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Community POTW #025

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KillerDraco

Well-Known Member
There is a reason why people are opting for the Zmoves over choice band,and that reason is to cut down on recoil and maintain offensive presence.

As to whether or not Z-mirror move is "incredibly gimmicky" : it's at the very least,a free swords dance boost on the switch, and at best, a swords dance boost,with a damage bonus.(Recall how dangerous powerup punch on Mega Kangaskhan was before they banned it).
However, Staraptor is always best used as a revenge killer so it can set up taking the least damage possible,and many weakened mons slower than staraptor are likely to switch out anyway, fearing heavy damage from the banded set.

And then the fun begins.

One common switchin to the banded set is ferrothorn, to wear staraptor down,pretty much through physical contact recoil alone:
Choice Band 252+ Atk Reckless Staraptor BB vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Ferrothorn: (69.8 - 82.1%)

Banded Raptor takes 2 turns of iron barbs and potentially rocky helmet damage(25%HP+25%HP)After stealth rocks and bb recoil, game over. You exchange one wall for one wallbreaker:Not ideal.

Instead, you could use z-mirror move and start the following turn with an attack at 2* power:
+2 252+ Atk Reckless Staraptor Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Ferrothorn: (92.8 - 109.3%)

Regenerator walls switch in for similar reasons:
+2 252+ Atk R. Staraptor BB vs.252HP/232+ Def Toxapex: (86.1- 101.9%)

You likely OHKO both after some prior damage.
The difference between this and choice band: you now you can severely damage something else,since you have -at worst- 25%HP to play with( if you OHKO a rocky helmet ferrothorn).

Plus, your opponent cannot freely switch in a rock or steel type,since you can switch to close combat and deal with heavy damage.To illustrate the power:
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor CC vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Heatran: (96.8 - 114.5%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor CC vs. 252 HP/252+ Def Magnezone: (102.9- 121.5%)
(Of course,if it's scarfed magnezone,you die.)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor CC vs. 248 HP / 0 Def AV Magearna: (66.1 - 77.9%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor CC vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Celesteela: (66 - 77.8%)
+2 252+ Atk R. Staraptor BB vs. 248 HP/192 Def Tapu Fini: (106.7 - 125.9%)
So regardless of what set you run,you deal heavy damage to the wall that comes in,crucial vs. ones without reliable recovery.

Your opponent could opt to switch in something faster:
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Keldeo: (45.8 - 54.1%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Jolteon: (75.6 - 89.6%)
+1 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Landorus-T(34.7 - 41.3%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Medicham-Mega: (59 - 70.1%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Beedrill-Mega: (100.7 - 118.8%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Greninja: (66.3 - 78.2%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Tapu Koko: (55.5 - 65.4%)
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Alakazam-Mega: (76.4 - 90%)

(Not so important now Pheromosa is forbidden in OU,but food for thought on Battle spot):
+2 252+ Atk Staraptor Quick Attack vs. Pheromosa: (102.8 - 121.2%)
So aside from priority attacks from mega medicham and greninja ruining your day if you're at low HP, that's a lot of free damage, and free KOs late game.

But I ramble on,as I tend to do,and I apologise for going overboard on calcs.
My point: the Z crystal set can achieve a lot ,and should not be considered inferior to the banded set.If you click Brave bird on the banded set and get the KO, the followup KOs above are not possible; you are forced to switch out and back in later,lose momentum and take stealth rock damage the next time you come in.

The argument for band is its immediate raw power,which can get you by depending on what you want for your team and what your opponent brings on theirs. But sometimes it just isn't enough to break the mons you want to break,and despite its power can be played around. I speak from years of experience using the banded set on many of my teams:missing KOs and being locked into the wrong move isn't fun.

I'm on Mobile right now (being on call is no fun) so I can't really quote point-for-point, but I will go into this:

What makes Z-Mirror move gimmicky is not the +2 Attack. Heck, I love +2 Attack; gimme all the Swords Dances. But the thing that makes it gimmicky is the fact that it is a Z-move; you can only use one per match. There's a reason not many Pokemon effectively and consistently can make use of Z-Setup; the most notable ones off the top of my head being the infamous Z-Conversion Porygon-Z (whose setup boosts all stats, making it harder to revenge kill as well), and Z-Hypnosis Xurkitree (whose Beast Boost lets it take advantage of the speed from Z-Hypnosis by accumulating more power, and Hypnosis at least has a decent sleep effect, although the accuracy is a bummer). With only one opportunity to set up, it's pretty much an all-or-nothing deal, and of course, it means none of your other teammates will be able to utilize a Z-move as well. So it's not really comparable to SD or Parental Bond PuP; you can always set up a second time with one of those moves if forced out, which means there's less pressure when choosing when to set up, since you don't necessarily have to only save them for late-game. Plus, once the Z-move has been used, you're stuck with Mirror move, which, in and of itself, is kind of a gimmick.

Again, it's not saying +2 Attack isn't good. It's just saying that the nature of Z-Moves makes it more OO territory than a standard. I should have elaborated more, but the comparison of Band was more to just using a Z-Crystal for a Supersonic Skystrike and then leaving it at that. Since a Z-Move attack is pretty much just a flashy wallbreaking move, after all.
 

Archstaraptor

Team Builder / RMT
Fair point - but that one use is often all you need to carve a large gap in your opponent's team,or sweep outright.
Ideally you want a weakened team for the latter, but the +2 attack boost can be incredibly disruptive to opponents expecting to take a banded hit.
Indeed, z moves are a one-time use item, but an offensive one with a +2 attack boost included prior to using said z-move poises you to deal incredible damage to any aspect of the opponent's team.
Be it a wall or a revenge killer,using +2 Brave Bird, Close Combat and Quick Attack hits anything for good damage,and crucially, unavoidable damage.
The opponent cannot switch in either a wall or a revenge killer to avoid it,which is where the banded set is less consistent.
And I much prefer the all-or-nothing deal: banded sets just don't pull teams apart like this set does.
 
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