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Community POTW #080

Discussion in 'POTW Collaboration' started by Serebii, May 27, 2018.

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  1. Serebii

    Serebii And, as if by magic, the webmaster appeared... Staff Member Admin

    Missingno. Master likes this.
  2. Local Maple

    Local Maple Member

    Ah, Quagsire. One of the big tanks. Back when Talonflame’s Gale Wings wasn’t nerfed and everybody ran some form of Fire like Arcanine, Grass Pokemon feared competitive usage. It was there that Quagsire shined as a tank.
    While Gen7 hasn’t seen as many Fire types, and Gale Wings is no longer viable, we do see a lot of Tapu Koko and Belly Drum Snorlax, and Swords Dance is not uncommon on such Pokémon like Garchomp or Mimikyu. While Gastrodon, Swampert, and Quagsire are immune to Koko’s Electricity, Quagsire edges out by ignoring Snorlax’s +6 and Swords Dance by using Unaware.

    Derp Tank
    Ability: Unaware
    EVs: Either max HP mixed defenses, or max out both Defenses.
    Item: Leftovers, Pinch Berry, or Normalium-Z
    Nature: +Def, -Atk or -Spd.
    (Z-)Stockpile
    Toxic/Sludge Bomb
    Scald
    Rest/Recover

    With Unaware, you can ignore any (Sp.) Attack or Sp.Def boosts on your opponent.
    Z-Stockpile, whether or not you already have all 3 up, fully restores your HP, and cannot be Knock Off’d, Trick’d, Taunted, etc. However, Leftovers and the Gen7-boosted Pinch berries are also an option. When using the EVs, higher HP means more rewards from Leftovers and the Pinch Berry, while higher Defenses means better Stockpiles for Leftovers or Normalium-Z.
    Since this is a tanky set, you need a way to both wall and stall opponents. Scald is STAB that can induce a Burn, Toxic applies Toxic, and Sludge Bomb is for those who want to deal damage while poisoning or during Taunt.
    After Z-Stockpile is used up, Rest is your recovery of choice. With Unaware and Stockpile, potentially the Burn or Poison too, it becomes easier to last the 3 turns before waking up. If, however, you don’t fear getting Toxic’d yourself, Recover is another option for faster healing that doesn’t give opponents free switches; just remember you won’t be able to stall out Burn and Toxic damage as effectively.

    Another move that might work on this set is Stomping Tantrum. Since this is a stalling set, waiting for doubled damage is acceptable. I’m 90% sure the doubled damage occurs off of Stockpile if you have all 3, Toxic should it not affect the target for any reason, Sludge Bomb against Steel types, Scald against Storm Drain (don’t recommend against Water Absorb), Rest in Misty/Electric Terrain, Recover if you miscall at full HP, and off of a faster Taunt if you try a non-damaging move. If I were to run it, I’d add a Toxic Spikes user to the team and replace Toxic/Sludge Bomb.
    Finally, Infestation is another interesting move to consider on this set. If the opponent is Poisoned by Toxic Spikes or Burned, lock the opponent in for extra end-of-turn damage.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2018
  3. Local Maple

    Local Maple Member

    I’m curious as to why there is no Pre-Evolution corner for Honchrow’s PotW. With Prankster, it has viability both inside Little Cup and in regular competitive play as a Support Pokémon.
    Sure, my first set might be too gimmicky; I know several Smogon players (with their notions of what is both viable and acceptable) who absolutely loathed it. But the second set as a supportive tank, why wasn’t that considered?
     
  4. XaelOstigian

    XaelOstigian Competitive...kinda

    Ah, Quagsire. The original Water type that did not fear Electric types but was owned by anything slightly grassy:
    [​IMG]
    All jokes aside, Quagsire is a solid defensive choice on most teams not just thanks to its defensive typing, but also because of its wide movepool and an ability that ignores stat boosts preventing your opposition from setting-up and getting the momentum to steamroll your team. There are a few sets you can run with this derpy giant Japanese salamander:

    The Moe-Blob (Boosting Tank)
    Ability: Unaware
    Item: Leftovers
    Nature: Careful (+Sp.Def -Sp.Attack)
    EV's: HP: 252 Def: 4 Sp.Def: 252
    [​IMG]
    Movepool:
    Earthquake
    Waterfall
    Curse
    Recover

    While Unaware prevents your opponent from drawing upon their stat boosts, you are still perfectly able to benefit from setting up your own. Curse sacrifices your negligible speed for a welcome attack and defense boost which will enable you to dish out and take physical attacks better. Earthquake and Waterfall have good neutral coverage against most threats minus Grass types of course, but you wouldn't want to stay in against so much as a Sunkern anyways and frankly you should make sure your Grass threats are taken care of before attempting a boost. Finally Recover keeps Quagsire healthy while sponging various attacks and chipping away at your opponents. EV distribution is pretty self-explanatory with all values invested into HP and special defense since Curse already provides a defense boost and you'll want your Quagsire to be able to take special attacks the best it can (Just stay away from opposing Energy Balls)

