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Duuuddee... Pass the blunt...

Discussion in 'Debate Forum' started by R4GEKILL!!!, Aug 12, 2011.

  1. ShinyUmbreon189

    ShinyUmbreon189 RealTalkRealFlow

    I never said it "cures" mental illnesses, it helps it. Just like Xanax helps anxiety. Xanax doesn't "cure" anxiety, it just helps it. Comparing marijuana and prescription meds is completely fair. If the marijuana's helping the patient suffering from anxiety then they're gonna continually use it because it helps. Rather get help than no help at all right?

    Edit: Both drugs will still get you high but marijuana is far more safe than Xanax.

    http://drugabuse.com/library/the-effects-of-xanax-use/
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2012
  2. Doux

    Doux Well-Known Member

    I resent people who use it for recreation, but that's not the question.

    People are going to do it regardless of whether or not it's legalized, so I suppose I wouldn't be too distraught if it became legal...at least then we could tax the godding poop out of it.

    My real problem with it is that it's continually being portrayed as not being dangerous and that's not true.
    It suppresses your immune system, making you more susceptible to disease or, if you're using it as treatment for a disease you already have, it increases the chances of not recovering. It increases phlegm production and leads to a constant cough, similar to smoker's cough. There's always cancer risk, too, which is awful.
    It's not the worst thing you could do to yourself, but that doesn't make it something you should choose to do.
     
  3. Celestial Moth

    Celestial Moth Bug-Type Deity

    Well bro it isn't dangerous, though their are links between people who abuse the substance to some illness's that by no means clarifies smoking ganja as a
    dangerous activity. I can name countless activities that are recreational and which can cause instant life changing problems,accidents and even death.
    The thing that most people do not consider, is the blatant benefits which are obvious due to the amount of people that choose to smoke ganja.

    I myself dont smoke weed anymore and i quit because my mindfulness and state of consciousness was no longer being benefited from the mediational state of mind
    induced by this substance. I also use to smoke weed before did yoga, because it relaxes the muscles and allows me to elevate my state of mind even higher while practicing yoga, which in turn created a blissful state that i wish i could verbalize to you.

    Their are some who use ganja to relax their spirit and mind, some who purely unconsciously benefit from the change of state of consciousness and some who are mindlessly smoking ganja for an escape. Though regardless of ones reasons the positive outcomes from smoking ganja eclipses the negative stigmas.

    If we were to take India for example, alcohol is basically outlawed and Ganja basically decriminalized to an extent. In many Indian communities their are spiritual people who use the states of consciousness encountered through ganja as purely a meditational tool to benefit their knowledge,spirit and well being. Because in many Indian communities
    ganja is practically legal, people don't abuse it and some even further their states of consciousness into planes and states of mind that i'm sure you as-well as many other could never in this lifetime comprehend.

    Your argument that, ganja is dangerous is somewhat irrelevant because many other recreational activities that are tolerated by the west are soo much more dangerous than smoking ganja.
     
  4. Lolsgod

    Lolsgod Sexy Trainer

    Except weed has downsides, like addiction and other long term and short term side affects
     
  5. Celestial Moth

    Celestial Moth Bug-Type Deity

    People get addicted to cooking,eating and get overweight which has a lot more health problems than smoking ganja, yet this is tolerated by most.
    Again, the argument that it is more dangerous than other activities is clearly eclipsed in comparison to the other recreational dangerous activities that many sanctioned as "ok".
    That argument means nothing, because their are so many more recreational activities that have horrible short term and long term effects...
     
  6. Lolsgod

    Lolsgod Sexy Trainer

    But see addiction to weed is not like an addiction to cooking (I don't even think thats a thing) or video games, weed addiction comes with withdrawls and isn't as hooking as weed, to get over and addiction to weed requires professional help, an addiction to things such as cooking or video games isn't because you'll eventually get tired of the doing the same actions over and over again.
     
  7. Celestial Moth

    Celestial Moth Bug-Type Deity

    Ermm alright ill admit that maybe an addiction to weed is harder to overcome than other addictions, though im gonna present to you a few example were their's absolutly n o difference in the cases. Some of which are obviously and blatantly more toxic and or dangerous than smoking weed.

    Their are people who are addicted to:

    Eating food
    Playing video games
    Drinking alcohol
    Sex
    Playing sports

    The list is infinite. An addiction comprises of a physiological attachment and or dependency upon a substance,activity or material object, In which without, a person with said addiction is emotional,mental and or physically compromised. The fact that you summarized that an addiction to weed is different to any other addiction is frankly insulting bro.

