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>>>> Closed Thread Container <<<<

Do you play with Nuzlocke rules?

  • Yes!

    Votes: 14 27.5%
  • No...

    Votes: 30 58.8%
  • What the hell is Nuzlocke?

    Votes: 7 13.7%

  • Total voters
    51
Status
Not open for further replies.

lava172

Free Spirit
^Actually, that's the point of all video games nub

To beat and perfect every aspect of the game. That is the goal of all games. I'm getting plenty of enjoyment out of my game by trying to perfect every pokemon within it. Pokemon is not life. Pokemon is a game meant to be perfected, and I have a achieved that goal (almost).
maybe back in the atari 2600 days when you have fun for a bit, and you try for a high score the rest of the time.
but whatever. i guess that's your fun level. mine is getting enjoyment out of the game itself, but a lot of people love their pokemon to be perfect. ill just have to live with it, its not going away.
 

Skydra

Well-Known Member
To some extent, the real world is present in the Pokemon world, or at least they wanted to send that message. There doesn't appear to be any indication other than Lt. Surge and quotes like the one we're mentioning.
 

GetOutOfBox

Original Series Fan
The anime occasionally references real locations, mainly in puns (like the earlier mentioned Minnesota Viking's pun). They aren't intended to be taken as serious world "lore", as in a character mentions "All the star's are in Hollywood" is more of just a random line rather than saying that there is a city called Hollywood.

Basically, never take puns as serious statements of Pokemon canon, as the writers rarely (if ever) follow up on them.
 

Glover

Pain in Rocket side
Right, what's happening is that at some point, you have to use something that people can relate to. That's why we hear money in dollars in the anime, despite the fact that that little flag thingy in the games is not $.

Mew was suppsoedly found in the Amazon Rain Forest. Most likely, Amazon was used to call attention to "exotic". There may well be an Amazon Rain Forest, but it's not the Amazon. Likewise, there may well be an
America, but it's not the America.

If anything, I think the best clue that the Pokemon World is not our world is by looking at the Globe used in the movies. Every one is defferent, but the key fact is that they are not even close to the real world globe. Even spacey-shows would reuse a mirrored shot of the Earth. The fact that the artists bothered to draw not only a new globe but one that wasn't even close means they had some intention of separating them.
 

adrin19

Airbending tattoo xD
That's not quite what inanimate object means, but you raise a good point...

If people comlain about Pokémon based on objects, why don't they complain about Pokémon made out of rocks? There's as much suspension of disbelief involved in living rock as a living magnet.

That's a VERY good point. We've had rock Pokemon since forever, but people complain about the inanimate objects.
 

Ohshi

Banned from Club Penguin
There isn't. That was a reference to the Minnesota Vikings, and nothing more.

Lt. Surge is known as "The Lightning American!"

In the English dub of Episode 20 of the original series, "The Ghost of Maiden's Peak," Team Rocket encounters a US penny on the floor.
But that is just the anime.

The game does reference real world places such as Guyana, South America in the Cinnabar Mansion journal entries. So the existence of real world places are referenced in the games and the anime.

Reference:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w...the_real_world#Real-world_locations_mentioned
 

Haxle99

Typhlosion Trainer
I didn't. Because I had no idea what the hell he was on about.

I'm assuming it's some sort of American sports reference? If not, please correct me. >_>;

I'm from Australia and I know that he was talking about the Minnesota Vikings NFL team!
 

WaffleCopter

<-- Kamehameha!!!
flaming ruby, frozen saphire?

;252;;258;;255;

http://i43.*******.com/2l95ttd.jpg
 

Luxie

Goddess of Lust
Fire Red=Charizard a FIRE, type
Leaf Green=Venusaur a GRASS, type

That made sense

Now what does Groudon, a GROUND type, have to do with flaming rubies?
And what does Kyogre, a WATER type, have to do with frozen sapphires?
 

Shine

Psyched Up
Staff member
Moderator
lol fanmade. Not even Nintendo and Game Freak has say anything yet suddenly there's an ENGLISH BOX of a game that's not even released in Japan yet?

the battle pic on the back of the box seems like it comes from D/P lol

also, lol Pokememes link on bottom of the pic




closing this since
1. there's nothing to discuss
2. the rule states no discussion of R/S remakes and fanmade games anyway
 

pokeaussie37

Well-Known Member
lol fanmade.

the battle pic on the back of the box seems like it comes from D/P lol

Yeah I saw these on a MEME website, so I immediately noted them down as fake. I also agree that Flaming and Frozen won't be the prefixes for the games.
 

