Gamefreak and "Shillmon" Starters?

[Mythical-Moonlight]

Anyone else dislike how, Game Freak has forced the concept that One of the Three Starters in every generation is the "Best" one that deserves the most attention?

Obviously there's always been some sort of favoritism in the franchise (Hi Charizard ), but ever since X and Y it feels more a lot more in-your-face? Especially with things like Ash-Greninja or Charizard having 2 Mega Evos.

I have No hate towards Pokémon like Greninja and Charizard but a lot of their pushing feels really.... Unbalanced (?) for a lack of a better term?

It makes one Question "Well what's even the point of having 3 Starters to choose from if they're going to put care into only ONE?"

Not to mention there's also always gonna be the underlying paranoia that the Starter you liked may end being the one who gets shafted/screwed over HARD (Poor Chespin...)

Perhaps maybe it's just me, but what do you guys think?

Do you think all 3 Starters Should be treated more equally?
Or are you fine with the way things are?

 

[Gamzee Makara]

It's almost like one starter out of a series is made to be more inherently marketable since Piplup.

If you think Charizard, Pikachu and Eevee are bad, just look at Piplup in Japan.

 

[Leonhart]

I remember being upset that only Lizardon (Charizard) received two Mega Evolved forms out of the Gen I Starters, but it was pretty much expected. Personally, I don't choose my Starters based on popularity: I typically go with whichever ones have the most appealing final evolved form. That said, I'm particularly bothered by the constant Gekkouga (Greninja) pandering even to this day.

 

[Taodragon]

There's two faces to this issue:

The first is just a general response to popularity. Pokemon is ridiculously marketing driven, and if you hit it off with the fanbase you're probably going to sell more merchandise and get more attention to their product. Due to that it's sadly a given that some Starters get all the love while others get left out in the cold. Gen 6 is a good example of that, for as much as I dislike how Greninja overshadows the other two so massively, it's no surprise that happened when you look at how the fanbase treats them. Greninja is hugely popular as even when the game first released it was making waves, while with the other two Delphox ended up getting mixed reception due to a bad first impression while Chesnaught is often among the most forgotten Starters in the franchise. So of course they're going to see Greninja's high popularity and milk that for all it's worth while ignoring the other two who will probably move far less merch. For Ash-Greninja in particular though, that is partly on GF as well as favoritism. Megas were treated as a non-Gen 6 thing to promote old favorites and that meant there was little incentive to give the Starters Megas in the first place, and Greninja lucked out as on top of that popularity the anime writers wanted a form for Ash's and they came up with a design.

The second does come down to favoritism as sometimes GF does jump on the boat before it's even left. With each Generation there's always some Pokemon that seems to get promoted ahead of all others in recent years, even before there's a chance for it to appeal to the fanbase. One big example of that is Gen 6 with Mega Charizard X as before it even appeared it had the Origins special, Mega Evolution special, and a huge amount of merch and advertising all lined up while Y got... Super Mystery Dungeon, and even then it was just the cover as X was all over the advertising for it anyway. While X's popularity probably solidified its presence in advertising, the fact that they didn't even give Y a chance to shine while shilling the former shows that GF just wanted to push it because they felt it'd be the bigger sell. For a more recent example we have Cinderace as even before we got the first popularity polls it was already making waves in merchandising and anime appearances while Inteleon and Rillaboom only appeared from time to time. It's evened out a bit, likely due to Inteleon being very popular in Japan, but even so it's clear that Cinderace is meant to be the face GF wants us to remember from the Generation.

In those cases it is more unfair as it's not a response that leads to the push, but rather just GF feeling like their favorite will be the bigger of the group and thus more marketable. It also ends up being something of a self-fulfilling prophecy as the one that gets the most exposure is usually going to be the one that has the most popularity as they have the biggest presence in the minds of the consumer.

I definitely would prefer that GF was better about balancing the Starters since even the least popular still has a number of fans, but even in that case I'm sure they'd still play favorites.

 

[Mythical-Moonlight]

It's almost like one starter out of a series is made to be more inherently marketable since Piplup.

If you think Charizard, Pikachu and Eevee are bad, just look at Piplup in Japan.

