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Community POTW #007

Discussion in 'POTW Collaboration' started by Serebii, Jan 8, 2017.

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  1. Serebii

    Serebii And, as if by magic, the webmaster appeared... Staff Member Admin

    Time for the next Pokémon, and this week we have a Pokémon not available in Sun & Moon...yet


    It's the Bug/Flying-type Pokémon, Vivillon. Surprisingly, Vivillon is actually somewhat capable competitively


    Go nuts
  2. Incineroar

    Incineroar Banned

    I was a bit disappointed that Game Freak chose Vivillon as pokemon #666, but hey, at least it was 1 fully evolved.
  3. Mr Spaz

    Mr Spaz Loading title. Please wait.

    Vivillon @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Compound Eyes
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Bug Buzz
    - Quiver Dance
    - Hurricane
    - Sleep Powder

    This is Vivillon's standard set. I used it in OU last gen to surprisingly good effect. Compound Eyes to boost the accuracy of Sleep Powder and Hurricane. Quiver Dance for obvious reasons, and Bug Buzz to hit Electric and Rock Types that resist your primary STAB. Downside is that it tends to get walled by Steel Types.
  4. BlackKyurem3DS

    BlackKyurem3DS Active Member

    Good old Vivillon.

    Shield Dust: Prevents opponent's attacking moves from having an additional effect. Not all that useful on Vivillon given it's frail defenses.
    Compoundeyes: Raises accuracy by 30% for all moves this Pokemon knows. Absolutely beautiful. Very helpful for Hurricane and Sleep Powder.
    Hidden Ability:
    Friend Guard: Allies in Double and Triple battles who take damage from this Pokemon will recieve 25% less damage. This ability is useless. Vivillon knows absolutely NO moves that hit both the enemy and allies. Plus it only works in Doubles and Triples (Triple battles arn't even in Sun and Moon anyways, so it would just be Doubles then). Just use Compoundeyes, it's more useful.
  5. EKZ1505

    EKZ1505 Well-Known Member

    I wouldn't say "useless" in doubles. Friend Guard lowers the damage from your opponent's attacks on Vivillon's ally. Vivillon is far from the best redirector, but it had some moderate success as one 2-3 years ago. Don't underestimate Friend Guard; it's what makes Clefairy arguably better than Clefable. On an offensive set or in singles, yeah, absolutely go Compound Eyes.
  6. Aduro

    Aduro Mt.BtlMaster

    To be honest this is best used in doubles. It gets tailwind and electroweb in ORAS along with friend guard and rage powder. Still its probably not going to be any better in doubles now accelerock and electric terrain are around.

    REMARCABLE Well-Known Member

    Disagree, it's bulk is abysmal and Doubles can make difficult to survive more than one turn.

    This butterfly is a terror in singles, the combination of Compoundeyes,Sleep Powder, Quiver Dance and Hurricane makes it threatening, sleep, setup, spam strongest STAB at its disposal.

    The universal set is well known, so it's not like it is more than a one trick pony
  8. generic villager #5

    generic villager #5 Your ad here!

    Vivillon, aka How to Fix Everything Wrong with Mothim. It's definitely predictable, usually running just one set, but that set is pretty good among lower-tier contenders. As said set has already been posted, I'll give a few OO's for it:

    -Energy Ball can replace Bug Buzz depending on what threatens you more, since it hits Rock-types (plus Ground-types with Rock coverage) a little better, although it does sacrifice some power.
    -HP Ground is sort of an option, but should only be considered if you have a teammate who needs to induce sleep more than Vivillon, or are okay with the loss of power from Bug Buzz or Energy Ball.
    -If you think you can get Vivillon in for free against something it naturally outspeeds, you could try another item like Life Orb.
  9. Mestorn

    Mestorn Wandering Battler

    Other Options

    -Powder -Gimmicky to no end, but on a Choiced Opponent with a Fire move, or a well predicted Fire move can easily cause some damage and force a switch.
    -Aromatherapy -Cleric moves are rare -almost every user should have this as an OO. That being said, waking up a Hypnosis/Sleep Powder/Spore victim, curing Toxic from a Tank, Burns from a physical sweeper and/or paralysis from a speedster always has value.

    Looking over Vivillon, it is really quite pathetic. 80/50/50 bulk means that it dies quickly, and 90 SATK is its best offense. 89 SPD is fast for Alola... but Vivillon is not Alola native (though you can find Ocean Patterned Vivillon in Hawaii), so it comes in with a LOT of faster threats. Vivillon admittedly is possibly one of the best abusers of Compoundeyes, firing off accurate Sleep Powders and Hurricanes without a thought, but struggles to make use of it in higher usage tiers. Vivillon greatly appreciates Rapid Spin/Defog users, as losing half your health on the switch is horrific. And anti Rock support in general. Yes it has Energy Ball, but loses out on a precious move to make room for it. Anti Electric support is appreciated as well, as any speedy Electric type can come in and OHKO Vivillon once Sleep Clause is activated.

