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Community POTW #109
- Thread starter Serebii
- Start date
- Status
unknownunown
???
Sun (Special)
-Flamethrower/Heat Wave
-Solarbeam
-Air Slash
-Sunny Day/Roost/Dragon Pulse
Blaze/Solar Power
Heat Rock (with Sunny Day)/Choice Scarf or Specs(with Dragon Pulse)/Shell Bell or Leftovers
Timid or Modest
252 Spd 252 Sp. Atk. 4 HP
Use in a Sun team. Solarbeam covers all but Electric, among weaknesses. Flamethrower/Heat Wave and Air Slash for STAB. Roost heals if you run Solar Power, but Shell Bell and Leftovers can heal too. Dragon Pulse for Dragons, as they can take Solarbeam and Flamethrower, and maybe Air Slash.
-Flamethrower/Heat Wave
-Solarbeam
-Air Slash
-Sunny Day/Roost/Dragon Pulse
Blaze/Solar Power
Heat Rock (with Sunny Day)/Choice Scarf or Specs(with Dragon Pulse)/Shell Bell or Leftovers
Timid or Modest
252 Spd 252 Sp. Atk. 4 HP
Use in a Sun team. Solarbeam covers all but Electric, among weaknesses. Flamethrower/Heat Wave and Air Slash for STAB. Roost heals if you run Solar Power, but Shell Bell and Leftovers can heal too. Dragon Pulse for Dragons, as they can take Solarbeam and Flamethrower, and maybe Air Slash.
Dragalge
"Orange" Magical Girl
Charizard, one of those overused fire breathing dragon creatures. Since Gen 4, Charizard hard time switching in nowadays due to Stealth Rock. That doesn't mean it's useless, Solar Power makes it a force to reckon with.
Counters: Good luck switching into this guy as its nearly impossibru. So revenge killing is the best way to handle the beast. Stone Edge and Rock Slide kill him with ease. Make sure to have rocks up as well.
Counters: Good luck switching into this guy as its nearly impossibru. So revenge killing is the best way to handle the beast. Stone Edge and Rock Slide kill him with ease. Make sure to have rocks up as well.
Rayofquazar
Well-Known Member
From the way I see pokemon, I divide them into two categories: Kanto pokemon and non kanto pokemon! The favorites are Kanto pokemon! I don't care, call me nostalgic but for me generation 1 is what started everything about pokemon and my passion to pokemon. Every new generation that come, brings new pokemon, new moves that just keep improving the game, but for me Kanto was the base... it's like the foundations to the empire state. (lol)
Kanto provided the best starters of all generations (of course), Bulbasaur is my favorite starter, Wartortle my favorite middle form and of course Charizard my favorite fully evolved starter of all time!
Of course being my favorite does not necessarily means best pokemon ever as charizard is the frailest fire type starter there is especially when stealth rocks are on the field. Once the rocks were introduced, Charizard dropped tiers severely and the abundance of pokemon using this particular move in every tier made it even harder for it to function well! Charizard does have a decent Sp att and speed which means that if given the chance, it can be pretty effective. 5th generation introduced DW abilities and all starters were glad that they finally got rid of their not so useful sole ability. DW abilities drove blaziken straight to ubers and transformed venusaur into a deadly sweeper in OU. Charizard on the other hand recieved a double edged sword in the form of solar power.
Solar power boosts Charizard's Sp ATT in the sun while chipping off some residual damage. In sun, this ability skyrockets charizard fire type moves into very high levels as also sun boosts the fire type attacks power. As deadly as that may sound, Charizard still has it's major flaw. Stealth rocks are charizard's worst nightmare. One that won't end anytime soon.
On other hand, stealth rocks, and other hazards has become easier to manage. Magic bounce xatu and espeon are so ever popular and make an ideal partner to charizard as they can also set up dual screens to protect it further more.
Charizard has access to a decent movepool that makes it somewhat unpredictable. It's stats enables it to use physical attacks as well with it's access to dragon dance and belly drum. Charizard is a perfect pokemon to equip with choice specs to makes deadly in every blow under the sun. Choice scarf is also viable if you think that charizard has enough special attack!
Charizard is a tough pokemon to handle, but when handled right it will not disappoint... Support it well and play it smartly and you will be rewarded... Throw it here and there carelessly and it will be a dead weight. Don't use charizard if you can't handle it's heat!
Kanto provided the best starters of all generations (of course), Bulbasaur is my favorite starter, Wartortle my favorite middle form and of course Charizard my favorite fully evolved starter of all time!
