here. Instead, it's one Pokemon after the other with a ton of:-

"Don't worry Oshawott, I know you can defeat Hydreigon!"
"Don't worry Ferrothorn, I know you can defeat Pignite!"
"Don't worry Pignite, I know you can defeat Samurott!
"Don't worry Samurott, I know you can defeat Pikachu!"
"Don't worry Swanna, I know you can defeat Pikachu!"
"Don't worry Riolu, I know you can defeat Unfezant!"

Oh wait, excuse the last one... Riolu did defeat Unfezant. The bird didn't manage to get off a single move... having said that, she was only hit by three moves that shouldn't have been that effective before being knocked out so I guess logic is being thrown out of the window for the 'Heart of the Cards' mentality the show has been pimping recently.

But let's get on to the worst factor about this episode... Cameron only brought FIVE Pokemon with him!. I mean, geez, there's dumb but then there's bone-shatteringly stupid. "Duh, I thought full battles were five-on-five!" They're called FULL battles, you dumbass. Clearly your logic does not resemble our Earth logic.

The fact the writers went this is stupid idea pisses me off for two reasons...

- It cheats us out of seeing a proper full battle at the league.
- It makes Ash look even weaker that he's having trouble against this guy. DP Ash would be walking over him.

Some people might reason there wasn't time to include another Pokemon, and I could buy that if we hadn't had yet another 'Axew goes missing' filler plot just before. God, even in a league Iris takes focus away from Ash.

People who refute that BW has made Ash weaker and is a massive step backwards for both him and the series, this episode is all the proof you need.

I guess I should give this episode one compliment... I liked the design of the scoreboard (and a really nice touch is that when the evolution is finished you can just see Riolu's picture being replaced by Lucario's... of course, he still shows at Riolu a couple of shots lateR). That's all the good things I can say about it.

Oh, and Jimmy Zoppi... did you have to use your James voice for the referee? Didn't you have anything new you could use?
 

dman_dustin

Well-Known Member
My thoughts exact, General Zod.

Also this post below sums up my feelings:
No offense to the user's earth logic but I don't know how Full Battle equals 6 on 6 without knowing prior that a trainer can carry and battle with a maximum 6 Pokemon.

If they said 6 on 6, then I would agree.

"I thought a 6 on 6 battle involved a 5 on 5" then the questioning of Cameron's logic valid.

But again since many different things have different definitions of full (a full gallon of milk is different than a full quart of milk), it's a bit too harsh to say that he was a dumbass, I mean he is, but not because he thought full battles were a 5 on 5 battle but because he apparently did not know you could carry 6 Pokemon, I'm pretty sure that would've been an important thing to know for any kind of trainer.
 

Joltik-Kid

Meh ಠ_ಠ
Like I said back when I watched the original, lame and boring league...nothing memorable thus time to let it go
 

matt0044

Well-Known Member
because he apparently did not know you could carry 6 Pokemon, I'm pretty sure that would've been an important thing to know for any kind of trainer.
Hell, it should've been common sense to any and all Trainers. I'd hate to quote Trip but that's basic. So basic it's not even funny.
 

Cresselia92

SM Ash = New Ash
No offense to the user's earth logic but I don't know how Full Battle equals 6 on 6 without knowing prior that a trainer can carry and battle with a maximum 6 Pokemon.

If they said 6 on 6, then I would agree.

"I thought a 6 on 6 battle involved a 5 on 5" then the questioning of Cameron's logic valid.
Um... didn't they say in the previous episode that the following matches were going to be 6 vs. 6? Bringing only 5 Pokemon was Cameron's fault, but that doesn't mean that is illegal to bring less than 6 Pokemon.
 

Raptor_Crow

I lied to you all
And remember, Cameron is a scatterbrain so it must have completely slipped out his mind. Also the focus on not being late to his match with Ash.

Cameron is especially careless when it comes to numbers; getting the date of the Junior Cup wrong, thinking you need 7 badges to enter a League.
 

Caseydia

Ace Trainer
And remember, Cameron is a scatterbrain so it must have completely slipped out his mind. Also the focus on not being late to his match with Ash.

Cameron is especially careless when it comes to numbers; getting the date of the Junior Cup wrong, thinking you need 7 badges to enter a League.
This is what I don't understand. Why would the writers make someone this dumb in the first place who doesn't even know the basics of league rules. I thought he was supposed to be experienced. And why let him be the one to beat Ash out of Virgil who seems more collected?
 

dman_dustin

Well-Known Member
Um... didn't they say in the previous episode that the following matches were going to be 6 vs. 6? Bringing only 5 Pokemon was Cameron's fault, but that doesn't mean that is illegal to bring less than 6 Pokemon.
I don't know what the dub did, but I'm pretty sure they were only referred to as full battles. And unless you knew about full battles, it doesn't automatically equate to it being 6 on 6, we know that a full battle is a 6 on 6, but because we were told that's what it meant.

But if someone didn't know jack about Pokemon, like say your hypothetical cousin in a country that has no internet, or knowledge of Pokemon, it's unlikely he'll be able to discern that full battles = 6 on 6 battles.

Now Cameron obviously knows something about Pokemon, he's a trainer with conveniently powerful Pokemon, and you'd think he would know what a full battle actually is. But it could've easily been something that was never came up, similar to the situation, where you're trying to find someone and you coincidentally keep missing them.

