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General Characters/Storyline Thread

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Hexin' Wishes

Diva Extraordinaire
Nothing gameplay-wise but you can build good and solid characters by having them be attracted to another.

That builds nothing of the sort. Plenty of games have had strong characters without a romance.

I thought Shauna looked lot younger than rest of the circle of friends, honestly. I found her kind of aggravating...:I
Which is why it's creepy! The Looker sidequest hints the character is at least 16+, so this little child trying to hit on you was just creepy. I did like her more than Bianca, but I would have really wanted her to have not existed at all. Her only purpose was that other starter she gives you.
I don't exactly understand what this statement is saying...
I once saw an argument that said gays don't belong in the game because romance isn't even a part of the game. Since we see that we're being threatened with more romance, I was bringing that back that that argument (still) sucks.

Yeah, maybe I should have said that before. I really didn't care for the romance between Shauna and the main (male) character. I made jokes about how much better the game would have been if she hadn't tried to secretly date you!

It just read so desperate and random.
 
Saw some posts about opinions regarding Team Flare and thought I would chime in. Forgive me if any of this has been said/people are tired of that particular discussion :p

On one hand, having Lysandre be willing to eliminate all life was a pretty dark and drastic means to an end. But on the other hand, the group overall was just kind of meh for me. The whole "wanting the world to be more beautiful" and making money things weren't that compelling for me, but Lysandre going to the lengths of eliminating life to accomplish his goal is what made him a pretty good villain. The pacing could have also had an impact, though. Overall, the story was all right. It was really saved by how far Lysandre was willing to go and the backstory of AZ.

That said, I really loved Team Plasma. Having someone who believes Pokemon should be free was a pretty good concept to me, as it becomes less of a "these people are evil" and more of a "these people mean well, but are going about it in the wrong way" sort of thing. Not only that, but you have Ghetsis behind the scenes trying to accomplish his own goals, which can be aided by N and his vision of Pokemon being free. Couple that with Black and White 2's story and Team Plasma was just a really great villainous group to me. It's easy for me to believe that there were members in Team Plasma who sided more with Ghetsis that N didn't know about, so having Plasma members with their own Pokemon (or stolen Pokemon) never really bothered me. That, and it could always be something N had to swallow in order to accomplish his goal; you can't fight trainers that have Pokemon if you don't have your own, so forcing Pokemon to be in a Pokeball and battle for you is the only way to try and defeat those that oppose you.

Memory is pretty hazy, but I would definitely rate Plasma as my favorite villains from the main Pokemon games. Galactic would most likely be second from what I remember. Despite what I said, I think I would actually rate Team Flare above Team Rocket. Despite being the first Pokemon games, I can't remember Team Rocket being all that compelling. I've never actually played Ruby or Sapphire so I can't really comment, but from what I understand they might actually be ahead of Rocket and Flare. Like I said, though, memory is hazy on past games.
 

Ruas

Well-Known Member
Actually, after Team Rocket, pretty much every other villain has been a "mean well, but are going about it in the wrong way". Magma/Aqua were just extreme environmentalists - they just wanted more sea/land for the good of everybody. In Galactic's case, Cyrus was just upset with the imperfections & similarly to Lysandre wanted to fix the world for the good of the world rather than it's inhabitants. The easiest way of doing it was to reset the world. IMO, Cyrus was a bit more extreme since he wasn't planning on taking any of the Galactic members either, just himself. And then, Team Plasma as you said were like another form of environmentalists, except more concerned with Pokemon. I guess just like the anime, GF must employ some sort of "not evil, just misunderstood" plot-line to keep the game clean, but thankfully unlike the anime, the games are still doing great.

For me, Team Flare has its similarities with Galactic and so scores less points. They were both upset with the human element & how it has dirtied/misused the world. Lysandre didn't seem as compelling as Cyrus was. His choice of letting the grunts in Flare live on also struck me as odd, since he wanted good people to properly share resources & reduce strife. I honestly thought Mega Evolution was going to be invented by Team Flare (for bad intents, of course) and then we eventually use this against them. Anyway, I'm sure the next instalment will do justice to the plot & it's characters. For now, we just enjoy the 3D!
 