    This next quote is from a post on the medical news today website

    The link to this article is here ----> http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/info/addiction/

    People who have any addiction need "professional" help. Weather it be an over-weight being whom might go to a doctor, nutritionist and personal trainer to get the help they might be wanting.
    A person whom has an unhealthy addiction to anything suffers withdrawn syndromes, a person who use to be my friend use to drink soooo much coke'a'cola that when he stopped he broke out in rashes and sores because his body had grown dependent on the chemicals within that substance.

    He's a small example of an Carbohydrate Addiction written by the author Rachael F. Heller from the Department of Pathology, Mount Sinai School of Medicine, New York, New York 10029, USA
    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0306987794900043

    Your argument is COMPLETELY INVALID bro because like all the other addictions that people suffer from, people who are not strong enough to overcome them seek professional help in one form or another. The contributing attributes to any addiction like a unstable state of mind, which may make people susceptible to be influenced into having problems with any addiction are completely irrelevant bro. Because as mentioned and state in this and previous posts, there's an infinite number of addictions and an infinite amount of variations to the physiological reasoning's to those addictions.

    SO saying that

    Means diddly squott! Because all addictions come with withdrawal symptoms and cognitive processes that are effected different and in fact varies in intensity from addiction to addition.


    I can somewhat interpret what you meant by that post, though they are exactly the same as an addiction to ganja. Because any addiction, is caused because of an unstable emotional state which as a result creates a dependency upon something which can fill the emotional void and or create an attachment.
    Obviously their are some substances that can create a stronger attachment and or chemical dependency towards some people, but this is only because of the person themselfs.

    For example, 2 people try parachuting out of a plane for the first time. Both loved it though, only one went back to do it again.
    I can explain this simply and logically, the person who went back, enjoyed the chemical release within their brain which was caused
    by the "jumping out of a plane" experience and thus, wished to gain that same feeling again, this in itself is an addiction to parachuting is it not???

    Your argument means nothing towards the reasons as to why marijuana should stay Illegal because your argument is essentially that, it is a dangerous addiction
    and its a dangerous activity to undergo. But their are hundreds of thousands of activities and addictions that are more dangerous and toxic to other people then smoking ganja.
     
  8. Lolsgod

    Lolsgod Sexy Trainer

    So then lemme ask you this, whats the point of legalizing something else for people to get addicted to? That doesn't sound like a smart idea.
     
  9. Celestial Moth

    Celestial Moth Bug-Type Deity

    Well before i address that, i feel that i have to address the obvious fact that it seems that your ignoring/ not reading parts of my previous posts, because i stated some of the reasons in teh very first post i recently posted today. I suggest you actually read em ( or read again...)

    Because of the stigmas and over exaggerated proper-gander produced by the many companies and organizations, the positive outcomes and positive effects of
    ingesting marijuana and or its many cannabinoids in varies forms are suppressed.

    This are a small list of the many things that can benefit humans if cannabis was decriminalized:
    ~Contentment
    ~Greater spirituality
    ~ The Terminally Ill can become happy and or content with their lifes.
    ~ People can Heighten their state of consciousness.
    ~ People can use it as a meditational tool to help many things.
    ~ IF it was decriminalized, research on many of the current criminalized canabinoids might cure illness's
    ~Cannabis seed oil is drop for drop healthier than fish oil, which would make us healthier if synthesized and or ingested

    Cannabis can also be used to create over 20,000 different products INDEPENDENTLY! AGAIN a small list
    ~ Paper
    ~Soap
    ~Clothing
    ~ Containment vessels ( Water bottles,jars ect )
    ~ Textiles


    TO me judging by your posts in reaction to the posts i have made, you ignoring a lot and you've done very little research on this subject.
    I Suggest reading some of the posts iv posted today in this topic again and or do some independent research of your own because theirs
    many things that your either blatantly ignoring or are un aware of..
     
  10. Lolsgod

    Lolsgod Sexy Trainer

    You're first point few points sound like some hippie nonsense, how many people do you honestly know that meditate? 2nd we already do use marijuana on terminally ill patients, its called medical marijuana, 3rd marijuana does NOT lead to a heightened state of consciousness, in fact one its primary side effects is a distorted perception.

