• Hi all. We have had reports of member's signatures being edited to include malicious content. You can rest assured this wasn't done by staff and we can find no indication that the forums themselves have been compromised.

    However, remember to keep your passwords secure. If you use similar logins on multiple sites, people and even bots may be able to access your account.

    We always recommend using unique passwords and enable two-factor authentication if possible. Make sure you are secure.
  • Be sure to join the discussion on our discord at: Discord.gg/serebii
  • If you're still waiting for the e-mail, be sure to check your junk/spam e-mail folders

Did you like SM's version of Ash?

Zhydra

Master of Chaos!
I do, he is a goofball that acts like an energetic ten year old kid, has funny moments when it isn't cliched slap stick and the way he and his pokemon are like a family in this one is spot on.

I also like how this one is more a support for the rest of the cast, rather than the central protagonist that others support.
 

janejane6178

Kaleido Star FOREVER in my heart <3

shoz999

Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Like SM's take on Ash? I don't really like it. I freaking love this take on Ash. Honestly it might be my favorite take on the character behind XYZ's Ash. Perhaps he would be almost everyone's favorites here if he had accomplished more.
 

Doppelgänger

Superancient Member
This Ash acts like a ten year old, has all the charm and goofiness of a ten year old, is there for pokemon and his human friends.

I see this comment a lot, but I'm not sure it's accurate. His classmates are presumably the same age yet are far more restrained. Kiawe is the next most goofy but he's a distant second place. Brock and Misty don't act like him, nor do any of the adults. If you say he acts like a ten year old, I'd think more ten year olds in show would behave like him, but he's an island unto himself.

I've always interpreted SM Ash as someone who is older than his peers, but acts like how he "thinks" a ten year old should act. He's also smarter than he lets on, another hint of an adult playing a child. Some things SM Ash does are far dumber than he's ever done in a prior Pokemon series.

In Best Wishes, the meme example for "dumb" Ash is the Nimbasa City Gym Battle, but this is often taken out of context. Ash decided early to not use Pikachu and had every reason to be confident in Palpitoad. Elesa threw him two curveballs, which unnerved him into making mistakes. Lenora did the same thing.

I don't think BW Ash would run into his herd of Tauros, only to get knocked into the sky. Or copy Samson Oak's Pokemon puns, which no on else in the cast likes.

SM Ash is either an idiot...or an idiot savant.
 

WishIhadaManafi5

To Boldly Go Where No One Has Gone Before.
Staff member
Moderator
Like SM's take on Ash? I don't really like it. I freaking love this take on Ash. Honestly it might be my favorite take on the character behind XYZ's Ash. Perhaps he would be almost everyone's favorites here if he had accomplished more.
Not mine. I can't stand him. Even if he accomplished more, it wouldn't change how I view him. I don't mind some goofiness and stuff, but I like it balanced out. SM Ash, is just portrayed as a joke, as someone who has fits for almost no reason, who is incompetent at battling. Sure he's done some of that in the past, but at least it wasn't nearly as over the top.
 

SatoSereFan224888

Well-Known Member
I HATE SM ASH! HE IS SO IMMATURE! This is the same Ash from Kalos.
 

Redstar45

The Anime/Special's canon know it all.
You know what ? This is similarly to the classic ben 10s show where fan do complaining about character development of the character Ben ten .
 

DuquÊ?

Too lazy to pick a pic
I’ll be honest, I read things as “have a falible character make him/her relatable” or “he/she have a personality now” and I don’t consider that as good argument. Heck, to exemplify, to me, Lana have the charisma of a rock, but she have a lot of fans (the anime staff included). When people points how interesting OS Ash was, I remember how of a prick he started, making more dumb decisions than not, having the short stick for minor (generally) offenses, facing big defeats or ridiculous defeats, but trying to be a better person after all of that, and everything that happened after that it’s to show how much he mellows and constantly humbles himself to become better than he was. Obviously it doesn’t happen as everyone wish every arc, but it still happen.