    The Quag-"Sire"
    Ability: Unaware
    Item: Leftovers
    Nature: Impish (+Def. -Sp.Attack)
    EV's: HP: 252 Def: 156 Sp.Def: 100 (I like balance)
    [​IMG]
    Movepool:
    Earthquake
    Scald
    Toxic
    Recover

    A gentleman needs not get his hands dirty if it at all can be helped. Best to just sit back, enjoy a cup of earl grey, and let the status effects do the work you hire them to do. Just a quick dash a Toxic and you need only buy your time for your goose-egg investment to pay off and take the opponent down for you. If your health gets into quite a sticky-wicket, one needs only to dip into one's resources and Recover one's health until your competition wears its own resources down to wee bits. Even should Poison and Steel types bar these Toxic practices, a true gentleman still knows how to do fisticuffs to defend one's self, and Earthquake punishes the rebellious Poison types and and impoverished Steels types with extreme pride and prejudice. Should you face an opponent that exceeds you in physical prowess, worry not my fine chap because the very earl grey you enjoy at your leisure is also your best weapon to handle such uncouth brutes, for the Scald of your hot tea serves as your best defensive in times of crisis creating a dearth of physical damage on their part and an alternative means of bleeding their health dry. A gentleman must also not make waste in his gluttony, so be sure to consume all of your Leftovers to respect the chef and maintain one's health. While calm and respectful, a gentleman must also be Impish at times to hold one's ground against the physically attacking rable even if it means sacrificing your special offenses in the process. Now that you are all adequately educated and privy to the ways of the gentleman, I must make haste to the aqua-turf gala held by my good friend the Wail-"Lord". I bid thee a kind farewell.
    [​IMG]

    Other Options

    Water Absorb: Because Unaware is the preferred ability and is not immediately seen, many opponents won't even bother using stat-up moves allowing you to bluff having the ability pretty easily. The only way your opponent will find out is if they use their powerful STAB Water attacks only to see Quagsire's health increase instead of drop. Granted the added immunity isn't worth the stat boost ignorance.

    Haze: While Unaware keeps opponents from capitalizing on their stat boosts, it does nothing to stop them from accruing them, and once Quagsire has swapped out or been knocked out those boosts will immediately matter again, so Haze is an option to ensure your opponent won't try anything and runs well if you really want your Quagsire to have Water Absorb instead.

    Amnesia: This can be run alongside the Moe-Blob Curse set dropping either Earthquake or Waterfall to make Quagsire incredibly difficult to take down but your offensive options will be limited as you will be walled by Flying types or Levitators (Earthquake) or by Pokemon with the Water Absorb, Storm Drain, or Dry Skin abilities (Waterfall).

    Stockpile: Another defense boosting move that jacks up both defense at the cost of capping the boosts at 3. Generally not the best choice as Quagsire has a difficult time fitting this onto most of its sets, and honestly Curse and Amnesia bring more to the table.

    Acid Spray: A bit of a gimmick that can be run with a special set. Weaken their special defenses and your opponent will have to choose to either stay in and face the increasingly powerful special attacks, or switch out allowing Quagsire to use Toxic to badly poison their entire team

    Ice Punch: A nasty surprise for the Dragon/Flying types that don't really fear either of Quagsire's STAB's but has a hard time fitting into the offensive movepool.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2018
  5. Mestorn

    Mestorn Wandering Battler

    Quagsire is a fantastic tank that despite having inconsistent tiering through the years, has found viability at nearly every level of play thanks to Unaware. That being said, even this loveable lump has its problems.

    -Grass Moves. No way around this, a 4x weakness is an Achillies heel for any pokémon, Quagsire included. 4 Curses/2 Amnesias is needed to reduce most grass attacks down to a manageable level. If you suspect a Grass move, switch out or sack your tank.
    -Strong Raw Power. Quagsire is a bane to setup sweepers. That means Choice sweepers, or pokémon that are just plain strong from the get go can punch through Quagsire's defenses. Especially its uninvested defense considering that it does not have the base stats to invest in both that well. Examples include Gengar, Mega Medicham, Latios, Hoopa Unbound (OU), Chandelure (sans Energy Ball), Heracross, Nidoking (UU), Nidoqueen, Machamp, Hoopa (RU)
    -Mold Breaker -Mega Gyarados and Haxorus are two setup sweepers that possess Mold Breaker, allowing them to setup and Quagsire's face and go for the sweep, with Quagsire struggling to damage Mega Gyarados. However, neither like a Scald burn and Haxorus is 3HKOd by an uninvested Earthquake.
    -Toxic -The bane of all tanks, and since Quagsire has access to recover, you will never see it with Rest.
     
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