Akashin

Well-Known Member
Actually, after Team Rocket, pretty much every other villain has been a "mean well, but are going about it in the wrong way". Magma/Aqua were just extreme environmentalists - they just wanted more sea/land for the good of everybody. In Galactic's case, Cyrus was just upset with the imperfections & similarly to Lysandre wanted to fix the world for the good of the world rather than it's inhabitants. The easiest way of doing it was to reset the world. IMO, Cyrus was a bit more extreme since he wasn't planning on taking any of the Galactic members either, just himself. And then, Team Plasma as you said were like another form of environmentalists, except more concerned with Pokemon. I guess just like the anime, GF must employ some sort of "not evil, just misunderstood" plot-line to keep the game clean, but thankfully unlike the anime, the games are still doing great.

For me, Team Flare has its similarities with Galactic and so scores less points. They were both upset with the human element & how it has dirtied/misused the world. Lysandre didn't seem as compelling as Cyrus was. His choice of letting the grunts in Flare live on also struck me as odd, since he wanted good people to properly share resources & reduce strife. I honestly thought Mega Evolution was going to be invented by Team Flare (for bad intents, of course) and then we eventually use this against them. Anyway, I'm sure the next instalment will do justice to the plot & it's characters. For now, we just enjoy the 3D!

At least in the case of Team Plasma, that's only half true. N and the side of Plasma loyal to his ideals certainly fit the bill, but Ghetsis and his side were quite open about simply wanting to rule the world; there were no good but misguided intentions in what Ghetsis was gunning for. And while Team Galactic may fit the bill as a whole (I question that myself, but your definition of good intentions is vague enough that it's not really wrong), Platinum revealed that Cyrus' new world was to be solely for him, not for humanity as a whole. Cyrus and Ghetsis, if not their Teams as a whole, were pretty well truly evil as far as I'm concerned.
 
It would have been interesting if they were the ones to introduce Mega Evolutions (though that would alter the Pokemon Origins special). Regardless of Team Flare, I really love this generation. The changes to breeding alone will be great (getting a hidden ability from male, female, or genderless), but I'm looking forward to seeing what else comes along. I still remember seeing the trailer for the games last year and being blown away by the graphics.

The anime I think I would have enjoyed more over the years if every single episode didn't constantly have Team Rocket trying to steal X Pokemon only to be thwarted. Maybe it is something that is more welcome elsewhere, but I honestly do not understand why Team Rocket are in every single episode. I actually had hope during one of the Black and White seasons where they seemed to actually be a legitimate trio, but they ended up back in the "must steal Pikachu" phase.
 

Rio!

Composer
Which is why it's creepy! The Looker sidequest hints the character is at least 16+, so this little child trying to hit on you was just creepy. I did like her more than Bianca, but I would have really wanted her to have not existed at all. Her only purpose was that other starter she gives you.

Yeah, she really didn't do very much. And in certain parts of the story like when the whole group is in the Team Flare lab basement, she certainly wasn't treated as though she was in remotely the same age group as everyone else. And don't get me started on her dialogue, ugh. XD


I once saw an argument that said gays don't belong in the game because romance isn't even a part of the game. Since we see that we're being threatened with more romance, I was bringing that back that that argument (still) sucks.

OOOH okay then. I haven't really been in any discussion dealing with that aspect of the game. All I know is that the only character out of the group I really cared for was Tierno. Everyone else seemed flat and dull, especially Calem. XD

Regarding the romance stuff, that is a pretty lame argument, hur-hurr.
I personally don't mind romance of any type as long as it isn't too cliche'd/overdone.
Though this is bound to happen every once in a while, eh.
 
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diakyu

Well-Known Member
That builds nothing of the sort. Plenty of games have had strong characters without a romance.
You do realize emotions drive motivations and build personalities right? Liking someone is a emotion. What do you have against love mannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn
 
I was never really creeped out by the Shauna thing. It just seemed like a "younger person admiring/liking someone who happens to be a few years older" thing, which I imagine for kids around that age isn't too bizarre of a situation to occur.
 

