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Finals I: Torrent (1218)

sutellakiara

Shirona, my beloved...
You do realize that not all of Leon’s Pokémon are at the same level of strength as his Charizard right.

You make it sound like all of Leon’s Pokémon are as strong as his Charizard and can sweep multiple Pokémon even though this has already been disproven by the simple fact that Leon’s Dragapult lost to Diantha’s Tyrantrum which was her 2nd Pokémon.

So no, Leon isn’t weaker just because Ash beat his Pokémon first when it has never been implied that his Inteleon is as strong as his Rillaboom or Charizard.

You might have had a point if the 1st Pokémon that had gone down in the match was Leon’s Rillaboom, but since Leon’s 1st Pokémon to go down was Inteleon which was one of the Pokémon we hadn’t seen him use in battle yet your just point just falls apart.
Can't blame people for having that impression when they tried so hard to keep the rest of Leon's team secret. It gives a "wow, if the Pokemon he's shown so far are this strong who knows how strong the others are! Sasuga unbeatable, invincible, undefeated Champion!".
You could argue that the Inteleon was strong anyway since it it took a G-Max to defeat but that's besides the point. If something gets hidden for so long and after the surprise is revealed it doesn't work out right away normal people will just "wow, that was it? What was the point of keeping it secret until now then?"
Blame the ridiculous performance of the monkey against Diantha for giving people this impression too.
 

nuzamaki90

Well-Known Member
Wow I am more impressed than I thought I would be.

few main points:
- Diantha and Cynthia yaaaaas queens so happy theyre still watching
- loved all the other cameos
- I am very happy Ash gets to use all his gimmicks
- Mr. Rime went from like a pokemon i dont care about to a pokemon that is so fun and cool and I am SO pumped for it vs sirfetch'd
- I was hoping for a Misty and Brock cameo tbh even if they didn't speak
- curious what Leon said at the end
He dedicated Gengar’s defeat to Inteleon, as it was because of it that Mr. Rime had such an easy time. He then reminded Ash that a 6v6 full battle can also be considered a team battle, and that all the Pokemon’s efforts contribute to the win.

I don’t know why exactly Ash was shocked given that this is something that he both practices and preaches, but maybe it’s weird when someone else says it lmao
 

BlueDragonfangirl

Well-Known Member
I guess they are trying to make up to Tracey fans by giving him all these cameos in the tournament LOL.

I‘m a bit annoyed that Gary is taking off instead of being one of the one’s to watch, an old rival / childhood friend can’t stay to watch Ash’s biggest moment in History?!

None of Ash’s XY or Sun and Moon pals or Dent make cameos yet but we got Alan who left without saying a word to Ash.

Why isn’t Ash’s mom their?

I am also hoping Anabel is watching.

Ash vs Leon looks alright so far.
 

TheNewGuy

Well-Known Member
I mean technically Leon is allowed more too, right? Just seems like he doesn't think he needs to use all 3 to win.

Maybe at the end of episode 2 he decides to Gmax Rillaboom or Cinderace, having been pushed into a corner by Ash. It definitely feels like right now he's saying he doesn't need to use the gimmicks to win but that could change.

Probably a coincidence but is it possible Ash using Will O Wisp on Aqua Jet to steam up the field is a reference to how he beat Gary's Blastoise at the Johto League?
 

Mythical-Moonlight

I just ran, I ran all Night and Day ~
Oh Arceus I have so many mixed feelings.

One hand I'm so sad my Lizard Baby had to be the Fall guy (tho I was kinda already expecting it)

But on the other he got such an AMAZING showing (much better than anything Goh's Inteleon had) and he literally went out with a bang!

