Gameplay Discussion Thread [Read First Post]

[Blazios]

I dunno, I felt it implied that beauty is only for females.

 

[R_N]

I dunno, I felt it implied that beauty is only for females.

No, the implication is that females are common figures of beauty, especially in art.

 

[Excitable Boy]

Which in the end doesn't change the fact that it would be OP for a secondary Pokemon.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

Which in the end doesn't change the fact that it would be OP for a secondary Pokemon.

Not really, since really the only thing Vespiquen's got going for it is good stats. It doesn't get anything useful (except maybe Power Gem for Fire and Flying type coverage) until Lv. 25. But if you so insist on removing it, how about something like Skorupi or Yanma instead?

 

[Morty05]

TO everyone who says Burgh should have vespiqueen: Techically he dose when you fight him in PWT it is one of his possible team for PWT: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Burgh so yeah he actually have one.. he just don't use one for gym battle.

 

[Excitable Boy]

Not really, since really the only thing Vespiquen's got going for it is good stats.

You're reeeaaaally overestimating the awesomeness of the 3rd Gym's movesets here, and you're reeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaally marginalizing the impact of base stats here. Burgh's Leavanny (that is, his ace) carries Struggle Bug, Cut, Razor Leaf, and String Shot. They gave his ace Pokemon friggin' String Shot. His Swadloon is the same, but with Protect over Cut. His Dwebble carries Struggle Bug, Smack Down, Faint Attack, and Rock Polish.

Right off the bat, Burgh's Vespiquen is getting Struggle Bug because that's his TM and it's cool. Considering that Leavanny has a base SpA of 70 compared to Vespiquen's 80, already Vespiquen is launching more powerful attacks than the Leader's ace.

I'm not done yet.

From there, Vespiquen has three slots to fill with moves. Following the pattern of Burgh's other Pokemon's movesets, she'd have access to Pursuit, Defend Order, Fury Swipes, and Slash. Of those moves, she's going to have to have either Defend Order or Slash. Defend Order raises her 70/102/102 defenses (better than anything you've faced so far by a huge margin) up to obscene levels, especially if she's allowed to use it multiple times. Slash is a fairly strong move coming off a base 80 Attack stat, and is comparable to hsi Leavanny's Cuts. If you want to go further down the list of moves she could use until you get into laughably bad territory, she could use Fury Cutter, Poison Sting, Sweet Scent, Confuse Ray, and Gust. The absolute worst moveset she could possibly have, then, would be Struggle Bug/Sweet Scent/Fury Swipes/Pursuit.

I'm not done yet.

So, she has a bad moveset. She's still f*cking hell on earth to face, because she has massive bulk in her 70/102/102 defenses (which, for perspective, are the toughest defenses you will have to punch through until Marlon), meaning she can just sit through your attacks, maybe using Burgh's Hyper Potion in the process, all the while Struggle Bugging your Pokemon to death, because oh yeah, those are more powerful than the ones his ace tosses out. If you have a resist, she could still pull off Sweet Scent to make you at least hurtable via Fury Swipes (which, again, is operating off a base 80 Attack stat, meaning that it will hurt).

I'm still not done yet.

The next Leader to use an -ace- that's better statistically than Vespiquen is Clay, and the next Leader to use a secondary that's better is Drayden, with his Flygon. Outside of catching a Roggenrola or Timburr in the Relic Path (who have bad SpD, are outsped and are just asking to get one-shotted by Struggle Bug), the best thing with a Rock attack would probably be Dunsparce's Rollout.

Seriously. Just stop.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

Again, what about something like Skorupi or Yanma?

 

[Kall El]

His team was rather redundant (Burgh) ..
But I was pleased with some of the other changes..
Marlon, Skyla and Drayden to name a few.
Challenge mode makes the Gyms a little more, should I say challenging or appealing?

 

[Bolt the Cat]

But I was pleased with some of the other changes..
Marlon, Skyla and Drayden to name a few.

I don't exactly like what they did with Skyla's team, the only Pokemon from her BW1 team that remotely suited her (Unfezant) was replaced with Skarmory. Swoobat and Swanna don't really suit her IMO, and it irked me to see them keep both of them on her team.

