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Community POTW #019

Discussion in 'POTW Collaboration' started by Serebii, Mar 2, 2014.

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  1. Serebii

    Serebii And, as if by magic, the webmaster appeared... Staff Member Admin

    Time for the next Pokémon of the Week, with apologies for the delay, and this time we have another awesome Pokémon

    [​IMG]

    It's Milotic, the awesome Water-type Pokémon.

    The way we consider Milotic has shifted somewhat as it's one of the lucky 2 dozen Pokémon that managed to get a new ability in this generational transition

    http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-xy/350.shtml

    Go nuts
     
  2. Sala-imence

    Sala-imence Rock type trainer

    Item: Leftovers
    Nature: Calm
    EVs: 252 Sp.D / 252 HP / 4 Def
    Ability: Marvel Scale
    Moveset:
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk
    - Scald
    - Toxic
     
  3. avsimone

    avsimone Magma Trainer

    though the sleep talk sets are popular with Milotic because of it's ability, but if you wanted a a bulky wall or bulky attacker I usually prefer control. for example:


    set name: how to put a vest on a serpent with no arms
    ability: competitive
    moves:
    scald
    dragon tail/ dragon pulse
    ice beam
    hidden power grass
    item: assault vest
    EV: 232 HP, 56 Sp.Atk, 220 Def or232 HP, 56 Sp.Atk, 220 Sp.Def
    nature: for power- Modest, for defense - sassy/relaxed (unless using dragon pulse then use calm or bold)

    set name: traditional bulky water
    ability: marvel scale
    moves:
    scald
    recover
    ice beam
    toxic/hypnosis/dragon tail
    item: leftovers (because seriously were you expecting something else?)
    EV: 252HP, 232Sp.Def, 20Def
    Nature: calm/sassy

    I can't think of any snake puns or any leviethan, or water thingy puns... maybe I'm tired of these bulky water snakes in this bulky freakin' tier?
     
  4. Meowmeow

    Meowmeow selfproclaimed guru

    I have a bit of a soft spot for Milotic. It is one of the best defensive Pokemon around and an amazing bulky Water type.

    Abilities: Marvel Scale is, in my opinion, the way to go. Having status pumps up your defense stat. How awesome is that?
    Competitive isn't bad. I just don't think it's suited for Milotic. Don't get me wrong, Milotic can pull it off, but there isn't much of a movepool to take full advantage of this ability. Besides, as an offensive Water type, the superior choices are Greninja, Starmie, Gastrodon (to an extent), Gyarados, Sharpedo, Cloyster, Keldeo, and Azumarill.
    Cute Charm is stupid. Don't bother with it.

    Defensive 1.0
    Nature: Bold
    Ability: Marvel Scale
    EVs: 252 HP and defense, 4 special attack
    @: Leftovers

    Scald
    Recover
    Dragon Tail
    Calm Mind/Hypnosis/Toxic

    Pretty basic.

    Defensive 2.0
    Nature: Bold
    EVs: 252 HP and defense, 4 special defense
    Ability: Marvel Scale
    @: Leftovers

    Rest
    Sleep Talk
    Scald
    Dragon Tail

    My favorite Milotic set.
     
  5. Ironthunder

    Ironthunder The Uncultured One

    Milotic, eh?
    Milotic@Flame Orb
    Marvel Scale
    Calm
    252 SpAtk, 252 Def, 4Spd
    -Dragon Pulse
    -Brine
    -Ice Beam/Blizzard
    -Recover

    This set is actually rather useful. Marvel Scale and Flame Orb causes a Defense boost that can help it wall for a few turns. Dragon Pulse and Ice Beam/Blizzard strike hard, with Brine to finish off any damaged 'mons. Recover allows it to last a lot longer in the field.

    Alternatively:-
    Milotic@Flame Orb
    Marvel Scale
    Calm
    252 SpAtk, 252 Def, 4Spd
    -Toxic
    -Surf
    -Attract
    -Recover

    This set runs for pure stalling. Attract reduces the chances of you taking a hit, while Toxic decimates their health. Recover heals Burn damage and Surf hits hard as STAB. The ability and item are the same as above.