Or it could be as simple as he was lied to by his parents, or something, who only wanted him to carry 5 Pokemon instead of 6, although his reaction was clearly more because of the former than the latter.

I mean looking at Cameron and who he is, I could see why his parents were to hypothetically lie to him, I mean could Cameron even take care of 6 Pokemon once, or is he going to forget, and then when he does remember, he sends out his Pokemon only to find a pile of bones.
 

AuraChannelerChris

The Dragon / "Dog"
I don't know what the dub did, but I'm pretty sure they were only referred to as full battles. And unless you knew about full battles, it doesn't automatically equate to it being 6 on 6, we know that a full battle is a 6 on 6, but because we were told that's what it meant.

But if someone didn't know jack about Pokemon, like say your hypothetical cousin in a country that has no internet, or knowledge of Pokemon, it's unlikely he'll be able to discern that full battles = 6 on 6 battles.

Now Cameron obviously knows something about Pokemon, he's a trainer with conveniently powerful Pokemon, and you'd think he would know what a full battle actually is. But it could've easily been something that was never came up, similar to the situation, where you're trying to find someone and you coincidentally keep missing them.

Or it could be as simple as he was lied to by his parents, or something, who only wanted him to carry 5 Pokemon instead of 6, although his reaction was clearly more because of the former than the latter.

I mean looking at Cameron and who he is, I could see why his parents were to hypothetically lie to him, I mean could Cameron even take care of 6 Pokemon once, or is he going to forget, and then when he does remember, he sends out his Pokemon only to find a pile of bones.
So in the end, it's the trainers' parents that never taught their children proper lessons.
 

Almighty Zard

He has returned.
Dman, the point i'm trying to make is, the fanbase wasn't expecting much of Ash's team before the league, so complaining about their preformance and Ash's preformance in general is pointless.
 

dman_dustin

Well-Known Member
dman even in the japanese version, Freddy stated that the next round was 6 vs 6.
All I heard was "Full Battle"

I know Cameron is scatterbrained, but he had to hear something, to make it seem like he knew it was a full battle, even if he believed it was just a 5 on 5.


If all Freddy said was "6 on 6" then clearly Cameron was a really huge mistake to be included.

I can understand getting "full battle" mixed up, under the assumption he never knew what a real full battle.

But there's no excuse for ash to lose to someone who thought 6 on 6 meant 5 on 5.
 

wobbanut

Team Awesome
Hahaha, I liked Oshawott's reaction to the twerps thinking Ash was using him as a throwaway pokemon. Poor oshawott. Too bad Oshawott hasn't learned any ice moves, at least it could have done a little damage to hydreigon then. Speaking as someone who had her back end handed to her by Ghetsis's hydreigon several times over on White, I'd go for the fast KO on that thing. :p I also liked the comments on Cameron and Bianca being scatterbrained. LOL

7/10
 

NPT

Just a member
This episode sucked!
The whole battle just felt rushed. First, Cameron's secret OP weapon Hydriegon took out Ash's Boldore, then Ash sent out.......Oshawott of all Pokémon against Hydriegon! That was a really...really bad choice. I think Bianca was right about Oshawott, he really was a throw-away Pokémon.
As expected, Oshawott got knocked out by Hydriegon before Ash's Pignite finally defeated it. After that Cameron sent out Ferrothorn against Pignite ???! Seriously Cameron, how stupid can you get? Ferrothron got knocked out by Pignite's one Flamethrower attack, so Cameron sent out Samurott. Samurott had the type advantage, so it took Pignite out and Ash sent out Pikachu. Samurott and Pikachu's battle were rushed and defeating Samurott with Iron tail instead of Thunderbolt of Electro Ball seemed kinda cheap. Using Swanna against Pikachu was total joke. As expected, Swanna went down easily, just like Ferrothorn.

Then Cameron revealed the most stupid part of this episode! Cameron revealed that Riolu is his last Pokemon ..... Now that was just ridiculosly stupid! Cameron thought a full battle is 5 on 5, so he didn't even bother bringing a sixth Pokemon with him. Whoa....seriously? Things like this really annoys me! Being a scatterbrain dosen't cut making a ridiculous mistake like that. *Sigh*, it makes me wonder how in the world he got away with breaking a league rule? He should've been disqualified for this, but sadly he didn't......Sigh!

So Ash recalled Pikachu and sent out Unfezent, but Riolu easily defeated her and Ash choose Snivy.
It looked like Snivy had the upper hand in the battle but then... Mid-battle Evolution happened! Now it seemed like Snivy and Pikachu might lose to Lucario in the next episode.
Overall, this episode was stupid.....that's all.
 
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phanpycross

God-king
Dont know if anyone pointed this out but Ash losing 5v6 is a big **** you to the idea of Ash, he is supposed to be the "underdog", so giving him an advantage is just stupid.

in retrospect this might be my least favorite episode of the entire show.

with all the glorification pignite and pikachu got, ive named them Piggybank, and Pikaching.
 

LizardonX

Banned
Dont know if anyone pointed this out but Ash losing 5v6 is a big **** you to the idea of Ash, he is supposed to be the "underdog", so giving him an advantage is just stupid.

in retrospect this might be my least favorite episode of the entire show.

with all the glorification pignite and pikachu got, ive named them Piggybank, and Pikaching.
In the games hydeign alone would have swept ash several times over, so ash is still the underdog.
 
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