Community POTW #16

[Meowmeow]

I'm looking at Toxicroak and, while it is good, it's pretty tame. Its attack at base 106 is small compared to other Fighting types (it DOES have the highest attack among Poison types) and its speed is merely above average. The only way you are going to get any significant damage dealt without STAB is to Choice it or it will be exposed to the weaknesses from attacks that will become common thanks to new Fighting types like Terrakion and Conkeldurr, as well as already existing fighters with Infernape and Machamp. What's worse, it doesn't even get Superpower, so you're stuck with Cross Chop. In this metagame, Cross Chop won't go very far.

If Toxicroak is going to be used at all, it MUST use what other fighters lack. Gimmicks just aren't an option if Toxicroak is going to survive in a metagame packed with overpowered attackers and quicker disruptors. Toxicroak is walking on fishing line when it comes to competitive value. I wish Toxicroak were better.

 

[bulber]

Rain Stall
Toxicroak @ Leftovers
- Protect
- Sucker Punch
- Brick Break or another Fighting-type move.
- Ice Punch

Protect means free healing every 2 turns. Sucker Punch for priority. Fighting-move is fighting-move. Ice Punch is for the dragons.

For a Fighting move, what about Drain Punch? It got a boost to 75 BP, so it's equally powerful as Brick Break.

An added Dry Skin would mean that Leftovers+Drain Punch+Rain would be quite a bit of healing each turn. And with that from behind a Sub...

 

[Mr. Marowak]

Settin' em' up, knocking them down.

Toxicroak @ Black Sludge
Adamant / Dry Skin
-Toxic
-Brick Break
-Sucker Punch
-Protect

A kinda Toxic Stall, but set up for ruining most, well, setup. Toxic to poison and ruin SubSeeders (If you go first...) Brick Break for death to dual screens, Sucker Punch for general owchies, and Protect to stall and scope. This set works best alongside a Spinner with Rain Dance, i.e Blastoise, and a switch-forcer, like Dragon Tail. (Can Blastoise learn it?)

EDIT: Blastoise CAN indeed learn Dragon Tail, so a nice set to go alongside might be...
-Dragon Tail
-Surf
-Rain Dance
-Rapid Spin

Sorry for getting off-topic, if that's what to call it.

 

[ringuma]

This is what I think of Toxicroak as a sweeper:
item:focus sash
abilityoison touch
nature:jolly(+speed+attack

Moves
-sucker punch
-ice punch
-poison jab/drain punch/brick break
-swords dance

Toxicroak just doesn't have good defense or special defense. You could make him a sweeper as his attack is good and his speed is...well, OK. Anticipation isn't a very useful ability because Toxicroak is more of a sweeper than a big tank so he probably will take out the opponent before it can attack (If that is what you intend to use him for). Dry skin is very risky because it can be very useful but also very dangerous. That sort of leaves you with the best ability Toxicroak has which is Poison touch. I'd recommend giving him a focus sash because there are some Pokemon that can outrun him and when the opponent attacks, your most likely doomed. Sucker punch is a devastatingly powerful move for Toxicroak especially when it goes up against speedy psychic types like Alakazam. Toxicroak can use Ice punch to counter flying AND ground types. Poison jab is a good move for him if you want to teach him poison type moves or you can teach it a move like Drain punch which can not only damage the opponent, but heal you as well. Swords dance is a good option because I think that If you choose Toxicroak, your #1 priority is speed but attack won't be as good so swords dance takes care of that.

 

[Dark End]

If I had a Toxicroak, this is how I would set it up.

FYI: I set up my pokemon so that they have moves that super effective against the types that pokemon is weak against and I'm an all out attacker. That's just my style.

Physical Obliteration
Ability: Poison Touch
Item: Black Sludge / Poison Barb / Black Belt
Nature: Jolly / Adamant
-Poison Jab
-Sucker Punch
-Brick Break / Cross Chop / Drain Punch
-Rock Slide / Ice Punch / Stone Edge / Thunder Punch

Poison Jab is just a good STAB. Sucker Punch covers Psychic types, plus it has priority. Brick Break is a good STAB too. Cross Chop is Stronger, but you get less Acc and PP. Drain Punch is just as good as Brick Break and you get some HP. Rock Slide, Ice Punch, and Thunder Punch are all good options against Flying types. Stone Edge is another option, but it has less Acc.

Regeneration
Ability: Dry Skin
Item: Damp Rock / Black Sludge / Leftovers / Shell Bell
Nature: Jolly / Adamant
-Poison Jab
-Sucker Punch
-Drain Punch
-Rain Dance / Rest / Substitute

The focus hereb is healing yourself and staying alive instead of dealing damage. Black Sludge will heal you because your a Poison type, Damp Rock extends Rain Dance which heals you because of Dry Skin, etc. Have fun choosing your method of healing.

;335;

 

[:wub:disc]

this has nothing to do with the current topic at hand, but on the Whimsicott POTW:

It's a lot harder to use Whimsicott in multiple Pokémon battles compared to singles. It can't do its job effectively, and multi Pokémon battles are often much faster, given you less time and reason to utilise Whimsicott's disruptive attacks.

this is completely wrong, just saying.

