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Colonization of Inhabited Worlds - Future Speculation

ShachonianX

Spheal Lord
So, you may be wondering, "But ShachonianX, we haven't even set up colonies on the moon yet!" Yes, this is true. But, this will eventually change. With technology rapidly advancing the the population increasing, we will one day be forced to start colonizing space.

Now, this is where we get to the topic at hand. As we begin colonizing space, we will need to have a source of water for our colonies, and Jupiter is the home of several large icy moons. These moons are Europa, Ganymede, and Callisto. Callisto would most likely be the best starting location, due to it being farther away from Jupiter's radiation belt. After setting up colonies there, it would make a good starting place to colonize the system.

This is where the problems start. It is believed Ganymede, Europa, and Callisto may harbor life because of the possible ocean underneath their surface. The surfaces on the moons also would block a lot of radiation, keeping most life alive.

Naturally, we would build in or under the surface in an attempt to stay safe from radiation. The problem is that building cities their may interfere with the life currently existing their, which is not used to Earth life. It is possible that pollution from the colonies would begin killing off the life there.

So, what do you think? Should we leave inhabited worlds like these alone, avoiding human interference, or try to co-exist with them?
 

Navin

MALDREAD
It will first cost us over a billion bucks just to send a probe over to Europa to study if potential life can exists in those sub-surface oceans, let alone any attempt of colonization. But I think it's fair to say that humans naturally have to look to the stars one day for survival. As for tampering with other life on other planets, well that just has to happen if we are going to explore the cosmos.
 

ShachonianX

Spheal Lord
It will first cost us over a billion bucks just to send a probe over to Europa to study if potential life can exists in those sub-surface oceans, let alone any attempt of colonization. But I think it's fair to say that humans naturally have to look to the stars one day for survival. As for tampering with other life on other planets, well that just has to happen if we are going to explore the cosmos.
True, it is sad how humans just end up messing everything up for everyone. Anyways, from what I've heard once at a lecture, the cost for sending a probe over to Europa costs about 200 million, if I remember that correctly.
 

Kitt Geekazaru

Infernape Trainer
I would say to first start by seeing if there is life there, and then see how humans could sustain life there. Then, send out a mission with one person to see if this will work at all, probably with androids to help them set up a house. Then, once he is there and alive, start sending families, say a group of 20. Ten adults, ten babies. (Read the City of Ember, so similar to what I am talking about) Once the colony is set for infinite survival, send in one last group to get the final stage set up, build a space port, etc, and finally, send the people.
 

epicdrill

Well-Known Member
It will first cost us over a billion bucks just to send a probe over to Europa to study if potential life can exists in those sub-surface oceans, let alone any attempt of colonization. But I think it's fair to say that humans naturally have to look to the stars one day for survival. As for tampering with other life on other planets, well that just has to happen if we are going to explore the cosmos.

Be realistic. There is no way in hell that probe would cost under 100 billion to send. This is the main problem with colonization. It is so damn expensive that even after we have the technology, it will be so impractical that it won't happen for several years, probably decades. Then there is the problem of Earth's dwindling resources. The technology to send such a probe might not be invented until it is too late, due to a lack of resources.
 

Navin

MALDREAD
Be realistic. There is no way in hell that probe would cost under 100 billion to send. This is the main problem with colonization. It is so damn expensive that even after we have the technology, it will be so impractical that it won't happen for several years, probably decades. Then there is the problem of Earth's dwindling resources. The technology to send such a probe might not be invented until it is too late, due to a lack of resources.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/nasa-wants-to-look-for-signs-of-life-on-europa--but-you-cant-get-there-for-15-million/2014/03/07/dd2ebe18-a47f-11e3-84d4-e59b1709222c_story.html

Actually it would only cost several billion dollars. Too bad NASA nowhere near has that type of budget.


