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Community POTW #127

Discussion in 'POTW Collaboration' started by Serebii, Apr 21, 2019.

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  1. Serebii

    Serebii And, as if by magic, the webmaster appeared... Staff Member Admin

  2. XaelOstigian

    XaelOstigian Competitive...kinda

    Ah Nidoqueen. I still remember you from the very first time I played Pokemon Yellow. Young me was too impatient to raise a balanced 6-man team (Which was actually kinda logical given how annoying the grinding was back then) so raised soloed the entire game with just a Nidoqueen. The fact that Nidoran (F) learned Double Kick was a godsend against Brock's gym after my Pikachu ran into obvious issues, and I also remember debated whether or not to evolve my Nidorina into Nidoqueen before or after Misty's gym given the added Ground type. In subsequent replays of that game I always chose Nidoking though. Actually, what set the sovereign Nidos apart back in gen 1 was their incrediblely wide movepool giving them access to TM's like Bubblebeam, Thunderbolt, Ice Beam, Surf, and Fire Blast. Talk about wide coverage at a time where most Pokemon back then were lucky to get an attack outside of their STAB and a Normal attack!
    Anyways, the game has changed a lot since gen 1, and Nidoqueen now faces still competition from a lot of Pokemon including it's male counterpart which has better speed and offenses. That's not to say less of Nidoqueen given it's bulkier than the king and still has pretty much all the moves that it does. So don't write Nidoqueen off just yet.

    Hazard Play
    Ability: Sheer Force
    Item: Leftovers
    Nature: Impish/Bold
    EV's: HP: 252 Def: 156 Sp.Def: 100

    Poison Jab/Ice Beam
    Earthquake/Earth Power
    Toxic Spikes
    Stealth Rock

    Set Details:
    Pretty self explanatory. Set up your entry hazards of choice where Tox. Spikes spreads disease and Stealth Rock does damage and hit Flying types that resist one of Nidoqueen's two STAB's. With Sheer Force Poison Jab becomes Nidoqueen's strongest move and Earthquake serves as a secondary STAB. THough you can opt for a special set replacing Poison Jab with Ice Beam and Earthquake with Earth Power since both moves get the ability boost and has better coverage against certain check. Change the nature accordingly to suit this.

    WishIhadaManafi5 likes this.
  3. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you wanna try a good Tapu Cocoa? My treat.


    Background Information - Nidoqueen, the Queen of Whoopass
    Nidoqueen is a fan-favorite appearing throughout the Pokemon anime series, the anime featuring Nidoqueen with multiple trainers, most notably Gary Oak and Dani, one of the Orange Island Gym Leaders however arguably it's most hilariously best moment to me as a kid was the time when this couple appeared, having a double battle with Ash & May, and showed off Nidoking's and Nidoqueen's combined Submission attack. Nidoqueen has also appeared in Pokemon Adventures in the hands of Kanto fem protag, Green (Or Blue in Japan) who is one of her major team players during the FRLG and Emerald arcs, however the most famous user of Nidoqueen is undoubtedly Giovanni's Nidoqueen who was a a force to be reckon with that almost defeated Red's highly-trained Snorlax in one shot. In fact Giovanni's Nidoqueen also had the most memorable appearance out of any Nidoqueen in another medium in it's debut in Pokemon Origins where just like Snorlax, it absolutely annihilates Charizard.

    Well-Known Trainers who caught or befriended the Nidoqueen Line.
    Nidoqueen - Giovanni (Games, Adventures, Origins)
    Nidoqueen - Green, Fem Protag (Adventures)
    Nidoqueen - Gary Oak (Anime)
    Nidorina - Whitney (Anime)
    Nidoqueen - Dani (Anime)
    Nidoqueen - Fergus (Anime Movie)

    Sheer Force Nidoqueen
    Item: Life Orb
    Ability: Sheer Force
    Nature: Modest Nature (+Sp. Atk, -Atk) or Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
    EVs: 252 Sp. Atk/252 Speed
    Sludge Bomb/Sludge Wave
    Earth Power
    Ice Beam/Blizzard
    Focus Blast

    The first time I came across Sheer Force Nidoqueen was actually during my time in Rating Battles when this caught me by complete surprise, having no idea that Sheer Force Nidoqueen was this strong from it's Special Attack, so I just to look it up of what was the deal with this Nidoqueen I saw and it turns out it's a Sheer Force set. You got the usual STAB, the ice-type moves for taking down annoying flying-types like Zapdos and Focus Blast against a variety of normal types that Earth Power just can't quite do the same, except for Porygon2, don't even try. Just switch out.

    Hazard Nidoqueen
    Item: Leftovers
    Ability: Sheer Force or Poison Point
    Nature: Timid Nature (+Spe,- Atk)
    EVs: 252 HP/252 Spe or 252 Sp. Atk/252 Spe
    Stealth Rocks/Toxic/Roar
    Toxic Spikes
    Venoshock (Poison Point)/Sludge Bomb/Earth Power/Ice Beam

    Standard Hazard User set. That's really all I have to say, neat though that Nidoqueen has access to both toxic spike and stealth rocks though.