Arachnae

Princess Arachnid
Probably for the same reason Shrek has so many subtle jokes that only adults would get. So that adults would find some form of entertainment for having taken their kids to see it.

I feel like this is true, Disney and various other children's movies do it, so why not the pokemon movies?
 

Zodiac Meteor

Active Member
Bringing Pokémon into Next Generation

Pokémon, it’s hard to hate it. It’s fun, addicting and exciting seeing new things and new places. The whole concept of Pokémon is good… Let me rephrase, it’s good enough for GameFreak. Don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with Pokemon as it is now, it's still an awesome game and an awesome franchise.

Pokémon hasn’t evolved much from the days in Red or Blue, heck, Charzard still has the 8-bit sound file in Pokémon Black and White; a sound effect that’s 12 years old. I dare anyone to transfer Hypno to Black and White then not laugh hysterically. It’s atmospheric breaking, going from the Togekiss smooth wave voice to something like DUN-DA-DA-DUN-DA-DA-ZA-ZA from Hypno.

Why am I picking on the sound files? Well, that’s not really the point I’m getting across. The thing is Pokémon hasn’t changed from its roots. Pokémon already has a great concept, but like all things, it can be even better.

This thread is about taking Pokemon to the next level, while keeping it's roots.
Before I get started; don’t say “why fix something that isn’t broken” argument. If that was the case, we will all be using candles to light our houses.

Story
First and foremost, the most important thing Pokémon that is lacking is a good story with deep characters.
-Story: Pokémon games should have three or more Story arcs. Pokémon Gold and Silver did this brilliantly despite lack of interesting characters. Imagine playing a Pokémon game similar to Pokémon the Third Movie, when your character and two allies must climb a crystal castle and calm the Unknown. That’s awesome! A lot of the movie plots can be adapted into the games, but not just one arc, have multiple storylines. It’s that simple. Villains don’t have to be human either, when was the last time in the game we had to defeat an evil Pokemon, seriously, was there ever a time?

-Characters: Interesting characters isn’t a problem, having deep characters is. For example, in the tradition of having 2 friends at the start of the adventure instead of them being complete beginners, say one of your ‘friends’ is a Pokémon Master and is your older sister/brother. Not only do they test you on your journey, meet you at the gym leader’s gym, but evaluate on what you do (if their nearby). In the Pokémon TV series, Ashes friends comment on what Ash is doing. So while Battling, you use a grass move on a flying type, your comrade will say, “Hm, I would have used X move instead” or “I suggest switching Pokémon” or it can be positive as well saying “Good move, you can win!” or “That was close, but you got this.” Helping newcomers to the series as well as empowering veterans.
Lastly, your comrades in Pokémon games way to often are like an afterthought. They rarely stick around, let alone stay around until the end. They always challenge you; rarely do they actually help you unless it’s against a villain of sorts. Remember Cheren in the final confrontation against N in Black and White, he gets to the champion and hangs with him! I’m only going into the heart of Team Plasma’s base; a little help would be nice Cheren. Compare that to Lance in Gold and Silver, assisting you in taking down Team Rocket.

Finally story is done, next is what I really want to talk about. Aesthetic design.

Aesthetics
Pokémon Black and White Aesthetic are great and lack-luster on the same time. Let’s start with the biggest offender, attacks, more specifically, the animation for the attacks. There is none, an Earthquake from a Magikarp is the same as any other Pokémon in the game.

Why is this? Well, console limitations, having an attack sprite animation for every Pokémon’s attack with the shiny sprites, with a back view sprite and every Pokémon’s attack, that’s over 5,000 different sprites! That’s not possible if their not put into 3D and 3D Pokemon are UGLY. There is a simple way around this, every Pokémon from here on out should be in 64-bit 3D graphics, PLUS a pixel overlay. What is a pixel overlay? When making a video you can add silly visual effects like ‘cartoon’ or ‘wide screen’ in the video editor, that a video overlay etc. With the pixel overlay, you can view every Pokémon 360 degrees while still having that Sprite Aesthetic. I’ll say again.

With the pixel overlay, you can view every Pokémon, 360 degrees, while still having that Sprite Aesthetic. Make in Pokémon in 3D, slap on the pixel overlay and VOLA, you got yourself an instant full 360 degree animated sprite with LESS memory take up.
How do you make a pixel overlay? I don’t know, GameFreak GET ON IT <3.

