Do you consider rivals almost as important as main cast members each series?

[Edewinr]

While we now have a new human cast with Ash every gen, what also seems important is we always have new rivals every gen that tend to become the driving force of the story each gen:

OS: Gary
AG: Drew/Harley
DP: Paul/Barry, Zoey, etc
BW: Trip, Stephen, Georgia, Burungly
XY: Alan, Shota, Shauna/Miette
SM: Gladion, Kukui, Hau

It's hard to talk about each saga without at least mentioning the rivals and what they did each series because a lot of the plots of each saga tend to revolve around them. What do you think?

 

[Pokegirl Fan~]

I think they are. They tie into a main character's development or whatnot.

 

[Zoruagible]

Yes, well.... some are.
Ash's best rivals(Paul and Gary) grew as characters with him, and Drew/Harley and Zoey pushed May/Dawn to become a better coordinator.
And I like Nando, Barry, Bianca, Stephan, and Hau.... but if you take them away, nothing of importance was really lost. Not every rival is important, heck none of Serena's were!

 

[thedarkdragon11]

It depends on who...

 

[J.Agera]

It depends on how a series Portrays them.
If a rival is involved in a main character's character arc, he is important.
For example Paul. Who was the entire reason Ash had development in DP.
While in XY there is a catalyst but Ash himself was mostly responsible for his own development.
Which is why rivals in XY don't seem that important to me.
In DP Ash and Paul's rivalry carried the entire series otherwise it would have been worse than AG.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

Rivals like Paul and Drew were just as important as the main characters were because they played a big part in the main character's growth.Guys like Alain,Barry,Sawyer,Bianca and Kenny not so much.

 

[SerGoldenhandtheJust]

Paul proved how having a rival from the start, having many appearances and battles in which he also loses some could lead to a satisfying league climax and story. If Paul was handled like Ash's rivals in AG, DP wouldn't be as praised. Rivals are very important. Tho I won't blame the anime, the games too have pretty much ruined rivals now. Bede and Marnie might break the trend of bad rivals but I won't get my hopes up for an anime appearance like Paul considering the eight region thing

 

[Ignition]

Yes because they add to the narrative. Just because we’re not seeing their every action doesn’t make them any less important. They’re probably not a priority compared to Ash and friends and some are definitely more important than others, but they are important

 

[shoz999]

For most of them, no. The only rival I can really see having that much of an impact that it would change a lot if you took him out of the series is Alain. Everyone else, I believe they aren't as important as the main cast.

 

[Kuzehiko]

In DP and XY only I'd say.
Paul was important to Ash's development and one of DP's important plot points. Alain was very important to the plot of XYZ.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

In DP and XY only I'd say.
Paul was important to Ash's development and one of DP's important plot points. Alain was very important to the plot of XYZ.

How?His only real importance was with Team Flare and becoming the strongest Mega Evolution trainer in the world,there was no real reason for him to enter the Kalos league other than to just stop Ash from winning.Alain being added to the main plot didn't make Ash any better as a trainer or battler.

 

[J.Agera]

How?His only real importance was with Team Flare and becoming the strongest Mega Evolution trainer in the world,there was no real reason for him to enter the Kalos league other than to just stop Ash from winning.Alain being added to the main plot didn't make Ash any better as a trainer or battler.

Ash's rivalry with Alain had it's true conclusion in the TF arc, not the league, and TF arc IS THE MAIN PLOT of XYZ.
Although its not as important as Paul, it's definitely 2nd most important I would say.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

Ash's rivalry with Alain had it's true conclusion in the TF arc, not the league, and TF arc IS THE MAIN PLOT of XYZ.
Although its not as important as Paul, it's definitely 2nd most important I would say.

Their rivalry was mediocre at best,they battled each other a few times and that was it.Alain had no real business being apart of the league when his goal was to become the strongest mega evolution user not become pokemon champion.Their rivalry isn't even second it's towards the bottom,May's rivalry with Drew is definitely 2nd behind Ash/Paul.

 

[J.Agera]

Their rivalry was mediocre at best,they battled each other a few times and that was it.Alain had no real business being apart of the league when his goal was to become the strongest mega evolution user not become pokemon champion.Their rivalry isn't even second it's towards the bottom,May's rivalry with Drew is definitely 2nd behind Ash/Paul.

It was not mediocre.

Oh ok, looks like I am pretty late to the party.
I know people in Serebii like to think Alain wasn't good rival, but he is probably the 2nd best rival so far.
Him meeting Ash, battling Greninja, he found enjoyment in battling with Ash, after all the stuff he went through, he found a challenge for his Charizard. Thus he easily agreed on joining the league because Ash told him to, he wanted to battle more, he re-discovered enjoyment in battling only because of Ash.
On the other hand, Ash had just overcome his depression, he saw Alain as a pillar to master and improve his Ash-Greninja form because his MCX was a worthy opponent.
Thus you can See Alain quickly finishing his opponents in the League directly starting with his MCX, except Ash, because Ash was the only one that mattered to him, he joined the league to battle Ash, as established.

Their rivalry wasn't about training methods or Pokemon.
It's conclusion was done during the TF arc AND NOT during a battle like most other rivalries.
He is Ash's second best rival and only Sawyer and Gary come close. That's it.

May and Drew had a completely different dynamic but yeah it was good.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

It was not mediocre.

Their rivalry wasn't about training methods or Pokemon.
It's conclusion was done during the TF arc AND NOT during a battle like most other rivalries.
He is Ash's second best rival and only Sawyer and Gary come close. That's it.

May and Drew had a completely different dynamic but yeah it was good.