Of course being my favorite does not necessarily means best pokemon ever as charizard is the frailest fire type starter there is especially when stealth rocks are on the field. Once the rocks were introduced, Charizard dropped tiers severely and the abundance of pokemon using this particular move in every tier made it even harder for it to function well! Charizard does have a decent Sp att and speed which means that if given the chance, it can be pretty effective. 5th generation introduced DW abilities and all starters were glad that they finally got rid of their not so useful sole ability. DW abilities drove blaziken straight to ubers and transformed venusaur into a deadly sweeper in OU. Charizard on the other hand recieved a double edged sword in the form of solar power.
Solar power boosts Charizard's Sp ATT in the sun while chipping off some residual damage. In sun, this ability skyrockets charizard fire type moves into very high levels as also sun boosts the fire type attacks power. As deadly as that may sound, Charizard still has it's major flaw. Stealth rocks are charizard's worst nightmare. One that won't end anytime soon.
On other hand, stealth rocks, and other hazards has become easier to manage. Magic bounce xatu and espeon are so ever popular and make an ideal partner to charizard as they can also set up dual screens to protect it further more.
Charizard has access to a decent movepool that makes it somewhat unpredictable. It's stats enables it to use physical attacks as well with it's access to dragon dance and belly drum. Charizard is a perfect pokemon to equip with choice specs to makes deadly in every blow under the sun. Choice scarf is also viable if you think that charizard has enough special attack!
Charizard is a tough pokemon to handle, but when handled right it will not disappoint... Support it well and play it smartly and you will be rewarded... Throw it here and there carelessly and it will be a dead weight. Don't use charizard if you can't handle it's heat!
Zachmac
Well-Known Member
Ironically, one of Charizard's best teammates in OU is actually the least popular Kanto starter, Bulbasaur. They both function best under the sunlight, and Venusaur can help remove bulky water types early in the game to help clear the way for a choice scarf, solar power Fire Blast. Exeggutor and Sawsbuck can do this as well.
Getting rid of Heatran is also extremely important, so Dugtrio could be an option. It would also help fight the weather war to make sure Solar Power is ready.
Ninetales is a must in OU. SubstituteBellyZard faces too much competition with Darmanitan now in days. The only thing it's really got over the ape is just a little bit of speed, but it has much less power. So, really, you're best just going for Solar Power if you're going to use it in the tier at all.
And, obviously, the dragon's health is going to be lowered quite a bit by solar power and stealth rocks, so folks like Forretress and Donphan can be very helpful. Though if the writers of the POTW are any good(which I'll bet you guys are), that should really go without saying.
Getting rid of Heatran is also extremely important, so Dugtrio could be an option. It would also help fight the weather war to make sure Solar Power is ready.
Ninetales is a must in OU. SubstituteBellyZard faces too much competition with Darmanitan now in days. The only thing it's really got over the ape is just a little bit of speed, but it has much less power. So, really, you're best just going for Solar Power if you're going to use it in the tier at all.
And, obviously, the dragon's health is going to be lowered quite a bit by solar power and stealth rocks, so folks like Forretress and Donphan can be very helpful. Though if the writers of the POTW are any good(which I'll bet you guys are), that should really go without saying.
Didn't comment for a while oh well.. LoL is too addictive but maybe I will be back
I wouldn't call everyone who uses charizard in OU a noob.. solar power have terrifing power if used right it can bea a huge late game cleanerjust feed him(LoL term..) just weaken the team a bit beat some counters and you get a sweep with choice scarf in the sun. (beat politoed mainly).
I am not updated with the last 3 months metagame but I guess it's the same since gen 6 is close.
My opinion: charizard is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY overrated but, also kinda underrated in OU since it can be powerful with ninetales (but actually most people prefer volcarona for better type and stats)
The problem is that even in the sun, it's easily revenge-killed by many common Pokémon in OU, and you don't only have to give it the Sun (because it lacks the bulk to set it up), it also needs Rapid Spin support, and even if it has them, it's still not hard to counter. While 100 Speed is good, many OU common Pokémon outspeed it (Lati@s, Starmie, Terrakion, Thundurus-T, Landorus, Starmie, Garchomp, Keldeo...) and most Choice Scarf users do too, and this, coupled with the damage that Solar Power causes, makes it unreliable. Apart from that, Weather changers are common in OU, so before sending Charizard, Politoed, Hippowdon, and Tyranitar (which counters it easily), must have been removed.
All in all, to use Charizard in a OU team, it needs too much support, and even if it gets it, it may not work, it can be useless.
