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Community POTW #035

Discussion in 'POTW Collaboration' started by Serebii, Jul 23, 2017.

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  1. Serebii

    Serebii And, as if by magic, the webmaster appeared... Staff Member Admin

    Time for the next Pokémon, and hoo boy did the RNG spit out a good one. I feel bad for whichever of the writers writes this one

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    That's right, it's Zygarde, covering all three forms


    Go nuts
  2. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Well-Known Member

    Zygarde is one of the most OP pokémon in the game, definitely earning its title as a legendary. It is so bulky it is absolutely ridiculous. This is the set I've been running in-game and I don't think I've ever had it faint. When it was around level 55 it easily swept teams of lvl 65 pokémon on its own.

    Zygarde @ Maranga Berry
    Ability: Power Construct
    Careful nature
    252 HP, 4 Def, 252 Sp.Def
    -Thousand Arrows
    -Sleep Talk

    The idea is simple. Switch in on a special move you resist like Fire Blast, and activate Maranga Berry. From there start boosting with Coil. Power Construct heals you once it triggers and if your health gets low you simply use Rest. To give you an idea of how ridiculously bulky this thing is after Maranga Berry, take a look at this:

    252+ SpA Kyogre Ice Beam vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde-Complete: 128-152 (39.6 - 47%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    That's max Sp.Atk Modest Kyogre's Ice Beam, which is 4x effective, and it doesn't even 2KO unless it also has an item boost. Another example:

    252 SpA Life Orb Kyurem-White Ice Beam vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde-Complete: 250-296 (77.3 - 91.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    Even Kyurem-White with a Life Orb can't OHKO with STAB Ice Beam, even with Modest it's not a guaranteed KO. That's base 170 with a Life Orb, using a 4x super effective STAB move. Zygarde is absolutely insane. If you manage to get rid of powerful sweepers with Ice Beam before setting up there's very little that can stop you. And on the physical side it's even bulkier after two Coil boosts. A good partner to this is Tapu Bulu, who can lure in poison and fire moves for Zygarde to switch in on and activate the berry, and Grassy Terrain gives a little bit of extra bulk to Zygarde while it's setting up.

    Marshadow with Spectral Thief is probably one of the best checks to this Zygarde, especially after Zygarde sets up. Marshadow steals the Maranga Berry boost and the Coil boosts and then you've got a problem. Marshadow can switch in when you Rest.

    Let's compare its special bulk with Chansey:

    252+ SpA Kyogre Origin Pulse vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde-Complete in Rain: 87-103 (26.9 - 31.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
    252+ SpA Kyogre Origin Pulse vs. 0 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Rain: 88-105 (27 - 32.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

    Granted, this Chansey isn't fully invested in Sp.Def, but that's some pretty darn close bulk. Let's compare the physical bulk to Mega Aggron:

    252+ Atk Tyranitar-Mega Crunch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Zygarde-Complete: 76-90 (23.5 - 27.8%) -- 80.1% chance to 4HKO
    252+ Atk Tyranitar-Mega Crunch vs. 252 HP / 16+ Def Aggron-Mega: 40-48 (22.5 - 27.1%) -- 30% chance to 4HKO

    That's also pretty darn close, and that's before boosting with Coil. Once Zygarde gets a few Coil boosts it won't even feel physical hits anymore.
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  3. Krookodile

    Krookodile 5 Gen trainer

    I just have to say that I used to really look forward to reading the POTW every week. The articles used to be very detailed and interesting, but they have gotten really lazy and disappointing recently. I hope that some of the quality returns soon.
  4. Jikling01

    Jikling01 New Member

    I totally agree with you, Krookodile. ;) I really feel too a lack of passion on this site. Plus, Lucario was already done in gen 6, which is way too recent...

    They should focus on new Pokmeon from Gen 7, or from the ones that are not done at all in Gen 6!!!