Ayrafeneres

~Contest Master~
No offense to those who read this, but, to me, X and Y seemed kind of shallow. By which I mean there wasn't much to do in it. Think about it, R/S had Contests, Pokeblock making, Slots, Roulette, and Secret Bases; Emerald had Contests, Pokeblock, Battle Frontier, Slots, Roulette, and Secret Bases; D/P had Super Contests, Poffin, Amity Square, Slots, Underground, Secret Bases, Poketch, and Pal Park; Platinum had Super Contests, Poffin, Amity Square, Slots, Underground, Secret Bases, Poketch, Pal Park, and Battle Frontier; HG/SS had Pokeathlon, Pokegear, Battle Frontier, Pokewalker, and Pokemon following you; B/W had Royal Unova, C-Gear, Musicals, Dream World, and the sports domes; and lastly B2/W2 had Musicals, Royal Unova, Dream World, Medals, PokeStar Studios, PWT, Mall, C-Gear, Black Tower/White Treehollow, and sports domes. In comparison, X and Y had pretty much nothing. All it had was the Battle Chateau, Battle Maison, Mega Evolution(which wasn't what it was cracked up to be in my opinion), the Trainer PR videos, and outfit customization. That's not much in comparison. The PR videos weren't much to get excited about and the Battle Maison was nowhere NEAR as fun as Battle Frontiers. Don't get me started on Mega Evolution, it is NOT a big deal in the slightest. Only a few are really worth anything to me. I just hope that, in the third game, they add TONS of new features. It only took me 13 hours to beat X, my previous record had been 31 hours on Pearl.

~Ayra~;267;
 

bigbro223

Well-Known Member
The Gym Leaders were... okay. Viola was nothing special, but a good introduction. Grant wasn't too memorable, but his team was okay. Korrina was disappointing, as a master of a key role of X/Y, she didn't do too much. Clemont was pretty good, and I suppose Bonnie was a key role to his character. Ramos was almost nonexistent, along with Olympia. Valerie was nice in design and character, but had no role. Wulfric was my favorite, as he was kind enough to treat for the abandoned Pokémon, apologizes for not being in the gym, and even admits to his type's disadvantages.
 

Rio!

Composer
No offense to those who read this, but, to me, X and Y seemed kind of shallow. By which I mean there wasn't much to do in it. Think about it, R/S had Contests, Pokeblock making, Slots, Roulette, and Secret Bases; Emerald had Contests, Pokeblock, Battle Frontier, Slots, Roulette, and Secret Bases; D/P had Super Contests, Poffin, Amity Square, Slots, Underground, Secret Bases, Poketch, and Pal Park; Platinum had Super Contests, Poffin, Amity Square, Slots, Underground, Secret Bases, Poketch, Pal Park, and Battle Frontier; HG/SS had Pokeathlon, Pokegear, Battle Frontier, Pokewalker, and Pokemon following you; B/W had Royal Unova, C-Gear, Musicals, Dream World, and the sports domes; and lastly B2/W2 had Musicals, Royal Unova, Dream World, Medals, PokeStar Studios, PWT, Mall, C-Gear, Black Tower/White Treehollow, and sports domes. In comparison, X and Y had pretty much nothing. All it had was the Battle Chateau, Battle Maison, Mega Evolution(which wasn't what it was cracked up to be in my opinion), the Trainer PR videos, and outfit customization. That's not much in comparison. The PR videos weren't much to get excited about and the Battle Maison was nowhere NEAR as fun as Battle Frontiers. Don't get me started on Mega Evolution, it is NOT a big deal in the slightest. Only a few are really worth anything to me. I just hope that, in the third game, they add TONS of new features. It only took me 13 hours to beat X, my previous record had been 31 hours on Pearl.

~Ayra~;267;

Didn't you already use this same, almost exact worded phrase not too long ago? Seems familiar...
Someone's trash is ALWAYS someone else's treasure sometimes.
When you think about it too, some of the features listed required Wi-fi or otherwise to actually be able to partake in some of the activities.
I have to admit (once again) that the only features that were actually 'fun/entertaining' that you mentioned was the Pokeathelon and the Battle Frontier. Dream World was alright, though spamming the same games over and over got tedious after a little while. Sometimes the Pokemon would be worth it.
Then too this is after all the first game/s of gen 6. Never know what you're going to get later down the road.