    Stats-wise, Milotic is obviously a Special fighter, with that 125 SpDef and 100 SpAtk. Marvel Scale and a status condition can raise the 79 base Defense to a reasonable level. The only real drawback with Milotic is that Speed stat of 81, which means that it is outrun by Pokemon such as Pinsir, Qwilfish and Skuntank. The Attack stat isn't necessary. No-one uses Physical Milotic.

    Milotic actually has a use in Doubles and Triples, with Surf hitting across the field, and moves like Safeguard, Rain Dance and Light Screen to help allies, especially Grass types. This, and the absence of wide-hitting Grass/Electric type moves aside from the hardly-used Parabolic Charge, make it worthwhile.

    As for countering Milotic, Electivire destroys the water serpent with Wild Charge. Other Physical Electric/Grass types are useful here as well, such as Trevenant, Luxray and Chesnaught, because even with the boost from Marvel Scale, its Defense is still weaker than its SpDef, so Physical moves are the way with this. Also, relatively fast Pokemon decimate Milotic, such as Leavanny, Leafeon and Electrode.
     
  6. Mestorn

    Mestorn Wandering Battler

    I remember my first encounter with a Milotic; just a random trainer on Route 120… AND IT NEARLY ROUTED ME! Sorry for shouting. Yeah, Milotic is awesome.

    Typing: Mono water isn’t anything to complain about: 2 weaknesses in exchange for 4 resists, with at least 2 of the resists being very common is great.
    Offensively Water’s pitfalls are very well known: Grass, Dragon and Water types are the lone resists outside of Dry Skin, Water Absorb and Storm Drain. And since most water types get Ice Beam in the end, opposing water types become the best checks.

    Stats: Little is wrong when it comes to Milotic’s stat distribution. In fact, it has a very similar distribution to Gyarados, just with a few values in different places. Base 95 HP and 125 SDef makes Milotic particularly spongy. While Base 100 SATK is not as stellar as Gyarados’ Base 125 ATK, but it gets the job done. It has the same awkward speed and just below average DEF as Gyarados, and like Gyarados it has an app for that. Don’t use physical attacks.

    Moves: Milotic’s movepool is as beautiful as the serpent itself. Its viable special movepool consists of the standard Water STABs and Ice Beam plus Hidden Power, and Dragon Pulse. While that may seem pitifully small, Water + Dragon has such excellent neutral coverage that only Azumarill, Shedinja, Empoleon, Ferrothorn and Whimsicott resist both moves. Milotic’s support movepool is where it really shines. In addition to the standard WTPS, the sea serpent possess Haze (!), Hypnosis, Mirror Coat, Recover (!), Aqua Ring, Light Screen, Confuse Ray and Dragon Tail. Milotic possesses the means of nullifying many a offense and can be a key defensive pivot. Thanks to Marvel Scale, RestTalk also deserves a mention.

    Abilities: Milotic walks away with a new ability this generation in addition to its other great ability. The classic Marvel Scale is Milotic’s answer to its shabby DEF stat: being the DEF based equivalent of Guts, Milotic becomes monstrously hard to take down with its only weak point annulled and access to Recover. The thing is Poison and Burning compromise Milotic’s integrity, Sleeping makes it useless and while the speed drop doesn’t bother Milotic that much, the paralysis chance will. Milotic’s new ability Competitive gives it boosting power Gyarados can only dream of. Any stat drop results in the serpent getting a Nasty Plot. That combined with its fantastic neutral coverage is terrifying, though it becomes frailer on the physical side. Don’t use Cute Charm: Milotic has the same problems with triggering its ability as Magmortar, with almost none of the benefit.

    The Verdict: “A myth remains a myth as long as you can’t touch it.” Milotic has the makings of great pokemon: near unresisted coverage, usable offensive, incredible bulk and recover. The chinks in its armor are apparent, and it can be apparent why myths are only myths.

