Competitive Single Rates (5th Gen Standard OU) - READ FIRST POST

[Xenevix]

Snorlax @ Normal Gem
Ability: Thick Fat
Nature: Brave (-Speed +Attack)
EVs: +200 Attack, +252 Special Defense, +56 Defense
- Selfdestruct / Body Slam
- Curse
- Crunch
- Earthquake / Seed Bomb

This is a Snorlax I would use on my Trick Room doubles team, supported by a Cresselia (has Trick Room), Rhyperior, Jellicent (has Trick Room), Hydreigon, and an Emboar. The old sixth slot was for a Ferrothorn but I found it to be too weak to actually fight (it was an offensive set) if it was left without Trick Room. So I replaced it with a stronger, longer-surviving Pokemon: Snorlax. Snorlax plays the same role as Ferrothorn did but better. Curse one turn to become "faster" and then destroy with pretty much any move.

The defense EV's are actually perfect. After a Curse it's defense is very close to 300 which is great with Snorlax's gargantuan HP (I feel its HP doesn't need any investment by the way.) The rest of the EV's are obvious: maximize special bulk and attack strength. Thick Fat is the preferred ability countering Heat Wave and Blizzard which Snorlax already takes like a boss and the Brave nature is to "maximize speed."

I feel the moveset is pretty self-explanatory: Selfdestruct or Body Slam for STAB, Curse for stats, Crunch for ghosts, and Earthquake in doubles is nice especially with two levitators, but Seed Bomb is a nice move for bulky waters. Especially since Wild Charge has recoil and Quagsire, Swampert, and Gastrodon all resist it.

Now here's the most controversial point: the STAB move. The only way I can get Selfdestruct is through Pokemon XD Gale of Darkness, which is not fun as the natures are random I believe. The only way to get the right nature is to keep restarting the battle with Cipher Admin Ardos until I get the Brave nature and get to that move tutor lady. Seeing as this would be quite tedious I am thinking about Body Slam. It doesn't let Snorlax kill himself and does decent damage with the chance of paralysis, but the lack of ridiculous power is not as amusing. It's always fun to just destroy everything in one shot when you're in a bind. Especially since he often pairs with Jellicent, and my Rhyperior with Protect.

Does the loss of Selfdestruct really lose that much for the team? Is Seed Bomb the better coverage move since I have two others on my team with EQ (Emboar and Rhyperior)? And is the normal gem too much? (I have leftovers on Cresselia and I have to keep all the hold items different.) Maybe I should use a Chople Berry? Should I be rid of Curse for more coverage? These are all my main questions on this set.

All constructive criticism is greatly appreciated. ​

 

[[Kingdra]]

I would throw some of the attack EVs into HP and give it leftovers so it turns into a more effective tank.

 

[Ghosts of the Forums]

yeah. defenitly. and tr is about powerful slow attackers, not set-up. that just wastes your trick room time.

 

[Xenevix]

yeah. defenitly. and tr is about powerful slow attackers, not set-up. that just wastes your trick room time.

Okay so Attack ev's into HP and getting rid of Curse would both make it less powerful making your point invalid. Moreover, neither of you answered any of my questions. :/

 

[HueYol]

Dusknoir @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP/129 Def/ 129 Spc Def
Nature: Careful
- Will-O-Wisp
- Confuse Ray
- Mean Look
- Shadow Sneak/Rest

Overview-
I was thinking of using Dusknoir as an staller on my new competitive team. I put max EVs in his HP to make up for Dusknoir's usual shoddy HP, and spilt the rest evenly among his special defense and defense to maximize his longevity, as well as giving him Leftovers to go, "The Full Nine Yards."

Mean Look is his best attribute here, which allows him to trap the opponent and then lay the slow beat down on the opposing pokemon. I chose a careful nature for him because Will-O-Wisp already supports him against Psychical attacks, and I'm not using any special attacks in this set, so that's why I decided careful. Will-O-Wisp is his bread-and-butter technique after laying down a Mean Look, as it will slowly defeat the opponent in sixteen turns regardless, and the opponent won't be able to really harm Dusknoir with psychical attacks at that point. Confuse Ray helps because it gives Dusknoir a 50/50 chance to recover with Leftovers, get extra burn damage in and confusion damage, and Confuse Ray's 100% accuracy is icing on the cake.