Plus the fact that Gengar had to resort to using G-Max to defeat it while Inteleon remained in it's normal state to fight, just speaks volumes about how strong it is

Now if you'll all excuse me I'm going to go find a place to Cope

So what were the 5 Stages of Grief again?
Oh yeah:
Denial
Anger
Bargaining
Depression
Acceptance


Welp at least I didn't go through Anger
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This is so much better than Ash vs Cynthia already, the battle is going great so far! If it keeps this up it might be a top 5, even top 3/2 battle as a whole.
Positives:
Seeing Dawn and Chloe cheering on Ash was cute
TRio Ash’s biggest fans
Corphish, Kingler, Buizel and Oshawott are happy
Allister, M8, and Marnie cameos
Animation was sick, the zoom up shot of Cinderace reminding me of the XY days
Libero Cinderace
Inteleon vs Gengar was excellent! I love seeing Inteleon using Countershield and Gengar countering it by using Will-O-Wisp!
GMAX Gengar using Max Ooze was great and I liked how it KOed Inteleon. Inteleon’s finger guns and how it dodger attacks with its slender build was great.
Mr. Rime tap dancing! Seeing it freeze the Sludge Bomb and Gengar was great, and seeing Cursed Body activate was great too. Liked how Gengar was KOed with Psychic Terrain plus Expanding Force. Also Mr Rime ice skating!!!!
Negatives:
No GMAX Inteleon
Dawn and Chloe being the only one at the stadium and not Ash’s own mom is WTF. Brock, Misty, and especially Serena have to show up physically. This is my major complaint.
 

DayQuil95

Well-Known Member
This is so much better than Ash vs Cynthia already, the battle is going great so far! If it keeps this up it might be a top 5, even top 3/2 battle as a whole.
Positives:
Seeing Dawn and Chloe cheering on Ash was cute
TRio Ash’s biggest fans
Corphish, Kingler, Buizel and Oshawott are happy
Allister, M8, and Marnie cameos
Animation was sick, the zoom up shot of Cinderace reminding me of the XY days
Libero Cinderace
Inteleon vs Gengar was excellent! I love seeing Inteleon using Countershield and Gengar countering it by using Will-O-Wisp!
GMAX Gengar using Max Ooze was great and I liked how it KOed Inteleon. Inteleon’s finger guns and how it dodger attacks with its slender build was great.
Mr. Rime tap dancing! Seeing it freeze the Sludge Bomb and Gengar was great, and seeing Cursed Body activate was great too. Liked how Gengar was KOed with Psychic Terrain plus Expanding Force. Also Mr Rime ice skating!!!!
Negatives:
No GMAX Inteleon
Dawn and Chloe being the only one at the stadium and not Ash’s own mom is WTF. Brock, Misty, and especially Serena have to show up physically. This is my major complaint.
Wholeheartedly agreed, just watched the battle and this was absolutely fantastic. The fact Ash is intelligent enough to switch Pikachu, his ace in the hole against Cinderace, an already unpredictable Pokemon with an extremely dangerous ability, goes to show how he's taking this seriously rather than betting on improvisation alone, and how Leon takes notice of that and saves Cinderace for later. The animation felt very fluid, with no clunky parts from what I've seen, and especially Inteleon vs Gengar was absolutely fantastic to watch unfold, everything felt so great about it. Preview for 130 also has consistently great animation from what I've seen, such as Lucario's Bullet Punches and Sirfetch'd vs Mr. Rime.

And the choreography is one of the best in the anime in years, already better than Ash vs Cynthia for sure, no unnecessary moves were done here, everything from Pikachu's Thunderbolt clash with Cinderace's Scorching Sands to the pure awesomeness that was Inteleon vs Gengar felt smooth as hell, Inteleon using his tail to block an incoming Shadow Ball, Gengar hiding in the ground with his underused ability to phase through surfaces, and Ash's actual logical loss of Gengar due to the overconfidence in Cursed Body, which is something he was hoping to be a deciding card in turning the tides against Mr. Rime.

There were no questionable or debatable "Ash lets Dragonite in the battlefield." or "Cynthia D-Maxes Togekiss" moments were, everything felt like a solid strategy, and played right in the core personalities of both characters, from Ash's still-in-development surpassing of his overconfidence in turning the ties with some ace in the hole like Cursed Body, which caused him to lose Gengar, to Leon's constant top-tier strategies that ranged from legitimate game strategies like Psychic Terrain + Expanding Terrain, and Libero, to crazier anime strategies like Counter Shield, thus allowing the battle to feel like a perfect mix of both anime and games that was unseen in this magnitude ever since Ash vs Paul in the Sinnoh League.