    Also, it would be nice to have reaccess to the Potw from Gen 3 to 5 on the menu, i would like to see them again, coz im still playing in those games. Plus, they were so well done.

    If they do things to be deleted after, ot to be "bothched" (Done lazy without passion), why don't they give up on their site and do other things with their lives... It's like they are wasting their time, but still ,it is not my problem at all.

    Hope things will get better for the site.... and the lost quality returns soon!!!!
  5. jr0904

    jr0904 Beginning Trainer

    hate to burst your bubble, but its complete form isnt OP. for one thing its a dragon and ground type which means it can get OTKO from a strong ice type!
  6. BillyBobJoe

    BillyBobJoe Active Member

    Ability: Power Construct
    Nature: Hardy/Docile/etc.
    252 HP, 106 Sp. Atk, 150 Sp. Def
    -Core Enforcer
    -Thousand Waves
    -Iron Tail
    -Outrage/Dragon Pulse/Earthquake/Extreme Speed

    This setup would be for a 50% Zygarde turning into a Complete Forme Zygarde. Core Enforcer removes the targets ability if it had already attacked, helpful for getting rid of Pokémon with Levitate. Thousand Waves ensures that the opponent has to battle Zygarde rather than switching out. Iron Tail deals with Ice and Fairy types. Outrage, Dragon Pulse & Earthquake are for strong STAB options and Extreme Speed is for priority if needed.
  7. But didn't it just say that an Ice Beam can still 2HKO at best?
  8. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Well-Known Member

    A 2KO is technically enough to bring it down, as Zygarde can only use Rest once every 3 turns. And there are things that OHKO, like Kyurem-White with Choice Specs and Ice Beam. But most stuff isn't in that league of power for ice moves as they lack STAB and have a lower Sp.Atk stat than Kyurem-White. In terms of physical users of ice moves, they're fairly rare among legendaries. Kyurem-Black is one, which can run Subzero Slammer based on Freeze Shock for a OHKO even after two Coil boosts, but for the rest there's also the issue of lacking STAB or power, because let's be real here. This is a STAB Z-move coming from a pokémon with a base 170 attack stat, hitting 4x effective. Even among legendaries that's insane power to throw around.

    252 Atk Kyurem-Black Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. +2 252 HP / 4 Def Zygarde-Complete: 352-420 (108.9 - 130%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    Defensive Zygarde with Maranga Berry should ideally be brought out when strong powerhouses with ice moves have already been eliminated on the enemy side, or at least sufficiently weakened, primarily the Kyurem fusions. If the enemy no longer has powerful ice moves on its side (only stuff like Darkrai's Ice Beam and/or Hidden Power ice left) Zygarde can set up fairly easily and become practically unbreakable. Zygarde has the benefit that ice is a terrible defensive typing so they're pretty much non-existent among these tiers outside of the Kyurem fusions, and the non-ice types lack STAB to really give those ice moves a powerful punch.
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  9. Djura

    Djura 99% chance to hit


    that set is bad and you should feel bad

    Zygarde got massive buffs in the forms of Thousand Arrows and Power Construct, so I don't see why doing Gen 7 analyses on Zygarde is a bad thing.

    "But an Ice type can OHKO it" is not a good argument against it. There are Pokemon that have 4x weaknesses and are still ridiculous in their respective formats.


    Choice Band

    Zygarde 50% @ Choice Band
    Ability: Aura Break
    Nature: Adamant
    4 HP/252 Atk/252 Speed
    * Thousand Arrows
    * Outrage
    * Extreme Speed
    * Toxic / Superpower

    So this is your standard Zygarde-50% set in OU. Max attack + an Adamant nature + Choice Band are needed to spam Thousand Arrows endlessly, as even Flying types that would normally wall it such as Celesteela cannot escape its wrath. Outrage is its secondary STAB, allowing it to muscle past Tangrowth if needed. Extreme Speed is needed to KO weakened opponents after significant damage. Finally, Toxic can be used to catch Tangrowth or Tapu Bulu on the switch, or Superpower can be used to 2HKO Ferrothorn.

