DP 187: Satoshi VS Shinji - Rivalry Battle Finale

[Sparklingwater]

i'm not sure if it would be lazy or interesting to have the outcome of this battle be the reverse of the previous ash vs paul 6 on 6 battle, with ash winning with only two of his pokemon being knocked out to show just how much he's improved.

going by what we already know i think the match up's will go something like this:

drapion vs buizel
gastrodon vs staraptor
pikachu vs froslass
gliscor vs ninjask
torerra vs aggron
infernape vs electivire

(obviously theres going to be switching and stuff but i think they're the most logical face offs)
i'm going to be excited to see infernape vs electivire since theyre parallels, that electabuzz witnessed every one of it's evolutions and chimchar witnessed it evolve from an elekid.

also i TOTALLY did not see gliscor coming back squirtle/charizard style, i thought he was gone forever. COOL!

BTW, all of Ash's pokemon has come back like "squirtle/charizard style" thus far including cydaquil, heracross, knotowl, maybe donphane too. I have no doubt in the LT battle, there will be more of Ash's pokemon's been powered up while they were away from him. It's interesting and new to watch, but it kind of gay if you think about it. The most ridicous one is heracross; it learnt a hyperbeam wave that's strong enough to matched with darkrai's kamehameha while sitting around in Oak's gardening sucking bubasaur all day.

 

[ssquaderi8]

drapion vs gliscor has also been confirmed

 

[Rokroad]

BOLD is winner.

DP 186:

Ninjask vs Staraptor
Gastrodon vs Staraptor
Gastrodon vs Buizel
Aggron vs Buizel
Aggron vs Torterra
Drapion vs Buizel
Drapion vs Gliscor

END OF DP 186

Drapion vs Gliscor
Ninjask vs Torterra
Froslass vs Gliscor
Froslass vs Pikachu
Electivire vs Pikachu
Electivire vs Infernape

PAUL 4
ASH 6

 

[Corzola]

If the match - any match - ends 6 - 5 that match could have gone either way. With two trainers that alike in terms of skills and Pokemons battle even/6-5 it is more the one who just this day is better. Who just that day is better focused, sees more opportunities than the other etc.

Regardless of line- up none of the trainers would have used a Pokemon that he did not think could win. So we may say that Pokemon x or y is probably weaker than z that Pokemons trainer does not think so. So say Paul losing and not usuing Torterra Paul thought he could win with another Pokemon.

Pokemon leauge- battles are like tennis tournaments, you win you advance, you lose you are out of the tournament and that makes no room for misstakes. Then the line- up are so well- thought as one can possibly think, because you don´t get a second chance. The team chosen are the team that the trainer regards as his best for the match.

So lets close the debate that any specific Pokemon would be a particular bad choice in the fight.

 

[ssquaderi8]

wellash vs morrison and ash vs tyson wereboth 6:5

 

[Sparklingwater]

If the match - any match - ends 6 - 5 that match could have gone either way. With two trainers that alike in terms of skills and Pokemons battle even/6-5 it is more the one who just this day is better. Who just that day is better focused, sees more opportunities than the other etc.

Regardless of line- up none of the trainers would have used a Pokemon that he did not think could win. So we may say that Pokemon x or y is probably weaker than z that Pokemons trainer does not think so. So say Paul losing and not usuing Torterra Paul thought he could win with another Pokemon.

Pokemon leauge- battles are like tennis tournaments, you win you advance, you lose you are out of the tournament and that makes no room for misstakes. Then the line- up are so well- thought as one can possibly think, because you don´t get a second chance. The team chosen are the team that the trainer regards as his best for the match.

So lets close the debate that any specific Pokemon would be a particular bad choice in the fight.

That's ********. Brazil didn't do as good as it did because Ronaldino and Ronaldo wasn't in the team this year. Why people say that? Why is that a logical debate? It is because they have a great history and has proven that they can lead the team or all the way. Just as Paul's old team did has proved it through countless battles with Ash and with other trainers.

wellash vs morrison and ash vs tyson wereboth 6:5

Yeah, that all happend because of Anime principle. The main character usually always shown to be a weaker than the other guys just so the show would be more interesting when the main character finally come out victorious in the end.