Zachmac
Well-Known Member
But, as a fan favorite, a lot of people won't care and will want to use it in OU anyway.
In fact, I've been thinking about making in OU team around it just for the heck of it anyway. But, I suppose I want to make a lot of gimmicky teams.
In the past, when I have battled Charizard under the use of my friends, no ev training whatsoever of either his or my pokemon. I was able to beat his lv. 100 Charizard with my lv. 79 Golem with just one rock blast every single time. Sure, it might help if he would've taught it earthquake for once (he wasn't that smart), but still. I've always regarded Charizard as a weakling after that.
However, that was before I took a better look at him.
Sure, this fire dragon is really, really... really weak to rocks. But, can't it learn Solarbeam? That practically takes care of the rock and water type weaknesses right there (unless, of course, you are a poor soul who gets stuck facing Politoad or Kyogre... for some reason). For its elecric weakness, it can power throughalmost anything with its massive fire attacks. Give it a sun boost, and that high special attack gets even more deadly.
And, now that he has a new ability, named Solar Power, his already impressive offensive power grows even more, at the cost of a little Hp every turn. All of this combines into one distructive force that has a good probability of sweeping a team right off its feet.
I cannot post a set because I have never used a Charizard. If anyone is thinking about a good pokemon for a sun team I would highly suggest him... and Victini...
However, that was before I took a better look at him.
Sure, this fire dragon is really, really... really weak to rocks. But, can't it learn Solarbeam? That practically takes care of the rock and water type weaknesses right there (unless, of course, you are a poor soul who gets stuck facing Politoad or Kyogre... for some reason). For its elecric weakness, it can power throughalmost anything with its massive fire attacks. Give it a sun boost, and that high special attack gets even more deadly.
And, now that he has a new ability, named Solar Power, his already impressive offensive power grows even more, at the cost of a little Hp every turn. All of this combines into one distructive force that has a good probability of sweeping a team right off its feet.
I cannot post a set because I have never used a Charizard. If anyone is thinking about a good pokemon for a sun team I would highly suggest him... and Victini...
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Can I just say one thing: please stop using Charizard in Ubers. Please. It's sitting at about 1.029% usage, which is about 1% too high (I'm leaving room here for people who use it for the novelty of using Charizard). I know that having Solar Power-boosted attacks seems so cool, but a Timid Specs Charizard's Fire Blast is hitting exactly as hard as a Modest Specs Reshiram's Blue Flare, and Reshiram has a much better secondary STAB (not to mention half the Stealth Rock weakness, far more bulk, etc.). Reshiram literally outclasses Charizard at pretty much everything of note. Oh but that's not the worst of it, about 58.8% of Charizard in Ubers use Blaze. So yeah...stop doing that.
Even in OU, Charizard isn't so great. If you can keep Stealth Rock off the field and make sure that the weather absolutely does not change, then it's alright. But the vulnerability to Stealth Rock and the passive damage of Solar Power rack up very quickly. Not only that, but if the weather changes, Charizard becomes very, very sub-par. Tyranitar and Politoed easily neuter Charizard, and specially defensive Hippowdon can handle everything but the Specs set locked into Fire Blast.
Now, in NU, Charizard is actually really good. A Sunny Day set can hit like an absolute truck, and unlike OU, there's no permanent weather to mess up Charizard's sweep. Even manual weather is fairly uncommon in NU. Charizard's base 100 speed is also a much bigger deal in NU, where many of the faster threats sit at around 90-95 base speed, as opposed to base 108-110 in OU. The lower stat standards in NU help Charizard stand out even more, since Charizard's base 109 SpA stat is a bit more impressive, beaten only by a small handful of common NU threats. So yeah, use Charizard in NU. Not so much in OU. And definitely not in Ubers.
Even in OU, Charizard isn't so great. If you can keep Stealth Rock off the field and make sure that the weather absolutely does not change, then it's alright. But the vulnerability to Stealth Rock and the passive damage of Solar Power rack up very quickly. Not only that, but if the weather changes, Charizard becomes very, very sub-par. Tyranitar and Politoed easily neuter Charizard, and specially defensive Hippowdon can handle everything but the Specs set locked into Fire Blast.
Now, in NU, Charizard is actually really good. A Sunny Day set can hit like an absolute truck, and unlike OU, there's no permanent weather to mess up Charizard's sweep. Even manual weather is fairly uncommon in NU. Charizard's base 100 speed is also a much bigger deal in NU, where many of the faster threats sit at around 90-95 base speed, as opposed to base 108-110 in OU. The lower stat standards in NU help Charizard stand out even more, since Charizard's base 109 SpA stat is a bit more impressive, beaten only by a small handful of common NU threats. So yeah, use Charizard in NU. Not so much in OU. And definitely not in Ubers.