    P.S. Why didn’t Milotic get a Mega-Evolution? (T.T) :(
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2014
  7. Clone™

    Clone™ Ded

    I need to say something about Marvel Scale before I post a set: Do NOT, under any circumstances, status yourself. Giving yourself a Flame Orb is counter productive to her job, which is walling things. She needs the longevity, and Marvel Scale acts as a deterrent to Toxic. This also applies to RestTalk. It is unreliable, and potentially having two turns of not being able to do anything is not good for a wall.

    With that out of the way, onto the set:

    Milotic @ Leftovers
    Bold Nature
    Trait: Marvel Scale
    EVs: 248 HP/252 Def/4 SpAtk
    -Scald
    -Recover
    -Toxic/Haze
    -Ice Beam/Dragon Tail

    This is the standard set for Milotic. Her special defense is really good, while her physical defense is somewhat lacking. 252 EVs are put into defense to patch it up, and with a bold nature, hits the 282 mark, which allows her to wall most neutral physical attacks. Add in Scald, and the burns will make her even more potent at her job. Recover is an obvious choice, as it allows her to recover 50% of her health in one move. It is superior to RestTalk, as it allows her to use the moves she wants. RestTalk is unreliable, and even the 50% defense increase won't help. The last two moves are based o team support. Toxic can be used to deter set up sweepers, but Haze can remove all the boosts a Pokemon get while trying to use Milotic as set up bait. The last move either allows her to have a bit of offensive presence with Ice Beam, or allow her to phaze with Dragon Tail.
     
  8. sbktdreed

    sbktdreed Veteran Trainer

    Competive/Cute Charm w/ Life Orb/Leftovers/Assault Vest
    Calm w/ 252 Sp Defense, 130 Sp Attack, 128 HP
    Hydro Pump/Scald
    Ice Beam
    Dragon Pulse
    Hidder Power [Fire/Rock/Flying/Ghost/Dark]/Confuse Ray

    Countering
    High Attack and Special Defense with Electric/Grass-type moves like Thunder Punch Hitmonchan/Dragonite/Dusknoir, Wild Charge Snorlax, Leaf Blade Gallade, or Ferrothorn.
     
  9. Darmanitans IGNITED

    Darmanitans IGNITED New Member

    MILOTIC W/ Leftovers
    Ability; Marvel Scale
    Moves
    Rest
    SleepTalk
    Scald
    IceBeam

    Spread
    EVS; 252 in HP & S. DEF, the remainders in DEF. Or; 252 in S. DEF & DEF, or remainders in HP
    -----------------------------------------------------------

    This is my Milotic set, and in my opinion, it's one of the best defenses a water type can have. While your only weaknesses are Taunt, anything with or like Storm Drain, Electric Type Moves such as Thunderbolt, and Grass Type moves, these can all be solved by a simple switch. Milotic isn't meant to set there and try to sweep, but it's meant to take a threat and mow it down with either a burn or freeze it over. It's enhanced defenses while asleep make it bulky, and with the aid of Leftovers, increases the livability while Scald gives everything a chance to burn.

    I never used a Dragon-type move, such as Dragon Pulse or Dragon Tail, simply because switching out wouldn't necessarily solve any problems aside from someone trying to use Swords Dance/Nasty Plot or any similar situation. But now I have a better excuse; Fairies exist. Azumarill can suffer a burn, Togetic (and Grass Types, aside from Mega Venasaur) gets hit fairly hard by Ice Beam.

    Milotic is a great defensive pokemon, but it can only sleep through so much.
     
  10. kirant

    kirant Member

    There's not much to say about Milotic that hasn't been said already - it has an ability that most bulky pokemon can only dream they had. It has Recovery, giving it two options to heal by (letting you ignore one of the two), and amazing special bulk.

    Unfortunately, there's a bit of competition in this category for Sleep Talking Milotics. Suicune as a Sleep Talker has virtually equal regular defence to Milotic's Marvel Scale defence, access to Calm Mind, and uses Pressure. After 1 Calm Mind set up, it's undoubtedly the more durable pokemon and a possible win condition...basically making Milotic's sole advantage Dragon Tail. I've also a huge fan of Sleep Talking Gyarados and that thing has huge advantages physically while running a similar move set.