I read comments about how bland he was in DP and XYZ and just remember things like the rotom mansion episode, be a butt monkey on a crazy game show, sleep during the summer school camp, be a doofus on dancing (both DP and XY) and other instances where his goofy side is still there and people just ignore because “bland battle drone yadda yadda”.

Not everytime a “personality” will be a decisive fator, a person can just like the way the character is conducted. So, I don’t find fair classify the character only because of their portrait, more as how the setting act about them. All of his traits were in the previous series, if only the staff choosed focus some of them more than others. Because of that, I’m mostly satisfied about how Ash was portraited in DP and XY/Z and I still can find his SM incarnation fun, if exagerated.

SM did a singular job taking Ash from his comfort zone to a grounded place, it forced him to Interact more with people and actually blend well with the set and other characters in the core cast. Heck, I consider interactions between Ash and Gladion, of all people, quite fun, for example. Previous arcs managed to make the cast feel well integrated, but SM, for its faults, still make Ash part of the cast, which I commend. For example, BW had that uneasy feeling about Ash being a “strange element” that doesn’t feel of part of the setting. Now, about SM Ash...

It was said here that one of SM Strong points was give more focus on Ash as a person than as a trainer. I partly agree, but I still remember that be a trainer is part of what make Ash being Ash. I can’t blame the series for not be focused on battles, but I wouldn’t complain if we had more of them showing Ash’s out-of-box tactics, which I find too sparse this time. His team is probably my main problem, but this is less about how Ash was displayed in SM and more about executive meddling. If anything, he accumulated his own functions with some of the TRio’s comical role, instead give the classmates some more shades of being “falible”. It was mentioned the lack of agency for the girls, and when the things didn’t changed much to anyone non called Lillie in the development department, I stopped to care.

Final opinion: A little flanderizing, but SM Ash was a fine take of the character. Not my favorite, but I positively doesn’t dislike. I’m kinda used by now about Ash have a different interpretation every arc, so I won’t be surprised about whatever he’ll be in SS.
 
Last edited:

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
One positive to SM Ash that is still connected to him actually being a trainer is arguably how often we see him EARN progression with his team. We see him actually train for moves and power boosts, with cases he gets them through plot armour or a well timed Team Rocket pivoted DEM being rarer. Said training episodes tend to be done in a rather amusing and substantial way, with showings of trial and error and how he bonds with his Pokemon, giving him more of an agency and at least demonstrating his 'out of the box' tactics in another approach. The bigger problem is the lack of payoff in how he uses said progression since battling tends to be more sparse and mediocre in SM.

Contrast to XY where he demonstrated his battling skills in full throttle but only sporadically was shown training effectively outside five second non descript scenes of his team flexing or pulling generic attacks, otherwise he relied on 'the power of really really wanting something' as much as everyone else in the anime.
 

Epicocity

Well-Known Member
One positive to SM Ash that is still connected to him actually being a trainer is arguably how often we see him EARN progression with his team. We see him actually train for moves and power boosts, with cases he gets them through plot armour or a well timed Team Rocket pivoted DEM being rarer. Said training episodes tend to be done in a rather amusing and substantial way, with showings of trial and error and how he bonds with his Pokemon, giving him more of an agency and at least demonstrating his 'out of the box' tactics in another approach. The bigger problem is the lack of payoff in how he uses said progression since battling tends to be more sparse and mediocre in SM.

Contrast to XY where he demonstrated his battling skills in full throttle but only sporadically was shown training effectively outside five second non descript scenes of his team flexing or pulling generic attacks, otherwise he relied on 'the power of really really wanting something' as much as everyone else in the anime.
We must have watched two very different series in both SM and XY, because we rarely see Ash train (I can count about 3 times) in SM, with most of his moves happening in the heat of the moment. Likewise, we had whole episodes dedicated to training Ash's Pokemon in XY (Froakie and Double Team, Cut; Noibat and flying; somewhat with Goomy and evolving to Sliggoo). I think you're remembering them very differently...
 

p96822

Evolve me please
I think Ash's cringe faces make me not care for him as much as I did with the other season. Plus I do think that Ash is more flanderized version of Ash during early days of Kalos. However I think they handle Ash better in the early version of XY because Ash doesn't have to be the butt of everyone jokes. Even though Ash does have his moments in Pokemon Sun and Moon, but I feel like it doesn't make me like him more then the other series of Ash. Like his friendship with his friends or the cool Pokemon that Ash has. These thing I think make me care for Ash then Sun and Moon. Ash's friends or Pokemon in Sun and Moon are not that interesting or have that type of relationship that make me care for Ash.
 

