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Controversial Opinions - READ GUIDELINES IN FIRST POST *Possible Spoilers for SM*

Discussion in 'Animé Polls' started by U.N. Owen, Mar 7, 2017.

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  1. U.N. Owen

    U.N. Owen Well-Known Member

    Okay, the last thread got shut down for obvious reasons. Ergo, we're going to try out best to avoid that this time.

    This thread is for discussing any tropes, patterns, outcomes, etc. This is a critique of these items, not of other users or the writers. We are not threatening to leave dead cats outside their doors.

    Here are some ground rules:
    1. No Shipping: We have a subforum for this stuff. Take it there.
    2. Explain Your Stance: "In my opinion" is not a valid explanation, seeing how I've seen the argument used in stupid ways like the following statement: "Well, it matters to me at least. Ash is the main protagonist, it looks weird if he is the shortest of all. Besides, a female character shouldn't be taller than a male character if they are of the same age, in my opinion."
    3. No Speculation: We have a spoiler section for this.
    4. No Comparisons to Other Pokemedia: As much as I like the endless flame wars of PokeSpe vs. PokeAni, they do get boring after a while. If you need to compare, then compare them to the games, seeing how that's what the anime is advertising.
     
  2. mystic9899

    mystic9899 Pokemon fan

    could you give an example of one of the things you mentioned? i'm a little confused by this thread's topic. is it just things like "ash is forever 10" and "ash always loses the league?"
     
  3. U.N. Owen

    U.N. Owen Well-Known Member

    The Kalos League's outcome, Ash's age, OS vs. AG, DP vs. XY, XY vs. SM, etc. Really, it's your opinion you've seen contested time and time again or a rathe unpopular opinion.
     
  4. 345ash-greninja

    345ash-greninja XY(Z) is the best!!!

    I didn't get it actually. Is this thread for discussing SM or something else as well, as mentioned in the name of the thread(Possible spoilers for SM)?
     
  5. U.N. Owen

    U.N. Owen Well-Known Member

    Considering SM hasn't exactly been dubbed here in the states and the fact this is out of the spoilers subpage, I had to put the possible spoilers tag on here.
     
  6. 345ash-greninja

    345ash-greninja XY(Z) is the best!!!

    I see, so this thread is something like that 'Unpopular Opinions' thread you created, right?
     
  7. U.N. Owen

    U.N. Owen Well-Known Member

    Pretty much, except that devolved from unpopular opinions to controversial ones. That's why this was created to minimize all of that nightmarish thread's problem.
     
  8. 345ash-greninja

    345ash-greninja XY(Z) is the best!!!

    I will then say: Ash should have won the Sinnoh and Kalos Leagues. He was a lot mature and competent in those sagas and went through quite some development there. Pulling of a Tobias with legendaries was absolutely pointless in my opinion, a desperate attempt by the writers to stop Ash from winning the Sinnoh League. Ash also should have definitely beaten Alain in the Kalos League finals as well. Ash never beat Alain before, so he definitely deserved to win it this time. Ash going through the region without beating one of his rivals not even once was truly ridiculous. Alain was portrayed as ridiculously overpowered. Will all the build-up in the Ash-Greninja arc, winning the Kalos League would have been perfect.

    I also feel that Ash maturity and competence was at its peak in XY and his character really came a full circle there. So it would have been nice to make him win the Kalos League, subsequently win the Champion's League and ending his stories on a high there.
     
  9. Frozocrone

    Frozocrone Miraculous!

    CO: I am more excited by the Sun and Moon anime than I am for the 20th movie.

    Not sure if the Japan movie trailer aired in English yet and thread title does not include potential movie spoilers so spoilered this just in case.

    Reasoning:
    I admittedly have not followed much of the discussion in Serebii's 20th movie thread. But it feels like they (the directors/writers/team behind it) are just doing a retelling of the beginning of Ash's journey. It's been 20 years since the anime started and the target demographic for the anime would not have been born when May and Max were introduced, let alone the original group and the beginning of Ash's journey. I already know how the encounter went down and the only differences are Ash getting the rainbow feather, which isn't really enough for me to peak my interest.

    Compared to Sun and Moon (again spoilered for comparisons that may imply movie content):

    Reasoning:
    Sun and Moon is wacky and quirky that I get a real sense of enjoyment out of following it. It might be because Sun and Moon eclipsed Platinum (the game I first got into Pokemon with) as my favourite games of all time. But I get a genuine sense of fulfillment and laughter when I watch the anime. I'm intrigued to see where it goes and how the characters are developed (aside one), as well as how they adapt the game story. I also love the constant 'silly faces' so to speak, they utilize what I enjoy about animated shows best, the ability to express all sorts of emotions.
     
