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February Plot Discussion
- Thread starter lolipiece
- Start date
- Status
'Ello, 'ello! It's time for Pokespe SwSh for December!
Also, here's the cover to volume 6 of Sun and Moon.
Has it been confirmed if Sobble is Sword's Pokemon?
horrahforyou
Pokemon and Kamen Rider is life
Does SM chapter 6 includes the finale?
SerGoldenhandtheJust
Deluded Dreamer
Why does sword look like Dia's son lmao. They look so similar.
SerGoldenhandtheJust
Deluded Dreamer
No definitely not coz sun and moon are the real ship I refuse to believe any different
G-SANtos
Well-Known Member
According to the scans, but Soudo and Shieldmillia want to enter the Gym Challenge, but still don't have endorsements. At the end of the chapter, Dande is calling Rose about someone he wants to endorse.
Hey guys, big news. I checked the latest 5ch thread, and apparently, Soudo has Grookey, not Sobble. While that makes more sense given his skill, it kinda seems to break the Starter rotation. However, I must bring up the las time that happened from one Generation to another: Black to X. Black had a Fire-type Starter, while X had a Grass-type one. But between them was Lack-Two with a Dewott. Therefore, Sun having a Fire-type Starter, but Soudo having a Grass-type one, implies there's someone else with a Water-type Starter between them. Now, the question is, is it some Alola kid with a second Popplio, or a Kanto kid with a Squirtle?
Someone on 5ch theorized that this is due to LGPE, and perhaps they'll start an LGPE arc after B2W2 ends. Yamamoto hasn't really ruled out an LGPE arc. When he was asked on Twitter last month, he said that "As far as I can tell now, there are no plans to do it, but there are also no plans to not do it.", which to me meant that either they hand't decided yet, or perhaps they want but can't promise in case something interferes with their plans. Perhaps the LGPE arc will have another set of Kanto Starters. But the weird thing is, if we go by the Yellow precedent, as well as the source material games, the main characters' Starters should be Pikachu and Eevee, not the traditional Starter trio from most Kanto games, and thus it wouldn't affect the rotation. Even if it happens they have both Pikachu and Eevee, and a set of Kanto Starters, X has a Charizard and it hasn't affected the rotation at all.
The alternative is a second set of Alola Starters, but I don't think we'll have a repeat of BW now. Like, the BW Starter situation feels like an one-off thing that happened due to Kusaka being used to the games having only one non-player Rival, allowing him to easily keep the same pattern going on and on, then suddenly having to deal with a number of characters that didn't fit his pattern. In fact, I actually think Kusaka himself thought it was going to be an one-off. The fact he had Fennekin being blasted off at the start of XY indicates he thought there was going to be a Z (and I believe there were such plans until it was cancelled to make SM in time for the 20th anniversary).
And, while I initially theorized they would introduce characters named Ulsun (or Ultsun) and Ulmoon to represent the USUM games, I now actually would prefer these be used as surnames for Hau, Gladio, and Lillie. Furthermore, an USUM arc would likely revolve around Episode RR, and feels like a likely place to have a Dex Holder reunion. I kinda feel like it would be best to just continue with Sun and Moon as the main characters instead of introducing new ones. Because, with new characters, you would have to establish them for some time before having the older ones return. And one of the main problems of Dex Holder reunions, is that so far they have only happened at the end. Even in B2W2 we only see the four Dex Holders reunited for the final battle. I think, if an USUM arc becomes a Dex Holder reunion, it would stand out more from the others by having only pre-established characters and not having to worry about creating new ones. Besides, it's not like Sun's story is done. He still has create the Pokémon Resort.
While I admit that I just don't want to have USUM introducing new characters and repeated Starters, I do think it's more likely that the Water-type Starter Dex Holder between Sun and Soudo is an LGPE character. Given how they are having Soudo have Grookey, it seems like Kusaka and Yamamoto plan to start another new arc soon, and it's more likely to be LGPE than USUM, because, while LGPE can simply have new characters following a story that can mostly ignore events from other region's arcs, and only mention stuff from arcs that have been finished, USUM, if it is indeed a reunion arc, would probably reference events from everything, including the post-B2W2 arcs that don't have volume expansions yet. Seeing how volumes always expand/alter the ending, it means they would have to avoid referencing stuff from these "unfinished" arcs until they are collected into full volumes, including SM itself, from which USUM would be a direct continuation.