 

[The Intersect]

OK i think of toxicrokk as a glass cannon due to the massive Psychic weakness and a large amount of psychic types used the move set i would use is
Revenge is a dish best sered to suckers
Sucker punch.
Revenge/brick break/drain punch
Poison Jab
and finally. Bullet Punch/ice punch
the item would be depending on the fighting move you use and ability you run if you use Revenge i would suggest focus sash but if brick break/drain punch your running on fumes so use a life orb anyway. as for the ability in a rain team dry skin otherwise maybe run poison touch. your choice

Sucker punch hits Psychics hard most of the time except in the case of defenceives like claydol and the part rock type duo.
Revenge will hit an e-quaker hard with a focus sash or the other two moves if you dont like the revenge idea drain punch heals life orb damage. brick break is handy if reflect or light screen are in effect to in case of defencive alomamola etc.
poison jab is simply for stab.
and bullet punch means you can hit priority if you know your going down anyway in case life focus sash hp remaining or you could run ice punch for weakness coverage.

EV's 252 Attack. 252speed if you want if not place these in HP if your running life orb the last 4 can go where ever i guess. Nature would obviously be ADAMANT

 

[TheAwesomeOne]

4 EV's=+1 to a Stat.
Toxicroak will never live a Psychic.

 

[The Intersect]

yeah i realised that once i said it and removed that note but the last 4 i know but its mentionable anyway

 

[gyarados151]

Sweepers don't care about 30% chances of poisoning. 50% is larger.


Poison Touch is for your contact moves.

Hmm. . . you obviously haven't read my post, in which I calculated and showed my workings out to the percentage chance of poison ^^ it is on page 2.

You do not add the percentages together, they're multiplied, so if Sludge bomb WAS a contact move (it obviously isn't), much like poison jab is, the chances of poisoning are 44%!

Read my post on the second oage if ou want to understand why (my knowledge of maths when calculating probability and percentage has never failed me yet).

 

[LatiosPwnzor]

Personally I think the only reason someone would use him in OU is for two reasons:
1.Dry Skin, something that gives him a prevalent spot as a Fighting type for Rain teams, meaning he pairs well with Politoed, and is sometimes a rain team's only way of dealing with Ferrothorn.

2.His typing comes with a rare prize:resists to Fighting, Rock and Dark, allowing him to stand in the face of common Scrafty and Terakion with impunity.

 

[TheAwesomeOne]

^
Yeah, 4X weak to Psychic, great!

 

[gyarados151]

Not to mention weak to ground, not my so much, but earthquake is like, the most spammed attack in the whole game? How many sweepers do you see not running earthquake? Only those who can't learn it (and those tend to be shoved down to lower tiers, where not so good sweepers are there but can STILL learn earthquake anyways so. . . yeah).

The fact that earthquake will be saring you in the face almost constantly is why the metagame is so hostile towards poison types. Only when they have levitate or a secondary type to make neutral towards ground types can they even think to stay alive more than 3 turns unless they have a stall strategy, and even then, they don't kill much with the stall strategy

In other words, a very good partner will be one that can aid Toxicroak in anyway from being killed by the always common ground types and the not so common yet A LOT MORE DANGEROUS psychic types ^^ lol crawdaunt ^^ (I think he is dark type).

 

[ringuma]

This is what I think of Toxicroak as a sweeper:

The frog faster than you can say.....sweep.

item:focus sash
abilityoison touch
nature:jolly(+speed+attack

Moves
-sucker punch
-ice punch
-poison jab/drain punch/brick break
-swords dance

Toxicroak just doesn't have good defense or special defense. You could make him a sweeper as his attack is good and his speed is...well, OK. Anticipation just isn't very useful in general and Dry skin is a very risky ability as it gives Toxicroak immunity to water type attacks but it also gives him a weakness to fire type attacks with so that sort of leaves you with the best ability Toxicroak has which is Poison touch. I'd recommend giving him a focus sash in case a pokemon outruns him and beats him. Sucker punch is a devastatingly powerful move for Toxicroak especially when it goes up against speedy psychic types like Alakazam. Toxicroak can use Ice punch to counter flying AND ground types (Gliscore is a good example). Poison jab is a good move for him if you want to teach him poison type moves. Or you can teach it a move like Drain punch which can not only damage the opponent, but heal you as well. If you'd like to use a fighting type move like brick break to break defenses instead of drain punch, that's fine too.

 

[Kindrindra]

The fact that earthquake will be saring you in the face almost constantly is why the metagame is so hostile towards poison types. Only when they have levitate or a secondary type to make neutral towards ground types can they even think to stay alive more than 3 turns unless they have a stall strategy, and even then, they don't kill much with the stall strategy

Actually, the hate for Poison-types is more because Poison only hits Grass Super-effectively, and Steel, the most commong defensive type, is immune to it.

