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Full Power! (My HO Team)

Discussion in 'Older Gen RMT' started by Jazz™, Oct 25, 2012.

  1. Jazz™

    Jazz™ Not exactly Orthodox

    Full Power!

    This is my first HO team, that I've used for a while. It's got to 1447 on Showdown, and counting. Please rate!
    [​IMG]
    HypnoCat (Espeon) (F) @ Light Clay
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Reflect
    - Light Screen
    - Wish
    - Psyshock

    Espeon is my lead. I set up screens as quick as possible and then get out of there. If they try to set up rocks while say, Sala's in, then i switch back and they get reflected! Wish is for recovery late game and Psyshock is for if Espeon is my last poke.
    [​IMG]
    Saladmence (Salamence) (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Outrage
    - Fire Blast
    - Earthquake
    - Dragon Claw

    MoxieScarfMence. I love it. Outspeeds anything you're opponent can throw at it, and when you defeat THAT... Your attack gets higher! Outrage rocks, just don't use it on a team with Genesect, Ice Beam will kill you. Fire Blast handles Scizor and Skarm, and Earthquake handles Tenta. Dragon Claw is good against a Genesect team where you don't want to be locked into Outrage.
    [​IMG]

    Mush Room? (Breloom) (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Spore
    - Swords Dance
    - Bullet Seed
    - Mach Punch

    Breloom is my pokemon that handles anything too scary for the rest of my team to take on (e.g Genesect) I switch in on a death and SPORE! Swords Dance can be used on a switch or sleep and then I Bullet Seed. Mach Punch gives me a bit of priority on the team, and Life Orb increases MP and BS's lackluster power to something a bit more respectable
    [​IMG]

    Shadow (Gengar) (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Substitute


    I needed a powerful spinblocker, so I chose Gengar. I chose the right attack for the Poke I'm against. Shadow Ball is STAB, Focus Blast covers Steel, Dark, Ice and Normal types. HP Fire covers Scizor and Skarm, and Subs can help me stall my HP back with Black Sludge
    [​IMG]

    Shelly (Cloyster) (F) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Skill Link
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Icicle Spear
    - Shell Smash
    - Rock Blast
    - Razor Shell

    No HO team is complete without Cloyster. Unless there's hazards, I Shell Smash, and then I can Icicle Spear or Rock Blast for immense power. Occasionally, Razor Shell might be useful for pokes that resist both Multi-attacks.
    [​IMG]

    Superstar (Starmie) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunderbolt
    - Rapid Spin

    Starmie is my spinner. I wanted a spinner that can do strong attacks, but I've always hated Donphan, so I chose Starmie. I get BoltBeam, and Hydro Pump is reliable STAB.

    Feel free to import and test:
    HypnoCat (Espeon) (F) @ Light Clay
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Reflect
    - Light Screen
    - Wish
    - Psyshock

    Saladmence (Salamence) (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Outrage
    - Fire Blast
    - Earthquake
    - Dragon Claw

    Mush Room? (Breloom) (M) @ Fighting Gem
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Spore
    - Swords Dance
    - Bullet Seed
    - Mach Punch

    Shadow (Gengar) (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Substitute

    Shelly (Cloyster) (F) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Skill Link
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Icicle Spear
    - Shell Smash
    - Rock Blast
    - Razor Shell

    Superstar (Starmie) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunderbolt
    - Rapid Spin
    If you do import, please keep the nicknames,and Sala has to be shiny for the name to make sense.
    Please Rate!​
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2012
  2. Jr Breshears

    Jr Breshears PKMN Breeder

    Just a quick nitpick try King's Rock over Focus Sash on Cloyster this will get you quite a bit of flinches that always help :D
     
  3. Klaus™

    Klaus™ Banned

    minor nitpick, full rate later, but go disable>thunderbolt on gengar. thunderbolt doesn't really help, and starmie is already koed by STAB shadow ball.

    salamence needs its ddance set, as it allows it to set up easier and be much more of a threat.

    Salamence @Life Orb
    - Moxie -
    Naughty/ Adamant
    252 atk/ 4 SpA/ 252 speed
    - Dragon Dance
    - Dragon Claw
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Blast/ Brick Break


    Breloom, replace with a Swords Dance Terrakion. this eliminates some mamoswine weakness, and allows it to be much more threatening.

    Terrakion @Life Orb
    - Justified -
    Jolly
    252 atk/ 4 def/ 252 speed
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - Swords Dance
    - Earthquake/ Substitute

    SD terrakion has a lot of opportunity to set up, or even lead by faking a deo-d lead. simply substitute or swords dance as they switch out, say, genesect, and wreak havoc. earthquake is another option over sub, if you want some coverage options and a quake-edge combo, and it also hits some random pokes harder than normal, like golurk and nidoking/queen, 3 reliable counters to terrakion.


    you are also fairly weak to SD lucario, especially priority variants. now, with you being less mamo weak with terrakion, change scizor to Rock Polish Genesect. HO teams often get a lot of opportunities to set up, so rock polish genesect is a great edition. it also beats and revenge kills SD lucario, as well as being a great late game sweeper.