I'm stuck on Rest and Shadow Sneak becuase Rest would tremendously help it's longevity, but Leftovers would sort of lose their value that way. I think I'd prefer Shadow Sneak because it allows Dusknoir to have a "Suicide" move, if you will, as well as having a good way to finish weakened opposing Pokemon without taking another hit. Also, Pressure is a fantastic ability for staller/annoyer sets such as this, sometimes eventually forcing the foe to use Struggle.

Thank you for your time!

 

[ChaosBlizzard]

Dusknoir @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP/129 Def/ 129 Spc Def
Nature: Careful
- Will-O-Wisp
- Confuse Ray
- Mean Look
- Shadow Sneak/Rest

Overview-
I was thinking of using Dusknoir as an staller on my new competitive team. I put max EVs in his HP to make up for Dusknoir's usual shoddy HP, and spilt the rest evenly among his special defense and defense to maximize his longevity, as well as giving him Leftovers to go, "The Full Nine Yards."

Mean Look is his best attribute here, which allows him to trap the opponent and then lay the slow beat down on the opposing pokemon. I chose a careful nature for him because Will-O-Wisp already supports him against Psychical attacks, and I'm not using any special attacks in this set, so that's why I decided careful. Will-O-Wisp is his bread-and-butter technique after laying down a Mean Look, as it will slowly defeat the opponent in sixteen turns regardless, and the opponent won't be able to really harm Dusknoir with psychical attacks at that point. Confuse Ray helps because it gives Dusknoir a 50/50 chance to recover with Leftovers, get extra burn damage in and confusion damage, and Confuse Ray's 100% accuracy is icing on the cake.

I'm stuck on Rest and Shadow Sneak becuase Rest would tremendously help it's longevity, but Leftovers would sort of lose their value that way. I think I'd prefer Shadow Sneak because it allows Dusknoir to have a "Suicide" move, if you will, as well as having a good way to finish weakened opposing Pokemon without taking another hit. Also, Pressure is a fantastic ability for staller/annoyer sets such as this, sometimes eventually forcing the foe to use Struggle.

Thank you for your time!

Since you appear to be new to competitive battling, I want to preface this by saying I did read everything you wrote and all of your logic is sound; I'm not just ignoring you. However, what you're going for here is not the best way to run Dusknoir. The set you are trying to create is much MUCH better run by Dusclops. Dusknoir is a tank, not a wall, whereas Dusclops is a wall like what you want. If you're going to run a Dusknoir, it should focus on attacking, not on stalling. However, Dusclops can do exactly what you want and do it very well. The standard set for Dusclops is this:

Dusclops @ Eviolite
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Sp Def
-Rest
-Sleep Talk
-Will-o-Wisp
-Seismic Toss / Night Shade

I would suggest Night Shade instead of Seismic Toss. Seismic Toss is standard, but Night Shade lets you hit Spiritomb, which is a big counter to this set. I think this will suit you much better.

 

[HueYol]

I didn't even think of Sleep Talk, thank you!

 

[Xenevix]

So Beartic. It's definitely different. Decent HP, STAB ice moves, and Swift Swim. I kinda want to use it on my prospective hail team as a surprise rain team counter. I want to run an offensive, rain-specified, hail supported variant. It is made specifically to destroy anything with weak physical defense. Here's what I came up with (two variants).

Pooh Bear @ Choice Band
Nature: Jolly
EVs: +252 Speed +252 Attack +4 HP
Ability:Swift Swim
- Ice Punch
- Superpower
- Night Slash
- Aqua Jet

OR

Pandaaa @ Life Orb
Nature: Jolly
EVs: +252 Speed +252 Attack +4 HP
Ability: Swift Swim
- Ice Punch
- Superpower
- Aqua Jet
- Swords Dance

Both sets are meant to destroy anything that does not resist or is not physically bulky. Specially bulky Pokemon are a hail teams main walls as they wall Blizzard. Especially Rain teams with all the water and flying types. Aqua Jet is rain-boosted, and is great priority fore revenge killing.

Overall I think Beartic is one of the most interesting Pokemon ever. Too me the number one most interesting. I've tried to run a bulky set and failed, but I have proved a Scarf set works with moderate success in OU. I think Beartic would work better in hail as a rain-specified counter, which is why I have posted this.

 

[Ghosts of the Forums]

sub punch is pretty good.