    Not to say Milotic doesn't have uses, but it needs special reasons to be taken before Suicune and needs to be utilized as a special wall effectively (or not expose an Electric weakness), or else Gyarados can replace it.

    One direction I would consider for Milotic is more of a Bulky Light Screen and Special Wall hybrid if you want a niche use.

    A Tender Habit
    Milotic @ Light Clay
    Calm Nature
    Trait: Marvel Scale
    EVs: 252 HP/4 Def/252 SpDef
    -Scald
    -Recover
    -Light Screen
    -Dragon Tail/Ice Beam/Toxic

    Really, the use of this set seems fairly obvious: come in against something that it can resist, set up Light Screen, and proceed to tank/set up something with a much less exposed weakness. Scald is a primary attack if you need one. Recover lets Milotic stay durable and, with Marvel Scale, can allow it to eat shot after shot after shot. Light Screen is your primary existence, and Dragon Tail/Ice Beam either provide coverage or a phaze mechanic. Toxic lets it deal with Water Absorbers to a degree.

    You may ask what exactly this has over something like Espeon. I'll start with this: typing. Ghost and Dark have gotten way more prevalent since Steel types don't wall them anymore ( :( ), meaning Espeon is very vulnerable. Though it has clear synergy with Charizard Y's sunlight and the decreasing use of weather wars, Espeon is very easy to hit with a common Knock Off or can find itself on the wrong edge of a Shadow Ball. Gengar can't OHKO Milotic and same goes with Aegislash. You'll get your Light Screen set up easily against it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
  11. Mestorn

    Mestorn Wandering Battler

    Doubles Review: Milotic doesn't bring much for doubles, but isn't exactly screwed in them either: Offensively, all it brings is Surf and support wise you have Haze and Light Screen. On the bright side, the graceful serpent isn't screwed over by many multitarget moves (Discharge and the rare Petal Blizzard are the only 2 coming to mind). The biggest problem I see in doubles is that Milotics brightest point, its durability, is compromised by focus fire. You can throw Milotic in doubles, but it is much more dangerous in singles.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Due to Marvel Scale (and access to Refresh), statusing Milotic is not that beneficial. Milotics lacking those two things are crippled by status. When it comes to counters, Ferrothorn comes to mind. It resists all of Milotic's coverage moves (save Hidden Power which does nil), and can proceed to setup on Milotic or scare it out with STAB Power Whip, though if Milotic carries Hypnosis, Ferrothorn becomes setup bait. Taunt also screws over Milotic, denying it access to recovery and any other support move it carries.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
  12. Clone™

    Clone™ Ded

    Shedinja is something that should never be used in doubles anyways, so I dont see why you mentioned him. Rock Slide is not only a spread move, but its also very common as well, and Shedinja loses to it every time. You should really consider taking that out, as Shedinja is by no means a threat to anything.
     
  13. StreetFlare

    StreetFlare Master of Flame

    As a doubles player, can I point out that a bulky Competitive Milotic with a bit of Spec. Attack investment makes for a semi-decent Intimidate Salamence counter? If 'mence switches in on you, you can hit it with a +2 Ice Beam. Not that it's perfect, mind, but it can work.

    Don't really see many Milotic anyway, but I haven't really been playing much at the moment.
     
  14. Mestorn

    Mestorn Wandering Battler

    Sorry, I guess I should be more specific. In addition to the doubles review, I often ramble on a few things about the pokemon; namely status, but on occasion hard counters as well. Shedinja is a crappy pokemon, but in singles where Milotic has no partner, Milotic will usually be forced to flee. That being said, I will remove Shedinja as it is far too uncommon and waaay too situational. Thanks :)
     
  15. Nulava

    Nulava Banned

    Milotic @ Assault Vest
    Nature: Modest
    Ability: Competitive
    EVs: 220 HP / 252 SpA / 36 SpD
    ~Hydro Pump
    ~Ice Beam
    ~Dragon Tail / Scald
    ~Hidden Power (Grass) / Hidden Power (Electric)
     
  16. RDaneel

    RDaneel Active Member

    Milotic is on of my favs all time, mind you I have three different sets that have worked fine for me and I'm thinking another one.