The vastness of space and the sheer amount of resources needed to just reach the Moon makes colonization of other worlds just a farfetched fantasy. I hope the Milky Way is full of advanced alien life that knows we exist but hasn't revealed their existence to us (maybe waiting for us to reach a certain stage). The Voyager probes were released in the 70s and only last year did has Voyager 1 left the Solar System and it's going to take 300 years to reach the Oort Cloud and some 30,000 years to cross it. And that's just a tiny pocket of our galaxy.
 

jireh the provider

Video Game Designer
Personally, just moving to another planet for colonization is not enough. For my opinion, this video that I'm watching tells what humanity MUST overcome if an almost perfect utopia happens during the colonization of an Inhabited planet.

You see, I just opened a debate about the tragic consequences of continuing the flow of the Monetary System: the counterpart to Resource Based Economy being promoted by the Zeitgeist Movement and the Venus Project. I personally hate saying this detailed opinion when all of us are influenced and raised to earn as much money as we can. So if humanity needs to colonize a new planet in the distant future, HUMANITY MUST CHANGE its perception about the Monetary System and other government systems that existed in human history, throw away our mind set of dependence of having money (it is a pointless human society factor according to the Zeitgeist Movement), AND DESTROY the Monetary System implemented to humanity. Then understand, learn, and value what the Resource Based Economy can benefit human both in moral and scientific factors. Truth is, while I am mad about this system, I just lament the fact that the Monetary System is only hurting us and the environment more than I've learned during my college days and lectures. Even until now...

Still in the end, this is my view and opinion about colonizing a planet with Earth like life (if there are no other intelligent beings on the same level as ours). It's just moving to another planet is not enough for humanity to usher in an almost better world. It is plausible within the next century or so. So good debate to start with about planet colonization

As for the transportation challenges, I see that everyone else answered the question for us to learn and understand.
 
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ShachonianX

Spheal Lord
http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/nasa-wants-to-look-for-signs-of-life-on-europa--but-you-cant-get-there-for-15-million/2014/03/07/dd2ebe18-a47f-11e3-84d4-e59b1709222c_story.html

Actually it would only cost several billion dollars. Too bad NASA nowhere near has that type of budget.


The vastness of space and the sheer amount of resources needed to just reach the Moon makes colonization of other worlds just a farfetched fantasy. I hope the Milky Way is full of advanced alien life that knows we exist but hasn't revealed their existence to us (maybe waiting for us to reach a certain stage). The Voyager probes were released in the 70s and only last year did has Voyager 1 left the Solar System and it's going to take 300 years to reach the Oort Cloud and some 30,000 years to cross it. And that's just a tiny pocket of our galaxy.

Remember, we're currently talking about colonization of our solar system (at the moment, at least). For our solar system however, it still does take a while to traverse it. Concerning the resource problem, our best hope is for asteroid mining (from companies such as Planetary Resources). Also, while NASA doesn't have the funding to even travel to the Moon again, Space X does have plans to go to Mars. Using the funding from sending supplies up to the ISS and making electric cars, Ellon Musk plans to send a mission to Mars.

epicdrill said:
It is so damn expensive that even after we have the technology, it will be so impractical that it won't happen for several years, probably decades. Then there is the problem of Earth's dwindling resources.

You are correct, colonization will take a long time, including terraforming (if required). However, with a steady stream of minerals from asteroid mining, we will have a nearly inexhaustible supply of resources. Hopefully that will deal with the looming problem running out of ores. If that gets enough money, that could help with the expenses of colonizing. This does not count in wars and politics.
 

Kitt Geekazaru

Infernape Trainer
Of course, there is the problem that eventually our sun will blow up. We aren't moving fast enough to leave this solar system and find a planet that is safe in another solar system. By the time we even have people on the moons of Jupiter, our solar system's time will be coming to an end.
 

ShachonianX

Spheal Lord
Of course, there is the problem that eventually our sun will blow up. We aren't moving fast enough to leave this solar system and find a planet that is safe in another solar system. By the time we even have people on the moons of Jupiter, our solar system's time will be coming to an end.