 

[cobaltlion69]

So Beartic. It's definitely different. Decent HP, STAB ice moves, and Swift Swim. I kinda want to use it on my prospective hail team as a surprise rain team counter. I want to run an offensive, rain-specified, hail supported variant. It is made specifically to destroy anything with weak physical defense. Here's what I came up with (two variants).

Pooh Bear @ Choice Band
Nature: Jolly
EVs: +252 Speed +252 Attack +4 HP
Ability:Swift Swim
- Ice Punch
- Superpower
- Night Slash
- Aqua Jet

OR

Pandaaa @ Life Orb
Nature: Jolly
EVs: +252 Speed +252 Attack +4 HP
Ability: Swift Swim
- Ice Punch
- Superpower
- Aqua Jet
- Swords Dance

Both sets are meant to destroy anything that does not resist or is not physically bulky. Specially bulky Pokemon are a hail teams main walls as they wall Blizzard. Especially Rain teams with all the water and flying types. Aqua Jet is rain-boosted, and is great priority fore revenge killing.

Overall I think Beartic is one of the most interesting Pokemon ever. Too me the number one most interesting. I've tried to run a bulky set and failed, but I have proved a Scarf set works with moderate success in OU. I think Beartic would work better in hail as a rain-specified counter, which is why I have posted this.

whats night slash for? swords dance would be good but you need to be able to take a hit for putting it to use... i would use a diff EV spread. speed isnt a strong point for beartic. if you wanted to run swords dance i would put more into HP. if you run speed Evs, like you did, id use the night slash set

 

[Cissinho]

Offensive Smeargle!! FTW

Well, there´s a pokemon that all of you uses only as a support option, using to baton pass boost and nothing more...
I was thinking, could Smeargle be that bad?.... it has infinite moveset and i think that an offensive option for this pokemon maybe can work, with the precise moves... and yes, it works....
this is my offensive Smeargle!

Smeargle @Focus Sash/Life Orb/Lum Berry
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 4 Hp / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Nature: Modest
- Spore
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Flamethrower/Searing Shot/Secret Sword

Maybe this you think this set is a gimmick, but with this moves used properly, Smeargle could be a machine in OU (in lower tiers, this thing kills everything)..
First, and the move that all the Smeargles need to have, Spore... and this move is the key to have a powerful Smeargle, Shell Smash... the best option (if you are running Focus Sash) is to use Shell Smash and next Spore... with one Shell Smash Smeargle´s Speed will reach to 498 and you can outspeed all 100 Base Speed Scarfed Pokemon, so you can Spore away and Shell Smash all the time you need (with two Shell Smash you don´t need more... but if you are feeling lucky, you can go for the third and make Smeargle OHKO almost all pokemon)...
Stored Power is the move you should use cuz´with the Shell Smash boost it gains so much power and hits hard every pokemon (including those that resist the attack)... Searing Shot/Flamethrower (SS has a little bit power, but low PP... realy i don´t know why i use Searing Shot xD) is to hand with Skarmory, Scizor, Ferrothorn, Genesect, etc... but if you run FF, Hydreigon and Tyranitar completely walls Smeargle.. so you can run for Secret Sword if you don´t want be walled...

Now, some examples of Smeargles power (all this attack are calculated after 2 Shell Smash Boosts):

Spoiler: Spoiler

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 252 HP/0 SpDef Skarmory: 71,86% - 84,73%
2 hits to KO (with Leftovers)
-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Searing Shot vs 252 HP/0 SpDef Skarmory: 111,38% - 131,14%
Guaranteed OHKO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Secret Sword vs 252 HP/252 Def Blissey (+Def) : 59,94% - 70,59%
2 hits to KO (with Leftovers)
-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 252 HP/4 SpDef Blissey: 38,8% - 45,66%
3 hits to KO (with Leftovers)

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 120 HP/136 SpDef Conkeldurr: 222,57% - 261,94%
Guaranteed OHKO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 4 HP/0 SpDef Latios: 54,97% - 64,57%
2 hits to KO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Secret Sword vs 4 HP/0 Def Tyranitar: 127,49% - 150,88%
Guaranteed OHKO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Secret Sword vs 4 HP/0 Def Hydreigon: 79,14% - 93,25%
2 hits to KO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 252 HP/32 SpDef Jellicent: 82,67% - 97,52%
2 hits to KO (with Leftovers)

And remember that you will always will outspeed your oponnent after 2 Shell Smash, so you can put their pokemon to sleep and then sweep...