    So far I fished one in Black and adopted it as my water pokemon ditching Seismitoad, and I consider Milotic the official pokemon for that team as is in my sig :)

    Sets:

    Milotic
    Ability:Marvel Scale
    Item: Leftovers
    Nature: Calm/Modest
    EV:252HP/252SAtt/6Spd
    Surf/Scald
    Ice Beam
    Recover
    Toxic

    This set is the first one I tried, and it has worked fine. I remember an half and hour online battle that ended Milotic vs Milotic...

    Milotic
    Ability:Competitive
    Item:Leftovers/Assault Vest
    Nature:Modest/Timid
    EV:252SAtt/252Spd/6HP
    Surf/Scald
    Ice Beam
    Hidden Power Grass/Fire
    Mirror Coat/Dragon Pulse

    With no investment in SDef, Milotic is not going to resist a STABBed 2x attack, like thunderbolt, but it could surprise a non-STAB one, and against something that is faster than you... as mirror coat goes last.

    Assault Vest could be an option if running Dragon Pulse to improve the non-EV invested Defense and Special Defense

    With this one I used the ability capsule and change the ability to get a +2 with some Intimidate opponents.


    Milotic
    Ability:Marvel Scale
    Item:Leftovers
    Nature:Calm/Bold
    EV:252HP/252SDef/6Def
    Surf/Scald/HydroPump
    Recover
    Toxic
    Mirror Coat

    This one on the other hand can resist a Modest Jolteon or Zapdos Thunderbolt with Choice Specs, and send damage back to them.

    Milotic
    Ability:Marvel Scale
    Item:Leftovers
    Nature:Calm/Bold
    EV:252HP/252Def/6SDef

    Scald
    Recover
    AquaRing
    Toxic

    The objective of this set is to status, either with Toxic or trying to get Lady Luck's (in the form of the game's RNG) favour and burn the opponet with Scald, and stall as much as you can.
     
  17. bombe32

    bombe32 Active Member

    I could easily see Milotic being a monster in doubles battles.

    However, I can't really be too specific because of the fact that Milotic is not allowed within the VGC ruleset at the moment, and (next to) no one who plays doubles at a high level uses it, since it's not allowed. But there are a lot of things that are good about Milotic in doubles:

    Competitive ability makes it absorb Intimidate to increase its special attack to extreme levels. And Intimidate is probably THE most common ability in doubles at the moment because of the physical powerhouses who roam the world of Pokemon: Mega Kangaskhan, Mega Mawile, Garchomp, Conkeldurr, Talonflame, Gyarados, etc.

    Doubles are fast-paced compared to singles, which is why Competitive would be the better ability. Stalling is not a big thing in doubles, and you would be better off with a bulky offensive set.

    Milotic @ Sitrus Berry
    Ability: Competitive
    Level: 50
    EVs: 4 SAtk / 252 HP / 252 Def or 252 SAtk / 252 HP / 4 Def
    Modest Nature
    - Protect
    - Ice Beam
    - Hydro Pump / Scald
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    I would prefer the maximum bulk, as otherwise it's pretty weak against physical attacks. Ice Beam kills dragons, Hydro Pump does massive damage (but can be unreliable), while HP Fire takes care of those who would otherwise wall the other attacks, life Ferrothorn.

    Sitrus Berry is very important to ensure it doesn't get taken out in one turn.
     
  18. Kraleck

    Kraleck Well-Known Member

    Milotic. So hard to get Feebas that few people had access to you without obsessive grinding or dumb luck. On top of that, the Evolution method was insane to get until the Prism Scale was introduced. However, you are well worth it, Milotic.

    Stats:
    -HP - Good-bordering-Great - Base 95 exemplifies Bulky Water, especially with Recover. Too bad it falls short of 101+ HP Substitute range.
    -Attack - Mediocre - Base 60 just isn't going to see much use at all.
    -Defense - Slightly-Below Average - Base 79 isn't that great on its own, but with Marvel Scale...
    -Sp.Atk - Great - Base 100 is quite common for usable Stats. With Milotic, you also have the option of Competitive...
    -Sp.Def - Incredible - Base 125 is going to wall quite a bit of things.
    -Speed - Sligthly-Above Average (Non-Trick Room) - Can't win 'em all. Base 81 isn't that bad with that bulk to compensate, though.