Next on the Aesthetics list is character design. Why can’t I change my characters clothing? I want a red shirt! Why can’t I look like a fisherman or a hiker? Character customization, case in point.

Did I mention battle aesthetics earlier? … Yes I did! I’ll get to that in my next segment, improving the battle system.

Battle Mechanics
The current battle mechanics in Pokémon SUCKS, it’s dated and outclassed. Where does it suck and how can it be improved?

I’ll start with the base mechanics to completely get rid of.

1. Accuracy, get rid of it completely!
2. Chances of X happening, GET RID OF IT COMPLETELY!
3. Battle Items, get RID of IT completely!

These mechanics suck, its luck that each of these fall under. I’ve won and lost battles on WiFi because the way the game is setup. I don’t feel like I got lucky or unlucky, in games it’s called feeling cheated. For example, while battling this guy in Triples he has Walrin use Blizzard, not only did it hit all 3 of my Pokémon, it caused 2 of them to freeze AND one got hit with critical and died. The odds of that happening are abysmal, I feel like I got cheated. His strategy and Pokémon were much worse than mine, but he gained a huge upper hand by pure luck. I can name a few battles that were frustrating because my opponent got lucky. I can say the same when I get lucky as well. For example, I’m fighting some guy in Triples, his team relies heavily on Trick Room and I miss read his strategy and sent out wrong Pokémon first, that put me in a bad spot. My best chance for victory was to kill the Pokémon that will use Trick Room, sadly, it can’t be killed in 1 turn, not possible from what I had, so I’ll have to improvise with what I got. My Typhlosion uses Eruption, gets a critical on his most vital Pokémon on his team, the Trick Roomer. My opponent rages and I don’t blame him. I made a costly mistake, it was going to be a tough fight that will require every inch of my skill, yet luck turned the tide of battle completely. He felt cheated and I felt like I was cheating, I was in for a fun tough fight, yet, luck completely ruined that for both of us.

The whole reason to get rid of it is if you have a deep battle system, then the need for the random %'s on skills will be unnecessary, explained below.

How does one change it?

Deep Battle System
Here is what you need to do simple but deep battling;

-Change the battling to a positional battling
-Add dodge and block counter moves
-Add environment in battles
-Simplify and deepen the battle system

Positional Battling in Pokemon doesn’t need to be complex; there is no need for, move Tepig, select Tackle, select Tackle path. There is NO need for that. You select Tackle, Tepig does tackle. Positional battling in Pokemon should be more about the attacks. Thus the dodge, block and counter move system falls into play. The environment however, can play a role; using stomp from jumping on top of a ledge should slightly increase damage. Commanding your Pokemon to jump into water, get ontop, get behind, underneath etc. Use the environments to your advantage, that doesn’t mean your opponent can’t do the same however. Altering environments would be awesome, but that's asking for a bit much.

Dodging and blocking in battles is self-explanatory, depending on the attack, depends on how effective the dodge and block attack is. Volt Tackle is an attack move where as High Jump Kick is a dodge counter move, Volt Tackle misses and High Jump Kick hits. Even though moves are classified as counter and block moves, if they don’t meet the conditions, say, High Jump Kick vs. Hydro Pump, it will still play out regularly. This means blocks and counter moves won’t fail, they just won’t have extra effects.

Of course, this means attacks would be useless right? They can countered and no counter moves have no draw backs. Wrong. Here is where critical hits and conditions really take effect. So Volt Tackle missed and the Pokemon got hit with High Jump Kick, but if Volt Tackle is evaded and is hit with a physical move, that Pokemon is paralyzed. If a Pokemon attempts to block Volt Tackle, it results in a critical hit.

Counters have an effectiveness level, I'd like to put the effectiveness level into tiers.
Depending on the attack and the counter tier depends on the outcome. For example, say Flamethrower is a tier 2 ranged attack, for a Pokemon to successfully block it; they must have a counter move tier of 2 or above. Bubble is a tier 2 block counter, meaning that Flamethrower attack damage will be greatly reduced and the popped bubbles will create steam, cleansing the Pokemon of status reductions.
Now if the Pokemon used Bubble Beam, a tier 1 block counter, it will reduce Flamethrowers damage a little, however the Pokemon will be burned because it failed.

Attacks can both be labeled as ranged or close. Thunder for example is ranged, Fury Swipes is close. Counters can only block or evade one type of attack, for example, Bubble is a tier 2 block counter, but instead of Flamethrower, the Pokemon uses Flame Charge, a tier 1 close attack. The result will play out regularly, X Pokemon got hit with Flame Charge, X Pokemon got hit with Bubble.
Evade and block moves can affect attacks from close or from a distance, it just depends on the move.