I know that priority movest could kill this Smeargle without problems, but this moveset is unexpected and your oponnent will always think that this Smeargle is only for support....
by the way, entre hazard support is recomended...

and that´s my offensive Smeargle....

 

[Ghosts of the Forums]

that would never work. granted, it is orginal, but the chances of smeargle getting off one, let alone two shell smashes before the opponent wakes up and beats the **** out of you is very small. and any conk you fight would kill you outright with mach punch.

 

[Psypert]

that would never work. granted, it is orginal, but the chances of smeargle getting off one, let alone two shell smashes before the opponent wakes up and beats the **** out of you is very small. and any conk you fight would kill you outright with mach punch.

Just Conk? any priority user will after Smeargle reduces it's defences, also hazards and weather can brake the sash and/or boost the opponent's speed liek venusaur and stoutland.

The set is very originial and a cleaver idea but I keep wondering why fusion flare? Flamethorower has more PP and Fire Blast has more power, the set might work but it has many weaknesses, you need a rapid spinner, something to clear a possible sandstorm and a way to brak opossing sash and Sturdy, it has a lot of difficulties but it can wokr if you have the proper conditions, just like Lv 1 FEAR Aron.

 

[Ghosts of the Forums]

i mentioned conk because i saw it in his/her calcs.

 

[Cissinho]

Just Conk? any priority user will after Smeargle reduces it's defences, also hazards and weather can brake the sash and/or boost the opponent's speed liek venusaur and stoutland.

The set is very originial and a cleaver idea but I keep wondering why fusion flare? Flamethorower has more PP and Fire Blast has more power, the set might work but it has many weaknesses, you need a rapid spinner, something to clear a possible sandstorm and a way to brak opossing sash and Sturdy, it has a lot of difficulties but it can wokr if you have the proper conditions, just like Lv 1 FEAR Aron.

yeah, that´s are flaws that this smeargle have... but i don´t know pokemons that don´t have some weaknesses xD.... is only risky as other choices...
and Fusion Flare... i really don´t know why i put that move jaja... Flamethrower is the option... my mistake jaja ....
and for the last... obviously you need a weather counter, entry hazards and a spinner (just like every team), but this thread is only for single pokemon xD... i always use this smeargle with the right support

 

[Klaus™]

Well, there´s a pokemon that all of you uses only as a support option, using to baton pass boost and nothing more...
I was thinking, could Smeargle be that bad?.... it has infinite moveset and i think that an offensive option for this pokemon maybe can work, with the precise moves... and yes, it works....
this is my offensive Smeargle!

Smeargle @Focus Sash/Life Orb/Lum Berry
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 4 Hp / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Nature: Modest
- Spore
- Shell Smash
- Stored Power
- Flamethrower/Searing Shot/Secret Sword

Maybe this you think this set is a gimmick, but with this moves used properly, Smeargle could be a machine in OU (in lower tiers, this thing kills everything)..
First, and the move that all the Smeargles need to have,

it is a gimmick. generally, sweepers need to have good stats. movepools arent everything *cough* mew/meloetta *cough*

Spore... and this move is the key to have a powerful Smeargle, Shell Smash... the best option (if you are running Focus Sash) is to use Shell Smash and next Spore... with one Shell Smash Smeargle´s Speed will reach to 498 and you can outspeed all 100 Base Speed Scarfed Pokemon, so you can Spore away and Shell Smash all the time you need (with two Shell Smash you don´t need more... but if you are feeling lucky, you can go for the third and make Smeargle OHKO almost all pokemon)...

...... at +6/ +6, i think anything can ohko anything. that doesnt say anything.

Stored Power is the move you should use cuz´with the Shell Smash boost it gains so much power

calcs prove otherwise :/ its reliant on boosts.

and hits hard every pokemon (including those that resist the attack)... Searing Shot/Flamethrower (SS has a little bit power, but low PP... realy i don´t know why i use Searing Shot xD) is to hand with Skarmory, Scizor, Ferrothorn, Genesect, etc... but if you run FF, Hydreigon and Tyranitar completely walls Smeargle.. so you can run for Secret Sword if you don´t want be walled...

lol, how does fighting and psychic get good coverage again? fighting, sure. psychic? no.