 

[TheNewGuy]

Torterra was never Paul's main battling pokemon. Electivire is it's most used pokemon and the first one we seen him use. Being his starter doesn't make Torterra his strongest either. He uses many pokemon throughout multiple regions. It was revealed that he caught Weavile and Honchkrow before coming to Sinnoh.

Honchkrow is very power, but how says these pokemon can't be just as good? Maybe even better.

Electivire might be stronger than Torterra but you'd be a fool to say it isn't close.

And yeah, these Pokemon might be just as good. But their strength not being previously established in the narrative cheapens the battle.

 

[pokemonloverXD]

Well, Paul's team isn't what I expected... I mean his main Pokemon aren't there except Electivire. WTF? Froslass, Ninjask and Gastrodon? I really want to know how strong they are that make Paul decided to keep them. I'm not so surprise that Ash is using the same team which Paul defeated, they need their revenge after all. Sad for Torterra, it won't get its revenge against Honchkrow

 

[Corzola]

That's ********. Brazil didn't do as good as it did because Ronaldino and Ronaldo wasn't in the team this year. Why people say that? Why is that a logical debate? It is because they have a great history and has proven that they can lead the team or all the way.

I assume that you are refering to the World Cup in soccer this summer. Brazil lost because after half the match against Holland they assumed that the match was home in all but name. Then they mentally stopped playing, thinking they just had so wait out the remaning 45 minutes and advance in the tournament. It had nothing to do that Ronaldo or Ronaldinhio was left out of the team.

A comparable situation is that Paul takes a huge lead (say 3 - 1 or 4 - 2), and then Ashs´Pokemons fights better than expected while Paul gets relaxed, thinking that the match is home, and gets nervous when Ash comes closing in. Then it has nothing to do with Pauls Pokemon but with Paul. So the match will be all about how the trainers handle the battles than the Pokemons. 6 - 5 means that one did just a little bit better. Not that anyones choice of Pokemon was wrong.

 

[Sparklingwater]

^ So much for the 4 years hyp leading to this battle. What's so different about this battle and all his previous 6 v 6 battles then?

 

[WaterShuriken]

The thing is, Paul knows that Ash has been using reserves all this time. He had to change his strategy so Ash won't predict what he wll do.

 

[Eternal Darkness]

The thing is, Paul knows that Ash has been using reserves all this time. He had to change his strategy so Ash won't predict what he wll do.

That or he wants to train Pokemon against a trainer he has won every time not including PokeRinger.

 

[WaterShuriken]

That or he wants to train Pokemon against a trainer he has won every time not including PokeRinger.

How do you "train" pokemon in a league?

 

[HoennMaster]

Actually, I'm kinda liking this new team. I'd like to see Honchkrow and Torterra in there, but I'm actually glad Ursaring, Weavile, and in a way Magmortar are not there.

So you get over it if you don't like what some of us are saying ignore it!!!!

You should take you own advice.

I find it a cheap win for Ash, I mean they downgraded Paul's team mostly, minus Electivire, Drapion, and possibly Aggron for the sole purpose of giving Ash an easier chance to win....

That's complete BS. They didn't downgrade his team at all. All of Paul's Pokémon are strong and we already knew he was winning anyway. Paul is using the same tactics he has for the last four years, rotating his pokémon.

 

[Rizardon]

Pretty pathetic whiners around here.

It's not like any Pokemon in Paul's team except Electivire had a real rivalry going on so who cares if he's using a different team this time?

The lack of Torterra is justified for the fact that they'd both have Torterra's and that would be lame. In the Hoenn league, Ash still had a Grovyle while Tyson had a Sceptile so that didnt matter. Ursaring kept getting beaten by Chimchar, so it makes sense that he'd take him out too.