    To your second list about it being used as a material, how do we know that using it as say a water bottle, won't make the user ingest the drug? What if they did this and I said "I don't want to smoke weed" but then i go get a water bottle made out of the material, whats to say some weed wont be in that and in the end go into my body?

    Also if you look back through the last few pages me and Shinyumbreon were having a great debate on the mental and physical effects of weed, with plenty of sources. In the studies I've done (you can check all the sources, they're right here on this thread) I've come to the conclusion that having weed be legalized as a drug for cancer patients and the terminal ill is great because then its being used as a pain killer. But I do not believe it should be allowed for regular by the general public, after all it is a drug, and legal drugs are not allowed to be casual use like you're arguing
     
  11. Celestial Moth

    Celestial Moth Bug-Type Deity

    I myself have also been posting in this topic a long time ago and if you yourself went back page by page, which im by no means suggesting lol, you'd find some logical arguments on my behalf as-well.But seeing as you've transferred your argument to the psychological reasons as to why ganja can stay illegal i can address that subject as well because im quite informed on all aspects of this topic.


    Well i actually no a lot of people who no how to mediate because they are true intellectuals who allow theirselfs to be open to all possible things, lol but that doesn't matter nor does the fact that you called my post "hippie nonsense", cause that would imply that i was making no sense, which i was. But again that doesn't matter lol

    What does matter is this,
    I have to re-establish that i don't smoke ganja anymore because i feel that might be effecting your perception.

    I'm not sure if you've sat down and meditated after smoking weed or if you have participated in yoga and or its varies forms after smoking weed, but i have.
    After smoking weed i would sit down close my eyes, practice my breathing techniques and meditate. As a result, i would no longer be plagued with the rush of thoughts
    and or impulsive reactions to thought i would be having which in turn allowed myself to project myself into higher dimensions and states of consciousness.
    This is a logical expression of how the state of consciousness of a human being can be elevated by smoking ganja.

    PLEASE do some independent research on this subject because what i'm about to say you should already no if you think your qualified to make an informed objection or post in this topic.

    Hemp is the deemed substance created through the isolation and removal of the cannabinoids, delta-9 tetrahydrocanbinol and delta- 8 tetrahydrocanabinal. These 2 canabinoids present in Ganja are confirmed to be the intoxicating canabinoids. The removal of them within a quantity of cannabis would then technically turn that substance into substance called hemp. ingesting t molecules of hemp will never cause or replicate the state of mind induced by ingesting ganja.

    Perhaps my post was misleading though regardless if you researched this topic you should have been able to recognize the difference. Hemp is used to create those products because of the very thing you said, which was basically that people don't want to accidentally become high, which is understandable.
     
  12. Doux

    Doux Well-Known Member

    And I stated that it isn't the worst thing that you could do to yourself, but just because other recreational drugs have worse effects does not mean that marijuana's harmful effects are simply null and void.

    But you proved the exact reason why I resent people who smoke/smoked marijuana...they can never accept that it does have dangerous long-term effects. They won't give up the iota of humility it requires to take responsibility of their habit and say that what they're doing is detrimental to their health.

    Your argument is that the pros of smoking marijuana outweigh any cons. That your mind and spirituality are improved through the use of marijuana.
    I have never smoked a thing, and I have to tell you, I feel that my body-mind-spirituality "triangle" is well-proportioned. You don't need a drug to change your way of thinking, you can do that all on your own.

    Once again, I'm not saying that it's the worst possible thing you could do to yourself. I'm not so deluded and anti-marijuana to think that, but this is a thread about marijuana, I'm sticking to talking about marijuana. If you'd like to start a thread about booting black-tar heroin, I'll toss my two cents into the ring about that too.
     
  13. Lolsgod

    Lolsgod Sexy Trainer

    Heroin's some scary **** man...
     
  14. Celestial Moth

    Celestial Moth Bug-Type Deity


    lol no ones talking about booting black-tar heroin, you were though and not ones did i state that marijuana has 0 long term or even short term effects i said:


    Yes their are short term and long term effects when you smoke marijuana and even greater effects if you abuse it. But theirs short term and long term negative effects to basically every single recreational activities that you can possibly name!

    The short term and even long term effects of users taking marijuana are based purely on cases were the substance was abused. So i cant really see the significance of a test or even study that concludes that all users of ganja will eventually have Mental problem a,b,c and d and have lung cancer. Because not all people who ingest ganja abuse it.