We know XY will start being collected into full volumes next year, but I don't think we'll get the entire arc collected in 2020. It'll probably stretch into 2021, even if only early 2021. From XY to SM, we'll probably get new chapters for all of those arcs to show off unused Megas, and fill some story gaps. For example, Mitsuru using Mega Altaria, something with Volcanion, maybe Moon, Kukui, and Burnet's time at Aether Paradise and Hau's training, and, of course, the Beast Ball not working on Necrozma and the realization Necrozma is not an Ultra Beast (remember that every Necrozma story so far has it being mistaken for an Ultra Beast. I don't see why PokéSpe would be different). Adding all these to the volumes could extend the time it would take for SM's true finale to be published until 2022 or 2023.
In other words, if an USUM arc starts next year, it would have to avoid explicitly referencing the SM finale for two to three years. That is an insane amount of time. That is, of course, assuming the end is radically changed. So, I find it more likely that LGPE, not USUM, would take B2W2's place at Sunday Webry. And that's assuming we don't get a DP remake next year, which would complicate things even further.
Back to something that is actually about the chapter. Soudo has Grookey, and Shieldmillia has Scorbunny. That also breaks precedent with the girl always having the Starter that is weak to the boy. I actually like that, because I always thought it was a bit sexist that the girl couldn't ever have the Starter with a type advantage even in a setup where she would have it in the games, like RS and XY. But I wonder why this is happening now, after so long with Kusaka trying to keep the patterns even when the games don't follow them. In my opinion, I think Kusaka has finally accepted that the Pokémon games have changed, and is perhaps changing the rotation pattern now to reflect that. Traditionally, the Rivals have always had the Starter with a type advantage to the player, and PokéSpe's rotation pattern is based on that,with the girl only having the remaining Starter because it wasn't taken by a game character. The DP and BW games even adopted this pattern, with the opposite gender player in DP and female Rival in BW having the Starter with a type disadvantage. But in XY, the Rival that is also the opposite gender character has the Starter with a type advantage, while the other Rival who has a Starter, and is the player's first opponent, has the Starter that is weak to the player's, and in all the following games the main Rival also has the Starter weaker to the player's.
That post-XY consistency seems to be the new norm, with Rivals now having the Starter that is weak to the players. Kusaka still tried to maintain the rotation pattern the same as he has always done, but that orgy of evidence that the games are switching course, may have finally convinced him to change how he does things. Therefore, Hop is probably going to have Sobble, the Starter weaker to Soudo's just like in the games, and maybe from now on, the Rival characters will always have the Starter weaker to the protagonist. Or, perhaps, if another game does things the traditional way, Kusaka is just going to follow whatever each game is doing rather than following a specific pattern. In that case, the only reliable rotation pattern is the one between successive protagonists.
Hey guys, big news. I checked the latest 5ch thread, and apparently, Soudo has Grookey, not Sobble. While that makes more sense given his skill, it kinda seems to break the Starter rotation. However, I must bring up the las time that happened from one Generation to another: Black to X. Black had a Fire-type Starter, while X had a Grass-type one. But between them was Lack-Two with a Dewott. Therefore, Sun having a Fire-type Starter, but Soudo having a Grass-type one, implies there's someone else with a Water-type Starter between them. Now, the question is, is it some Alola kid with a second Popplio, or a Kanto kid with a Squirtle?
Someone on 5ch theorized that this is due to LGPE, and perhaps they'll start an LGPE arc after B2W2 ends. Yamamoto hasn't really ruled out an LGPE arc. When he was asked on Twitter last month, he said that "As far as I can tell now, there are no plans to do it, but there are also no plans to not do it.", which to me meant that either they hand't decided yet, or perhaps they want but can't promise in case something interferes with their plans. Perhaps the LGPE arc will have another set of Kanto Starters. But the weird thing is, if we go by the Yellow precedent, as well as the source material games, the main characters' Starters should be Pikachu and Eevee, not the traditional Starter trio from most Kanto games, and thus it wouldn't affect the rotation. Even if it happens they have both Pikachu and Eevee, and a set of Kanto Starters, X has a Charizard and it hasn't affected the rotation at all.