    Zygarde is best used mid-game as a hole puncher. It is best paired with Spikes/Stealth Rock setters such as Greninja, Ash-Greninja, Heatran, Ferrothorn, and Chansey. Toxic Spikes support from either Greninja or Toxapex will allow it to use something other than Toxic and continuously harass bulky Grass types. Mega Mawile and Mega Medicham, thanks to their ridiculous wallbreaking prowess, can be used to rid the opponent of physically defensive threats. Fast U-turners such as Tapu Koko and Ash-Greninja get out of the field and provide Zygarde with chip damage. Slow U-turners such as Mega Scizor will allow it to gain momentum against threats such as Heatran and Magnezone. Magnezone itself is a fantastic partner to eliminate threats such as Mega Scizor and Ferrothorn.

    Will write more later
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  10. generic villager #5

    generic villager #5 Your ad here!

    Since I wager most people want to discuss Complete Zygarde, which admittedly is the big name here, I figure I'll drop a set for 10% in UU:

    Krypto (Zygarde 10% Forme)
    Ability: Aura Break
    EVs/Nature: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe, Jolly Nature
    Item: Choice Band
    - Thousand Arrows
    - Outrage
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Iron Tail / Rock Slide / Toxic

    If this set seems familiar, it's probably because it's similar to other Choice Banded dragons you've seen, like Garchomp or Dragonite. The strategy is simple: hit hard and very fast. Base 115 Speed is not too common in UU, and with Extreme Speed you can out-prioritize most threats anyway. The EVs, nature, and item work to increase Zygarde's Speed and power, and the ability is there because Power Construct is useless on the 10% Forme. Thousand Arrows is a great Ground STAB that can hit aerial targets, so it's fine getting Choice-locked into it. Outrage is the Dragon STAB, and with the Choice Band does impressive damage. Plus, you're getting Choice-locked anyway, so why not? Dragon Tail is your only other option, and I don't need to say why that's a bad idea. ExtremeSpeed circumvents priority users and makes Zygarde a potent revenge killer. The last slot suffers a bit from Zygarde's shallow movepool, but you have some options. Iron Tail hits Fairy and Ice-types hard, but is inaccurate. Rock Slide has great coverage with Thousand Arrows and offers a good flinch chance, but is relatively weak. Toxic is a decent desperation tactic, crippling threats too bulky for Zygarde to take down itself.

    This set is far from invincible, unfortunately. Its defenses are appalling, so any decently powerful unresisted hit will destroy it. Tanks are a big issue for Zygarde, although they'll have to be wary of Toxic. Mamoswine is a good answer, since it can survive most hits from Zygarde and KO with Ice Shard (since ExtremeSpeed does less than 50% in return), but there's a chance for Zygarde to OHKO if Mamoswine switches into an Iron Tail. Alolan Ninetales can also survive a hit and OHKO in return, but will be OHKO by Iron Tail and may be KO'd by a Rock Slide. Weavile and Mega Sceptile also avoid a OHKO from ExtremeSpeed and are two of the rare threats in UU able to outpace and OHKO Zygarde. Gliscor is a good counter to Zygarde, as it can take most of its moves with ease and Zygarde lacks the coverage to account for it.
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2017
  11. TheIceCream

    TheIceCream User of Ultra Beasts

    Zygarde. The Pokemon that wished it (but never) got a game. But in Sun and Moon, it got 2 more forms. So, 50% Zygarde used to be an outclassed Garchomp, but now, it hold its own niches together. And Complete Zygarde allows it to be a bulky pokemon with lots of power. Sun and moon was great to Zygarde.