The Gym Leaders were... okay. Viola was nothing special, but a good introduction. Grant wasn't too memorable, but his team was okay. Korrina was disappointing, as a master of a key role of X/Y, she didn't do too much. Clemont was pretty good, and I suppose Bonnie was a key role to his character. Ramos was almost nonexistent, along with Olympia. Valerie was nice in design and character, but had no role. Wulfric was my favorite, as he was kind enough to treat for the abandoned Pokémon, apologizes for not being in the gym, and even admits to his type's disadvantages.

Yeah, the fact they would only have what, 3 Pokemon was a little off-putting. Outside Wulfric and Korrina, I had to refresh my memory as to who the gym leaders even were. XD
 
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No offense to those who read this, but, to me, X and Y seemed kind of shallow. By which I mean there wasn't much to do in it. Think about it, R/S had Contests, Pokeblock making, Slots, Roulette, and Secret Bases; Emerald had Contests, Pokeblock, Battle Frontier, Slots, Roulette, and Secret Bases; D/P had Super Contests, Poffin, Amity Square, Slots, Underground, Secret Bases, Poketch, and Pal Park; Platinum had Super Contests, Poffin, Amity Square, Slots, Underground, Secret Bases, Poketch, Pal Park, and Battle Frontier; HG/SS had Pokeathlon, Pokegear, Battle Frontier, Pokewalker, and Pokemon following you; B/W had Royal Unova, C-Gear, Musicals, Dream World, and the sports domes; and lastly B2/W2 had Musicals, Royal Unova, Dream World, Medals, PokeStar Studios, PWT, Mall, C-Gear, Black Tower/White Treehollow, and sports domes. In comparison, X and Y had pretty much nothing. All it had was the Battle Chateau, Battle Maison, Mega Evolution(which wasn't what it was cracked up to be in my opinion), the Trainer PR videos, and outfit customization. That's not much in comparison. The PR videos weren't much to get excited about and the Battle Maison was nowhere NEAR as fun as Battle Frontiers. Don't get me started on Mega Evolution, it is NOT a big deal in the slightest. Only a few are really worth anything to me. I just hope that, in the third game, they add TONS of new features. It only took me 13 hours to beat X, my previous record had been 31 hours on Pearl.

~Ayra~;267;

It would have been nice if the Battle Maison was a bit more like the Battle Frontier with the various battling options. I really enjoyed some of the stuff from the D/P and HG/SS battle areas. Really a shame they never really came back. Renting Pokemon and having battles where you got to choose one of the opponents Pokemon to replace one of yours I always liked doing.

That said, a lot of the stuff you listed I feel could be lumped in with the "weren't much to get excited about" aspect that you find with PR Videos, or just replaced. Contests I would say were nothing to get excited about (they were cool in the anime, but not in the game); Slots and Roullete aren't that exciting in retrospect; Pokemon Amie you could say replaced Amity Square, except it is a lot more interactive (and Amity Square was very limited); Poffin and Pokeblock making is really just the berry planting and juice making in X/Y, albeit with less interaction; Pal Park is not needed and was one of the problems I had with previous games, as they made trading from the previous generation to the current one more tedious than it needs to be (seriously, I don't want a mini-game when I'm transferring boxes full of stuff); Pokemon being able to follow you I'm not sure I would count as "something to do in the games" as much as it would be purely a cosmetic feature; Musicals and the Pokestar Studios are pretty much similar to PR Videos, except you have a lot more input with PR Videos (and they're more fun); Dream World was replaced with the Friend Safari, and the Global Link is now having those Attractions (haven't checked them out yet); again, the Mall I wouldn't consider something "to do," and X/Y also has the entirety of Lumiose to replace it; the Royal Unova/sports domes are replaced by the Battle Chateau (which you can alter with the Writs); and the C-Gear really wasn't anything to do and was replaced by the far superior PSS (the Feeling Checks and Surveys weren't anything exciting). Just because previous games had features doesn't mean they were automatically any good.