The alternative is a second set of Alola Starters, but I don't think we'll have a repeat of BW now. Like, the BW Starter situation feels like an one-off thing that happened due to Kusaka being used to the games having only one non-player Rival, allowing him to easily keep the same pattern going on and on, then suddenly having to deal with a number of characters that didn't fit his pattern. In fact, I actually think Kusaka himself thought it was going to be an one-off. The fact he had Fennekin being blasted off at the start of XY indicates he thought there was going to be a Z (and I believe there were such plans until it was cancelled to make SM in time for the 20th anniversary).
And, while I initially theorized they would introduce characters named Ulsun (or Ultsun) and Ulmoon to represent the USUM games, I now actually would prefer these be used as surnames for Hau, Gladio, and Lillie. Furthermore, an USUM arc would likely revolve around Episode RR, and feels like a likely place to have a Dex Holder reunion. I kinda feel like it would be best to just continue with Sun and Moon as the main characters instead of introducing new ones. Because, with new characters, you would have to establish them for some time before having the older ones return. And one of the main problems of Dex Holder reunions, is that so far they have only happened at the end. Even in B2W2 we only see the four Dex Holders reunited for the final battle. I think, if an USUM arc becomes a Dex Holder reunion, it would stand out more from the others by having only pre-established characters and not having to worry about creating new ones. Besides, it's not like Sun's story is done. He still has create the Pokémon Resort.
While I admit that I just don't want to have USUM introducing new characters and repeated Starters, I do think it's more likely that the Water-type Starter Dex Holder between Sun and Soudo is an LGPE character. Given how they are having Soudo have Grookey, it seems like Kusaka and Yamamoto plan to start another new arc soon, and it's more likely to be LGPE than USUM, because, while LGPE can simply have new characters following a story that can mostly ignore events from other region's arcs, and only mention stuff from arcs that have been finished, USUM, if it is indeed a reunion arc, would probably reference events from everything, including the post-B2W2 arcs that don't have volume expansions yet. Seeing how volumes always expand/alter the ending, it means they would have to avoid referencing stuff from these "unfinished" arcs until they are collected into full volumes, including SM itself, from which USUM would be a direct continuation.
We know XY will start being collected into full volumes next year, but I don't think we'll get the entire arc collected in 2020. It'll probably stretch into 2021, even if only early 2021. From XY to SM, we'll probably get new chapters for all of those arcs to show off unused Megas, and fill some story gaps. For example, Mitsuru using Mega Altaria, something with Volcanion, maybe Moon, Kukui, and Burnet's time at Aether Paradise and Hau's training, and, of course, the Beast Ball not working on Necrozma and the realization Necrozma is not an Ultra Beast (remember that every Necrozma story so far has it being mistaken for an Ultra Beast. I don't see why PokéSpe would be different). Adding all these to the volumes could extend the time it would take for SM's true finale to be published until 2022 or 2023.
In other words, if an USUM arc starts next year, it would have to avoid explicitly referencing the SM finale for two to three years. That is an insane amount of time. That is, of course, assuming the end is radically changed. So, I find it more likely that LGPE, not USUM, would take B2W2's place at Sunday Webry. And that's assuming we don't get a DP remake next year, which would complicate things even further.
Back to something that is actually about the chapter. Soudo has Grookey, and Shieldmillia has Scorbunny. That also breaks precedent with the girl always having the Starter that is weak to the boy. I actually like that, because I always thought it was a bit sexist that the girl couldn't ever have the Starter with a type advantage even in a setup where she would have it in the games, like RS and XY. But I wonder why this is happening now, after so long with Kusaka trying to keep the patterns even when the games don't follow them. In my opinion, I think Kusaka has finally accepted that the Pokémon games have changed, and is perhaps changing the rotation pattern now to reflect that. Traditionally, the Rivals have always had the Starter with a type advantage to the player, and PokéSpe's rotation pattern is based on that,with the girl only having the remaining Starter because it wasn't taken by a game character. The DP and BW games even adopted this pattern, with the opposite gender player in DP and female Rival in BW having the Starter with a type disadvantage. But in XY, the Rival that is also the opposite gender character has the Starter with a type advantage, while the other Rival who has a Starter, and is the player's first opponent, has the Starter that is weak to the player's, and in all the following games the main Rival also has the Starter weaker to the player's.
