Delta Episode Discussion

[The Pokemon Broadcast]

Just want to say that this whole "'no BF = worst game ever!' attitude is as annoying as those complaints about Cameron in the Unova league. People need to let both of these go at this point. -_-

 

[Autobot N]

Just want to say that this whole "'no BF = worst game ever!' attitude is as annoying as those complaints about Cameron in the Unova league. People need to let both of these go at this point. -_-

Who is Cameron? Do you mean Catlin from the Battle Castle?

 

[Akashin]

Who is Cameron? Do you mean Catlin from the Battle Castle?

He's talking about a character from the anime.

 

[Alexander18]

As always, that you were not consulted and every detail tailored to your precise demands does not make for a "mediocre game", and some of your "demands" border on pointless and inane and read more like disappointment that they didn't follow some sort of fanfiction script that you had already written up. The sooner you realize this the better off we'll all be.

There is no fanfiction script, HGSS had bits from Crystal and those games turn out great. Remaking Ruby/Sapphire but not including anything from Emerald does not make since. Yes, it is a remake of Ruby and Sapphire but they could have included bits of Emerald in. And the fact that they put a model of the battle tower at the battle resort was a slap to the face to those who expected a battle frontier. They just copy and pasted the battle maison from X and Y which I think is lazy. Emerald was the best of the pair considering all the neat features especially seeing cut scenes of Kyogre and Groudon fighting and Rayquaza coming to stop them. I would have like to see that in ORAS but they decided to remain as original as possible despite having the HGSS games containing the Suicune thing. This is my opinion and I am not changing it. It would have made sense to included Emerald elements as everyone here seems to be against a Delta Emerald.

 

[Hydrohs]

There is no fanfiction script, HGSS had bits from Crystal and those games turn out great. Remaking Ruby/Sapphire but not including anything from Emerald does not make since. Yes, it is a remake of Ruby and Sapphire but they could have included bits of Emerald in. And the fact that they put a model of the battle tower at the battle resort was a slap to the face to those who expected a battle frontier. They just copy and pasted the battle maison from X and Y which I think is lazy. Emerald was the best of the pair considering all the neat features especially seeing cut scenes of Kyogre and Groudon fighting and Rayquaza coming to stop them. I would have like to see that in ORAS but they decided to remain as original as possible despite having the HGSS games containing the Suicune thing. This is my opinion and I am not changing it. It would have made sense to included Emerald elements as everyone here seems to be against a Delta Emerald.

You go make a game, then come back and tell me that GameFreak was lazy.

 

[Taodragon]

Alexander, I do agree with some of your points, but I do feel that you're going a bit too far. It is disappointing that we didn't get a BF or other Emerald elements, but constantly stating that point, that the game sucks for it and GF is lazy is not going to win more people over to your side and would more likely make them annoyed. We all have our opinions on the game and how it handled certain elements and we're not going to change our positions on that, so it's best that we just say what we want to say and leave it at that rather then beating a dead horse continuously.

 

[Bguy7]

I would like to remind anyone who was expecting a Battle Frontier that those only come out during the "3rd game." Original came out in Emerald, the Sinnoh one came out in Platinum, and the Pokemon World Champoinships (Unova's version of the Battle Frontier) came out in Black and White 2. I wouldn't expect a Battle Frontier or anything like it until "Z Version."

 

[Autobot N]

He's talking about a character from the anime.

Oh. You mean that kid with the Riolu/Lucario.

 

[Taodragon]

I would like to remind anyone who was expecting a Battle Frontier that those only come out during the "3rd game." Original came out in Emerald, the Sinnoh one came out in Platinum, and the Pokemon World Champoinships (Unova's version of the Battle Frontier) came out in Black and White 2. I wouldn't expect a Battle Frontier or anything like it until "Z Version."

HGSS had a Battle Frontier actually. Either way, that's kind of ignoring the circumstances as Gen 5 didn't even have another set of games following the paired or third version.

 

[NotABeginningTrainer]

HGSS had a Battle Frontier actually. Either way, that's kind of ignoring the circumstances as Gen 5 didn't even have another set of games following the paired or third version.

The difference was that the Platinum BF was already a thing. It required very little effort to copy into HGSS. Some people (not necessarily you) use the Frontier in HGSS as a reason why ORAS should have had one, but the circumstances were different. But on the topic of the Delta Episode, how could anyone say it was awful? Sure, there are many valid opinions on Zinnia and the slightly convoluted story, but if this wasn't the best post-game plot we've ever gotten, I don't know what is.

 

[Taodragon]

The difference was that the Platinum BF was already a thing. It required very little effort to copy into HGSS. Some people (not necessarily you) use the Frontier in HGSS as a reason why ORAS should have had one, but the circumstances were different. But on the topic of the Delta Episode, how could anyone say it was awful? Sure, there are many valid opinions on Zinnia and the slightly convoluted story, but if this wasn't the best post-game plot we've ever gotten, I don't know what is.

The thing is, we only have two instances to go off of before this game that aren't paired versions, FRLG and HGSS (Gen 5 didn't have a non-Unova game to use for this pattern). The former came out before and didn't have a Battle Frontier (or any facility) because it didn't exist yet, whereas the latter copied it over with some changes. Neither really show that it was impossible to make a BF for a remake if GF decided that they wanted to, so it's possible (key word here, I'm not sure if they really could) that they could've done it for ORAS if they wanted to.