Their goals were completely different,one wanted to be a pokemon master and the other wanted to be the strongest mega evolution trainer,there's no conflict between the two at all and neither grow or develop off each other,Alain just came off as more of a league rival but with more screentime.Them being involved with TF doesn't change anything.May and Drew actually had a developing rivalry,had conflict and shared the same goal.

Alain really didn't need to show up in the main plot he was fine in those XY specials.Adding him in the main plotline was pretty much fanservice,there was no real reason for him to enter into the Kalos league because his goal isn't to become an elite four member or pokemon champion,they just brought him in as a roadblock to keep Ash from winning the league.Ash's second best rival will always be Gary and that more than likely won't ever change.The two have history with each other when they were younger.

They both shared the same goal,even though they didn't battle much they still had good interactions whenever they met and there was conflict along with comedy which is better than anything I seen between Ash/Alain.Lastly what makes Alain or Sawyer better rivals than Barry,Stephan,Morrison,Harrison,Tyson and Trip?

 

[J.Agera]

Their goals were completely different,one wanted to be a pokemon master and the other wanted to be pokemon master,there's no conflict between the two at all and neither grow or develop off each other,Alain just came off as more of a league rival but with more screentime.Them being involved with TF doesn't change anything.May and Drew actually had a developing rivalry,had conflict and shared the same goal.

Alain really didn't need to show up in the main plot he was fine in those XY specials.Adding him in the main plotline was pretty much fanservice,there was no real reason for him to enter into the Kalos league because his goal isn't to become an elite four member or pokemon champion,they just brought him in as a roadblock to keep Ash from winning the league.Ash's second best rival will always be Gary and that more than likely won't ever change.The two have history with each other when they were younger.

They both shared the same goal,even though they didn't battle much they still had good interactions whenever they met and there was conflict along with comedy which is better than anything I seen between Ash/Alain.Lastly what makes Alain or Sawyer better rivals than Barry,Stephan,Morrison,Harrison,Tyson and Trip?

Did you even read?
This was not your standard rivalry where you fight for one thing.
He was made to join the Kalos League for more emotional development.
In the end Alain was the one who developed from it.
Just because Ash and Gary have history doesn't change the fact that their rivalry wasn't written so well.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

Did you even read?
This was not your standard rivalry where you fight for one thing.

But how does this make their rivalry if you can even call it one better than the ones in the previous series?Just because it's different doesn't necessarily mean it's good or better.And if they aren't really fighting for the same thing you can't consider that a rivalry,I suggest you look up what the word means.

He was made to join the Kalos League for more emotional development.

Emotional development?You do realize that if Alain never showed up Ash would have won the league.That was the only reason they brought him back was to keep Ash from winning.Emotional development has nothing to do with the rivalry if you can even call it that.At this point the more I go into this the more I'm starting to believe that Alain really isn't a rival at all and is just a friend of Ash.

In the end Alain was the one who developed from it.

But what does that have anything to do with Ash when we're talking about "rivals"?Honestly Sawyer has more of a case than he does.

Just because Ash and Gary have history doesn't change the fact that their rivalry wasn't written so well.

Who f*cking cares,majority of the fandom have Gary as one of Ash's best rivals in the entire series and there's no changing that just because they didn't battle each other much.The fact is they grew up together and became rivals,their interactions were better than anything ever shown between Ash and Alain,Gary became less of a jerk in the Johto region.What makes Alain a better rival than Barry,Stephan,Morrison,Tyson,Harrison and Trip?Barry was entertaining,battled Ash and shared the same goal along with idolizing Paul which was the opposite with Ash.Morrison despite only being a league rival was better than Ash/Alain.

------------------------------------------------------------------
https://forums.serebii.net/threads/best-rival-of-ash.669855/
Where were you when this poll was created?

 

[ash&charizardfan]

I think Gladion may very well be one of the best developed rivals in the anime. He also got to take part in arcs like the Aether and UB Black arcs, and his Lycanroc and Sillvally were developed nicely over the course of the saga. I’ve been rewatching his episodes and now I see how well handled he was over the course of the saga.

No, as an individual character he was well written but as a rival he was lcking, most of his appearances had more to do with his own issues than continuing his rivalry with ash, paul, gary and sawyer were much better written rials than him. It was similar issues with alain as well.

 

[ash&charizardfan]

That may be true, but the Lycanroc rivalries were pretty much established from his first episode, and he and Ash battled a few times before the league. Besides that as you said, I like how Gladion was developed with his own story issues during the Aether arc, trying to hide Type:Null, helping out in the UB Black arc, and we got to see his progression in the league on screen and beating Kiawe too.

Due to the way SM is set up we couldn’t see him competing with Ash for badges like past rivals, but as a character and role with Ash they did a great job.

They could have competed as number of z crystals or number of trials who finished first but that was not the case, lycannroc rivalry was the only better part of there fued but even that only happened two times before the league out of which when they battled second time there rivalry was put aside in favour of gladion trying to find his father. Gladion vs ash was massively underwhelming just like most of major arcs of SM like aether arc, UB black.

 

[Epicocity]

How?His only real importance was with Team Flare and becoming the strongest Mega Evolution trainer in the world,there was no real reason for him to enter the Kalos league other than to just stop Ash from winning.Alain being added to the main plot didn't make Ash any better as a trainer or battler.

Alain just wanted to be the strongest, not the strongest Mega Evolution trainer. That was the whole point of his arc: constantly finding reasons to continue his pursuit of strength to the point it became toxic to him and all his relationships. It literally showed in the final battle with Ash where Ash has no problems with who wins or loses and Alain screams that he has to be the strongest no matter what.

So, yes, their goals do overlap and align, though I'd hardly call him the main rival of the series.

As for why he entered the League: Mega Evolution energy. He even says as much.