    Genesect @Life Orb
    - Download -
    Timid
    252 SpA/ 4 SpD/ 252 speed
    - Rock Polish
    - Bug Buzz
    - Flamethrower
    - Thunderbolt/Ice Beam


    i would also recommend a spinner, as rocks and opposing spikes offense really hurt you, especially as both can be on opposing hyper offense teams. forretress>deoxys-d might well fix it.

    other pokemon that might give you trouble:

    - any form of Volcarona, if rocks arent up
    - +1 gyarados
    - Baton pass teams
    - Rain Offense
    - Sun Offense with Gene+Duggy
    - more

    all in all, it needs a bit more work and/or thought put into it as a team. i suggest reading an article or two on hyper offense and team-building in general, just for future purposes.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2012
  4. Cloyster needs focus sash to at least survive for the first turn to set up shell smash, and after that there's the danger of being one-shot by neutral (or super-effective) special moves and strong piority users like Scizor and it's bullet punch, Cloyster will need focus sash even if it doesn't get hit on the turn it sets up, and the rare nightmare of it's opponent surviving icicle spear or rock blast (rock blast may even miss) and then Cloyster will DEFINITELY need focus sash then to try again in the event of a rock blast miss or to finish what it started with the first icicle spear.

    I'd replace fire fang with another move a super-effective fire fang does less damage than a neutral-damage outrage:

    65 x 2 (supper-effective) =130
    120 x 1.5 (STAB) =180

    so I'd recommend Dragon Dance for a pre-moxie boost (as Darklord said).

    OR

    Go for Mixed Salamence and give it a Naive or Hasty nature and replace Fire Fang with Flamethrower or Fire Blast (hits Skarmory more painfully too).

    If you decide to use this I'd use an EV set of 156 Atk/ 100 Sp.Atk/ 252 Speed

    EDIT: Outrage/Earthquake/Fire Blast(flamethrower) gives perfect coverage so I'd replace crunch with dragon dance (also ensures outspeeding specs Thundurus-Therian).
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2012
  5. Jr Breshears

    Jr Breshears PKMN Breeder

    For some reason my damage calc isnt working right now so onto what you said. On Cloyster its pretty easy to get a shell smash so sash isnt all that needed, send it onto something that forces a switch and shell smash. I can beat grass types with icicle spear and electric types with rock bast. Scizor takes 2-3 hits to KO cloyster iirc so imo kings rock is better than sash imo it mostly depends on prefernece. After all its a suggestion to test he doesnt have to do it if he doesnt want to. Also dragon claw > crunch and fire fang < fire blast might be better and also naive over jolly for fire blast.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2012
  6. Klaus™

    Klaus™ Banned

    kings rock is too gimmicky to use effectively. focus sash is its best bet. also, not only electric or grass types carry those type moves. js.....
     
  7. Jr Breshears

    Jr Breshears PKMN Breeder

    Its really not gimmicky lots of good OU battles use it I even saw a team with one peaked 3rd with in the 1700s on PO again its just a suggestion. Oh also you could try the SD Tech set on Breloom which is

    Breloom @ Fight Gem
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
    Adamant Nature
    -Swords Dance
    -Spore
    -Mach Punch
    -Bullet Seed

    This gives you priority and this set would fit well with this team, you could also try out Jolly over Adamant with the HP evs into Speed but isnt needed. I would also not suggest forry over deo d, deo d is far better than forry on a HO team you need to have a fast stealth rocker and lay spikes as fast as you can which forry doesnt do.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2012
  8. Klaus™

    Klaus™ Banned

    just because you ladder high does not mean you are good, or even know what you are doing. pokemon is a luck based game. learn that now.
     
  9. Easy there!

    Anyways, I forgot to mention, if you notice that Deoxys-D isn't staying as long as you'd hoped, I'd recommend recover over spikes, you get to stay awhile and pummel on with night shade, it might be one less type of hazards to put down but unlike spikes, stealth rocks hit levitate users and flying types, so you still have some degree of hazards damage on everything (baring magic guard users who are immune from residual damage overall), but you get the added ability of regeneration as well.
     
  10. Jr Breshears

    Jr Breshears PKMN Breeder

    Recover isnt bad at all but I really think you need spikes so maybe over taunt or shadow sneak since hes more of a set up hazards and go type of pokemon. And if you do it over taunt then I would try mental herb a go over rocky helmet so you can still setup.
     
  11. Prohawk

    Prohawk A Professional Bird

    Changes done in red

    Things you may have trouble with

    -Stealth Rock

    Seriously, 2 of your pokes are weak to it and only 1 resists it. Investing in a Spinner/Magic Bouner may save your life here. Or just modify the team to be less rocks weak?