  10. Navin

    Navin MALDREAD

    No Shipping: We have a subforum for this stuff. Take it there.


    You just lost out on at least 500 posts right there, my friend.
     
  11. Pokegirl Fan~

    Pokegirl Fan~ Mikoto Uchiha

    I like Serena alot, but she's been treated like crap by the writers and higher ups. It felt like they hardly even cared about her with the mediocre at best writing of her character, especially in early XY. I'd argue she was the worst companion in the first 40 episodes of XY due to the way she was being neglected in the background and then in XYZ they wrapped up her goal of becoming Kalos Queen way too quickly. Not to mention that Showcases were just poorly executed in general. I'm also extremely disappointed that they always had Serena being saved by someone even when she could have handled things by herself *cough* Battling at Full Volume episode*cough* as well as the fact that she hardly every finished a battle besides only a handful of times. Honestly Serena deserved to be treated alot better than this
     
  12. Xenon Blue

    Xenon Blue No Hard Feelings

    This anime should have never kept Ash beyond OS in hindsight. Yes it made for an easily recognizable character along with a recognizable Pokemon, but it would have been better if the anime started each series with new characters, whether they are in the same universe or not. It allows for something new to look forward to each season and will easily get rid of the staleness problem. The writers can experiment with different tone and theme to determine if Pokemon works best if it is serious, comedic, or somewhere in between, and there is no problem of creating new protagonists with completely different personalities to accommodate with the theme rather than create a character who is so generic that he can fit with any theme. It also isn't terrible for marketing, as multiple Pokemon can become mascots of the franchise and sell more toys in the long run. This far into the series though it is far too late to start over without a good reason.
     
  13. Navin

    Navin MALDREAD

    I think it was fine to keep Ash a bit longer than OS. What they should have done though was:

    1. Have Ash accept the Frontier Brain position at the end of AG.
    *Time skip*
    2. Young adult, experienced Ash leaves Frontier Brain post and travels to Sinnoh. Imagine a grander version of DP where Ash wins it all. This can be the conclusion of Ash's story.


    BW can be an actual fresh slate with a new protagonist, instead of a poor decision to 'reset' Ash (and then try to make it up in XY).
     
  14. mystic9899

    mystic9899 Pokemon fan

    ideally, i think ash should've finished his run in DP. OS-DP felt like an actual story of progression and continuity, wherease BW, XY, and SM are all pretty contained within their own series for the most part.
     
  15. satopi

    satopi All hail Satomine Night!

    Not sure if this is controversial enough but this feels like an unpopular opinion.

    I'm quite fine with Ash staying eternally 10. I feel no need for him to age or have him 'grow up' with his viewers. Dozens of cartoon characters don't age and yet Ash gets nagged about not aging. It's common and accepted that many cartoon characters don't necessarily age despite the many different seasons and events that happened.
     
  16. Satomine Night

    Satomine Night The Power of Z!

    I agree with this. I don't have, and never have had, a problem with Ash staying eternally 10 years old. As you said, there are plenty of shows where the main characters don't age despite the passing of time; Pokémon is not alone in this regard. Ash is 10 years old because the target audience is around 10 years old. He doesn't need to age with the older, periphery demographic.
     
  17. Navin

    Navin MALDREAD


    It's less about 'age' and size (it wasn't an issue for Ed Elric in FMA:B), and more of wrapping up his role as the main character. With how much Ash has achieved and his overall growth, there's not a whole lot left to do with him.
     
  18. satopi

    satopi All hail Satomine Night!

    They always think of something when it comes to him. I seriously wouldn't want to see another snot nosed beginning trainer to go through what everyone else has been through. There's a reason why Digimon works well with having different protagonists in each saga while Pokémon on the other hand, has always been Ash's journey and with that in mind, he meets those beginning trainers and they have a journey together so it's killing 2 birds with 1 stone. Of course there isn't much for Ash to do but I would hate to see him go even after so long. It would've been less painful if he left in say, OS like Taiki and the others have.
     
  19. 345ash-greninja

    345ash-greninja XY(Z) is the best!!!

    But that completely defies logic, doesn't it? Ash still remaining 10 years old despite so many adventures throughout such a long amount of time- seems like everything is stagnant. If Ash ages, that will also help to signify his progress, with aging, he will mature and become more stoic in enduring his hardships and coming out on top. Ash, aging, progressing and maturing- this should the way of going forward in my opinion. But......the Anime tend to ignore these three aspects and that's what I dislike most about the Pokemon Anime.
     
  20. satopi

    satopi All hail Satomine Night!

    Being a cartoon is the reason it defies logic. Fiction defies logic all the time and nobody has a problem with it because it's fiction. Even in real life, certain things defies logic sometimes but that's what we call miracles.
     
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