    Also cool Nidoqueen/Nidoking signature. They look like some kind of J-Pop couple or strangely reminds me of this card anime I once saw as a kid, girl protagonist and some tsundere boy? Ring any bells?
    WishIhadaManafi5 likes this.
  4. Divine Retribution

    Divine Retribution Master of the freak show

    Nidoqueen is actually quite an underrated threat in UU, being able to check top tier threats such as Mega Manectric, Scizor, Terrakion, and Cobalion, while providing the rare Toxic Spikes to help its teammates break down bulkier threats. Its typing is quite good defensively, notably giving it an immunity to Electric, as well as resistances to common attacking types such as Fighting, Fairy, Bug, and Rock, while Sheer Force helps alleviate its otherwise mediocre offensive presence to some degree. Its biggest problem is it faces stiff competition both from its cousin Nidoking, which boasts more power, Nihilego, which also gets access to both Stealth Rock and Toxic Spikes, and can more directly threaten defoggers with Z-Thunderbolt or Power Gem, and Tentacruel, which doesn't learn Stealth Rock but is arguably a more reliable Toxic Spike user, as well as getting access to other support moves such as Rapid Spin.

    Nidoqueen @ [​IMG] Black Sludge
    Bold - Sheer Force
    252 HP, 124 Defence, 132 Speed
    -Earth Power
    -Sludge Wave
    -Toxic Spikes
    -Stealth Rock

    This set is rather straightforward and self-explanatory. Toxic Spikes and Stealth Rock are most of the reason to use Nidoqueen in the first place, as she's one of a small handful of Pokemon with access to both. Earth Power offers a strong, reliable STAB move that threatens opponents such as Mega Manectric and Terrakion, while Sludge Wave is useful for checking opposing Fairies such as Sylveon and Mega Altaria. Poison Jab does deserve a mention as it does 2HKO Sylveon without rocks (Sludge Wave requires some chip damage to reliably 2HKO), but it also requires you to run a Relaxed nature, which means giving up the hopes of outspeeding Sylveon without a much larger investment. Otherwise, Sludge Wave doesn't actually miss any important KOs that Poison Jab would get. Other options to consider include Thunderbolt, which is useful for chunking bulky waters such as Suicune and Alomomola, Flamethrower, which allows Nidoqueen to apply more pressure to Scizor, and Dragon Tail or Roar, which allow Nidoqueen to phase opponents and rack up hazard damage. Teammates Nidoqueen appreciates include pretty much any sweeper that appreciates Toxic Spikes and its ability to break down bulkier walls, such as Substitute + Protect Suicune, as well as powerhouses that can force switches, racking up hazard damage and spreading Toxic poison, such as Chandelure, Hydreigon, and Infernape. Bisharp also deserves a mention for dissuading the use of Defog by taking advantage of Defog to potentially gain a +2 Attack boost.​
    WishIhadaManafi5 likes this.
  5. Golurk

    Golurk PokeRanger

    Cardcaptor Sakura?
    shoz999 likes this.
  6. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you wanna try a good Tapu Cocoa? My treat.

    Yes. That's the one!
  7. Luthor

    Luthor Well-Known Member

    Can we put as one of the negatives of Nidoqueen. - Inexplicably cannot breed. Which does make it slightly harder for breeding as you have to use a Female Nidoran for egg moves rather than being able to chain breed with one that is already fully evolved.
  8. KyogreThunder

    KyogreThunder Call of Fate

    I think Crunch deserves a mention on a physical set, as it gets boosted by Sheer Force and beats Ghost- and Psychic-types.
    Likewise, Bubble Beam works well on a special set, although getting a Nidoqueen with that move requires transferring one from a Virtual Console Generation I game.
  9. Divine Retribution

    Divine Retribution Master of the freak show

    Bubblebeam is extremely weak even with the Sheer Force boost, and doesn't really hit anything important that isn't already taking a ton of damage from either Earth Power or the already much more niche Ice Beam.

    Nidoqueen also already learns Surf, and even after factoring in the Sheer Force boost, Surf is still a little bit stronger.
  10. KyogreThunder

    KyogreThunder Call of Fate

    True, but it also causes recoil damage from Life Orb, unlike Bubble Beam.
  11. KillerDraco

    KillerDraco The Enforcer Staff Member Super Mod

    The bigger issue is that it doesn't really gain all that much from a Water type move in terms of coverage. Ground + Ice has pretty stellar offensive coverage on its own, and Water doesn't really contribute much additional coverage compared to Fighting, Fire, or Poison. Just because it can use Surf or Bubblebeam doesn't mean it needs either. If we consider UU, there's only two relevant threats that Water has any noteworthy use on; Moltres and Rotom-H. Everything else that's weak to water is hit harder by Ice Beam or Earth Power. And in RU (Nidoqueen's native tier), there's really nothing that Water hits harder than the aforementioned moves.

    So yes, Surf or Bubblebeam are usable per se but generally not worth a spot on a movepool.
    Divine Retribution likes this.
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