    -Skarmory

    Once Gengar is gone, nothing on your team can really touch it. Even Fire Fang from Mence will fail to do very much. Perhaps think about adding a Special Attacker, or at least some more Special Attacks

    -Set up sweepers

    Something like Rock Polish Landy can easily set up on say Deoxys and proceed to destroy your team with Earth Power/Hp Ice/Psychic. This is somewhat alleviated with Cloyster being sashed, but if even 1 layer of hazards are up, your only shot is for Scizors Bullet Punch to really come through for you

    -Speedy threats

    Tornadus-T can totally destroy you with Hurricane. Maybe you could add in a nice Mixed Wall like Porygon2 or Cresselia to tank hits like that
     
  12. jle1076

    jle1076 Well-Known Member

    Salamence should definitely be Naive with some SpA investment with Fire Blast. Fire Fang's base Power is absolutely laughable. Also, Poison Heal Breloom is SEVERELY outclassed by Technician Breloom.
     
  13. Yeah, a spinner is recommended on any type of team. although personally I wouldn't replace Deoxys-D with it

    The prime sprinners for OU are: Starmie, Tentacruel, Donphan, and Forretress, however, I would recommend the Starmie the most since it has Natural Cure to heal off toxic spikes after spinning them away and switching out. However, Tentacruel also works since it can use rapid spin as well as lay down hazards of its own (toxic spike layers), plus it absorbs toxic spikes upon entry unlike Starmie who takes damage and has to switch out to get rid of the toxic condition however aside from Starmie the latter 3 are a bit stall-based may ruin your momentum, plus Tentacruel is a little relient on weather due to rain dish, but it presents an opportunity against the ever so common rain teams found in OU.

    This set for Starmie has worked well for me:

    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Timid
    Natural Cure
    4 HP/ 252 Sp.Atk/ 252 Speed
    -Hydro Pump
    -Ice Beam
    -Thunderbolt
    -Rapid Spin
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2012
  14. Jazz™

    Jazz™ Not exactly Orthodox

    Made lots of changes, so please continue to rate!
     
  15. Why do you have Mental Herb on Deoxys?! It cures attracted status - Deoxys is non-gendered - immune in the first place! Try leftovers or red card if you don't see much use for mental herb, as far as I have seen on PO, taunters aren't used very often and the ones I have ran into is the obvious Aerodactyl, plus you can still pummel on with 100 base power nightshades.

    Why are you running a mixed Cloyster? The EV set-up for it doesn't doesn't give it much support for it's Sp.Atk stat, plus, it's not rare to see Heatran run 31/30/30/31/31/31 for HP Ice 70, so it's physical defense would be weaker than it's Sp.Def, a 252 Atk EV, smash boosted, STAB Razor Shell should do the deed just fine. If you still see the need for a mixed Cloyster, run Naive as well for a speed advantage and stick some attack EVs and the 4 defense EVs into Sp.Atk.

    EDIT: Nevermind the crossed statement.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2012
  16. Hi there. I don't really play anymore but I am a fan of HO so, hey, why not give a rate?

    Pretty cool team you got here, but it can use some changes.
    - From what I've heard, there's a whole lot of HO Teams on the ladder, so you may want to change Deoxys-D's moveset to sort of help out with that. May I suggest this set?:
    - If you're going to be using Scarf Mence, just use 252 Atk | 4 SpA | 252 Spd with a Naive Nature. You will be using a Physical Dragon Move most of the time anyway, most likely Outrage. It makes a much better Late Game sweeper anyway.

    - Breloom seems fine.

    - May I also suggest a Gengar set that I found to be pretty fun and good to use? It fits quite nice with HO Teams.
    - I am a bit iffy on Cloyster, but hey, if it works for you that's fine.

    - You don't really need a spinner on an HO Team. Maybe try swapping Starmie for another sweeper like Swords Dance Lucario / Dragon Dance Dragonite / Swords Dance Terrakion.

    Good luck!
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2012
  17. -Umbreon-Latias-

    -Umbreon-Latias- Dark Master

    The only thing im sort of iffy on is 2 water types with Starmie and Cloyster. that and running a non D-dance mence...if a good electric type comes your way then you might just not be able to win. the salamences eathquake is the only thing that can really do some damage and if it goes down then your water types sort of have to fend for themselves..
     
  18. Jazz™

    Jazz™ Not exactly Orthodox

    I thought you got banned.
    Thanks for everyone's rates, I think the team is getting a lot better now.
     
  19. A Moon Gust

    A Moon Gust I Like Punz

    your team is too reliant on deo-d, your team needs volturn if its HO, also can you post a threat list please
     
  20. Prohawk

    Prohawk A Professional Bird

    Team is hardly reliant on Deoxys-D. Sure he's there to get up hazards and reflect opposing hazards, but that's pretty much standard for HO.

    Also a HO team doesn't need volt-turn

    @Jazz Hands, I think Life Orb is generally a better item on Breloom rather then Fight Gem. Sure the 50% boost is nice, but it only works once and only on Mach Punch. Life Orb gives a 30% boost to all moves and sticks around as long as Breloom is alive.

    Also just a note that Heatran takes neutral damage from Rock Blast, it doesn't resist it
     

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