Challenge mode makes the Gyms a little more, should I say challenging or appealing?

Some of what they did in Challenge Mode seemed like it should've been part of Normal Mode to begin with (in terms of number of Pokemon, specific species of Pokemon, etc). And of course, Challenge Mode should've been available to begin with as well.

 

[Pokechan]

Unable to battle N is just the tip of the iceberg here.



According to Serebii, Kyurem will appear in Giant Chasm for you to capture only if you have captured N's Resh/Zek.

So the real problem is that since you can't battle N that means you can't capture Resh/Zek, and without capturing Resh/Zek, Kyurem won't appear at Giant Chasm, and without capturing Kyurem you won't have the DNA Link Pin, which means no box mascot for you even if you trade a Kyurem & Resh/Zek into B/W 2.

That is really terrible. I hope that glitch is fixed in the International versions because that can cause some major frustration.

 

[Wishing Star]

I don't exactly like what they did with Skyla's team, the only Pokemon from her BW1 team that remotely suited her (Unfezant) was replaced with Skarmory. Swoobat and Swanna don't really suit her IMO, and it irked me to see them keep both of them on her team.

Personally, I think Swanna fits her (not in terms of personality, but rather in aesthetics). Swoobat, not so much.

Some of what they did in Challenge Mode seemed like it should've been part of Normal Mode to begin with (in terms of number of Pokemon, specific species of Pokemon, etc). And of course, Challenge Mode should've been available to begin with as well.

And of course, if neither Challenge Mode nor Assist Mode were available until post-game, at least they shouldn't have made them version-exclusive. Yeah, it promotes interactivity and such, but eh. Can't have it both ways, I suppose. :/

 

[TsukiMirage]

Wally kind of did in the end, but other than that, he kind of was a bad rival. RSE also handled your rival(s) badly. And Silver did have the same goal, to beat the Pokemon League and become Champion.

As far as I remember, neither Wally or Silver were purposely attempting to become the champion. The league was just a roundabout way for them to challenge the hero, which was Wally and Silver's main goal, along with destroying TR for the latter. Which was the original point, that we have already had two rivals like Hugh that didn't start out with the same goal as the hero. All three of them still ended up getting badges and challenging the league, but that wasn't their main goal.

 

[Cutty]

I don't exactly like what they did with Skyla's team, the only Pokemon from her BW1 team that remotely suited her (Unfezant) was replaced with Skarmory. Swoobat and Swanna don't really suit her IMO, and it irked me to see them keep both of them on her team.

Well, they're both locals. I think Skarmory is kinda cool for her team. The only one that a bit unsuits her is probably Swoobat since it's a bat.

I'm pretty content w/ everyone's changes.

 

[dirkac]

So yeah, anyway, what do you guys think of this:
Anyway, this is what they should've done in this game:

-Make Assist/Challenge Mode available to both versions from the start. YES
-Make Pokemon catchable in Oath Forest to give it more of a purpose than an empty field that you use to change Keldeo's form. This would have made a lot of sense, now it's just empty if you don't have Keldeo.
-Add a patch of grass in the entrance of Twist Mountain to allow you to catch Ice types earlier in the game. I would have liked it if Vannilite would appear but since they probly wouldn't, I couldn't care that musch other than catching Cubchoo.
-New Victory Road looks more like N's Castle What are you saying here?
-Make Rt. 10, Old Victory Road, and Challenger's Cave accessible post game. After beating the Elite 4, the entrance to Rt. 10 opens up. You can then access Challenger's Cave by crossing the bridge and going west (maybe they can keep the old entrance to Challenger's Cave open but block it with a one way ledge for good measure). Meanwhile, if you head to Old Victory Road, you can access N's Castle through there instead of down the cliffs of New Victory Road. Old Victory Road will remain inaccessible from the Pokemon League side until you've gone through it from the other side. I loved route 10, so I would have liked this too, actually, it would have made more sense to me if Keldeo learnt Secret Sword in Challenger Cave.
-Accumula Town, in keeping with the theme of being a fast growing town, has expanded eastward to the coast and is now Accumula City. That would have been nice.
-Change the rival's team so it has more Pokemon earlier in the game (seriously, why did he bother showing up to the Pokemon League with 4 Pokemon?) and more previous gen Pokemon. I haven't thought this one out that well, but I have some ideas:

Spoiler:- Rival Team:

Show Spoiler

Aspertia City:
Tepig/Oshawott/Snivy Lv. 5

Sangi Ranch:
Buizel/Sunkern/GrowlitheLv. 5
Tepig/Oshawott/Snivy Lv. 8
Going to have to disagree here. Putting the monkey again just seems like a Cheren/Bianca ripoff.

Virbank City (new):
Buizel/Sunkern/Growlithe Lv. 15
Pignite/Dewott/Servine Lv. 18

Rt. 4 (new):
Trapinch Lv. 25
Buizel/Sunkern/Growlithe Lv. 25
Pignite/Dewott/Servine Lv. 27

Lostlorn Forest (new):
Trapinch Lv. 26
Buizel/Sunkern/Growlithe Lv. 25
Pignite/Dewott/Servine Lv. 29

PWT:
Trapinch Lv. 25
Floatzel/Sunkern/Growlithe Lv. 25
Pignite/Dewott/Servine Lv. 25

Rt. 6 (new):
Drifloon Lv. 27
Trapinch Lv. 29
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 30
Pignite/Dewott/Servine Lv. 32

Celestial Tower (new):
Drifblim Lv. 34
Vibrava Lv. 35
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 36
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 37

Lentimas Town (new):
Drifblim Lv. 37
Vibrava Lv. 37
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 38
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 40

Undella Town:
Drifblim Lv. 40
Vibrava Lv. 40
Roselia/Lampent/Sealeo Lv. 39
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 42
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 44

Village Bridge (new):
Drifblim Lv. 46
Vibrava Lv. 44
Roserade/Chandelure/Walrein Lv. 45
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 47
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 49

Seaside Cave (new):
Drifblim Lv. 50
Flygon Lv. 50
Grumpig Lv. 51
Roserade/Chandelure/Walrein Lv. 49
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 51
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 53

Giant Chasm (new):
Drifblim Lv. 53
Grumpig Lv. 54
Flygon Lv. 53
Roserade/Chandelure/Walrein Lv. 52
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 55
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 57

New Victory Road:
Driblim Lv. 55
Grumpig Lv. 57
Flygon Lv. 57
Roserade/Chandelure/Walrein Lv. 56
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 57
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 60

Segaiha City:
Drifblim Lv. 61
Grumpig Lv. 61
Flygon Lv. 61
Roserade/Chandelure/Walrein Lv. 62
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 62
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 64

Challenger Cave (new):
Drifblim Lv. 64
Grumpig Lv. 64
Flygon Lv. 64
Roserade/Chandelure/Walrein Lv. 65
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 65
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 67

Driftveil City:
Drifblim Lv. 68
Grumpig Lv. 68
Flygon Lv. 68
Roserade/Chandelure/Walrein Lv. 67
Floatzel/Sunflora/Arcanine Lv. 67
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 70

Changes and additions in Bold.

But yeah. Vespiquen would be way overpowered for Burgh, Yanma or Skorupi would make sense though.

 

[Wishing Star]

Does the 3D function work for the 3DS BW and BW2 games (I'm not sure if they exist, since I play them on a regular DS)?

 

[dirkac]

Does the 3D function work for the 3DS BW and BW2 games (I'm not sure if they exist, since I play them on a regular DS)?

Nope. B2W2 does have 3DS add ons due to Dream Radar though.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

Personally, I think Swanna fits her (not in terms of personality, but rather in aesthetics). Swoobat, not so much.

Well, they're both locals. I think Skarmory is kinda cool for her team. The only one that a bit unsuits her is probably Swoobat since it's a bat.

Swanna doesn't fit nearly as much as Skarmory or Unfezant, and it sure as hell doesn't deserve to be her main.