    Abilities:
    -Marvel Scale - Great Ability. Defense +50% when under a Status Effect is huge for a Water Type, especially since Milotic rarely ever uses Attack and Flame Orb exists.
    -Competitive - Pretty much Defiant Ability for Sp.Atk. Quite fun for a new toy, but one cannot argue its use over Marvel Scale too well. Good Ability, but too situational.
    -Cute Charm (Hidden, Available [Poké Transfer]) - Not very good at all. It's a 30% chance upon the opponent using a Direct-Contact Move AND they have to be the opposite Gender for that to work in the first place. Just...no.

    Overall, Milotic exemplifies Bulky Water Type with Marvel Scale and Recover. Very little can take it out quickly without being a hard-hitter with STAB Electric or Grass. If you're quick on the draw, Toxic can be a huge check to Marvel Scale Milotic if it lacks Protect - the gradual increase in chipping renders Milotic's existence increasingly limited. Milotic's Moveset is very methodical, but limited in options. That's not a bad thing though, considering how well it can tank.
     
  19. Clone™

    Clone™ Ded

    It's fine. Really, the only reason why I brought it up was because I see way too many people praising the bug, and inexperienced players hop on the bandwagon once they see Wonder Guard. Sure, it can hard counter many things, but it can't hurt them back. Since this is going on the main site, it would be best to mention only competitively viable sets and counters.
     
  20. Neosonic97

    Neosonic97 Fastest thing Alive

    Milotic is all about stall. Hence, my movepool would probably be something like this:
    Milotic@Leftovers
    Bold Nature
    Ability: Marvel Scale.
    EVs: 252 HP, 126 Def, 126 SDef.
    -Protect
    -Recover
    -Toxic
    -Scald.
    This Milotic set is all about walling the heck outta stuff, which Milotic does like a champ. It's typing is great defensively, having a mere two weaknesses. The moves almost speak for themselves: Toxic, Protect and Recover are self-explanatory, while Scald is to prevent Milotic from being taunt bait, and also provides an alternative status to inflict in case it does get taunted, and if you're lucky it can really mess up something like a Garchomp. Bold Nature is to maximize it's Physical defences- it already has enough special to not need a nature boost. EVs are split amongst HP, Defense and Special Defense. HP is to maximize Recover's healing, and I pray I don't need to explain the other two. Marvel Scale is Milotic's best ability considering outside of fast physical attackers like Garchomp, statusing Milotic is probably your best bet at not being walled by it, and Milotic can take advantage of that. Overall, Milotic will never be a top-tier threat unless it gets a Mega Evolution like Mawile's, but in lower tiers, Milotic is monstrously hard to take down- even the mighty Arcanine has trouble, although there are a couple of counters to Milotic.

    Counters: Milotic's defense isn't THAT good, and as such my first check that comes to mind is Pikachu. Pikachu outspeeds Milotic, meaning Milotic CANNOT status it bar a lucky Quick Claw activation. If it tries, it WILL take a Volt Tackle to the face, and with a Light Ball, that OHKOes defensively invested Kyogres and Yveltals. Yeah, Milotic's not gonna enjoy that. Luxray and Electivire also come to mind, albeit somewhat less than Pikachu, seeing as they don't get access to Volt Tackle, which is amazing, and have to use the less-than-stellar Wild Charge instead.. Pikachu can also counter-status Milotic with Nuzzle, but that'd trigger Marvel Scale, and Pikachu DOES NOT want that.
    Mega Venusaurhard counters Milotic. Leech Seed or Grassy Terrain, Milotic can't do a thing to MVenusaur, while it can just give Milotic a lot of grief. Other than that, however, there really isn't much that can actually check Milotic, outside of MAYBE Mega Absolwho can reflect Toxics back in Milotic's face with it's amazing ability of Magic Bounce.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
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