Also, there isnt really anything as a Pokemon being suited to a trainer. Why dont Froslass and Gastrodon fit Paul? Did Gliscor look like something you'd expect for Ash? Or Gible etc for that matter? Whatever the guys' name was, deathseer or something, who refuses to watch this episode because you dont get to see his regular team, that's just pathetic and your loss. >.>

 

[1rkhachatryan]

Actually, I'm kinda liking this new team. I'd like to see Honchkrow and Torterra in there, but I'm actually glad Ursaring, Weavile, and in a way Magmortar are not there.



You should take you own advice.



That's complete BS. They didn't downgrade his team at all. All of Paul's Pokémon are strong and we already knew he was winning anyway. Paul is using the same tactics he has for the last four years, rotating his pokémon.

ok one stay out of it it does not concern you me and the guy this involved are cool now so mind your own business.
And two they totally did downgrade it by throwing in a bunch of new pokemon that we have not seen prove themselves and that do not match him at all and im not talking about drapion and aggron cuz im fine wit those two cuz they match paul and electivire since we know what it can do already. The problem here is frostlass gastrodon and ninjask. Ninjask while im not happy about it at all at least we knew paul had one so its not as shocking. But frostlass and gastrodon i mean come on they killed the battle and the hype by adding these too.

 

[thunderblade12]

X = Paul's old team
Y = Paul's New team
Z = Ash's Sinnoh team

If X > Z (6:2 lost with in there previous battle)
If Z > Y (6:5 win for Ash in the league), then

Y cannot be equal to more than X.

That is also pokemon math.

Although people could still argue otherwise in a different context in the past 600 posts.

It would make sense if Ash was battling these pokemon immediately after he battled the others. That's not the case. He even flat out said in the Uxie episode that he was going to make his Sinnoh team stronger and wins the next battle against Paul.

So it's more like this:

X = Paul's old team
Y = Paul's new team
Z = Ash's Sinnoh team

X>Z
Y<Z + 2

Doesn't really say that this team is definitely as strong as the old one, but it proves that we have no reason to be skeptics and believe otherwise.

 

[Ray the Ruler]

See this is exactly what Paul wants, his strategy is so amazing that he's got the viewers just as annoyed as he wants Ash to be. Paul is purposely putting together a team Ash has never seen before simply to slap him in the face. Ash will likely be just as annoyed as a lot of people here seem to be about not sticking to the rivalry that carried them this far into the Sinnoh League, which means Ash will be fighting with rage on his mind and that would lead to defeat. This is just like Paul to out-smart Ash and take the advantage, of course this time it back-fires and Ash is able to pull through and beat Paul's seemingly random team; when the team is likely built with pummeling Ash in mind.

I too am disappointed the writers decided to make Paul 100% consistent in being a jerk but for me Aggron saves the day, any team with Aggron on it becomes incredibly awesome. I look forward to seeing how Ash handles the jerk move.

 

[SkyDeity]

I hope Paul puts up a good fight. We all know Ash will win, though.

 

[Grassmen]

It would make sense if Ash was battling these pokemon immediately after he battled the others. That's not the case. He even flat out said in the Uxie episode that he was going to make his Sinnoh team stronger and wins the next battle against Paul.

So it's more like this:

X = Paul's old team
Y = Paul's new team
Z = Ash's Sinnoh team

X>Z
Y<Z + 2

Doesn't really say that this team is definitely as strong as the old one, but it proves that we have no reason to be skeptics and believe otherwise.

This "pokemon math" thing doesn't work; in maths, yes, if X>Z and Z>Y, then X>Y too, but this overlooks the fact that X, Y, and Z in terms of pokemon teams all have differing compatibilities.

Let's say X is a Grass Team, Y is a Fire Team, and Z is a Water Team. Perhaps X>Z because grass has the advantage against water, and Z>Y because water is good against fire. According to this "pokemon math", then X>Y. But we know that the Fire Team has the advantage against the Grass team, and so is more likely to win. (Simplifying things just to type here to make things easier).

So if we go back to the Paul situation, this doesn't mean his new team is worse than his old one. It just means that Ash's team (or perhaps, Ash himself) has the advantage over the team Paul chose. Speculation here, but I think Paul was expecting Ash to use his reserves, and so chose his Pokemon to prepare for what he predicted. It seems that he may have predicted wrong though.