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Community POTW #082

Discussion in 'POTW Collaboration' started by Serebii, Jun 10, 2018.

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  1. Serebii

    Serebii And, as if by magic, the webmaster appeared... Staff Member Admin

  2. TheIceCream

    TheIceCream User of Ultra Beasts

    So, the Guardian Deities have been ruling the Gen 7 Metagame with their Terrain Abilities. Arguably the best Tapu in the Metagame - Tapu Fini, has many tricks up its sleeve. For example, with Misty Terrain, it can't be affected by any Status Conditions and by being Water/Fairy, it has plenty of good resistances. Seriously, just use it, it's great!

    + Misty Terrain basically makes it so that you can't be affected by any Status Conditions, this is even better in doubles with an ally that not only is immune to Status but also takes less from Dragon-Type moves (Not like Tapu Fini cares that much about Dragons anyway)
    + Water/Fairy gives it good resistances to Fire, Water, Ice, Bug, Dark and Fighting whilst having an immunity to Dragon
    + Its Stats are pretty solid too. 70/115/130 bulk means that this thing can take a lot of hits and has 95 Sp Attack which is rather solid
    + Good Movepool too! Having moves such as Moonblast, Muddy Water, Calm Mind etc.; it can really perform well at its job
    + It's not No.3 on the Global Link for nothing!


    - It has no form of reliable recovery - it doesn't even learn Rest! (With Misty Terrain, it wouldn't be able to use it anyway though)
    - 85 Speed is OK, but it could've been a bit better
    - 95 Sp Attack is certainly great but again, just a little bit more would've been nice
    - It has 3 weaknesses to Electric, Grass and Poison. This thing can run into problems.
    - Might want to be careful of Bulky Pokemon, which T Fini has trouble breaking pass sometimes.

    Misty Surge: This is what gives Tapu Fini its usage. Being able to create Misty Terrain and keep it safe from all Status, it is something that many Pokemon dream of getting.
    Telepathy: Similar to the rest of the Tapus, it has Telepathy as its Hidden Ability that it can't even get. Does it really matter? Not Really. Always stick to Misty Surge, even when this is released (If Ever).

    Counters: Ferrothorn works as a great counter. Being able to take any of Tapu Fini's attacks and OHKOing with Power Whip makes it an ideal counter. Tapu Bulu works similarly as well. Tapu Koko can set up his own Terrain and OHKO with some electric-type moves; Electrics or Grasses, they're your best friends against this thing.
  3. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Nighttime Guardian

    Supportive Fini:

    Tapu Fini @ Icium Z
    Calm nature
    252 HP, 252 Def, 4 Sp.Def
    -Heal Pulse
    -Muddy Water / Moonblast
    -Muddy Water / Moonblast / Swagger / Icy Wind

    You can replace one of the offensive moves with Swagger if you want to boost physical attacking buddies that are grounded (for instance Tyranitar, Garchomp, or Incineroar), with Misty Terrain blocking the confusion, although Swagger is still fairly unreliable with its 85% accuracy. Heal Pulse heals your partner, Mist is an interesting option that blocks any kind of stat lowering the opponent might try, mostly Intimidate, but also Icy Wind, Electroweb, Snarl, Struggle Bug, Bulldoze, and others. With Intimidate being very popular nowadays in doubles and a lot of teams having double Intimidate, it can be a useful trick to block all that for five turns. Z-Mist gives you semi-reliable recovery once, fully healing Tapu Fini's health when used. A Bold nature with 252 HP, 132 Def, 124 Sp.Def can also be used, it results in the same stats for the same EV investment. You can move the investment around a bit to become more physically or specially defensive, the given one gives you 166 defence and 165 special defence for a good balance.
  4. Locormus

    Locormus Can we please get the old forum back?

    Honestly not a single part of me is willing to bother "contributing" to these any more. Last weeks entry had three responses and guess how many of those were eventually used in the actual article? None. Yeah, Anorith got mentioned for a Little Cup segment, but Murkrow didn't while it arguably is one of the best users of Eviolite.