Piplup never completely overshadowed Infernape and Torterra tho

Well it didn't overshadow Infernape anyways....

 

[desdar300]

I say that based on what Dr, Lava has written it's a three party system with TPC, Nintendo, and ofc OLM.
It seems like before a gen begins they get together to decide the shillmons based on how they feel it'll appeal to the market.
Greninja is a recent example of this where Sakurai and TPC made it a star without it even having a name yet while Chesnaught and Delphox got peanuts.
The G8 Starters are an odd case because Intelion won JP polls but the other two were very popular in the VGC and meta scene and took the West by storm.
I think this is why they're being treated somewhat well by OLM via Gou compared to their peers because of how lopsided things turned out

 

[Mythical-Moonlight]

I say that based on what Dr, Lava has written it's a three party system with TPC, Nintendo, and ofc OLM.
It seems like before a gen begins they get together to decide the shillmons based on how they feel it'll appeal to the market.
Greninja is a recent example of this where Sakurai and TPC made it a star without it even having a name yet while Chesnaught and Delphox got peanuts.
The G8 Starters are an odd case because Intelion won JP polls but the other two were very popular in the VGC and meta scene and took the West by storm.
I think this is why they're being treated somewhat well by OLM via Gou compared to their peers because of how lopsided things turned out

This makes me I wonder what happened during Gen 7.

From what I saw Decidueye was very popular in the West while Primarina was popular in Japan

Both got table scraps compared to Incineroar who was the only Alola Starter with a Movie cameo, Main Anime Debut had it One-Hit KO'ding the other 2 Starters, King of VGC (at the time), and of course Smash Bros

Same case with Gen 5.

Serperior was very popular yet got the shaft in favor of the Emboar line (by far the least Popular of the Trio)
(Then again I also heard that apparently Gamefreak thought that a Snake starter might've been too scary for kids so that may explain it)

 

[Ignition]

In an ideal world, all ~900 Pokémon would have equal amounts of push from GF in marketing. Unfortunately that’s not the world we live in yet it doesn’t bother me. For better or for worse, they are a business who prioritizes what sells over what’s fair. The reason it doesn’t bother me is because ...I’m still free to like what I want? Like yeah I get tired of seeing Charizard everywhere but I still like it as a species. I don’t really care how much the general public reacts to the popularity of anything. How much push something gets doesn’t impact my opinion on it that much.

 

[desdar300]

This makes me I wonder what happened during Gen 7.

From what I saw Decidueye was very popular in the West while Primarina was popular in Japan

Both got table scraps compared to Incineroar who was the only Alola Starter with a Movie cameo, Main Anime Debut had it One-Hit KO'ding the other 2 Starters, King of VGC (at the time), and of course Smash Bros

Same case with Gen 5.

Serperior was very popular yet got the shaft in favor of the Emboar line (by far the least Popular of the Trio)
(Then again I also heard that apparently Gamefreak thought that a Snake starter might've been too scary for kids so that may explain it)

Incineroar was the favorite Pokemon of Ken sugimori and Shigeru ohmori combine that with being a Pokemon based off of the incredibly iconic tiger mask and you have yourself a deal.
Even without people picking up on tiger mask a lot of people are aware of the wrestling scene thanks the WWE so it's that appeal.
I think what ended up happening with deci is that its pre Evolution was very popular and was selling merchandise like crazy.
Since one of them could fill the cute niche the other two were allowed to fully evolved

 

[janejane6178]

Tbh, while it's true it gets alot of merch, I dont see Greninja heavily marketed in the anime.. He hasnt shown up since XYZ.

 

[Spider-Phoenix]

Not to mention there's also always gonna be the underlying paranoia that the Starter you liked may end being the one who gets shafted/screwed over HARD (Poor Chespin...)

It's really good seeing you care.

Jokes apart, I'm kind indifferent, specially because all of the "shill starters" are pokémon I like so no loss so far.

I just hope we get a type changing grass starter at some point to complete a trio with Greninja and Cinderace lol

 

[Mythical-Moonlight]

It's really good seeing you care.