Actually, we still don't have to worry about the sun exploding right now. It will take billions of years before that happens.
 

Kitt Geekazaru

Infernape Trainer
Actually, we still don't have to worry about the sun exploding right now. It will take billions of years before that happens.
And it will take longer than that to reach another solar system, to even get out of the reach of our doomed sun. If we still haven't built a colony on the moon, were going to stay there for a while, then move on to mars, then stay, then move to an asteroid in the asteroid belt, then "Here comes the sun" starts playing.
 
Be realistic. There is no way in hell that probe would cost under 100 billion to send. This is the main problem with colonization. It is so damn expensive that even after we have the technology, it will be so impractical that it won't happen for several years, probably decades. Then there is the problem of Earth's dwindling resources. The technology to send such a probe might not be invented until it is too late, due to a lack of resources.

Or lack of funding. If we spent as much money on NASA as we did on the military for the last 30 years, I can't imagine where we'd be. Cell phones when they first came out were only affordable for the mega rich, and now they're in the hands of everybody. The price tag isn't the problem, our priorities are.
 
And it will take longer than that to reach another solar system, to even get out of the reach of our doomed sun. If we still haven't built a colony on the moon, were going to stay there for a while, then move on to mars, then stay, then move to an asteroid in the asteroid belt, then "Here comes the sun" starts playing.
You foolishly underestimate how much time a billion years really is, and we have more than that to move on in our space manifest destiny. It probably won't even take 1,000 years for us to move past the barriers we are hitting to move on to colonization. We have many of the tools we need already.
 
Honestly, provided

A) We end up being too retarded to fix global warming (Actually looking like a possibility)
B) A big ****ing rock from space wipes us all out
C) Nuclear holocaust

all do not happen, then I'd say it's no question that humans will colonize space. As for possibly interfering with life on other planets, who cares? Unless the planet has a diverse range of life with intricate ecosystems, I don't think any real moral dilemma is present. If all a planet has on it is low level life forms like microbes I'm sure they won't mind us passing through.
 
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Kitt Geekazaru

Infernape Trainer
But will we accept the small bacterium there? I.E. Super disease. However, if that happens, then we look somewhere else.
 
But will we accept the small bacterium there? I.E. Super disease. However, if that happens, then we look somewhere else.
Humans have the cool ability to overcome biological pathogens by synthetically making ourselves immune. We only need a sample and we can inoculate ourselves against the threat, the same way we do when travelling overseas. Nothing new here.

As a side note, we are going to need some of that terraforming equipment sooner rather than later so we can fix our own planet. People really want to ignore the blatant ecological and chemical effects that are currently happening, even when trends and meteorological evidence validates the cause is a trend towards GW? Good thing, though, that whatever we develop to make an atmosphere on Mars (for example) should also help out with problems such as GHGs and climate change on Earth.
 

ShachonianX

Spheal Lord
As we seem to have slightly gotten off track, I will try to re-rail the discussion to its original purpose: If we begin colonizing a planet/moon, and discover intelligent alien life (still not at the point of building cities), should we try to coexist with them on this planet/moon, leave the planet, or simply ignore them and continue colonizing?

In my opinion, we should either try to coexist with them (giving them advanced technology, helping them through dangerous situations, basically playing god), or abandon the planet/moon (if it doesn't work out).
 
This is a bit silly, in my opinion. More or less nothing more than conjecture.

1.) None of the worlds we will colonize is believed to be able to host life well at all, so sentient life is beyond a stretch of the imagination. Only a biocentrist would support the notion that displacing non-thinking beings is inherently immoral.
2.) We are already killing out own planet as it stands, and we're too stubborn to do anything about it. Why should we be in a big hurry to move on to the next rock? So we can screw that up too?
3.) Getting to the technological level where discussing this is more than hypothesizing is a bit of a huge issue.
 
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