    I get it when there's a ton of responses that one or two don't get used. But when there are only two for the main pokemon and the input is completely ignored.. then what's the point.

  5. generic villager #5

    generic villager #5 Your ad here!

    All right, let's talk threats, because as common as this thing is, you'll want to be ready for it.

    TheIceCream nailed down one of Tapu Fini's best counters, Ferrothorn. With the same typing, Kartana is also a solid threat; and like Ferrothorn, it can easily take advantage of a switch out, either by setting up a SD or clearing hazards with Defog. Kartana also has the benefit of being faster than Tapu Fini, so unlike Ferrothorn it doesn't have as much to fear from Taunt. Generally speaking, any offensive Grass or Electric type will probably have little trouble with Tapu Fini as long as hey avoid a Scald burn and either OHKO or can just afford to eat a Nature's Madness. Examples include Serperior, Tapu Bulu, Tapu Koko, Thundurus (T), Magnezone, and Mega Manectric. Defensively oriented Grass-types, like Mega Venusaur and Amoonguss, tend to enjoy switching into Tapu Fini, scoring a KO with Giga Drain and healing at the same time. But always remember: Tapu Fini always has the ability to strip you of half your HP. Finally, for generally just annoying Tapu Fini: removing its Leftovers removes its only form of recovery; changing the terrain and hitting it with status; using an Assault Vest (epecially if its Celesteela or Amoonguss); and chip damage, since Tapu Fini has so little recovery.
  6. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Nighttime Guardian

    Tapu Fini usually can't Scald burn stuff due to Misty Terrain. It's part of the reason why it's not all that good of a move on Tapu Fini, I generally prefer Muddy Water in doubles just to get accuracy drops and spread damage, or Hydro Pump for single-target damage. In singles Surf is just superior in almost every way. Theoretically you can still burn some non-grounded threats, but most of those are better hit by Ice Beam (see Landorus, Salamence, etc) rather than gamble on a 30% chance to burn.
  7. Archstaraptor

    Archstaraptor Team Builder / RMT

    Surf isn' t really all that superior. Higher damage sure, but the power drop for scald isn't detrimental for Tapu Fini: it can afford to take hits, whilst the burn chance is always useful. On the flipside, the additional damage from surf doesn't put mons under pressure like the burn status does, moreso for physical attackers.

    It's Fini's defensive nature that often requires it to sit on the field for a while, potentially as a calm mind sweeper. You also have flying types as you mentioned, and whilst ice beam would hit Landorus harder it's not necessarily a move that can just fit on a set, and arguably overkill.

    Additionally, terrains can expire or be replaced. If not in for the full duration of misty terrain fini will be switching in and out, at which point it could expire whilst on the field. Alternatively other Tapus could be switching in, wiping away misty terrain. And whilst they matchup favourably to fini, bulu is naturally outsped by fini and does not appreciate a burn at all.

    In a nutshell all terrains have been popular in standard games this generation, and for this reason scald still sees some use. Surf's power increase doesn't help fini as much as a potential burn in certain situations.
  8. ampfire101

    ampfire101 Well-Known Member

    Tapu Fini was a good Pokemon in VGC last year, and it's still great this year! Haze Fini is one of the best ways to neuter teams with setup Pokemon, like Dragon Dance Megas and Belly Drum Snorlax. When you know you need to add a water type on a VGC 18 team, usually the first water type you'll think of is Tapu Fini. It's also arguably the best fairy type to handle Kommo-o since it can guarantee an OHKO against it even after it's boosted, halves the damage your grounded mons take from its signature Z move and Clanging Scales with Misty Surge, and support variants can even use Haze to stop it. Tapu Fini usually plays one of 2 roles: either a bulky Calm Mind/Choice Specs attacker or bulky support. Calm Mind Fini usually runs Protect, Calm Mind, Muddy Water, and Moonblast with a pinch berry (or rarely, a Z move, but Fairium Z Calm Mind Fini did win top 8 at Japan Nationals), Choice Specs will usually run 4 moves from Muddy Water, Scald, Hydro Pump, Moonblast, Dazzling Gleam, Haze (keep in mind you have to switch f using this on the choice set), and rarely, Ice Beam. Finally, the Support Fini will run Muddy Water/Scald, Moonblast, Protect, and Haze/Icy Wind/Light Screen/Reflect. The support Tapu Fini has the most versatile item slot because, depending on the rest of your team, you can run a pinch berry, Waterium Z, or Fairium Z. However, while Tapu Fini is great against Kommo-o, most Kommo-o usually run Mega Gengar and Choice Scarf Tapu Bulu, so one must be mindful of that. Tapu Fini also loses a lot of bulk by getting its pinch berry knocked off, which can be a problem because it's now available as a tutor move in USUM. It's also a rather passive pokemon, not threatening much neutral damage as soon as it's sent out without choice specs as the hold item. That being said, here are two sets from Trainer Tower:

    Calm Mind:
    Tapu Fini @ Wiki Berry
    Ability: Misty Surge
    Level: 50
    EVs: 212 HP / 108 Def / 124 SpA / 36 SpD / 28 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    – Moonblast
    – Muddy Water
    – Calm Mind
    – Protect

    • +1 124+ SpA Tapu Fini Muddy Water vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 92-110 (52.2 – 62.5%) — guaranteed 2HKO
    • 252 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 212 HP / 36 SpD Tapu Fini: 146-174 (84.8 – 101.1%) — 6.3% chance to OHKO
    • 252+ Atk Landorus-T Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 212 HP / 108 Def Tapu Fini: 147-174 (85.4 – 101.1%) — 6.3% chance to OHKO
    Choice Specs:
    Tapu Fini @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Misty Surge
    Level: 50
    EVs: 236 HP / 92 Def / 132 SpA / 20 SpD / 28 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    – Scald/Hydro Pump
    – Moonblast
    – Muddy Water
    – Dazzing Gleam/Ice Beam/Icy Wind/Haze

    • 132+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Fini Muddy Water vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 92-110 (52.2 – 62.5%) — guaranteed 2HKO
    • 132+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Fini Ice Beam vs. 140 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Landorus-T: 196-232 (107.6 – 127.4%) — guaranteed OHKO
    • 252 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 236 HP / 20 SpD Tapu Fini: 150-176 (85.7 – 100.5%) — 6.3% chance to OHKO
    • 252+ Atk Landorus-T Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 236 HP / 92 Def Tapu Fini: 150-177 (85.7 – 101.1%) — 6.3% chance to OHKO
    • 252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 236 HP / 20 SpD Tapu Fini: 133-156 (76 – 89.1%) — guaranteed 2HKO
  9. XaelOstigian

    XaelOstigian Competitive...kinda

    Hypothetically you could make a gimmick set that pairs Brine with Nature's Madness. Provided you have entry hazards, you use Nature's Madness to drop your opponent's health down to less than half, and then use a double-powered Brine to finish your targets.
  10. Sceptile Leaf Blade

    Sceptile Leaf Blade Nighttime Guardian

    It's indeed a hypothetical gimmick. Double-powered Brine has base power 130 and Hydro Pump has base power 110. You'd need two slots for Brine + Nature's Madness, and then it's advantageous if you are up against a threat that Hydro Pump can't 2KO but double-powered Brine would 2KO, which is a small damage range, and even then it only works either if you have hazards up (ironically conflicting a bit with Tapu Fini's Defog role which removes hazards) or if the opponent has an even number of hitpoints as Nature's Madness damage rounds down. It also falls flat if the opponent runs Sitrus Berry or Leftovers.

    Edit: Btw, kind of strange that in the article Tapu Fini doesn't have a doubles section at all while it's the most popular Tapu in high ranking Battle Spot Doubles and VGC, third place overall behind Incineroar and Landorus-Therian, ahead of Tapu Lele, Tapu Koko, and Mega Metagross. It's a bit in sentiment to an earlier post in this thread. It seems like all you're focusing in this article on is Showdown singles (for example mentioning Zygarde several times which is normally banned). And if a fanmade showdown format is all you're focusing on, what do you have to set yourself apart from the descriptions on Smogon?
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2018
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