    + 100 Attack does make Zygarde have some capabilities.
    + 121 Defense in 50% and Complete form is solid
    + 108 HP in 50% is solid and 216 in Complete is absurd, making it the 4th highest HP in the game only behind Blissey, Chansey and Guzzlord
    + 115 Speed in 10% form is very solid
    + Dragon/Ground is a decent typing
    + Zygarde has a good movepool with moves such as Extreme Speed, Thousand Arrows, Core Enforcer, Dragon Dance and Outrage

    - In 10%, 54/71/85 isn't bulky whatsoever. This thing will die to unresisted hits
    - 81 Sp Attack in 50% isn't brilliant and Complete is only 10 points higher
    - Complete Form is only base 85 Speed meaning it will get outsped a lot of the time
    - Complete Form needes to be under half HP to activate, making it somewhat unreliable
    - If Complete form is banned, its main ability becomes useless
    - Why was there no Pokemon Z? This would've made Zygarde look much cooler.

    Aura Break: Reverses Fairy Aura and Dark Aura. This sounds good on paper until you realize that Xerneas and Yveltal are banned to Ubers with Complete Zygarde who needs its other ability. So in OU, where you can't have Power Construct, this ability is useless.
    Power Construct: Changes Zygarde to Complete Form at half HP. This is what makes complete Zygarde (literally). The only downside is that Zygarde needs to reach half HP, which isn't the most reliable.

    Counters: In OU, Tapu Bulu fairs quite well as it's immune to Dragon and takes Ground moves fairly well while taking Zygarde out with its moves after a Swords Dance. It also weakens Zygarde's Earthquake, should it run it. Other fairy types do well such as Clefable. In Ubers for Complete Zygarde, Xerneas enjoys destroying Zygarde with STAB Moonblasts, Primal Kyogre outspeeds and KOs with an Ice Beam and some special Attackers such as Mega Mewtwo Y and Fairy Arceus.
  12. Archstaraptor

    Archstaraptor devolved.

    Would there be other abilities you would like to remove with core enforcer other than levitate? I'm curious! If not, Thousand arrows hits both levitators and flying types without any prior attacks,so would be more useful than core-enforcer (although it has the downside of not being a gigantic laser).

    The set direction is pretty good - you're saying that you value all of Zygarde-C's stats too much to lower one by 10%, and that's ok if you're going for a mixed attacker set. But the question becomes why you want Zygarde as mixed attacker on your team,as opposed to another mixed attacker. What is it about the three ( and the fourth seemingly undecided) moves that have made it effective for you? What does it defeat that other sets cannot?

    A lot of people have suggested slow, stally defensive sets so far, so I'm not only intrigued by this offensive spin but by the inclusion of both core enforcer and thousand waves.

    Now Thousand arrows is available to Zygarde,it has very little reason to choose earthquake instead.Terrain aside: earthquake deals 10% more damage, which will make a difference in certain matchups. But as you say, Tapu Bulu is used frequently enough to be concerned about the potential 50% drop in power in grassy terrain.
    Alternatively,Thousand waves is unaffected by terrain and is thus more consistent. Thousand arrows also has that bonus effect of threatening checks to the earthquake set (Switchins such as Skarmory and Landorus, will now take damage regardless of what attack is selected and lose their ground immunity).
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  13. Neosonic97

    Neosonic97 Fastest thing Alive

    Time for stat Analysis.

    First, let's go over 10% Zygarde.

    HP: Base 54. Bad. In its 10% form, Zygarde HP is really low.
    Attack: Base 100. Good. Although base 100 Attack is nothing to laugh at.
    Defense: Base 71. Mediocre. In fact, can we just say that 10% Zygarde is really frail?
    Special Attack: Base 61. Bad/Irrelevant. Zygarde's special movepool sucks, so its low Special Attack doesn't hamper it at all.
    Special Defense: Base 85. Average. It's got better Special Defense than Defense.
    Speed: Base 115. Great. Zygarde 10%, despite being frail, is REALLY freaking fast. This is as much speed as the dreaded Mega Rayquaza.