You can give a Pokemon the best counters available but that doesn’t mean they will work 100% of the time.

That’s just an example, just because it’s labeled as a counter move doesn’t mean it will counter exactly the same as all the others. Battle between Pokemon will still be simple, but the strategy will be more complex.


The effectiveness of certain moves can also be affected by distance. Like Hydropump losses some power if the Pokemon is too far, same goes if it’s to close. Whereas Flame Charge gains power the farther away the Pokemon is. Thunder at close range will result in a paralyze. Dragon Pulse from far away will result in a critical. Picking the Pokemons position should be simplified; by pressing a certain button, players can use the Touch screen to manually select where the Pokemon should go before it attacks. Pokemons Leg power (explained below) should affect how far a Pokemon can move as well. Pokemon cannot phase through one another, so a large Pokemon size can shorten the distance the other Pokemon can travel. For example, the players Emboar will have hard time getting distance to increase damage for Flame Charge against a Steelix.

Pokemon Stats Revamp
I would remove special attacks and physical attacks completely along with their defensive counter parts.

Each Pokemon will have a body chart showing their stats connected to the body part.

The moves power will be based off the body part used (ex. High Jump Kick on Hitmonlee will do more damage compared to Mienshao's; but Mienshao Drain Punch will do more damage compared to Hitmonlees but Drain Punch on Hitmonchan will do more damage than all 3 of them)

Depending on the Pokemon, depends on the number of moves it can learn. Types of moves can be limited as well. (ex. Typhlosion can learn 2-3 attacks, 1-2 status and 2-3 counter moves, Kingler can learn 2-3 attacks, 1 status and 1-2 counter moves, Bronzong can learn 1-2 attacks, 2-4 statuses and 4-5 counter moves)

Skills will still have their base power, however, the game will show how much a Pokemon can benefit from it. For example this Feraligator can know 2-3 attacks, 1-2 status and 2-3 counters, maxing at 6 total moves; Feraligator’s ability is Strong Jaws, it adds 2 tiers to bite moves and ranged special moves’ damage is not decreased by distance:
Feraligator Attack Power chart:
Head = 90 power
Arm = 65 power
Legs = 60 power
Body = 80 power
Tail = 90 power
Special = 70 power
------------------------
Attack List:
Ice Fang (tier 1+2 (Strong Jaws) close attack) = Base 65 – Total 155
Hydro Pump (tier 3 ranged attack) = Base 120 + STAB – Total 250
Crunch (tier 2+2 (Strong Jaws) close attack) = Base 85 – Total 175
Dragon Dance = Increases head, body, wings and tail attack damage by 1.5 and increase close counter moves tier by 1
Bubble Beam (tier 1 ranged counter) = Base 65 + STAB – Total 135
Aqua Tail (tier 1 close counter) = Base 90 + STAB – Total 230

One thing that bothered me with Pokemon is you don’t see the damage increase/decrease on moves. A friend of mine taught Steelix Hyper Beam, he didn’t know that was a bad choice. If he wanted to teach Steelix a powerful normal move, Giga Impact is the much better choice. Teaching a normal move is questionable to begin with.
When I asked him why did he pick a special attack on Steelix he responded, "whats a special attack?" He did not know, I don't blame him, I didn't know about STAB or Physical/Special differences until 4th gen. I had to read it online.

Despite Pokemon having a simple battle system, it still isn't clear to non-veteran players.

Even if the battle system isn't revamped, the least GameFreak can do is when a Pokemon learns a move, right off the bat you should see its full effectiveness. When that Feraligator is about to learn Crunch, the player should see how good of a move Crunch should be on Feraligator.

In battle, if a Pokemons attack is reduced or increased. The player should see the damage decrease/increase, a tier increase/decrease right on the screen. There is no reason why the buttons have to be so huge and blank.

The way this battle system is setup, if done properly, it’s very easy to learn and understand, but mastering it is the hard part.

Small change to Abilities

Lastly, abilities. On some Pokemon, for example, Chandelure can’t levitate, which is very odd because it’s faster than Pokemon with legs. Flygon has wings but it’s levitates? This is a simple fix; give certain Pokemon a natural ability (Levitate) along with its other ability. Natural Abilities should be obviously visible in battle, Flygon is up in the air, Earthquake cannot hit, simple as that.

