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General Character Discussion

Discussion in 'Pokémon Generation VI Discussion' started by bobandbill, Jun 8, 2014.

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  1. HM02gon

    HM02gon Waiting...

    I was actually level 23.
     
  2. Mr.Munchlax

    Mr.Munchlax Thunder Trainer

    Personally, I think that this is a Looker from an alternate timeline since he did bring up the Battle Frontier when he first appears, which hasn't even been built yet in OR/AS. Maybe it'll be some special event that happens in the game once you receive Hoopa since it seems that the Mirage Spots and Zinnia's mention of the RSE universe in the Delta Episode could indicate that they may be setting up some kind of multiverse storyline
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2015
  3. R_N

    R_N Well-Known Member

    Huh? No he doesn't, unless I (& Bulbapedia) overlooked that dialog
    it sounds more like he's confused by some place being for BATTLE but also a relaxing resort
    It wont, the text's been dumped and I'm pretty sure you can hack in a hoopa to trip the flags

    Looker just remains an amnesiac so far as ORAS is concerned
     
  4. Mr.Munchlax

    Mr.Munchlax Thunder Trainer

    I thought that when Looker first appears, he asks if he's in the Feng Edge region or the Battle Frontier
     
  5. R_N

    R_N Well-Known Member

    neither of those
     
  6. SILVER XD

    SILVER XD Momentai, bro.

    Ack, nevermind. After checking Zinnia's "other world" speech in Mossdeep I see that I was incorrect in thinking the "other world" was just the other version of the game. I hope this whole "alternate timeline" and "the old games still exist" shenanigan gets left in the dust here and isn't mentioned again. It just seems really... dumb. Why even tell us about a "timeline" that we're never going to visit again? I was personally comfortable with these remakes being straight up retcons to fit in the possible continuity issues introduced by X&Y.

    Also, it's probably already been discussed here somewhere deep in the backlog of this thread but who do you think Aster was in relation to Zinnia? Not her Whismur, but the person who she lost and named her Whismur after(at least, that's the impression I got from her speech on Sky Pillar).

    I must say that I do like the world building and subtle characterization present in these games. Things from the Draconids to the near-worship of Rayquaza as a god to the little things like the letters in Sea Mauville. (I just noticed a lot of this really picks up around the Sootopolis event)
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2015
  7. R_N

    R_N Well-Known Member

    I got a "sister" sort of vibe, since the Draconids seem fairly blood related
    But I'm basing that on basically a puddle of information on who the Draconids are so a girlfriend is also more than possible (& the fact they dance around who aster was probably leans more towards it)

    I dont think it's like her mom since words like "my dear aster" is kind of weird language to use for a mother
     
  8. Grey Wind

    Grey Wind Only rescues maidens

    I don't think they put much thought into the other timeline, it feels like they just decided to throw in the description as a sort of easter egg. I can't imagine that it'll be ever brought up in more than a throwaway line again.


    I definitely got the impression that Aster was her daughter, what with the way she speaks to her and the "mum" sound Whismur makes (and I feel like she refers to her as her daughter at some point?). Although going with a dead child story line for someone so young does seem kind of weird, it could just be her sister or something
     
  9. Alexander18

    Alexander18 Banned

    I agree that alternate universes and timelines are dumb, it makes no sense for me and should exist in these games. As for Zinnia, I doubt we get any more info on her. She is likely to be a one-time thing.
     
  10. Bguy7

    Bguy7 The Dragon Lord

    Zinnia says this to Aster:
    Which means Aster was her daughter.
     
  11. Lorde

    Lorde Banned

    In my opinion, Zinnia didn't seem that old, so I personally doubt that the original Aster was her daughter. Maybe she simply thought of her Whismur as her kid.
     
  12. AuraChannelerChris

    AuraChannelerChris "Am I supposed to laugh?"

    If anything, the logic is supported in the side of Japan since they had inappropriate birth ages back when they were in the feudal period, and Zinnia's family tree is ancient enough to go further back, and she still has that custom with her somehow.

    But since Zinnia is this young, we can surmise that she was pregnant and her baby didn't make it.... I know, I know, it's too dark for a Pokemon game, but what can you do?
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2015
  13. TheFightingPikachu

    TheFightingPikachu Smashing!


    Please allow me to clarify and expand on R_N's point, Mr.Munchlax.