That post-XY consistency seems to be the new norm, with Rivals now having the Starter that is weak to the players. Kusaka still tried to maintain the rotation pattern the same as he has always done, but that orgy of evidence that the games are switching course, may have finally convinced him to change how he does things. Therefore, Hop is probably going to have Sobble, the Starter weaker to Soudo's just like in the games, and maybe from now on, the Rival characters will always have the Starter weaker to the protagonist. Or, perhaps, if another game does things the traditional way, Kusaka is just going to follow whatever each game is doing rather than following a specific pattern. In that case, the only reliable rotation pattern is the one between successive protagonists.
The most interesting thing about Soudo having Grookey is that, while he is breaking the pattern, Shieldmillia is keeping up with it. The pattern for the girls, assuming Whi-Two does get Gigi, has been Water-Grass-Fire. Moon got Rowlett, so it checks out that Shieldmillia would get Scorbunny. So, unless we're in for a twist that has Grookey run away from Soudo so he can get Sobble later (a la White with Gigi and Amanda), only the male side of the pattern is changing.
If there is a LGPE arc that features a male protagonist with a Water Pokemon, then that would mean either there would be no female protagonist to fully keep the pattern, or that there will be a female protagonist and, unless she doesn't get a starter, then the pattern would still be broken only this time on the girl's side of things.
Alternatively, if they go with a USUM arc, maybe they could introduce an original male protagonist like Emerald to take a Water starter (most likely to be Brionne like what Lack-Two did). "Ultra" as a name doesn't sound as out-there as some other names in the manga. Technically speaking, Emerald, even if he is an original protagonist, does keep up the male protagonist pattern of Grass-Fire-Water in that he had the Grass starter after Ruby's Water starter. It's more Diamond that broke the pattern with having another Grass starter. Back then though they were kinda limited in terms of games and available starters. Now that B2W2 showed multiples of each starter, there's nothing stopping this hypothetical Ultra character from having his own Water starter in addition to Hau having one.
Personally I'm still hoping we get a White-Gigi-Amanda situation where Soudo does get Sobble, but I'm not holding my breath.
If there is a LGPE arc that features a male protagonist with a Water Pokemon, then that would mean either there would be no female protagonist to fully keep the pattern, or that there will be a female protagonist and, unless she doesn't get a starter, then the pattern would still be broken only this time on the girl's side of things.
Alternatively, if they go with a USUM arc, maybe they could introduce an original male protagonist like Emerald to take a Water starter (most likely to be Brionne like what Lack-Two did). "Ultra" as a name doesn't sound as out-there as some other names in the manga. Technically speaking, Emerald, even if he is an original protagonist, does keep up the male protagonist pattern of Grass-Fire-Water in that he had the Grass starter after Ruby's Water starter. It's more Diamond that broke the pattern with having another Grass starter. Back then though they were kinda limited in terms of games and available starters. Now that B2W2 showed multiples of each starter, there's nothing stopping this hypothetical Ultra character from having his own Water starter in addition to Hau having one.
Personally I'm still hoping we get a White-Gigi-Amanda situation where Soudo does get Sobble, but I'm not holding my breath.
e9310103838
Well-Known Member
Until Kusaka let the third Kalos Pokedex be destroyed. This was one year before Sun & Moon was released. Kusaka might have known then that there would be no Z version.
horrahforyou
Pokemon and Kamen Rider is life
I agree, he did that on purpose and since there's no 3rd Kalos dexholder Fennekin received by the hands of the villain
TotallyNotCrt
Well-Known Member
Image links: https://twitter.com/strawhatcrt/status/1208661394201047040
Quick summary in bullet points:
-Marvin (Manabu) does a simulated Dynamax battle with Shii-chan and Sou-chan.