I have made it very clear that Inteleon vs Gengar was my favorite part of the episode, and I will explain why. So, for one, the battling style of both Pokemon are, like Cinderace vs Pikachu, perfected to a T, you can see that he abuses a lot of his phasing and flight, but that when under pressure and unable of levitating, he's forced to be in a scenario that he's not used too much to, relying on relatively clumsy jumps and dodges when facing Inteleon's Counter Shield initially, while Inteleon is agile, strong, and powerful, yet you can see that he's not tanky at all, which takes into consideration how the Pokemon in the games actually battles, Inteleon was barely hit through the battle, and different of Ash vs Drasna, this time it made sense because it was clear from his battling style and Leon's calls that he wasn't tanky, and how the finishing blow was a surprise attack.

I love everything in this battle, from Inteleon's amazingly animated moves that hit the correct in-between of fast, fluid, and strong, to the evident buff in animation quality once Gengar G-Maxed, leading to Inteleon also benefits from it, in ways that make, once again, the choreography and writing of this battle prove themselves to be top-tier for pokemon once again when you see that every move Inteleon makes is calculated in order to avoid an incoming move from Gengar before it even starts coming and that it turns a sick counter spin into an opportunity to shoot Gengar with a Dark Pulse that could have sealed the battle.

I also have no problems with Ash using 3 gimmicks here while Leon only gets to use G-Max Charizard, Ash has proven himself to be this powerful and skilled trainer that beat the second and third strongest trainers in the Masters 8 in fair battles with an equal amount of gimmicks being used, if Leon, the strongest trainer in the world, is hyped up by him to the point of allowing him to go all-out like that, then I'm sure as hell accepting it rather go on about it being potentially unfair. Ash isn't fighting blindly here, he's using these gimmicks with proper strategy, timing, and calculation to them, and I'm loving every moment of it.

Simply a 10/10 battle so far, already infinitely better than Ash vs Cynthia's first part, which was already great, and things are only looking better and better with the preview for 130, Sirfetch'd vs Mr. Rime looks extremely fluid, and we can see more strategy involving abilities being employed by Dragapult's potential Cursed Body blocking Mega Lucario's Bullet Punch, which could lead into a very interesting scenario of Ash paying the price for not thinking properly some of the movesets for his Pokemon like Leon does, and being stuck with his own unpredictability in order to beat Dragapult without hitting it directly, assuming Leon also has some way of trapping Lucario in the matchup of course. If the battle continues as great as it is, it has great chances of surpassing Vs Sawyer for me.
 

vondecayle

Long gone are the days
The way Leon threw Cinderace’s pokeball made him look like a baseball player.
 

Soniman

Break the Limit
Wow that was a fantastic start, no complaints from me. I’m glad the pacing and animation is FINALLY back to the level we come to expect, even it took till the last battle to get there. Intelleon especially stole the show, the way he moves, dual weilding, just incredible, and Mr Rime was just a joy to watch as well, what a good lad.

There was good back and forth in terms of strategy and pressure, these feel like two high level trainers going at at. No questionable moments like the Dragonite KO last battle, just all around solid, I have no complaints this far really, really looking forward to next week
 

Zweilous

Go-ing for Gold
I was worried about Ash using 3 gimmicks to Leon's one. But after ruminating on it a bit, I feel a little better. Not only did Ash earn those gimmicks, but he effectively nerfed the entire PWC by being limited to one; a rule that really only affected him and Cynthia. Also, Leon was able to take Counter Shield for himself - he's coming in stronger than usual, and it was all thanks to Ash. Still, I'd prefer it if Leon got to use multiple gimmicks/multiple Dynamaxes, though I don't think that will be happening.

I really like the fight so far, and how expressive Leon's Pokemon are - especially Cinderace and Mr. Rime. I liked how they gave him a clear sense of strategy, in a way that differs from Cynthia or Diantha; he's powerful, has moves with incredible range, and can deflect on a dime. He was able to turn regular moves into more impressive versions: Aqua Jet was a distance attack with both offensive and defensive capabilities, and Inteleon itself didn't even need to move to use it. Inteleon also dual-wielded attacks.