Anyway, I don't want to start up another BF argument, so lets just leave it at that.

But on the topic of the Delta Episode, how could anyone say it was awful? Sure, there are many valid opinions on Zinnia and the slightly convoluted story, but if this wasn't the best post-game plot we've ever gotten, I don't know what is.

Well, as you said, Zinnia does have her problems as a character (and since she's a central one, that can be a big problem) and the story has some weak points. Also, being forced to do a fetch quest around the region by revisiting old areas wasn't too interesting and the episode could've benefitted from some post-game areas to do that.

Having said that, I did like the episode, but I can understand those flaws causing others to not like it as much.

 

[KurashiDragon]

Finished the delta episode yesterday. The only thing I can really say is, I'm glad the meteor decided to disappear into the aether when Rayquaza broke it into fragments. That would've caused even more untold destruction considering those fragments were still about 1/5th the size of the original meteor and going to multiple different places. They were really really lucky. XD

In all seriousness, I enjoyed the episode. I'm only sad that I decided against going after a perfect rayquaza and deoxys but at the time, I didn't know you could reset the Deoxys battle and properly save before fighting it again by simply knocking it out so I didn't want to bother going after perfection ;_;

 

[Excitable Boy]

but if this wasn't the best post-game plot we've ever gotten, I don't know what is.

it's the best post-game plot by virtue of not having any competition

though I still don't know why you'd play Pokemon of all games for the plot

You go make a game, then come back and tell me that GameFreak was lazy.

Calm down, Sakurai.

 

[NotABeginningTrainer]

I wouldn't say Delta Episode is the only post game plot ever. Sure it's the first one that has a name and triggers automatically, but there was also the Looker quests in XY. They were excellent in my opinion (By pokemon standards).

 

[crystalphoenix88]

I wouldn't say Delta Episode is the only post game plot ever. Sure it's the first one that has a name and triggers automatically, but there was also the Looker quests in XY. They were excellent in my opinion (By pokemon standards).

exactly. in fact, a lot of previous games had at least some kind of minor post-game "plot", just nothing as elaborate as the Delta Episode:

GS/HGSS = collecting the 8 Gym Badges of Kanto (calling this one a post-game "plot" is bit of a stretch, I'll admit)
FRLG = Team Rocket in the Sevii Islands (I think this was post-game? never actually played FRLG myself)
Platinum = Charon + Heatran plot, with Looker too
Black & White = helping Looker find + arrest the Seven Sages
X&Y = Looker Bureau

I might even be forgetting others, but there absolutely is a basis of comparison for the Delta Episode, and it puts most/all of what came before it to shame (Battle Frontier issues aside, but it's clear that the Delta Episode wasn't a "replacement" for the BF, the Battle Resort + Maison are the "replacements" for that.)

 

[Autobot N]

exactly. in fact, a lot of previous games had at least some kind of minor post-game "plot", just nothing as elaborate as the Delta Episode:

GS/HGSS = collecting the 8 Gym Badges of Kanto (calling this one a post-game "plot" is bit of a stretch, I'll admit)
FRLG = Team Rocket in the Sevii Islands (I think this was post-game? never actually played FRLG myself)
Platinum = Charon + Heatran plot, with Looker too
Black & White = helping Looker find + arrest the Seven Sages
X&Y = Looker Bureau

I might even be forgetting others, but there absolutely is a basis of comparison for the Delta Episode, and it puts most/all of what came before it to shame (Battle Frontier issues aside, but it's clear that the Delta Episode wasn't a "replacement" for the BF, the Battle Resort + Maison are the "replacements" for that.)

Not really much of a post game either, but B2W2 had the Black Tower/White Treehollow that you could beat.

 

[crystalphoenix88]

Not really much of a post game either, but B2W2 had the Black Tower/White Treehollow that you could beat.

ah, right right. thanks for bringing those up. I did want to separate the "plots" from the Facilities, though (like Battle Frontiers, Subway, World Tournament, Maison, etc.), since I don't think it's fair to compare the Delta Episode to those. the Battle Maison is the ORAS post-game Facility to compare against previous Facilities.

 

[KurashiDragon]

ah, right right. thanks for bringing those up. I did want to separate the "plots" from the Facilities, though (like Battle Frontiers, Subway, World Tournament, Maison, etc.), since I don't think it's fair to compare the Delta Episode to those. the Battle Maison is the ORAS post-game Facility to compare against previous Facilities.

I wouldn't really call Black Tower/White tree hallow "Facilities" in the same manor the world tournament or the Maison is. You get experience and money from it and there's a little subplot with benga too. It's really the closest B2/W2 have to a post game story.

 

[Autobot N]

I wouldn't really call Black Tower/White tree hallow "Facilities" in the same manor the world tournament or the Maison is. You get experience and money from it and there's a little subplot with benga too. It's really the closest B2/W2 have to a post game story.

Besides the whole Zoroark leading you to N's Castle after you beat Iris thing. But then again, that was an excuse to get Zekrom/Reshiram.

 

[Excitable Boy]

But then again, that was an excuse to get Zekrom/Reshiram.

every Pokemon plot is an excuse to shuttle you from battle A to battle B

some plots are just more needlessly convoluted than others