Facts seem to have become powerless

[Black Marauder]

Manipulate can be too strong of a word in this case.

Why? I do not agree. Manipulation is manipulation, I'm not going to pick a new word because it is too "strong" or it makes someone uncomfortable.

The nonreligious don't seem a whole lot better at accepting new information.

People seem especially quick to deny something if it implies they should change some aspect of their life, i.e. eat something different or drive something different.

Can you please provide some examples which lead you to conclude that "The nonreligious don't seem a whole lot better at accepting new information". Thank you

 

[Rezzo]

I just can't help wondering what has caused people to have grown so cynical and so doubtful.

Freedom of speech.

If people are allowed to come to their own conclusions, they will.

 

[Ethan]

The nonreligious don't seem a whole lot better at accepting new information.

People seem especially quick to deny something if it implies they should change some aspect of their life, i.e. eat something different or drive something different.

From the examples you list in your post, I wouldn't classify that as blocking new information, but simple indifference. Oh no, trans fats! High fructose corn syrup! Run! People don't care. When someone has an established way of living they aren't going to run leaps and bounds to change it simply because certain aspects of what they do are negative. I eat food that's absolutely terrible for me, and quite frankly I don't care how bad it clogs my arteries. If you want to live until you're ninety, that's awesome. I'll enjoy McDonalds and live to seventy something. I'm cool with that.

Same thing with driving a car. "These better cars don't kill polar bears, drive them!" Okay, well, they're expensive as hell, I only have one payment left on the car I have, why do I want a green car again? Oh right. Polar bears.

You can't just expect people to change their lives just because of the things they do aren't 100% good for them. Lightbulbs give off radiation? Okay, so does the sun. Awesome.

 

[legendarypokemonmaster]

The nonreligious don't seem a whole lot better at accepting new information.

People seem especially quick to deny something if it implies they should change some aspect of their life, i.e. eat something different or drive something different.

People are afraid of change.

Freedom of speech.

If people are allowed to come to their own conclusions, they will.

This doesn't make any sense. Are you saying that if people make their own descisions, they will be ignorant?

 

[Rezzo]

This doesn't make any sense. Are you saying that if people make their own descisions, they will be ignorant?

Well yes. Why should you have to change your conclusion to something, just because somebody told you otherwise? A lot of people have that attitude to science nowadays.

"Oh I've been smoking for 40 years now and I still haven't got cancer". I hear stuff like this all the time. The person who said this, for example, is refusing to give up smoking just because the side-effects from it hasn't affected them.

 

[legendarypokemonmaster]

Oh gosh that really makes people sound ignorant. If someone looks at everything and makes his or her own decision(as objectively as possible) it should be a good thing.

 

[manaphy72]

i wish people would start looking for a ultimate cure. i know they are looking but not hard enough.

 

[CSolarstorm]

Emotional connections and habits are generally more powerful than facts. If you don't present the objective truth in a pleasing, relatable and catchy way, it might not be accepted, and even so, you can't please everyone. Luckily if you're smart enough to know the objective truth then you should be able to learn the science of communicating it.

 

[legendarypokemonmaster]

Exactly. "Logic may convince people, but only emotion can motivate them"

 

[ChedWick]

This topic reminds me of a certain someone in our forum community. Someone who racked up an astounding 1000+ posts in something like a month.

 

[bel9]

Why? I do not agree. Manipulation is manipulation, I'm not going to pick a new word because it is too "strong" or it makes someone uncomfortable.

No, it's because it implies religions everywhere were secretly working against all science in large unified groups, which isn't true. Many people, religious and non-religious, have certain convictions that they hold to be true because that is their world view. If some new idea comes along, and people [whether they be average citizens or clergymen] feel threatened by it, they will reject it. It's not that manipulation is too strong, it's just a really distorted view and major generalization of events that took place. Another non religious example would be the psychologists involved in the great Nature vs. Nurture psychology debates. Despite the fact that our current evidence points to a mixture of both, the pioneers/ people who advanced each belief fight to the bitter end that there idea is perfect and the other is false because they spent their whole life practicing/testing their own.

EDIT: Black Maurader, are you fugging kidding me? Everyone experiences some kind of confirmation bias. It is a universal human experience. See my previous example for support. You can't actually believe that only religious individuals experience confirmation bias.

 

[scythemantis]

This topic reminds me of a certain someone in our forum community. Someone who racked up an astounding 1000+ posts in something like a month.

I've been here since 2006 but have barely posted for the past year, I'm out of the loop.