OceanicLanturn
Non non non!
Charizard is overrated as a fan favorite, I can't drag myself to like it for some reason, maybe it's just because of the over hype about it that irritates me and keeps me away from liking this lizard-dragon.
IMO Charizard could be passed as the worst fire starter in tier placing. Thyphlosion is RU and has the Eruption wrecking and tearing stuff apart, Blaziken has speed boost which is a nuff said, Infernape is pretty viable in OU (where he belongs) and can run a mixed set pretty well, even Emboar seems to fare better with the Head Smash-Wild Charge-Flare Blitz-Reckless/last Ditch Blaze. Poor Charizard has a nasty x4 SR weakness, and yeah...
It's really hard (IMO) to use Charizard in OU efficiently, on paper at least. You need a spinner/bouncer, Ninetales for the sun - Solar Power is probably the only reason why anyone would want to use it in OU, something to keep Heatran and pink blobs in check and Charizard himself, which makes a total of 4 slots. Not very efficient.
Enough with the ranting though, Charizard does pretty well in NU, in a sun team, here's a set
Charizard @ Heat Rock/Leftovers
Ability: Solar Power
Nature: Modest/Timid
EVs: 252 Sp.atk/252 Spe/ 4HP
- Sunny Day / Substitute / Roost
- Fire Blast
- Air Slash
- Solarbeam/Roost
Your Charizard can be your sun setter, or your sun sweeper. I know it might sound idiotic to have Sub on a Solar Power mon, but it keeps poison away nicely, or paralysis. Fire Blast is the STAB, and hits incredibly hard under Sun, though Flamethrower can be used in their place. Air Slash is another STAB of choice, beating grass types and fighting types. Last slot is a variety of choices. Solar Beam can be used in NU, since unlike OU, there is no auto weather casters. Snover was recently relocated to RU, and even if it was NU, the person would be an idiot trying to switch into a fire breathing poke,on.
IMO Charizard could be passed as the worst fire starter in tier placing. Thyphlosion is RU and has the Eruption wrecking and tearing stuff apart, Blaziken has speed boost which is a nuff said, Infernape is pretty viable in OU (where he belongs) and can run a mixed set pretty well, even Emboar seems to fare better with the Head Smash-Wild Charge-Flare Blitz-Reckless/last Ditch Blaze. Poor Charizard has a nasty x4 SR weakness, and yeah...
It's really hard (IMO) to use Charizard in OU efficiently, on paper at least. You need a spinner/bouncer, Ninetales for the sun - Solar Power is probably the only reason why anyone would want to use it in OU, something to keep Heatran and pink blobs in check and Charizard himself, which makes a total of 4 slots. Not very efficient.
Enough with the ranting though, Charizard does pretty well in NU, in a sun team, here's a set
Charizard @ Heat Rock/Leftovers
Ability: Solar Power
Nature: Modest/Timid
EVs: 252 Sp.atk/252 Spe/ 4HP
- Sunny Day / Substitute / Roost
- Fire Blast
- Air Slash
- Solarbeam/Roost
Your Charizard can be your sun setter, or your sun sweeper. I know it might sound idiotic to have Sub on a Solar Power mon, but it keeps poison away nicely, or paralysis. Fire Blast is the STAB, and hits incredibly hard under Sun, though Flamethrower can be used in their place. Air Slash is another STAB of choice, beating grass types and fighting types. Last slot is a variety of choices. Solar Beam can be used in NU, since unlike OU, there is no auto weather casters. Snover was recently relocated to RU, and even if it was NU, the person would be an idiot trying to switch into a fire breathing poke,on.
All Special
Item: Life Orb/Focus Sash/King's Rock
Modest w/ 252 Sp Attack, 252 Speed, 6 HP
Flamethrower/Fire Blast/Heat Wave
Air Slash
Focus Blast
Dragon Pulse/ HP [Grass/Ice]
All Physical
Blaze w/ Life Orb/Focus Sash/King's Rock
Adamant w 252 Attack, 252 Speed, 6 HP
Fire Punch/Flare Blitz
Aerial Ace
Earthquake/Dig/Brick Break
Dragon Claw/Dragon Rush/Outrage/Shadow Claw/Thunderpunch/Crunch
Partners:
Sunny Day-users
Tailwind-users
Countering:
High Attack and Sp Defense with Rock/Water/Electric-type moves like Tyranitar, Gyarados, Bouffalant, Snorlax, or Rock Slide Muk.
