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Community POTW #067

Discussion in 'POTW Collaboration' started by Serebii, Feb 25, 2018.

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  1. Serebii

    Serebii And, as if by magic, the webmaster appeared... Staff Member Admin

  2. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Happy Minun

    Aww yeah, I've had a lot of fun with Typhlosion in doubles. It needs a bit of setup and support to shine but it can be devastating if used right. Flash Fire, Eruption, decent stats, decent coverage, it has enough to work with.

    Typhlosion @ Firium Z
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 252 Sp.Atk, 252 Speed, 4 HP
    Modest nature
    -Eruption
    -Flamethrower
    -Protect
    -Focus Blast

    This is the set I've been using in doubles. I use a Weakness Policy Musharna with Baton Pass to get in safely while a Torkoal uses Lava Plume. It simultaneously gets Typhlosion in safely and activates Flash Fire because Torkoal is pretty much the only thing slower than Musharna. A lot of opponents go for super effective damage on Musharna, anticipating a Trick Room setup, which activates Weakness Policy, and Musharna is bulky enough to survive most super effective hits with ease (to give an idea, Mega Alakazam usually fails to even hit 50% damage with Shadow Ball). This way, after a single turn of setup, I've got a +2 Sp.Atk Typhlosion on the field at full health, with sunlight, and Flash Fire activated, which is enough power to OHKO even the most defensive Cresselia with Eruption, and simultaneously it's not uncommon for Lava Plume to burn at least one opponent. It also has enough power to KO defensive Tapu Fini after Lava Plume damage with Eruption. Most teams can't handle that kind of power and crumble. On the second turn I usually switch Torkoal out and switch in Lilligant, which provides speed support with Chlorophyll After You to outspeed most opponents. Firium Z gives Typhlosion a devastating fire attack to use if it gets damaged, needs to go through particularly sturdy opposition, or anticipates a Protect. For instance:

    +2 252+ Sp.Atk Flash Fire Typhlosion Inferno Overdrive (200 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Sp.Def Multiscale Dragonite in sun: 185-218 (111.4 - 131.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    +2 252+ Sp.Atk Flash Fire Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 44+ Sp.Def Tapu Fini in sun with doubles spread damage: 147-173 (83 - 97.7%) -- guaranteed KO after Torkoal's Lava Plume damage
    +2 252+ Sp.Atk Flash Fire Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Sp.Def Cresselia in sun with doubles spread damage: 253-298 (111.4 - 131.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    +2 252+ Sp.Atk Flash Fire Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Sp.Def Mega Salamence in sun with doubles spread damage: 229-270 (133.9 - 157.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    +2 252+ Sp.Atk Flash Fire Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Sp.Def Mega Latias in sun with doubles spread damage: 147-173 (94.8 - 111.6%) -- guaranteed KO after Torkoal's Lava Plume damage


    Typhlosion is the only pokémon that can get this kind of power because of the combination of Flash Fire and Eruption. Heatran gets that too but Eruption Heatran is banned on the battle spot and is very difficult to find legit nowadays. If I get the Weakness Policy setup off it just destroys even pokémon that resist fire in a single hit like Mega Salamence and Incineroar. Even Mega Latias crumbles, and Mega Latias has a base 150 Sp.Def stat. With After You support from Lilligant it's absolutely devastating and almost impossible to revenge kill and I win most battles with it. Recognise that the Z-Move OHKOs Dragonite, which has effectively a 4x resistance thanks to Multiscale, and realise that a lot of pokémon around those defensive ranges get OHKOd through Protect on neutral hits with it. I've had so much fun with it. It doesn't win every battle of course, there are ways of stopping it and you shouldn't go into the free battle spot where Primal Kyogre just wrecks you, but it's pretty solid and not a lot of people run Typhlosion. It is somewhat gimmicky, it's far from the meta, but the power you get after a single turn of setup is terrifying.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2018
  3. jr0904

    jr0904 Beginning Trainer

    unfortunately all of the johto starters are more or less in the NU category. if there were any starters that needed a mega evo, its those three. it more or less proves that their the least popular starters in the entire franchise. otherwise they would have already gotten a mega already.
     
  4. Lucario At Service

    Lucario At Service Calm Trainer

    Typhlosion, stat/move-wise is the 2nd weakest of the Johto Starters (Meganium is the weakest for me). And may possibly be the weakest Fire type Starter yet.

    While it has better and respectable stats (atleast Sp.ATK and SPD) when compared to Meganium, sadly its move-pool is the worst of the three (when looking at options available). Thus decreasing its utility by a lot.

    It has a good selections of Physical moves, but with a Base ATK stat of 84 (especially when compared to its Sp.ATK of 109), leaves a lot to be desired.
    Not to mention the lack of good ATK (or Sp.ATK) boosting moves as well (unless i think someone tries to transfer one with 'Curse' from the Gen 2 games, which i doubt anyone would).

    On the Special side, aside from STAB Fire type moves, the other coverage options it gets are 'Extrasensory', 'Focus Blast' and 'Solar Beam', thats all.
     
  5. Mestorn

    Mestorn Wandering Battler

    Ah Typhlosion. While the 2nd Gen starters may be in contest for the 5th Gen starters for the worst starters ever (try using Serperior without Contrary :p) Typhlosion has one claim to fame: Eruption. As the strongest user of Eruption in the game (barring Mega Camerupt and Primal Groudon), plus a respectable base 100 speed stat (making it faster than the aforementioned two), when Typhlosion hits the field in good health, everything is going to get flash fried. However that is where the good news ends. Typhlosion otherwise feels like a poor man's Charizard, having the same base stats, but losing out on that amazing Fire Flying typing and the love Charizard has gotten over the years.

