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Dragon Battle! Ash VS Iris!! (1154)

Trainer and pokemon can learn new move during battle must means they have deep trust toward each other.
His Pokémon will always listen to him, but him asking and expecting that after seeing its damage doesn’t sit right with me.

Ash isn’t the selfless type. His eye is only on victory. That’s why he’s better off becoming a Pikachu master.
 
I just don't personally believe the Dragonite's best feat, 1v2ing Korrina, is on the level of a Champion tier Pokemon.
The other pokemon who have swept Korrina is Alain's Mega Charizard whose Fire attack is super effective against Mega Lucario. This Mega Charizard beat Ash Greninja who can fight equally against Diantha's Mega Gardevoir. I say Dragonite is on the same level as those pokemons.
 

Illusio

No words, only rage
Finally watched the subs, some random musings:

-I was very happy with Iris here. She's still similar to her Best Wishes self, but you can tell she grew up. She feels more well rounded in both her strong and weak points and shown a better understanding of Dragon Pokemon, so well done JN for bringing back a character in a good way.

-The episode should've been two parts, you could've easily split the character focus and the battle and still have enough to fill it.

-The battle was pretty rushed, the hyped Dragonite battle didn't last that long and Dracovish's were one shots so that was pretty disappointing. Haxorus vs. Happynite was better, but still a little weak.

-I was happy with Haxorus. I've been waiting for it to evolve for a long time so I'm glad it finally happened. I would've liked to have seen some interactions with Pikachu so that we could see more of his personality, but lack of time probably hurt him. Battle-wise, while I saw some clowning on him I felt he did fine with the limit of the episode. He creamed Dracovish and was doing well against Happynite before Draco Meteor, so it wasn't like he got destroyed. Also, he did show some good strategy with Iris with that confusion cleansing headbutt and keeping his distance from Dracovish, I'm fine with his first onscreen battle since it was already limited.

-Iris thought Mr. Fish was cute, best companion confirmed.

So 8/10, should've been two parts, but at least we got some great moments.
 
His Pokémon will always listen to him, but him asking and expecting that after seeing its damage doesn’t sit right with me.

Ash isn’t the selfless type. His eye is only on victory. That’s why he’s better off becoming a Pikachu master.
Ash haters gona hate Ash no matter what he do.

Funny how you change from "Iris talk already replenish Dragonite from damage" to "Ash instruct still damaged Dragonite".
 
The other pokemon who have swept Korrina is Alain's Mega Charizard whose Fire attack is super effective against Mega Lucario. This Mega Charizard beat Ash Greninja who can fight equally against Diantha's Mega Gardevoir. I say Dragonite is on the same level as those pokemons.
I'm not sure I'm understanding you. Are you saying that Korrina is close to the level of Alain and that Dragonite has been shown to be on the level of MCX and Ash-Greninja?
 

Blood Red

【推しの子】
Like this? Personally yeah. I just don't think this is the way to portray the storyline of showcasing that Champions and E4s aren't gods and are actually humans that can be beaten.
I mean, I'm not exactly a complete fan of how the entire battle played out, but it makes sense that Iris just felt like a regular opponent against Ash; after all, Ash is a Champion himself. Lots of people seem to forget this.
 

Watershuriken97

Well-Known Member
Ash’s approach is reckless to me. His Pokémon love him and want to win for him but he doesn’t understand them besides Pikachu. No trainer should have a strategy of requiring your damaged Pokémon to learn a new move on the spot. He got lucky and it worked out for him but it doesn’t make it right. It’s concerning.
But is this that different from using ice aqua jet and those? I mean, if written differently, ash could just as easily have used the hurricane with dragon pulse absorbed in it and lauch that towards haxorus to win. We've had new moves/evolutions happen so many times in the anime? He protected dragonite from the psycho cut and dpulse with the counter shield, he made it fight safe and from a distance, using its opponents power against it? Where is that reckless?
 