Same thing with driving a car. "These better cars don't kill polar bears, drive them!" Okay, well, they're expensive as hell, I only have one payment left on the car I have, why do I want a green car again? Oh right. Polar bears.

This isn't what I'm talking about. I don't care if people choose to ignore the environment, but there are countless people who believe, with all seriousness, that environmental problems are a lie.

Nobody's seriously saying polar bears are the main reason to be more fuel-efficient, don't oversimplify. There's a long list of other environmental and economic reasons, all of which various people are choosing to deny are even true.

Some people don't even believe we're in a recession. There's wild theories that the government is artificially raising the prices of everything in the country.

You can't just expect people to change their lives just because of the things they do aren't 100% good for them. Lightbulbs give off radiation? Okay, so does the sun. Awesome.

You misunderstood this one. Many people are refusing to switch to the newer, more energy-efficient lightbulbs because they believe those give off dangerous radiation. My own uncle thinks they're some sort of "left-wing" scam and will give everybody cancer, which he heard off some radio show.

 

[legendarypokemonmaster]

This topic reminds me of a certain someone in our forum community. Someone who racked up an astounding 1000+ posts in something like a month.

I can think of a few people who meet this description.

This isn't what I'm talking about. I don't care if people choose to ignore the environment, but there are countless people who believe, with all seriousness, that environmental problems are a lie.

Nobody's seriously saying polar bears are the main reason to be more fuel-efficient, don't oversimplify. There's a long list of other environmental and economic reasons, all of which various people are choosing to deny are even true.
Some people don't even believe we're in a recession. There's wild theories that the government is artificially raising the prices of everything in the country.
You misunderstood this one. Many people are refusing to switch to the newer, more energy-efficient lightbulbs because they believe those give off dangerous radiation. My own uncle thinks they're some sort of "left-wing" scam and will give everybody cancer, which he heard off some radio show.

Those darn republican radio shows. I saw on the news today that Rush Limbaugh(however you spell it) bashed Romney and said he had no chance because Mitt Romney admitted Global Warming/Climate Change is real.

 

[scythemantis]

There are just as many examples of my fellow liberals latching onto bogus nonsense, of course, like the 9/11 "inside job" conspiracy theories.

You can't pin the rampant ....denialism?....going around on any one group really.

 

[legendarypokemonmaster]

There are just as many examples of my fellow liberals latching onto bogus nonsense, of course, like the 9/11 "inside job" conspiracy theories.

You can't pin the rampant ....denialism?....going around on any one group really.

It hasn't been proven false!!!

 

[Tyrant Tar]

If you want to live until you're ninety, that's awesome. I'll enjoy McDonalds and live to seventy something. I'm cool with that.

The problem with this type of mentality is that we humans do not each live in a vacuum. Whatever the individual does has an effect on all others (human and non-human alike). Now, most of those effects are tiny, yes, but multiply that by several billion for all individuals, and then multiply that by the number of times those individuals perform that action (per day, per month, per year, per decade, etc.) and, well, you get Earth-changing results.

Which is why ignoring, denying, over-simplifying, and misunderstanding well-researched facts is such a deadly thing (the McDonalds example at least accepts the consequences; same cannot be said for the polar bears and radiation).

 

[Gladys]

Fuck Gravity; it is just a theory!

If the gravity lobby was as powerful as it had been back in the 70's, this type of thinking wouldn't be happening!

 

[Crimsonlink]

Its not that facts seem to have become powerless. Its more of the mentality that opinions are easier to go with rather than to face the facts. Like Ethan said before with his Mickey D's example.

Social loafing, conformity, confirmation bias, and other thought processes help to deny the facts of reality. Your lightbulb example is something I struggle to convince to my parents along with recycling. They tell me nobody recycles in my neighborhood or getting those energy saving lightbulbs.

I think its more along the lines of facts being pushed away for the easier alternatives and the fear of change.

 

[xsedr]

Facts aren't nearly as comforting as ignorance and fairy tales. Humans don't want to a) take responsibility b) thin for themselves c) face a world where bad things are constantly happening and there is no invisible sky man making everything okay

 

[pokemaster001]

This double negativity makes this sentence senseless.

actually, it doesn't avoid not making sense

but anyway, yeah, it's a fact, life never goes as it should, and each human fits somewhere on the Sliding Scale of Idealism Versus Cynicism (be warned, link to TV Tropes) whether they don't believe because they're too Cynical or too Idealist is inconsequential. Me, I'm a Cynic, and I believe someone is a moron until proven intelligent, yet I believe many scientific facts so.....................yeah