    Next, Complete Zygarde.

    HP: Base 216. Godly. There's no denying it- Complete Zygarde is built like a tank. This is the fourth highest HP in the game, and, in conjunction with its decent defenses, stops even Ice Beams from OHKOing it, even from the Kyurem Fusions (The absolute strongest Ice Types). There is a good reason as to why Power Construct ended up being banned to the Uber Tier, despite this stat being the ONLY change between 50% and Complete Zygarde.
    Attack: Base 100. Good. Despite being super bulky, it also has a decent base 100 attack, which actually allows it to harm its foes fairly well, despite being a defensive Pokemon. It helps that it only has to run one attack, ever.
    Defense: Base 121. Great. Combined with its incredible HP, it should come as no surprise that Complete Zygarde is a bit like Eviolite Chansey, only it walls physical attacks to hell and back.
    Special Attack: 91. Average/Irrelevant. Zygarde's Special Attack is a bit lower than its attack, but let's be honest here. Zygarde's special movepool sucks, on top of Thousand Arrows being one of the best moves in the game, period, Core Enforcer just isn't powerful enough to warrant a special set.
    Special Defense: Base 95. Average. Despite being primarily a physical wall, Zygarde does boast a passable Special Defense stat too. And given its base 216 HP, its Special Defense not being bad is very welcome.
    Speed: Base 85. Mediocre. Really, this is Complete Zygarde's one and only bad stat, and even then, that's not TOO big an issue on such a defensive titan like Complete Zygarde in the first place.

    And my own take on Zygarde, which is a bulky Coil Set. It forgoes the Maranga Berry in favour of Leftovers for passive recovery.

    Ability: Power Construct
    Nature: Impish (+Def, -SpA) or Careful (+SpD, -SpA).
    EVs: 252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SpD or 252 HP, 4 Def, 252 SpD
    -Thousand Arrows
    -Sleep Talk

    Thousand Arrows is one of the single best moves in the game, and it is what allows Zygarde to still thrive while running a mono-attack set, given that nothing is immune to it, and the things that resist it generally cannot breach Zygarde's defenses in the first place. Coil allows you to take Zygarde's already astronomical defense and raise it even higher, as well as giving Zygarde some rather deceptive killing power, even with a mere base 100 attack with no investment. The EVs and Nature can be interchanged to afford Zygarde greater physical or special bulk, depending on what you need. Rest and Sleep Talk are, well... ResTalk. Zygarde's main problem is that Rest is its only form of active recovery (Although if it DID have active recovery outside of Rest, that might have been the grounds for it becoming another tier crusher like Mega Rayquaza), but given its insane defenses, this isn't a HUGE problem. The strategy is simple. Use your natural bulk to set up, keep Zygarde away from Ice Moves and try to get it into its Complete form. From there, keep setting up and then go ham with Thousand Arrows once you've got enough Coil boosts under your belt.
  14. Gardellade

    Gardellade Member

    Zygarde-50% Banded
    Item: Choice Band
    Ability: Aura Break
    252 Attack/252 Speed/4 HP Adamant
    ~Thousand Arrows

    Self explanatory set. The goal is to hit hard. Thousand Arrows is an easily spammable move since it's only resisted by grass and bug types. Outrage acts as Dragon-STAB that's stronger and usable once the opponent's fairies have been taken down. Extremespeed can be used to pick off weakened opponents. Superpower rounds out the coverage. Adamant max attack is used to maximize damage output while max speed is used to outspeed opponents.

    Zygarde-50% Dragon Dance
    Item: Lum Berry/Groundium Z/Dragonium Z
    Ability: Aura Break
    4HP/252 Attack/252 Speed Adamant
    ~Thousand Arrows
    ~Dragon Dance

    This set is used to set up zygarde and potentially sweep. Thousand ARrows is the spammable STAB attack while Outrage is a more solid option once opponent's fairies are eliminated. Extremespeed is used to hit weakened targets. Dragon dance is the move of choice, setting up both attack and speed, making it harder to revenge kill zygarde and tank its attacks. Alternatively, you could use Coil and a bulkier spread of 252hp/252 special defense or attack/4 Defense, with an impish or careful nature to have a bulkier, stronger zygarde at the cost of speed.