Blood Red

【推しの子】
Ash’s approach is reckless to me. His Pokémon love him and want to win for him but he doesn’t understand them besides Pikachu. No trainer should have a strategy of requiring your damaged Pokémon to learn a new move on the spot. He got lucky and it worked out for him but it doesn’t make it right. It’s concerning.
...he clearly understands (or tries to, at least) all his Pokémon, what're you even saying?
 
I'm not sure I'm understanding you. Are you saying that Korrina is close to the level of Alain and that Dragonite has been shown to be on the level of MCX and Ash-Greninja?
No, I mean Ash's Dragonite, Ash Greninja, Alain's Mega Charizard X, and Diantha's Mega Gardevoir is on similiar level.
 
I mean, I'm not exactly a complete fan of how the entire battle played out, but it makes sense that Iris just felt like a regular opponent against Ash; after all, Ash is a Champion himself. Lots of people seem to forget this.
I keep on saying this, but Ash isn't using the Pokemon he won his Alolan championship with. If Ash busted out Lyranoc and Pikachu and used them to beat Iris, I wouldn't have the kind of problems I have with the battle.
No, I mean Ash's Dragonite, Ash Greninja, Alain's Mega Charizard X, and Diantha's Mega Gardevoir is on similiar level.
...Okay, man, I'm just going to say I strongly disagree. I don't think they showed this with Dragonite at all.
 

RafaSceptile

Well-Known Member
No, I mean Ash's Dragonite, Ash Greninja, Alain's Mega Charizard X, and Diantha's Mega Gardevoir is on similiar level.
I can see Ash's Dragonite being on a very high note, he was proved until now to be extrememy resistent in battle, Even more than Goodra, because Iris never healing Dragonite
 

Blood Red

【推しの子】
No, I mean Ash's Dragonite, Ash Greninja, Alain's Mega Charizard X, and Diantha's Mega Gardevoir is on similiar level.
I wouldn't say they're on the same level, personally. However, Dragonite's power level clearly stands out amongst the many Pokémon we've seen in the anime. He has that 'Champion's ace Pokémon' quality to him, like Charizard, Sceptile or Greninja.
 

RafaSceptile

Well-Known Member
I wouldn't say they're on the same level, personally. However, Dragonite's power level clearly stands out amongst the many Pokémon we've seen in the anime. He has that 'Champion's ace Pokémon' quality to him, like Charizard, Sceptile or Greninja.
Well, same is not the same as similar, even when they are similar words (?
 
Yes, he use stronger pokemon than the one he used at Manalo Conference final.
I feel like we're going around in circles at this point, but so you're telling me that the anime portrayed Dragonite and Dracovish on the level of Pikachu and Lyranoc? I just have to really disagree and say that isn't at all what happened.
 

Blood Red

【推しの子】
I keep on saying this, but Ash isn't using the Pokemon he won his Alolan championship with. If Ash busted out Lyranoc and Pikachu and used them to beat Iris, I wouldn't have the kind of problems I have with the battle.
His Alolan team wasn't that strong either. Plus, Dragonite might've just been one of those 'mons that's just super-strong right out the gate.

...I mean, they could've done it a thousand ways that were better than this, but they didn't. I still don't get why people are making excuses for Iris losing though, when it can all be blamed on bad writing.
 
I’m good with training to learn a new move or unexpected new moves/evolutions during battles, but Ash clearly had a specific outcome in mind and rolled the dice. Like always, his asspulls worked out for him but he deserves to be called out. It comes across as selfish to me especially looking at the damage Dragonite had taken.

If he had won using one of his other weird strategies like using hurricane off the wall or something, at least I can respect the creativity. But no trainer should expect a new move to happen and pulled off successfully during battle.
 
I feel like we're going around in circles at this point, but so you're telling me that the anime portrayed Dragonite and Dracovish on the level of Pikachu and Lyranoc? I just have to really disagree and say that isn't at all what happened.
Dracovish was only lucky because Iris and even Drayden do not know how this pokemon species battle.

In a rematch, Iris will defeat it in no time unless Ash manage to figure out how to cover for its weakness.
 
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