Jokes apart, I'm kind indifferent, specially because all of the "shill starters" are pokémon I like so no loss so far.

I just hope we get a type changing grass starter at some point to complete a trio with Greninja and Cinderace lol

Closest we had was Sceptile.
Even so it got overshadowed by Blaziken.

Fire Starters always seem to get the most attention except for Gen 6 it seems

 

[Mr.Munchlax]

I say that based on what Dr, Lava has written it's a three party system with TPC, Nintendo, and ofc OLM.
It seems like before a gen begins they get together to decide the shillmons based on how they feel it'll appeal to the market.
Greninja is a recent example of this where Sakurai and TPC made it a star without it even having a name yet while Chesnaught and Delphox got peanuts.
The G8 Starters are an odd case because Intelion won JP polls but the other two were very popular in the VGC and meta scene and took the West by storm.
I think this is why they're being treated somewhat well by OLM via Gou compared to their peers because of how lopsided things turned out

The Johto & Unova starters seemed to have had equal treatment during their haydays too

 

[Orphalesion]

The Johto & Unova starters seemed to have had equal treatment during their haydays too

Though tbf the Johto starters are pretty much the most forgotten starter trio in all of Pokémon, and arguably rightfully so; neither are their designs on par with other starter trios (imo) but they are also fairly terrible as far as stats and move pools go.
It kinda goes hand-in-hand with Gen 2 being generally overlooked and being treated as little more than Gen 1's "expansion pack"

 

[Weavy]

Anyone else dislike how, Game Freak has forced the concept that One of the Three Starters in every generation is the "Best" one that deserves the most attention?

I've disliked it since forever; and this favourtism among starters is something that REALLY bothers me. That question brought up perfectly explains my thoughts as well since why bother making 3 starters when it's very clear they have a favourite and push that one more than the other two.

I know Gen 6 is used a lot as an example, but can you blame people when it's one of the biggest examples of starter favourtism in the franchise? You could remove Chespin and Fennekin from the starter pool and most people wouldn't care or notice, which really sucks for Chespin and Fennekin fans (I like both of them and it hurts). When Greninja gets so much special treatment to the point it has a mega-like form that the other two don't and constantly shoved down our throat to this day, I can kind of see why some people would be upset. Froakie was the obvious favourite since day 1 and might as well have been the only Kalos starter considering how badly the other two were treated in comparison.

However, I do find it funny that Gen 8 tried to do this, but right now it's in a really awkward spot. It's really obvious they wanted Cinderace to be the clear favourite since it's being marketed more than the other two, but Inteleon is almost as popular as Cinderace is if we look at popularity polls (especially in Japan), and this is despite the fact Inteleon was completely screwed over in regards to competitive Pokemon. While Rillaboom is easily the least popular of the three in general terms, it is however very popular in the competitive scene at the moment, to the point it's considered one of the top choices, so that still gives it a bit of exposure. So in a strange way, all three of them have appeal somewhere, but Cinderace still has the upper hand having appeal in both casual and competitive, while Inteleon only really appealing to the casual crowd and Rillaboom mostly appealing to the competitive crowd.

 

[Yveltal91057]

Venusaur, Charizard, Blastoise, Sceptile, Blaziken and Swampert all got Mega Evolutions in Gen 6.

Two generations later, the fully evolved Kanto and Galar starters get Gigantamax forms. Except for the Alola starters who got exclusive Z-Moves in SM/USUM, what did the other starters get in Gen 6, 7 and 8? Absolutely nothing.

 

[TheWanderingMist]

Venusaur, Charizard, Blastoise, Sceptile, Blaziken and Swampert all got Mega Evolutions in Gen 6.

Two generations later, the fully evolved Kanto and Galar starters get Gigantamax forms. Except for the Alola starters, what did the other starters get in Gen 6, 7 and 8? Absolutely nothing.

Venusaur and Blastoise only got them because Charizard got them. The favoritism toward Charizard is blatant enough. Not to mention Charizard and Blaziken are STILL treated as more special, because Charizard got two Megas and Blaziken's Mega got to exist for a full year before the other two got one.