As far as I remember, neither Wally or Silver were purposely attempting to become the champion. The league was just a roundabout way for them to challenge the hero, which was Wally and Silver's main goal, along with destroying TR for the latter. Which was the original point, that we have already had two rivals like Hugh that didn't start out with the same goal as the hero. All three of them still ended up getting badges and challenging the league, but that wasn't their main goal.

At least with Silver, he made a decent attempt to challenge you and the Pokemon League was in line with his goal. Wally only battles you a handful of times and only really challenges you at Victory Road, and Hugh's team is pathetic and is more interested in Team Plasma then he is with trying to beat you.

Changes and additions in Bold.

But yeah. Vespiquen would be way overpowered for Burgh, Yanma or Skorupi would make sense though.

Jesus Christ man, I know there weren't that many rival battles in the game, but this is a pretty huge overcorrection. I don't think you've ever battled a rival that much with the possible exception of BW1 (which would make more sense since there are 2 or 3 depending on your definition). On average, you only really battle your rival about 6 or 7 times. So I'd say no more than 10 or so would be appropriate. Also, as far as the Grass/Fire/Water trios go, keep it as simple as possible. Most of the time when rivals use trios of random Pokemon, they only use 2/3 of one trio. And you should try to balance the types as much as possible (for instance, don't use Litwick or Spheal lines since they have dual types that would make it unfair for certain starter choices), unless you're clever enough to balance it out with the starter difficulties. So then maybe something more like this:

Spoiler: Rival Battles

Aspertia City:
Tepig/Oshawott/Snivy Lv. 5

Virbank City:
Budew/Magby/Azurill Lv. 13
Azurill/Budew/Magby Lv. 13
Tepig/Oshawott/Snivy Lv. 15

Rt. 4:
Scraggy Lv. 22
Roselia/Magmar/Marill Lv. 23
Marill/Roselia/Magmar Lv. 23
Pignite/Dewott/Servine Lv. 25

PWT:
Roselia/Magmar/Marill Lv. 25
Marill/Roselia/Magmar Lv. 25
Pignite/Dewott/Servine Lv. 25

Rt. 6:
Scraggy Lv. 33
Roselia/Magmar/Marill Lv. 34
Marill/Roselia/Magmar Lv. 34
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 36

Undella Town:
Scraggy Lv. 38
Vibrava Lv. 40
Roserade/Magmortar/Azumarill Lv. 42
Azumarill/Roserade/Magmortar Lv. 42
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 44

Seigaiha City:
Drifblim Lv. 47
Scrafty Lv. 47
Flygon Lv. 47
Roserade/Magmortar/Azumarill Lv. 48
Azumarill/Roserade/Magmortar Lv. 48
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 50

Victory Road:
Drifblim Lv. 54
Scrafty Lv. 54
Flygon Lv. 54
Roserade/Magmortar/Azumarill Lv. 55
Azumarill/Roserade/Magmortar Lv. 55
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 56

Driftveil City:
Drifblim Lv. 67
Scrafty Lv. 67
Flygon Lv. 67
Roserade/Magmortar/Azumarill Lv. 68
Azumarill/Roserade/Magmortar Lv. 68
Emboar/Samurott/Serperior Lv. 70

 

[Plus side down side]

Swanna doesn't fit nearly as much as Skarmory or Unfezant, and it sure as hell doesn't deserve to be her main.

I think that Swanna fit on her team very well. Swanna was meant to be some beautiful, graceful bird, while Skyla was meant to be a beautiful and graceful pilot. But, I agree that they should have left Unfezant on and taken Swoobat off. Unfezant at least looked like an aerial pilot. Swoobat was just plain awkward looking.

 

[Cutty]

She should get Braviary. It looks so much better than Unfezant.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

She should get Braviary. It looks so much better than Unfezant.

For her post game team, yes, but for the gym battle they'd have to seriously underlevel it to get it to work (since Rufflet doesn't evolve until Lv. 54), and even then, I'm not sure it'd be worth it. It's almost an unwritten rule not to underlevel it more than 10 levels before its evolution level, so I suppose if you wanted to bump her Pokemon up to around Lv. 44, you could get away with it. IMO, they should only do that in Challenge Mode if at all.