Ash finally used Gengar's hiding strats in a match. Figures, it'd be in a match where his opponent can counter it instantly. Other that than, he was on fire: Max Ooze was multidirectional. While he couldn't control or plan it, inadvertently incorporating Cursed Body into the match was a brilliant move by the writers.

This was a great contrast to the Cynthia opener. Cynthia's moves were more unexpected and you could really feel Ash getting caught off-guard by Spiritomb all the way through. Spiritomb was a beast, and it made more of an impact than Inteleon did. But Leon made it clear that even if Inteleon fainted, it still did its part to weaken Gengar and ensure its defeat. All his Pokemon made good first impressions, especially compared to Gastrodon and Roserade.

But overall, this was a very strong start. I love how Ash isn't so much of an underdog here. While Cynthia felt like he was fighting an uphill battle, this match feels like a fight between equals. I love that, I need that, I appreciate that. I hope they continue this and have Ash's Pokemon rack up some wins. I really doubt it'll happen, but I'd love for every one of his Pokemon to get a win here.

Wish we got that Allister cameo before Gengar's win, and not before its loss. That stung.
 

Sham

Name a better duo
Yea kinda defeats the purpose of her, Alain, Steven and Lance leaving like they had something important to do if they were just gonna sit around watching the match onnTV/stream anyway.
Well they all lost. More than likely they all took it as reasoning why they should go home immediately and start training in case anybody actually challenges their title by winning the league. Well at least that’s the headcanon response but in all reality they didn’t want to pay Alain’s and Iris’ VA’s and just sent the other first round losers on a bus.
 

Mythical-Moonlight

I just ran, I ran all Night and Day ~
I take back what I said before

I now love and appreciate this episode for finally giving my Long Boy so much love from the Twitter community after being ridiculed for 3 years <3

Who ever would've guessed that all it needed to take for people to finally start warming up to him was to see that mofo in a proper battle?

Could've saved so much time

I can only imagine how popular the Galar Starters would've been if they went to Ash?
 
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Akkipeddi

All set to be a nice guy
Meanwhile, Daisuke Ono truly showing why he's one of the GOAT VA's. He was superb as Leon in this.
 

Sham

Name a better duo
I finally got home to watch this so

  • It’s a good thing that Ash was allowed to use all three gimmicks. The writers knew you’d have to be smocking crack to think Ash would have an easy time winning or just in general without that.
  • Team Rocket being all sappy for Ash was so cute, they’ve really all been through so much together
  • Chloe travelled all the way from Kanto, met up with Dawn and said she’ll cheer loud for herself and Goh. And she’s the only companion that actually showed up in person. Everybody saying they aren’t friends, please shut up.
  • I’m still a Leon stan sorry he’s arguably the second best Champion
  • Intellion’s movements like a spy dodging all of Gengar’s move was nice and excellent. It even timed out GMAX earlier than usual
  • The fact that Leon didn’t have a care in the world about Cursed Body and immediately turned it around and gave himself the advantage was kino.
  • I like that all of Leon’s Pokémon have an actual personality.
  • The animation and battle cartography is actually hitting this time.
  • I still think some of his other companions will be returning by the third or fourth episode.
  • I still feel so bad for the reserves just sitting there while the biggest battle ever is occurring.
  • This battle already looks like it’s better than the Cynthia battle. Let’s please hope Leon doesn’t make questionable choices and the final ace clash is good.
 
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Rune Knight

Well-Known Member
Personal Key Notes/Highlights:
  • Dawn returning to cheer Ash on for his final battle, as well as Chloe.
  • Leon being addressed as the Galar Champion (100% confirmation).
  • Audience cheering for Ash.
  • Team Rocket cheering for Ash.
  • Leon letting Ash use all three gimmicks.
  • Leon's Cinderace having such a deep voice.
  • Cincerace using its signature ability, Libero.
  • Ash nodding that he feels like he is battling Goh.
  • Gengar getting a win on Inteleon.
  • Mr. Ryme debut; portrayed some awesome poses too.
  • Awesome animation.
9.5/10 episode; hopefully, we'll get to see the rest of the companions come in/cameo in the later episodes as well.
 
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