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Could TPCi keep the JPN vocal songs (lyricless) in the dub this whole time?

Discussion in 'Pokémon Animé Discussion' started by matt0044, Aug 23, 2011.

  1. matt0044

    matt0044 Well-Known Member

    In the DP episode where May comes to Sinnoh for the Wallace Cup competition, "A Full Course Tag Battle!", the dub kept in the song "I Won't Lose - May's Theme" without the lyrics being sung during May and Dawn's battle with Team Rocket. I didn't fully notice this until I saw the rerun on CN today and I was shocked and amazed in a great way. I'm sure a good amount of you felt the same.

    But this got me thinking. If TPCi and DuArt could've kept in an insert song from the Japanese version without the singing in the dub, then why, pray tell, couldn't they have done this since day one? Hell, 4kids did this once in a while only they put in their own English lyrics.

    It just baffles me when I think about it. What about you guys?
     
  2. randomspot555

    randomspot555 Well-Known Member

    Wait, 4kids used Japanese themes but put their own lyrics???

    This was asked in that infamous PokeBeach interview with one of the storyboarders. What he explained, via his translator, was that Japan as a culture is very protective of...well, their culture, including their music. So there are huge licensing fees that go along with using these songs outside of Japan, which could, in theory, explain why Japanese tracks are used in limited amounts.

    I also question how much creative control dubbers, 4kids, PUSA, or whoever else, have over what appears in the Pokemon anime. If it costs them *huge licensing fee* to use the original music versus creating their own using studio musicians, then...well, it's understandable, to an extent.
     
  3. matt0044

    matt0044 Well-Known Member

    ^^Then how come dubs of other Anime keep the music from the Japanese version? Especially ones that get DVD releases.
     
  4. Yeul

    Yeul Green Eyed Girl

    I really like the current JP opening, so much that I wonder why they couldn't just dub it instead. That's not too hard, is it?
     
  5. randomspot555

    randomspot555 Well-Known Member

    You have to keep in mind that "other animes" aren't really a good contrast with Pokemon. Pokemon's anime is basically a 23 minute commercial for the series. It's main purpose is to promote the franchise. I wouldn't be surprised to learn if OML and their respective dub affiliates were on a strict budget. Licensing music is very expensive (its where most musicians and those in the biz actually make money) even if the guy completely lied about Japan charging heavy fees for using their music, it's still expensive. It's much cheaper to pay some studio musicians for a 30 second clip and a few minutes of backround music than it is to license music made by someone else.
     
  6. MidnightMelody

    MidnightMelody Hopeful for Gen 8

    I think it has to do with money and the fact Pokemon is aimed at kids. I would of loved if Megaman NT and Yugioh GX kept the japanese songs
     
  7. Reign G

    Reign G Roggen and Rolan

    Like randompsot's saying, it's all about the money. The dubbers have to pay for every piece of Japanese music used, and it's just cheaper to hire someone to make music specifically for the dub instead.

    As for other shows, I'd imagine it's because other dubbing companies have more money they can put into that. TPCi works on the entire franchise if I'm not mistaken, so they have to balance their money between the show, games, cards, etc.
     
  8. randomspot555

    randomspot555 Well-Known Member

    Even in JP's production, there is likely some budget issues. There's probably a reason in non-important episodes (and even some important ones) get the crappy animation directors.
     
  9. Yeul

    Yeul Green Eyed Girl

  10. MidnightMelody

    MidnightMelody Hopeful for Gen 8

    Director 1-So do we use this money to make a good dub or get drunk?

    Director 2-GET DRUNKKKKK!
     
  11. (P.O.K.E.M.O.N)

    (P.O.K.E.M.O.N) AshXSerena = Canon

    because it's for a western audience! and children would not understand a japanese song
     
  12. Yamato-san

    Yamato-san I own the 5th gen

    obviously, anime that only come out on DVD (of which make up the grand majority of domestic anime releases) are geared toward a limited audience. Namely, the audience that's already familiar with anime and would be willing to buy it. To thus audience, it's obvious that it comes from Japan, and they couldn't care less, so listening to Japanese lyrical songs in an English dub (or hell, just watching the Japanese version with subtitles) wouldn't bother them one bit.

    Pokemon, on the other hand, aims at people expected to buy the games (namely children). Now, Nintendo doesn't necessarily hide the fact that they're a Japanese company, but their localization practices since the NES days seem to suggest that they don't want to alienate western gamers much, thus a tendency to use heavily Americanized scripts among other things. This is probably how the anime ended up in 4kids's hands in the first place (similarly, all the painted-over Japanese signs in the early episodes were supposedly the higher-ups' call), and probably why TPCi is still refusing to use some Japanese music now.
     
  13. MidnightMelody

    MidnightMelody Hopeful for Gen 8

    Not true. I know my friend's 8 yr old brother prefers hearing japaense lyrics to english.
     
  14. Reign G

    Reign G Roggen and Rolan

    Well sure, but it's not the norm.I'm willing to bet most kids would rather understand what they're listening to.
     
  15. Mr. Reloaded

    Mr. Reloaded At this point, who knows?

    They should have just kept the best wishes opening rather than black and white.
    Kids should try to learn a new language early.
     
  16. MidnightMelody

    MidnightMelody Hopeful for Gen 8

    They could dub the lyrics then
     
  17. Mr. Reloaded

    Mr. Reloaded At this point, who knows?

    It wouldn't be the same.
     
  18. Honeyichigo

    Honeyichigo The manliest

    Keep in mind that if they kept the original opening they'd have to cut like a minute of footage out of each episode to make room for it. Cartoon Network has a longer commercial break time than whatever channel Pokemon airs on in Japan.
     
  19. MidnightMelody

    MidnightMelody Hopeful for Gen 8

    I don't know about that. I rather like when Funi dubs songs
     
  20. matt0044

    matt0044 Well-Known Member

    I don't get why Americans in this day and age would be alienated by the fact that they're favorite show or games comes from a different country. If people already like it, then they should still like it, regardless of it's country of origin. I can understand localizing it so people can understand and like it more easily but doing it because the fact that it comes from Japan would apparently bother American fans?

    Come on, people! Didn't we learn anything about tolerance for other people from American history alone?

    Back on topic: If the games can keep every single, solitary track in every single versions outside of Japan, why can't the Anime? Hell, the movies (not counting the first few) keep their Background Music in their dubs. And why does TPCi have to pay for music they practically co-own? The music is made for Pokemon and they own Pokemon in America.

    It's just so ridiculous.
     

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