Item: Life Orb/Focus Sash/King's Rock
Modest w/ 252 Sp Attack, 252 Speed, 6 HP
Flamethrower/Fire Blast/Heat Wave
Air Slash
Focus Blast
Dragon Pulse/ HP [Grass/Ice]
All Physical
Blaze w/ Life Orb/Focus Sash/King's Rock
Adamant w 252 Attack, 252 Speed, 6 HP
Fire Punch/Flare Blitz
Aerial Ace
Earthquake/Dig/Brick Break
Dragon Claw/Dragon Rush/Outrage/Shadow Claw/Thunderpunch/Crunch
Partners:
Sunny Day-users
Tailwind-users
Countering:
High Attack and Sp Defense with Rock/Water/Electric-type moves like Tyranitar, Gyarados, Bouffalant, Snorlax, or Rock Slide Muk.
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my bad. used to acrobatics being a TM move, i forgot to take a proper look at the webpage T.T
this means Swords dance would have to be used instead of DD/belly drum with a salac berry if acrobatics would be used..... atleast it gets 2 great physical stabs this way... but might not really be worth it.
Zachmac
Well-Known Member
Charizard is x4 weak to stealth rocks, learns acrobatic, and has the ability Blaze....
Charizard @ Salac Berry
252 Att/252 Speed
Adamant/Blaze
-Acrobatics
-Fire Punch
-Swords Dance
-Substitute
A speedy sweeper, pretty much. Force a swap out on something such as a steel type, and use that as a chance to set up a substitute. Salac Berry will active instantly if stealth rock is in play, and if not, you can just sub two more times for the effect. Just remember the dragon's HP IV will need to be messed with so it will be at exactly 25%.
Acrobatics will be at 165 power, fire punch will be at 168. After a swords dance, Charizard's attacks should be at 330 and 336 power. Use it in the sun, and Fire Punch will even reach 504 power! It's walled by rock types, but this can be solved with team support. You really won't want to use this Charizard until the very late game anyway. Speaking of rock types, though, you could squeeze in Earthquake or Focus Punch onto the set to handle them.
Charizard @ Salac Berry
252 Att/252 Speed
Adamant/Blaze
-Acrobatics
-Fire Punch
-Swords Dance
-Substitute
A speedy sweeper, pretty much. Force a swap out on something such as a steel type, and use that as a chance to set up a substitute. Salac Berry will active instantly if stealth rock is in play, and if not, you can just sub two more times for the effect. Just remember the dragon's HP IV will need to be messed with so it will be at exactly 25%.
Acrobatics will be at 165 power, fire punch will be at 168. After a swords dance, Charizard's attacks should be at 330 and 336 power. Use it in the sun, and Fire Punch will even reach 504 power! It's walled by rock types, but this can be solved with team support. You really won't want to use this Charizard until the very late game anyway. Speaking of rock types, though, you could squeeze in Earthquake or Focus Punch onto the set to handle them.
Ghosts of the Forums
Who Ya Gonna Call?
I find it very easy to switch into the 'zard.
Ok some hints. Run HP ice over dragon pulse. it has less power, but has better coverage, esp. gligar/gliscor, landorus-t/-i/ or hp grass for gastrodon/swampert. Heat rock is useless on the sets suggested, due to lack of sunny day on the sets. infero has very shaky accuracy, so use a different fire move. use fire blast.
physical set. always fire fang<fire punch, due to shaky accuracy. Wing attack is worse than aerial ace. only techni-scyther would rarely use it. aerial ace is still shaky. you only get fighting coverage extra, which isn't really needed. Dig... need i say more than this: the opponent can use this to set up/switch in safely to a flying type. Dragon rush is only a maybe on hone claws set.
Ghosts of the Forums
Who Ya Gonna Call?
i like this. reminds me of gliscor in lower tiers. i def think e-quake should be there, maybe, just maybe over fire punch.
pikadon92
Raiden Maximus
Am I the only one who likes Charmander instead? Well, if only it can have Solar Power in LC........
....if only >.>"
And for anyone curious on Charizard's current tier, basically it's based on its effectiveness in weather. It only works in Sunny weather, and in the RU team, TRs are more favorable than weather one. For more information, go here: http://www.smogon.com/smog/issue20/how_nu
....if only >.>"
And for anyone curious on Charizard's current tier, basically it's based on its effectiveness in weather. It only works in Sunny weather, and in the RU team, TRs are more favorable than weather one. For more information, go here: http://www.smogon.com/smog/issue20/how_nu
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