Apslup

Feelin' Fine.
He's one of my more less-liked versions of Ash. He's better than BW Ash (for obvious reasons) and he's better than AG Ash, who just felt like OS Ash but more competent and without the charm of OS Ash.

XY Ash was competent and the peak of his abilities as a trainer but was a little bland, retaining some elements of BW Ash in terms of being silly.

OS Ash was so endearing and entertaining to watch, having great dynamics with his friends and Pokemon (especially Pikachu and Charizard).

DP Ash had the perfect mix of competance and silliness, since we saw him go through Kanto, Orange Islands, Johto and Hoenn making his skills feel well-earned and he had a great relationship with his group and knew when to be funny.

SM Ash fits the more comedy centred tone perfectly, though I do feel he suffers from this being too silly and not competent. In SM's more serious moments, I find it hard to take Ash seriously since he acts so goofy the rest of the time.
 
Last edited:

Kintaro

Banned
What's peoples opinion on Johto Ash? He battled better than Kanto Ash, but he just feels kinda there. I remember disliking Ash in the Johto era because he lost some of his Kanto humor/charm but was still kinda dumb.
 

Ignition

We are so back Zygardebros
What's peoples opinion on Johto Ash? He battled better than Kanto Ash, but he just feels kinda there. I remember disliking Ash in the Johto era because he lost some of his Kanto humor/charm but was still kinda dumb.
Arguably the most unappealing version of Ash to me besides maybe BW Ash. Johto Ash really has no stand out moments for me
 

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
I remember the twerps kinda dissolving into the background in Johto in many episodes. They still had some funny and sarcastic moments, but it was the point the show was becoming more formula driven. A lot of episodes in Johto actually almost had a Road Runner like feel to them with Team Rocket being more the protagonists than Ash. Still, better than in some episodes of later series, where NEITHER of them really drove the plot along distinctively.
 

Kintaro

Banned
Arguably the most unappealing version of Ash to me besides maybe BW Ash. Johto Ash really has no stand out moments for me

That's kinda my problem with him too. It didn't help that I was annoyed by Ash leaving Charizard and then Squirtle (especially since at the time we didn't know they would come back), and going to a bunch of weak Johto starters felt like a regression at the time. While he did start to battle a bit better than Kanto, he just felt kinda stagnant.

It's probably the reason I initially like AG Ash so much, besides the character redesign, he really felt like a slightly more mature/older version than the OS one. Back then writers were giving us this illusion Ash was actually going to develop and grow each saga, so between that and Ash acting as a mentor to May for a bit, it felt like a noticeable change. Of course nowadays we know Ash's character will forever be rebooted/stagnant, but back in the early days of the franchise we didn't know that.
 

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
I think it's that AG Ash for a while felt like he was actually wary of old habits, which was kind of cathartic in a formula driven show. He was actually genre savvy to Team Rocket's traps sometimes and was shown mentoring May on occasion, his experience felt like it had effect on the plot here. These elements were downplayed in later series because the formula was clearly there to stay and couldn't have him interfering and complicating it, oddly even SM despite being more character driven, maintains his dimness towards the formula, something ironically even Kanto Ash seemed way more self aware of (eg. his reply to the thousandth TR interruption being a rightful "Not you guys AGAIN!" over the genuinely surprised and outraged "TEAM ROCKET!").

This was something I think was tragically overlooked with XY Ash, despite being more battle competent he was a complete prop to the formula. Only the first few episodes toyed with this in impressive ways (eg. him actually avoiding a potential 'disobedient' arc with Froakie by immediately getting what's wrong with him).
 
Last edited:
Top