That said, I was kind of disappointed in the lack of post game from X and was iffy with the story. With Black there was an entire area to explore once you defeated the Elite Four, whereas in X and Y you beat the Elite Four and that's it. It would have been nice if you could battle the Elite Four with higher leveled Pokemon AT the Pokemon League instead of just the Chateau as well. The Poketch, at least some features, would be nice but I don't think are necessarily needed (having a lower screen map would have been handy with Zapdos -_-). Still, there's a decent amount of stuff that you can do in X and Y once you beat it, and the amount of time it takes to beat the game has no bearing on whether there is or isn't a lot to do. I think one of the reasons it was easier to beat these games was they reworked the Exp. Share, as I didn't have to constantly waste time grinding like in previous games.
 
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Goten21

Well-Known Member
What the storyline really needed was better pacing. The earlier encounters with Team Flare were really boring and generic because they were keeping their motives secret, and then we get tons of reveals pretty much all at once at the end of the game. If they'd have spaced those reveals out a little more, it would've been more interesting.

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. If you talk to them after battles, you'll see they DO reveal a lot. I was surprised at how shocked people were with the "sudden" holocast message... But I guess I'm one of a kind when I talk to literally every NPC before I go on with my journey
 
I'm going to have to disagree with you here. If you talk to them after battles, you'll see they DO reveal a lot. I was surprised at how shocked people were with the "sudden" holocast message... But I guess I'm one of a kind when I talk to literally every NPC before I go on with my journey

I tend to talk to every NPC as well (even if I know they won't say anything that helpful, like starting town residents). I don't think I really talk to trainers too much after battles. If I ever get around to restarting my game, I'm definitely going to have to do that for the Team Flare members. I just wish I could start a new game without losing anything from my current one (items, BP, oval charm) <_<
 
I'm going to have to disagree with you here. If you talk to them after battles, you'll see they DO reveal a lot. I was surprised at how shocked people were with the "sudden" holocast message... But I guess I'm one of a kind when I talk to literally every NPC before I go on with my journey

I didn't see it as surprising. At all.

What I did think was that it was abrupt. And odd. Why did they need to tell everyone what they were doing? They didn't have any demands!




Oh, and goomaestro005, there are some pretty hilarious things that NPCs say after battle. I think a few hilarious things are even said by Team Flare members.
 

diakyu

Well-Known Member
people really should talk to trainers after they beat them, especially grunts. They usually reveal some background information or just say something funny. It's a win-win.
 

Taodragon

Training Anaylst
I'm going to have to disagree with you here. If you talk to them after battles, you'll see they DO reveal a lot. I was surprised at how shocked people were with the "sudden" holocast message... But I guess I'm one of a kind when I talk to literally every NPC before I go on with my journey

It's still rather abrupt, Team Flare's tone overall shifts quite suddenly and even with spare NPC dialogue that doesn't change that much. Plus, you don't get a feel for their grand plan until that crucial moment, before then their activities felt rather random.

They really did need to have better pacing and lead up because they have the making, but lack the depth.
 

Goten21

Well-Known Member
It's still rather abrupt, Team Flare's tone overall shifts quite suddenly and even with spare NPC dialogue that doesn't change that much. Plus, you don't get a feel for their grand plan until that crucial moment, before then their activities felt rather random.

They really did need to have better pacing and lead up because they have the making, but lack the depth.

True, but I think the shock-factor was supposed to be there.
I'd actually be surprised if team Flare wasn't supposed to come off weird, all over the place and tacky.
And I certainly didn't see some dead machine coming, even after talking to all the NPC's
 

Goten21

Well-Known Member
I didn't see it as surprising. At all.

What I did think was that it was abrupt. And odd. Why did they need to tell everyone what they were doing? They didn't have any demands!




Oh, and goomaestro005, there are some pretty hilarious things that NPCs say after battle. I think a few hilarious things are even said by Team Flare members.
Actually, if you'd pay 5M pokédollars, you'd get a chance to join them and... Well, not die
I tend to talk to every NPC as well (even if I know they won't say anything that helpful, like starting town residents). I don't think I really talk to trainers too much after battles. If I ever get around to restarting my game, I'm definitely going to have to do that for the Team Flare members. I just wish I could start a new game without losing anything from my current one (items, BP, oval charm) <_<

That is a pain in the *** :\
 

cascadethewarrior

~Ðiva and Lucariϕ~
Just got to parfrum palace and I always wonder what happens if you don't have that $1000 entrance fee? My guess is that you can't progress through the game if you don't. That's messed up gamefeak lol
 
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