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Finals IV: Partner (1221)

Teravolt

cilan lives forever in my heart

Sonic Boom

@JohanSSB4 Twitter
OI.

FhSgI2VWQAISrGn



MY BOY.
 
While I do agree that Ash's jump to World Champion level can be a bit sudden, I see that more of a flaw with how the previous series showed the gaps as well, like that Flint episode

Ash needed to level up to their scale someday, and what better way to start then after he finally becomes champion of Alola
Skill wise, his growth has been pretty realistic. Top 16 - Orange island winner - Top 8 - Battle Frontier winner - Top 4 - Hitting a slump and Top 8 - Top 2 - Champion - World Champion

The ISSUE is with the fact it's a new team. Even that could have been avoided if we saw more organic interactions of the new team earlier in the series and more training segments and a mention how Ash is training harder than ever

So to summarise, Ash's skill as a trainer being world champion level makes sense, his new mons being as strong less so. But also, even if the execution was wonky, the decision to have Ash finally ascend to this status in this series was absolutely the right one. It was ABOUT time and remember,

It would ALWAYS felt uncanny to see Ash become this strong and defeat everyone simply because the rest of the series did a poor job by constantly showing him as handicapped and not as strong, with some ridiculous gaps such as again, the Flint episode
So the execution may be botched, but I'm glad we finally are at this stage. It's about time Ash's journey let him more upwards and he won
Don't search Flint episode in sinnoh

Worst mistake of my life
 

BlobbiBoi

Well-Known Member
tl;dr: Blame Ash's meteoric rise on the anime being allowed to do what it should have been doing for 20+ years rather than being forced into reset after reset to keep it fresh for each never generation of fans.

Its not bad writing, its a massive fault of how prior seasons had to handicap Ash as a very strong (but Not Too Strong) trainer.

Its the same reason why Leon, the only Champion with no side gig, got taken as a Tobias-tier character and not a genuine threat.
 

AJ97

Well-Known Member
I think this is my main problem.

Even Elite 4 members have also been shown as way out of Ash's league (Hi, Flint!) to a degree that never made sense and because Ash literally cannot advance yet HAS to advance at the same time. Ash, the character who has stopped world-ending plots and fought Legendary Pokemon more times than I can bother to remember.

I don't know why Ash having a new team matters in this case; if Ash was allowed to be as effective of a trainer as his progression implies on a macro level he should have no trouble taking any Pokemon and making them good. That's what he generally does.

I do agree that OS > Johto was the most obvious bit of progression; after that Ash wasn't really allowed to progress further.
I absolutely agree with regard to your point about why Ash having a new team shouldn't matter. Ash is clearly much more experienced and stronger now. Plus, the PWC is far more difficult and challenging compared to the traditional gym challenge giving his Pokemon more experience. Also; Ash started with some fairly experienced Pokemon already in the first place.

That said, considering that this particular tournament is supposed to be the culmination of all his experiences and also the fact that Ash is not the kind of Trainer who would simply stick to optimizing a specific set of Pokemon to win a tournament etc; I think not including reserves was a mistake from that perspective.
 

Peluched49

Well-Known Member
Yes, if not at least use his Alola team which is the team that got him to "Champion tier" in the first place. This conversation has been dragged out forever but people aren't that keen of Ash using new(ish) Pokemon and yet somehow they're able to defeat opponents that he was never implied to be on their level before this series. It comes off as very hand wavy and messy just because they've decided he should stop becoming a loser out of the blue this series and use this as a make up.

It's so weird because I've always somewhat coped with that episode that in a way it was just a one time thing and he defeated an old companion but who would've thought it was establishing the narrative that somehow Ash is Champion tier.

And it made absolutely no sense and they haven't helped established this anymore than they did since then. We aren't privy to any new training tactics, what's he been doing differently than the last series, why is this team somehow more powerful or anything else showing progress that Ash has used his past experiences to improve this team to that level. Nothing
They decided to make him stop being a loser in XY, Journeys is just the cherry on top. Going from a trainer who suddenly became an everyday is my first day to narujesus admired and loved by every trainer is an awful transition. That came out of the nowhere. This isnt a problem that journeys started, it is something that started when the series did a soft reboot.
 

hottom3rd

Well-Known Member
I have watched this anime since the literal first day it aired when I was in grade school after school. It has been a long, long, long time and this was the most satisfying conclusion to this immortal "always a 10 year old's" story I have ever seen.

Pikachu needed to be the star, and that he was. The animation was intense and the cinderace strata backfired so hard. Cameos of all ash's companions were on point. I cannot believe it, my boy finally did it.. I am okay with the anime going in a different direction now. Ash aging, making random cameos in the future as the unbeatable one and the reigning monarch. Maybe he becomes the "goal" for a new protagonist?

I feel it's time to introduce a whole new protagonist. Ugh. My heart. I cannot express how happy I am with this. And the journeys series as a whole.

20+ years dude... it's been so long.. glad I lived to see this day.
 

AJ97

Well-Known Member
Don't search Flint episode in sinnoh

Worst mistake of my life
It's not just Flint. Ash was always shown to be outclassed by Elite four members and Regional Champions. He was never strong enough (Until Kalos, to hold his own against them in a serious battle).

Elite four members are strong enough to hold their own against the Regional Champion.

Yes, I know about Scott mentioning BF being on par with the Elite four. However, in the subs, I believe Scott mentions that some of the BF members are able to hold their own against Elite four members.
Maybe Brandon could be an example. Ash barely won against Brandon after what 3 tries? And even in that battle; he did not beat Brandon at his best.
 
blame the previous series Ash post BF was already at E4 level as it was implied that those trainers are E4 equivalent and Ash was the BF champion but then that infamous Flint Episode....

.... Let's pretend that DP165 never happened
 

Jibanyan

Well-Known Member
Was the gender of May's Eevee/Glaceon ever confirmed? I think the oufit implies it is male, I know they are just clother but this is the Pokémon anime
 

Bortgreen

Captain Pikachu is EPIC
tl;dr: Blame Ash's meteoric rise on the anime being allowed to do what it should have been doing for 20+ years rather than being forced into reset after reset to keep it fresh for each never generation of fans.

Its not bad writing, its a massive fault of how prior seasons had to handicap Ash as a very strong (but Not Too Strong) trainer.

Its the same reason why Leon, the only Champion with no side gig, got taken as a Tobias-tier character and not a genuine threat.
Anyway it's funny how there was a common sense if Ash won a league the anime would end and now here we are
 

Spider-Phoenix

#ChespinGang
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