 

[Zachmac]

Okay, for all of you who want stall croaks, it will only be effective it's a DrySkin+BlackSludge+Substitute.
Toxicroak
Jolly/252att/252speed
Dry Skin/Black Sludge
-Toxic
-Substitute
-Protect
-DrainPunch

Best teammates for this set are Politoed and ToxicSpikers. Force a swap out, use substitute, toxic if you need to, then substitute/protect as many times as you can. It's kind of like a subseeder.

Anyway, it wasn't a pokemon meant for stalling.

Finally, don't list OU counters and teammates. If you want it in OU battles, forget about it.

Teammates: Houndoom. Dry skin Toxicroak takes water, rock, and fighting for it, while Houndoom takes Fire and Psychic.

 

[LatiosPwnzor]

Not to mention weak to ground, not my so much, but earthquake is like, the most spammed attack in the whole game? How many sweepers do you see not running earthquake? Only those who can't learn it (and those tend to be shoved down to lower tiers, where not so good sweepers are there but can STILL learn earthquake anyways so. . . yeah).

The fact that earthquake will be saring you in the face almost constantly is why the metagame is so hostile towards poison types. Only when they have levitate or a secondary type to make neutral towards ground types can they even think to stay alive more than 3 turns unless they have a stall strategy, and even then, they don't kill much with the stall strategy

In other words, a very good partner will be one that can aid Toxicroak in anyway from being killed by the always common ground types and the not so common yet A LOT MORE DANGEROUS psychic types ^^ lol crawdaunt ^^ (I think he is dark type).

True true, but what I mean is that Terakion usually is one to rely on the coverage of his STABs for ALL of his offensive might (usually running both Rock Polish and Swords Dance along them) and Scrafty does nearly the same, except that it's usually a defensive view for Scrafty, and its STABs are more seen as making it the worst defensive pokemon to use Taunt on. I find it hard to see how Scrafty would beat Toxicroak since Scrafty doesn't have access to Earthquake nor that new ground type Ankle Sweep.

 

[dragontamer98]

My favorite attacking lead...
(Insert catchy name here)
Toxicroak @ Focus Sash
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 4 HP/ 252 Attack/ 252 Speed
Trait: Anticipation/ Dry Skin/ Poison Hand
-Fake Out
-Taunt
-Cross Chop
-Sucker Punch

Fake Out breaks opposing sashes and Sturdy Pokemon's full health. Taunt is a great move for stopping bulkier, slower leads. Cross Chop is for STAB and puts the "Attacking" in "toxicroak attacking lead set" and sucker Punch is to pick off any left over HP.

My prefered choice for the trait is Anticipation, just to ease prediction a little. Poison Hand is my second choice of ability because two of Toxicroak's three weaknesses are predominantly physical. Dry Skin is risky, it will let u recover some HP against Politoed leads and absorb any Water-type moves that someone might use if they forget about Toxicroak's Dry Skin, but it will KO you against Ninetales leads...

I've seen great success with this lead... Yeah...

EDIT: Heh, does anyone else find it curious how on the Serebii news page Toxicroak is in the picture against Mirohog?

 

[Kraleck]

True true, but what I mean is that Terakion usually is one to rely on the coverage of his STABs for ALL of his offensive might (usually running both Rock Polish and Swords Dance along them) and Scrafty does nearly the same, except that it's usually a defensive view for Scrafty, and its STABs are more seen as making it the worst defensive pokemon to use Taunt on. I find it hard to see how Scrafty would beat Toxicroak since Scrafty doesn't have access to Earthquake nor that new ground type Ankle Sweep.

Yeah. It's not like Scrafty can learn Zen Headbutt. Oh, wait...

Sarcasm aside, getting Scrafty safely past a Fighting Type Move from 'Croak and slamming a Zen Headbutt into it is also a potential counter, plus Intimidate (DW) to weaken 'Croak's offense and Shed Skin to counter Poisoning. Tauros, Stantler, and Salamence can also do the Intimidate + Zen Headbutt trick, plus Crobat and Immunity Snorlax can crash into it without fear of Poisoning.

Speed Boost Blaziken and Infernape's superior Speed and STAB Fire are also cause for concern for Dry Skin 'Croak. Primeape can slam an EQ into 'Croak with less fear of Sucker Punch. Excadrill is faster on Base Speed, is immune to Poisoning, and has STAB Ground to handle 'Croak, especially with a Sandstorm activating its non-DW Abilities. Krookodile has better Speed and Intimidate to wreak havoc with 'Croak. Durant has great Speed and Aerial Ace to rip into 'Croak, plus immunity to Poisoning.

The Short Version (too late) is that Intimidate can screw with Poison Touch 'Croaks. There are 5 Pokemon that also carry higher Speed and super effective Moves (Arcanine, Tauros, Salamence, Staraptor, and Krookodile). Against a combo of Imprison+Sucker Punch, a 'Croak without Taunt has issues with Spiritomb and Banette.

 

[TheAwesomeOne]

Since Toxicraok will never be moving out of UU, fast Psychic/Flying types will pwn it.
Alakazam needs to watch out for Sucker Punch, but other than that, it is home free.
Guts SWELLOW owns Toxicroak.
Fast Ground types will also OHKO it. Most notably Dugtrio.
EDIT: Thanks Kindrinda!