 

[Mythical-Moonlight]

Venusaur, Charizard, Blastoise, Sceptile, Blaziken and Swampert all got Mega Evolutions in Gen 6.

Two generations later, the fully evolved Kanto and Galar starters get Gigantamax forms. Except for the Alola starters, what did the other starters get in Gen 6, 7 and 8? Absolutely nothing.

The Alola Starters got Z-Moves

It's Gens 2, 4, and 5 that didn't get any special gimmicks

But that's not what this thread's about.

There's always one Starter in every Gen that's the clear "favorite" of TPCi except Gen 2 and 5

Gen 1 - Charizard
Gen 2 - Still Charizard XD
Gen 3 - Blaziken
Gen 4 - Infernape
Gen 5 - Was supposed to be Pignite but it somehow became Charizard again XD
Gen 6 - Greninja
Gen 7 - Incineroar
Gen 8 - Cinderace

It got especially bad from Gen 6 onwards.

I've disliked it since forever; and this favourtism among starters is something that REALLY bothers me. That question brought up perfectly explains my thoughts as well since why bother making 3 starters when it's very clear they have a favourite and push that one more than the other two.

I know Gen 6 is used a lot as an example, but can you blame people when it's one of the biggest examples of starter favourtism in the franchise? You could remove Chespin and Fennekin from the starter pool and most people wouldn't care or notice, which really sucks for Chespin and Fennekin fans (I like both of them and it hurts). When Greninja gets so much special treatment to the point it has a mega-like form that the other two don't and constantly shoved down our throat to this day, I can kind of see why some people would be upset. Froakie was the obvious favourite since day 1 and might as well have been the only Kalos starter considering how badly the other two were treated in comparison.

However, I do find it funny that Gen 8 tried to do this, but right now it's in a really awkward spot. It's really obvious they wanted Cinderace to be the clear favourite since it's being marketed more than the other two, but Inteleon is almost as popular as Cinderace is if we look at popularity polls (especially in Japan), and this is despite the fact Inteleon was completely screwed over in regards to competitive Pokemon. While Rillaboom is easily the least popular of the three in general terms, it is however very popular in the competitive scene at the moment, to the point it's considered one of the top choices, so that still gives it a bit of exposure. So in a strange way, all three of them have appeal somewhere, but Cinderace still has the upper hand having appeal in both casual and competitive, while Inteleon only really appealing to the casual crowd and Rillaboom mostly appealing to the competitive crowd.

Your completely fine for using Gen 6 as an example because it's the biggest offender of this

And your right in saying that barely anyone would care if you removed Fenniken and Chespin because that's how skewed the bias towards the Froakie line was

 

[Tepig Pignite Emboar 969]

I like how most of the fire starters get the most love out of the 3 in each generation, but I do believe the starters should be treated more equally. I mean my favorite pokemon of all time, the Tepig evolution line, which is a starter, is possibly considered the least popular and worst starter of all time. That makes me angry, because I want Tepig Pignite and Emboar to be more loved and popular.

And speaking of the Gen 6 starters, isn't the Fennekin evolution line also popular too? I mean isn't Braixen one of the most popular starter middle evos? I know I read that somewhere in this forum I think. Does that make Chespin the least popular gen 6 starter? Because I know lots of people didn't like Quilladin.

 

[janejane6178]

The Alola Starters got Z-Moves

It's Gens 2, 4, and 5 that didn't get any special gimmicks

But that's not what this thread's about.

There's always one Starter in every Gen that's the clear "favorite" of TPCi except Gen 2 and 5

Gen 1 - Charizard
Gen 2 - Still Charizard XD
Gen 3 - Blaziken
Gen 4 - Infernape
Gen 5 - Was supposed to be Pignite but it somehow became Charizard again XD
Gen 6 - Greninja
Gen 7 - Incineroar
Gen 8 - Cinderace

It got especially bad from Gen 6 onwards.

Your completely fine for using Gen 6 as an example because it's the biggest offender of this

And your right in saying that barely anyone would care if you removed Fenniken and Chespin because that's how skewed the bias towards the Froakie line was

Indont think that theres a clear favourite starter in gen 7 and 8. Atleast its not very noticable like in previous gens