    First, it is important to point out that the particular part of the conversation with Looker we are considering was the two possible responses[/] to his question about where he is. Sometimes these sorts of questions may indicate things the questioner specifically asked about (and I really can't think of any example except the dude who travels hotels in XY and can give you info about only[/] the female Gym Leaders). However, there are also instances in which the possible responses are clearly not part of the question; they are responses that only make sense from the perspective of the main character. This is not 100% either way, but I suggest that the confusion Looker expresses should indicate doubt that Looker is volunteering (incorrect) options for where he is.

    Second, take a look at this post, which includes a captioned picture of a Japanese screenshot of that conversation. The poster then ran it through Google Translate. There is a problem, though. I know enough about Katakana to know that the two options are not "Feng Edge Region" and "Battle Frontier"; instead, they are simply "Hoenn Region" and "Battle Resort."

    So for complete clarity, it appears to be (and there is no evidence to suggest that it is any more than) Looker asking where he is and the game giving you the option of how specific you want to be in answering him.


    (BTW, I have no knowledge about the caption of the picture, but since I know it isn't Katakana, I recognize a distinct possibility that it is entirely different from what is in the screenshot itself, and given the time it was posted, trolling people who use Google Translate is a highly likely explanation.)
     
  14. Akashin

    Akashin Well-Known Member

    A couple of Zinnia's lines at the Sky Pillar distinctly refer to Aster as somebody she used to be with and later lost (daughter or otherwise), so no, this explanation doesn't work.
     
  15. AuraChannelerChris

    AuraChannelerChris "Am I supposed to laugh?"

    Never mind, then. Her kind can have babies at 8 years old.
     
  16. Akashin

    Akashin Well-Known Member

    I sure hope not, but at this point your explanation is as good as any.

    I like R_N's idea of either a sister or a girlfriend, personally.
     
  17. Endolise

    Endolise TengenToppaBoogaloo

    There's that, but there is also the fact that they explained that the other timeline's Hoenn was less advanced and wouldn't be able to protect themselves from the meteor strike. The RSE games portrayed a world that was inherently less advanced, so it fit the story and gave Zinnia a reason for piping up about it, *and* it served as a nifty little easter egg, as you say. Essentially, it legitimizes Zinnia's stance, but in a way that also provides some substance since the other timeline is one that we've actually seen and gotten to know. If she just mentioned a random alternative world out of the blue that we had no familiarity with, then it would have felt a lot more hollow. Well, in my opinion, anyway. I think using the RSE games as the other timeline actually shows that they *did* put thought into it and decided to tie it together in a clever little way.

    However, the concept of a multiverse doesn't have to be some revolutionary twist that completely changes how they handle all of their storylines from now on anyway (and let's face it; Game Freak would never be able to keep something like that up consistently). It could easily just be a detail that is only relevant to the plot of the Delta Episode, since that storyline is meant to deal with stuff like that.

    You know, just like it was in BW.

    Or it just means that Zinnia imposes a pseudo-familial relationship on her pet. It's fairly common even in real life for, say, a female pet owner to refer to herself as her pet's "momma" or something along those lines.

    Now, Zinnia *could* be older than she looks, or maybe she did have a daughter at sixteen-ish that died in infancy. Personally, though, I just assumed that she was a sister, a close friend, or a girlfriend.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2015
  18. Räven Velish

    Räven Velish black lives matter

    It could be in a free DLC.
     
  19. Alexander18

    Alexander18 Banned

    DLC would be a bad idea, it would be better to release the game itself with the content rather than having to go and download it. But since Delta Emerald is out of the question, we just have to stick with the mediocre games that we got. I think Zinnia story is finished here and would return any time soon in the future.
     
  20. Bguy7

    Bguy7 The Dragon Lord

    To me, it seemed like the point of Aster the Whismur was to be a replacement for the original Aster. Zinnia was sent into insanity by the loss of Aster, so if she went and got a Pokemon, named it after her, and called it her daughter, I feel like that would mean that Aster really was her daughter. Aster was a replacement, not just a pet.

    When she first made the connection to Aster, one of my first thoughts was that she seemed to young, so I just assumed that Zinnia was older than she looked. Just look at the playable characters across the generations, they look closer to 16 than 10. Pokemon isn't the most consistent when it comes to ages.

    Also, is there a specific reason that we're considering girlfriend?
     
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