    Countering Vivillon
    Mow Rotom is Vivillon's nemesis, immune to sleep powder, neutral from Hurricane and capable of OHKOing with a STAB electric move... along with Stealth Rocks, Accelrock, Rock Slide, Stone Edge. Yeah. Vivillon hates Rock moves, especially given how prolific they are. Lycanroc, Aerodactyl, and Archeops all reliably outspeed an OHKO. Minior is another thorn in Vivillons side, immune to Sleep Powder when its shields are up and able to outspeed when its Shields are down, enabling to get Vivillon coming and going. RestTalk users are also dangerous, as Sleep Powder only slightly inconveniences them, and they can still strike back. Ice Shard users like Lapras, Mamoswine, Sneasel, etc. can reliably strike the butterfly down even after setup, though taking a boosted Hurricane is not recommended.
  10. RedRaselom

    RedRaselom Member

    - Compound Eyes is a great ability that Vivilion can abuse. Sleep Powder, Hurricane, Poison Powder... ugh, what else?
    - Access to Quiver Dance which is argurably one of the best stat-boosting moves.
    - It has a cute design. Even it's pre-evolutions are kawaii.
    - Nothing else.

    - All stats are underwhelming
    - Too frail and still slow to set up
    - 4x weakness to rock type and stealth rock
    - Moveset is also underwhelming
    - Tailwind, which makes Vivilion useful in Double/Triple is only obtainable through transfer.

    REMARCABLE Well-Known Member

    It must never run Poison Powder, because #1 Toxic exists which causes badly poisoned not regular poison which is superior
    And #2 Because it it won't affect Grass types, Pokemon with Overcoat or Safety Goggles
  12. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Nighttime Guardian

    It suffers from the same downsides as Butterfree. Just far too frail to really set up Quiver Dance, even with sleep support. Spamming sleep powder is quite nice, but with most stuff outspeeding it and Vivillon being unable to take hits that's not that easy. That said, I've been trying this set on Butterfree in-game:

    Vivillon @ Life Orb
    Timid nature
    252 Speed, 252 Sp.Atk, 4 HP
    -Sleep Powder
    -Dream Eater

    I run it with Bug Buzz over Hurricane on Butterfree in-game as Butterfree doesn't get Hurricane. Anyway, hope you're fast enough to put your opponent to sleep, then set up a Substitute while the opponent is asleep. Then use Dream Eater for recovery or your STAB move. Use Sleep Powder again if the opponent wakes up or switches, using your substitute to survive the first hit that your opponent does. Of course this doesn't work if you play with sleep clause, and even without it it's difficult to pull off as you're not really fast enough.
  13. Karxrida

    Karxrida Lost in the Waves

    Dream Eater is bad. All it takes to stop it is the opponent switching out (which is very likely to happen after you put something to sleep), it doesn't exactly grant you necessary or useful coverage, and Vivillon doesn't really benefit from the health gain since it's frail.

    It's not a move worth mentioning.
  14. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Nighttime Guardian

    That's why I said use Sleep Powder again after they switch, so you put their switch-in to sleep too and potentially cripple a part of their team. It doesn't work if you play with sleep clause though (can't find anything in the rules about which rules or clauses Serebii PotW follows). If you want to go down that route I'd say Vivillon itself isn't even really worth mentioning. It's arguably better than Butterfree as it's faster and gets Hurricane, but that's not saying much. Btw Dream Eater recovery is primarily to recover Substitute and Life Orb damage, you're not supposed to be eating enemy attacks at all because Vivillon dies if it tries to (a problem every Vivillon set has).

    To be fair, I don't even get why we're already covering Vivillon as it's still illegal in Alola in the first place.
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2017
  15. Karxrida

    Karxrida Lost in the Waves

    Honestly if you're going to spam Sleep then why bother with Substitute? Roost would also be a much more consistent way to heal up since it's fixed and nonconditional. Besides, trying to keep its health up kind of goes against the role it functions best at (frail QD cleaner).

    Also, doesn't Bank get released this week?
  16. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Nighttime Guardian

    Sub is your shield in case they don't switch, you never know when they wake up again. Idk, I think it's just far too weak to actually try to sweep. There's just so much that does setup sweeping better even in the lowest tiers I can't really see any reason to bother going with Vivillon for that. Swords Dance Scyther for example, much faster, more bulk thanks to Eviolite, hits a lot harder thanks to Technician, why not go with that? Or Venomoth, which is slightly faster, has more bulk, Tinted Lens to fix coverage issues, and Baton Pass.

    I guess Roost is a good option for recovery over Dream Eater though, I just use Dream Eater because it's both an attack and recovery in a single moveslot and you're already struggling hard with coverage.

    About Bank update, the last I've heard is that it's 'expected in January 2017', at least that's what the Dutch version of the Pokémon website says. No idea if that means January 31st, tomorrow, or if maybe even February or later if there are delays. I also kind of expect Serebii to post updates if they know anything more about it.
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2017
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