Now, some examples of Smeargles power (all this attack are calculated after 2 Shell Smash Boosts):

Spoiler: Spoiler

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 252 HP/0 SpDef Skarmory: 71,86% - 84,73%
2 hits to KO (with Leftovers)
-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Searing Shot vs 252 HP/0 SpDef Skarmory: 111,38% - 131,14%
Guaranteed OHKO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Secret Sword vs 252 HP/252 Def Blissey (+Def) : 59,94% - 70,59%
2 hits to KO (with Leftovers)
-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 252 HP/4 SpDef Blissey: 38,8% - 45,66%
3 hits to KO (with Leftovers)

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 120 HP/136 SpDef Conkeldurr: 222,57% - 261,94%
Guaranteed OHKO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 4 HP/0 SpDef Latios: 54,97% - 64,57%
2 hits to KO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Secret Sword vs 4 HP/0 Def Tyranitar: 127,49% - 150,88%
Guaranteed OHKO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Secret Sword vs 4 HP/0 Def Hydreigon: 79,14% - 93,25%
2 hits to KO

-252 +4 SpAtk Smeargle (+SpAtk) Stored Power vs 252 HP/32 SpDef Jellicent: 82,67% - 97,52%
2 hits to KO (with Leftovers)[/QUOTE]

those calcs prove the smeargle set sucks. for multiple reasons:

1) skarmory has sturdy, so its not a ohko.

2) @ +4, it doesnt ohko a blissey....with secret sword. that uses the defense against it, like a fighting psyshock. and, its a supereffective move. at +4!!!

3) you expect to have a stupid opponent, who lets you get to +4/+4.

4)smeagle has poor offensive stats. for god's sake, it can ohko a hydreigon @+4. :/

all in all, you are better off using something else to sweep. something faster, not as reliant on any hazard being away or sand/hail being up, etc etc. its baton passing set is great, but smeargle still sucks and always will.

 

[Ghosts of the Forums]

alright, i've been testing a stall politoed, and it can outstall gastrodon and otthe rbulky statusers by utilizing one underappreciated move.

Politoed @Leftovers
Calm
Drizzle
248Hp 100Def 160Sp.Def
-Scald
-Protect
-Toxic
-Refresh
poli can utilize refresh quite well, as it allows him to shrug off satus while he posions his foes. gastro, jelly, all pokes who try to toxic me get a nasty surprise, and this set can be hard to work around.

 

[UgoPop]

This is a set that i have made.

Deoxys-S
Nature:Timid
EV:4Def,252SpA,252Spe
Item:Life Orb
Moveset
-Stealth rocks
-Sunny Day
-Hidden Power Fire
-Calm Mind

This Deoxys-S is one of my favourite leads.I usally Set up Rocks first before saving him for later.
He has Destroyed multiple teams due to HP Fire Calm mind and Sun Boosted.Overall all its a great Set

 

[5221A]

alright, i've been testing a stall politoed, and it can outstall gastrodon and otthe rbulky statusers by utilizing one underappreciated move.

Politoed @Leftovers
Calm
Drizzle
248Hp 100Def 160Sp.Def
-Scald
-Protect
-Toxic
-Refresh
poli can utilize refresh quite well, as it allows him to shrug off satus while he posions his foes. gastro, jelly, all pokes who try to toxic me get a nasty surprise, and this set can be hard to work around.

I preffer Supporttoad :/. Anyways looks good, but I think Scald clashes to much with toxic. It dose have a chance to burn Ferro, but you dont want his to stay in him. Mabe Hydro Pump or Foucus Blast (to deal with Ferro, but the later loses STAB and rain boost). As for refresh, Politaod dosent lose anything by switching out, so switching to a clearic, (and mabe a spinner) you probable will get more from it. Don't forget that toad has no means of recovery, wich hampers it alot. Its not that refresh is under appreciated, but it worksbetter on set up sweepers who lose things when switching (boosts, that is why it is common on EK Aceus). But I think it can work alright, just that normal rain stall members already heal politoad (Blobs). Toxic stall (Tenta). Do damge (D-nite). I didn't realy get the EV's, but it looks good.

 

[Ghosts of the Forums]

the thought behind the set was, although it was a gimmick at first, that no one likes losing their toed to status, and no one likes being forced to switch to avoid poison, as not everyone uses the blobs.