    I appreciate the fact you said
    Because your very correct in that you don't and that you can do that on yourself. Though what i was suggesting and what i feel was misunderstood was that it can be used as a tool to encourage a state of consciousness in which can be used to further ones own state of mind into a higher state. Obviously still, you could do it without the use of any substance though some cant and have great difficulty doing so, and it could be and is being used as a tool to help this. A simple tool to help meditation.

    I don't expect you to greatly understand the point of view of myself perfectly because you've never tried smoking weed, nor am i telling you to try it. But most people who smoke ganja and are mature,use it responsibly and are well aware of the risks that are involved.
    The point that intellectuals are trying to get across to those who ignore the information provided,is that, their are positive things that can come from ingesting ganja.
    Especially when it is not abused, in those cases were it's not abused and the positive outcomes out-weigh the negative, the outcomes are things that greatly benefit the communities such as a greater care for their environment, a higher and more aware state of consciousness and the spiritual knowledge that spawns out from the state of consciousness that can be used as a meditational tool.

    You can't simply ignore things because they don't fit into a perception because that perception doesn't really exist and it is not reality, the reality without a perception, is that their are positive outcomes that come from smoking ganja.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  15. Doux

    Doux Well-Known Member

    My point was that you continue to say "well, other things are worse so marijuana's not bad at all compared to those things," and this isn't about comparison of marijuana to other recreational drugs or activities, it's about marijuana itself. Not compared to anything else, just the effects of marijuana itself.

    Once again, the fact that there are negative effects to other recreational activities does not negate the negative effects of marijuana.

    Define "abuse". 22.5 million people use marijuana daily. [page 15, first paragraph]
    Is daily use of marijuana not abuse?

    A simple tool to help meditation- and jeopardize your health in the meantime!

    I don't think you can call use of any recreational drug 'responsible'.

    The positive effect seems to be this heightened state of mind you speak of, but once again, marijuana is unnecessary for that. You can think whatever you want to think, believe that and you don't need any substance to change your mindset.


    There appears to be one positive outcome and it's one that doesn't require smoking anything. You can feel and think and learn whatever you want to, no outside substance required.
     
  16. Bolt the Cat

    Bolt the Cat Bringing the Thunder

    That's fine, but if you're going to take a stance on marijuana, you need to take a stance on everything that's just as bad, such as alcohol. Because otherwise, you're being hypocritical and defying the core principles of freedom.
     
  17. Doux

    Doux Well-Known Member

    Oh, no, I do. And it certainly is. I never once said that the use of alcohol was something I supported. It's just as unnecessary as marijuana or cigarettes or any other recreational drug. I haven't drank alcohol either.

    What I was saying was that Celestial Moth likes comparing unrelated activities to marijuana and that that is not what this should be about. It should be about marijuana and it's effects alone, not compared to any other activity's effects.

    Other activities with negative effects worse than those of marijuana cannot negate marijuana's negative effects, which is why I believe that they shouldn't be brought up when debating whether or not use of marijuana should be considered "okay."
     
  18. Steampunk

    Steampunk One Truth Prevails

    ^ just to re-state something I said earlier.
     
  19. Celestial Moth

    Celestial Moth Bug-Type Deity


    lol , if you cant see the relative information between 2 things that's your own fault bro and i'm not gonna reiterate some of the things iv said ay. Cause all the comparisons I've made are because their are soo many more legal activities that are more harmful and dangerous than smoking marijuana, and that is the topic. Legalizing marijuana.
    The comparisons I've made clearly state how their are activities, that are also addictive, yet are more dangerous and toxic than smoking marijuana. It's relative information because
    if their are recreational activities that are in fact more dangerous and toxic than smoking ganja, it begs the question as to why some of these activities are legal and smoking ganja is not.

    Ps I meant no offense if you already read the post I posted before this edit.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  20. Doux

    Doux Well-Known Member

    I'm not saying that marijuana shouldn't be legalized. I believe that it should be legalized so that at least those using it can be taxed.

    What I don't (or maybe can't) believe is that good, otherwise intelligent people choose to use substances like marijuana and cigarettes and alcohol for recreation to change the way that they feel and think. It's not a matter of "I believe anyone who does this should be tossed into prison," it's "I cannot believe that anyone would choose to do this to themselves for fun."

    I doubt I'll be changing your mind about smoking marijuana being some wonderful experience that will open doors for you that you didn't even know were there, but certainly you can see what I mean when I say that it's not a necessary part of the human experience.
    Great thinkers and spiritualists are not great thinkers and spiritualists because of an outside substance.
     

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