    Ring of Fire
    Typhlosion
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Item: Choice Scarf
    -Eruption
    -Lave Plume/Fire Blast/Burn Out
    -Focus Blast/Extrasensory
    -Solarbeam/Focus Blast/Extrasensory
    Nature: Modest (+SATK, -ATK)
    EVs: 4 HP/252 SATK/252 SPD

    Revenge killer Typhlosion. Get a free switch in, (preferably under sun) come in and pull an Ark of the Covenant on your foolish opponent. Switch out, rinse and repeat. Eruption is Typhlosion's claim to fame and does stupid damage (equivalent of Blast Burn when Typhlosion is at full health). A secondary fire STAB is necessary when Typhlosion get's worn down. Lava Plume is a great standby in doubles and the burn chance keeps Typhlosion alive longer. Fire Blast has shaky Accuracy, but is reliable otherwise. Burn Out has the same base power as Overheat, but strips away Typhlosion's STAB instead of it's SATK. Focus Blast and Extrasensory are decent coverage options for Rock types, Tentacruel and Toxapex. Solarbeam is fantastic considering how Typhlosion likes to bait in Water and Rock types, but you NEED sun support to pull it off.

    Other Options
    Firnium Z-is boosted off of Eruption's already incredible base power without any reductions, so a great nuke when Typhlosion has been whacked around.
    Grassnium Z-most Fire types get this as an option because Solarbeam powered Bloom Doom is a great way to remove one of your checks.
    Sunny Day -Typhlosion loves the sun. 'Nuff said.
     
  6. dementeddurian

    dementeddurian Well-Known Member

    In Singles, it's near impossible to get Typholsion to get a Flash Fire boost, but one idea I had was to first bring out a Wormadam-Trash Cloak with Anticipation to bait Fire moves. Since Wormadam-Trash Cloak is only weak to Fire, it will notify you (and your opponent) of their Fire attack. The idea is they'll be stupid enough to use a Fire attack. It's then you switch to Typhlosion (maybe with a Choice Scarf) and proceed to sweep. And I know it's not ideal, but I couldn't find a better strategy for Eruption in Singles.
     
  7. GeeGee

    GeeGee Late to the party

    Pros:
    +Exact same base stats as charizard gives it a decent 84/109/100 offenses, making it a prime user of choice scarf or choice specs
    +mono fire typing gives it good defensive typing leaving only 3 weaknesses and 6 resistances
    +offensive movepool includes Eruption, focus blast, extrasensory and solarbeam
    +flash fire makes it a good check to fire types, especially if they are locked into a choice item

    Cons:
    -Typhlosion lacks the movepool to get past anything that resists its fire type moves, bar hidden power coverage
    -78/78/85 defenses coupled with a weakness to stealth rocks makes it very frail
    -good physical coverage but poor 84 attack prevents typhlosion from making use of it
    -100 speed is pretty middle of the road for speed tiers, leaving it outsped by a lot of threats

    Abilities:
    Blaze: Typhlosion's fire type moves get a 50% power boost when its health is below 33% of its max. This is a serious boost to power, and is especially useful that typhlosion generally only spams fire type moves. However, this leaves typhlosion vulnerable to being revenge killed and outsped by faster opponents, making it a high-risk, high-reward type of ability.
    Flash Fire: Grants immunity to fire type attacks, and also boosts the power of typhlosions fire type moves by 50% when it takes a fire type attack. This ability allows typhlosion to switch into any fire type move, and completely check choice item fire types like delphox and opposing typhlosion, should they lock themselves into a fire type move.

    Sets:

    Choice Specs
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Item: Choice Specs
    Ev's: 4 Def/ 252 Spa/ 252 Spe
    Moves:
    -Eruption
    -Focus Blast
    -Hidden Power Grass/Hidden Power Ice
    -Fire Blast

    Typhlosion's eruption hits like a bus when boosted by choice specs, and is the main reason to use typhlosion over other fire types like delphox or houndoom. Focus blast hits dark types like Houndoom and Guzzlord, as well as rock types like Omastar and rhydon. Hidden power grass is mainly used for water types like Jellicent and Vaporeon that otherwise wall Typhlosion, as well as hitting the beforementioned rock types. Hidden power Ice can be used to hit dragon types, but leaves Typhlosion with no options to handle water types. Fire blast is the second fire type that should be used when Typhlosion is low on health, and thus eruption will be dealing less damage.

    Other options:
    Extrasensory hits fighting and posion types, but unless they resist Eruption and are weak to psychic type attacks, Stab Eruption is still likely to hit harder.
    Grassium-Z and Solarbeam can be used to nuke water types, but its a one-time use trick that can be hard to utilize correctly.
     
  8. BillyBobJoe

    BillyBobJoe Active Member

    Surprise STAB:
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Item: Charcoal/Life Orb
    -Flamethrower/Eruption
    -Burn Up
    -Solarbeam/Focus Blast
    -Focus Blast/Extrasensory
    EVs: 4 HP/252 SpAtk/252 Spd
    Modest Nature

    The charcoal is meant to “replace” the lack of STAB due to Burn Up. Flash Fire would effectively give you one STAB attack. This really only works in doubles though. The last two moves are for coverage.
     
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