    Countering Zygarde:
    The plethora of fairies in OU give Zygarde a hard time. Tapu Koko and Lele do not like to take a thousand arrows, but can dish out a lot of damage with dazzling gleam and moonblast, respectively. Tapu fini is bulky enough to take most of zygarde's attacks and can hit it hard in return using Ice beem or moonblast.

    Zygarde-ians of the Galaxy (Zygarde Complete)
    Item: Leftovers
    Ability: Power Construct
    252 HP/252 Def/4 SpDef Impish
    ~Thousand Arrows
    ~Dragon Tail/Toxic
    ~Sleep Talk/Toxic

    As it is your duty to watch over and protect the galaxy from some of the strongest threats, it's only right that you run a physically defensive set so you can take the hits from monsters such as Primal Groudon and Ho-Oh. Full investment into HP and Defense maximize your bulk. Thousand Arrows is the STAB move of choice, hitting everything besides Shaymin-Sky, Pheromosa, Arceus-Grass, and Arceus-Bug for at least neutral damage. Rest is used to restore that ridiculously high HP stat and to potentially get rid of a status. Toxic provides utility and allows Zygarde to break through some bulky mons it otherwise can't touch. Dragon tail can be used to shuffle mons and rack up entry hazard damage. Sleep Talk allows Zygarde to not be set up bait while it's sleeping, and is especially helpful when used in conjunction with dragon tail since it bypasses dragon tail's negative priority.

    The other fat Zygarde set
    Power Construct
    Item: Leftovers
    Nature: Careful
    252HP/252 SpDef/4 Def
    ~Thousand Arrows
    ~Sleep Talk

    Because of the amazing coverage Thousand Arrows offers, you can run it as the only attack on Zygarde. Rest and Sleep talk are there to stay healthy and to potentially boost or attack while you're sleeping. Coil is used to boost Attack and Defense simultaneously. The spread is used to maximize special defense, since you hopefully will be boosting your defense with coil.

    Counters to Zygarde-C:
    The easiest way to deal with Zygarde-C is to not let it transform in the first place. 50% Zygarde is not nearly as bulky as Zygarde-C is, so if you can either OHKO it or keep it above 50% HP and then KO it, you should be fine. Taunt users can prevent Zygarde from setting up and restoring its health. Strong fairies are immune to dragon tail and can hit back hard. Arceus-Water and Primal Kyogre don't like taking a thousand arrows but hit Zygarde hard with ice beam, which can be useful if Zygarde has not transformed yet.
  15. Rocxidi

    Rocxidi ס₪₪₪§€ΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞ7

    Zygarde @ Figy Berry
    Ability: Aura Break
    EVs: 160 HP / 216 Atk / 28 SpD / 104 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Coil
    - Extreme Speed
    - Thousand Arrows

    Double Dance Zygarde is a god. Having both boosting moves creates more opportunities to set up, and thanks to Thousand Arrows, everything is taking big damage. It has the bulk to live things like Garchomp's Outrage and Tapu Lele's Moonblast, the speed to outrun Greninja after boosting, and thanks to the Figy Berry buff, it will be hard to take down.
  16. dementeddurian

    dementeddurian Well-Known Member

    I know this may be stupid, but what about putting a Focus Sash on Zygarde? It is viable with any of its forms?
  17. MetalSonic

    MetalSonic Orderan' Defendan'

    Maybe it's Dog Form? But not so much its others since its bulk is very apparent and it would appreciate other items because of it.

    Anywho, Thousand Waves sets aren't too shabby either!
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