Removal of Held-items
Why get rid of battle items? If you add the depth into the battle mechanics, there is no need for them. Not that they’re too bad. They do allow for very unfair strategies (F.E.A.R.) and they’re atmosphere breaking, Heatran weighs 948.0lbs, yet he can be lifted INTO THE AIR BY A SINGLE FREAKING BALLON?! If GameFreak was going to take Pokemon into next generation and deepen the battle system, there will be no need for held items.

Small change to HM's
In the Pokemon games, if a Pokemon has big wings or floats it should have the ability to fly around without the move. Same goes with Pokemon that can surf, strength and any HM move. NO MORE HM SLAVES, NO MORE HMS, if you want to halt the Player from progressive that hasn’t beaten the gym, just have it so you need to badge. No need the badge and the HM, it’s annoying and stupid.

Shinies vs. Personalizing Colors
Lastly, get rid of Shiny Pokemon. The only problem with Shiny Pokemon is they aren't very special. Making them hard to find does not make them special in my opinion, plus, some shiny Pokemon can be weaker than their colored counter-parts thanks to the IV's, that Shiny Boldor might have 1 attack IV and 31 speed. There is a better way to get altered colored Pokemon. With the 3D pixel overlay, you can have a near limitless number of sprited Pokemon. What better way to use it than Color Gems, an extremely rare gem that can alter a color of a Pokemon it comes into contact with. Certain Colorization Gems can affect certain parts of the Pokemon. For example, Colorization Gems are broken into 3 categories they affect, Primary, Secondary and Special parts. Want a white skinned Charizard with red secondary color with a black tail flame? You’ll need a Black Special Colorization Gem, Red Secondary Colorization Gem and a White Primary Colorization Gem.

Like shiny Pokemon, you cannot find these gems lying around in the game. They have to be earned through gameplay or events, not found. Make them difficult to obtain, just like shiny Pokemon. Why have color customization over shinies? It adds to the feeling of "this is my team." It adds more uniqueness than what shinies ever can accomplish.

Tell me what you think below! Oh, almost forgot, LET US USE THE POKEDEX IN BATTLE. To see types and Pokemon's strengths, this is mainly for beginners. Honestly I don't know why GameFreak won't add it.
 
Last edited:

IamLegend

Legend
I agree with everything you said. Pokemon games need a massive overhaul. The "if it ain't broke, don't fix it", argument doesn't really apply to the entertainment industry. Everything within the entertainment field, must keep evolving. For example, look at Mario. The series has changed drastically from the first game, and has reaped the rewards. The Sonic series on the other hand, while evolving like Mario, didn't do it right. Gamefreak doesn't want Pokemon to fail, like Sonic. They must start taking risks though, or Pokemon will eventually fall off.
 

Darth Sabreus

Want to get a soda?
Looks like you've done a bit of homework.

The current battle mechanics in Pokémon SUCKS, it’s dated and outclassed. Where does it suck and how can it be improved?

I’ll start with the base mechanics to completely get rid of.

1. Accuracy, get rid of it completely!
2. Chances of X happening, GET RID OF IT COMPLETELY!
3. Battle Items, get RID of IT completely!

How does one change it?
Here is what you need to do simple but deep battling;

-Change the battling to a positional battling
-Add dodge and block counter moves
-Add environment in battles
-Simplify and deepen the battle system

I see what you mean by wanting to see an overhaul of the Battle Mechanics. These sound like great ideas, but seem a bit too over-the-top. What I personally love about the Battle Mechanics is how simple they are.

With number 2, are you suggesting that all secondary effects never apply? And the same goes for Battle Items. These two are significant contributors to how a battle turns out. Sure, you may have gotten triple hit by a Blizzard attack that KO'd one of your Pokemon and froze the other two, but that's just the game. Sometimes you get lucky, and sometime you don't.

And who cares if a 20cent Balloon (couldn't resist) can lift a 900+ pound monster? The little 8 year old that GF targets with Pokemon isn't going to give, and neither does big and scary 18 year old me.

Lastly, get rid of Shiny Pokemon.

Officially hate you. The whole gem idea is good in theory, but a bit too complex. (Most) Shiny Pokemon are amazing, just the way they are (yay Bruno Mars).
 

IamLegend

Legend
Officially hate you. The whole gem idea is good in theory, but a bit too complex. (Most) Shiny Pokemon are amazing, just the way they are (yay Bruno Mars).

He doesn't want to get rid of shiny Pokemon. He wants to get rid of them as they are now. His idea of being able to choose the color of the Pokemon, via rare gem stones, is still basically shiny Pokemon.
 
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