-He borrows Sou-chan's Sirfetch'd and he's never done a Pokemon battle before.
-They win.
-They eat and Shii/Sou explain they were doing special training for the Gym Challenge.
-TV is turned on where they introduce the Champion Cup, but the Champion isn't there.
-They learn that he's at Wedgehurst dealing with a pack of stray Wooloo who are blocking the train's railroads.
-Leon tries to gather them, but they keep dispersing back to the railroad as if something's bugging them.
-Sou and Shii arrive on the scene and deduce it's an Obstagoon scaring them all.
-Sou uses Sirfetch'd and deals with it.
-Leon thanks them and after talking with Magnolia who he knows, he heads out.
-President Rose calls Leon and asks if he found a trainer yet he recommends for the challenge and asks for their profile.
-Back to Magnolia's place, everyone learns that Leon didn't make it to the ceremony but the train should've been operational for the last 30 mins.
-Back at the stop, you just see Leon saying he ended up back where he was already.
Quick summary in bullet points:
-Marvin (Manabu) does a simulated Dynamax battle with Shii-chan and Sou-chan.
-He borrows Sou-chan's Sirfetch'd and he's never done a Pokemon battle before.
-They win.
-They eat and Shii/Sou explain they were doing special training for the Gym Challenge.
-TV is turned on where they introduce the Champion Cup, but the Champion isn't there.
-They learn that he's at Wedgehurst dealing with a pack of stray Wooloo who are blocking the train's railroads.
-Leon tries to gather them, but they keep dispersing back to the railroad as if something's bugging them.
-Sou and Shii arrive on the scene and deduce it's an Obstagoon scaring them all.
-Sou uses Sirfetch'd and deals with it.
-Leon thanks them and after talking with Magnolia who he knows, he heads out.
-President Rose calls Leon and asks if he found a trainer yet he recommends for the challenge and asks for their profile.
-Back to Magnolia's place, everyone learns that Leon didn't make it to the ceremony but the train should've been operational for the last 30 mins.
-Back at the stop, you just see Leon saying he ended up back where he was already.
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SoftMonKeychains
Member
That chapter was the typical hilarity at the cost of the antics from the champion lol
Love the ending, oh Leon
Love the ending, oh Leon
Damn, so Grookey really does belong to Sou. Was hoping they would use Sobble since Sword is blue themed and I feel Sobble would be better suited for Sou, especially since Sou can help give Sobble confidence and when it evolves to Inteleon we can see the sharp knife that Inteleon has hidden in its tail which would be used in battle and can be apart of the plot where Sou gives Sobble a knife to help develop its character.
Pokemon.Manga
Well-Known Member
It's very strange that Kusaka would step back from the starter pattern. I think that Sou's Grookey could be a red herring perhaps. It's weird the Gen 6,7, and 8 will have the main boy's starter go from grass, fire to grass instead of the usual grass,fire,water. I think it highlights grass starters to much instead of it being equal. I also don't think a starter pokemon for a hypothetical LGPE chapter even makes much sense since the main starters are not even the kanto starters but Pikachu and eevee. I think the chapter looks good overall and enjoy the sirfetch'd as well but hope Sobble gets it due.
LordSerperior
Well-Known Member
I think its too early to say the pattern has been ignored. When BW came out, everyone thought Black amd White would both use Tepig, with Cheren and Bianca completing the "trio" but that changed later. No one saw the Gigi/Amanda switch coming.
shoz999
Back when Tigers used to smoke.
Yup. Kusaka could pull another Kusaka on us.
Inteleon: You thought Rillaboom would be Sou's starter but it was actually me! Inteleon!
Grookey Gang: NANI!?
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SerGoldenhandtheJust
Deluded Dreamer
Eh not much happens it seems like. Hugh seems to have confronted the grunts who stole purrloin but is yet to recover it. The shadow triad seem to be defeated but colresss is still fighting. It seems B2W2 will go on longer than we think, probably till June
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