Red and Blue
Well-Known Member
Gladion's fatal error was probably keeping in Silvally after defeating Melmetal. If he recalled it and let it rest and regain strength it could have finished off an exhausted Lycanroc
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He's Born! The Alolan League Winner! (1082)
- Thread starter Serebii
- Start date
Cradily17
Well-Known Member
I'm glad he won here instead of XY. Unlike XY Ash's team in SM was better since all of them got a chance to shine whereas Pikachu and Greninja hogged the spotlight in XY.
FlygontheRavager
#1 Pokémon Anime Fan!
Doubt it. Silvally might have recovered a bit with some rest, but two Double Iron Bashes from Melmetal weakened it enough for Pikachu to take it out with one Iron Tail. Even if what you're saying did happen, a few well-placed hits from Lycanroc would've been the end for Silvally.
Cradily17
Well-Known Member
I really hope that's the case. The characters in SM are far more likeable and have more development than the ones in XY. Cutting your hair and "Dude Science LMAO; my inventions always break down!" are not how you properly do characters.
Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
They're still far more memorable than
Lying Lecherous Loli
Literally Cardboard
Fat Kid Who Likes Food
HOOOOSHIIIIIII
I think all of them have potential, just SM has more free range storytelling as most of XY did. They couldn't go on 'auto pilot' because a COTD or TR took over the plot most of the time, sometimes they had to drive the story or there WAS NO story.
Hell the league almost felt like it was undermining the old formula, how beating up bad guys like Team Rocket a few times over did NOT make Mallow or Lillie badasses or help with their development much at all. It was pointless fluff compared to legit training.
Hell the league almost felt like it was undermining the old formula, how beating up bad guys like Team Rocket a few times over did NOT make Mallow or Lillie badasses or help with their development much at all. It was pointless fluff compared to legit training.
Xenon Blue
No Hard Feelings
Not exactly how I envisioned Ash would win his first league, but I guess it's something? No 6v6, let alone only one 3v3, battles were uninspiring and bland most of the time, literally only ONE battle had switching going on, and both cases were due to a move's effect or ability. Like is switching banned in Alola or something? It's kind of sad when the best battle of this league is around on-par with something like Ash vs Conway. I have no way to sum this up other than battles in this region have been severely lackluster. I know there is still the full battle coming up, but honestly I have no faith in that battle being good, maybe mediocre at best. Maybe Gen8 will bring in a new protagonist and actually make battles interesting again by focusing on developing as a trainer, as Ash clearly has nothing to learn now in terms of battles.
Xuxuba
Well-Known Member
Oh yeah Melmetal and Torracat really shined so much on this competition. Like, remember when Melmetal ate that medal and won without even fighting? What about the moment when Torracat won that one battle in 2 seconds just because of emergency exit surprising Scizor and taking him out of the pokeball? Those were truly highlights of the series. I also love how Lycanroc was completely ignored for the past episodes just to appear out of nowhere and grab the final win. Totally didn't forget he existed until then.
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Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
Ash is the Champion of the Orange Islands yet never has to go battle anyone there, so...probably not?
He's immortalized in the Hall of Fame and has his Pity Trophy, so he can leave right after the Masked Royal fight
AuraChannelerChris
Easygoing Luxray.
MR beats the kid and takes the title for himself.
Otherwise, either Ash keeps the title or...he gives it away because it would probably mean he needs to live in Alola TILL HE DIES.
keepitsimple
site of lies
Yes as we all know champions can absolutely never leave the region they won their champion title in. Totally a requirement, yup. The Alola national police will just detain him if he tries to go home. /s
D
Deleted member 384931
Guest
Cynthia in Unova cough
andrewscott48209
Well-Known Member
Also, Steven Stone in Kalos.
keepitsimple
site of lies
AuraChannelerChris
Easygoing Luxray.
They know very well they will never be dethroned from their spots, so they can take vacations. Ha ha.
I mean, seriously, when will this anime show a different regional Champion (outside of Alola)?
Twilight-Kun
Pokemon World Champion
Ash has yet to go back and defend his Champion title in the Orange Islands, so...
Lord Godwin
The Lord of Darkness
taking into account the confirmation od Naganadel returning I would've preffered him to replace Melmetal and fight Silvally while Meltan could've evolved vs Guzzlord. A Guzzlord vs Melmetal and Silvally vs Naganadel fight seem more right
dman_dustin
Well-Known Member
I should've brought this up earlier but I kind of wanted to sit and think about it.
People complain Ash had plot armor, yet they don't realize Gladion technically cheated thanks to the writers.
Counter.
Counter is not a move that you can just randomly use and it works. It only works if you the Pokemon have actually taken damage and you reflect that damage double.
The first time Gladion's Lycanroc used Counter, it was legitimate, because Ash's actually hit Gladion's (though it kind of happened at the same time). The 2nd time, the big one, Gladion's Lycanroc completely avoided the damage taken and used counter, but counter what? Lycanroc never received damage from anything AT that point in time, since Lycanroc used a different move since receiving the last bit of damage it received.
The next time, after confusion wore off, same issue, Lycanroc immediately countered Ash's Lycanroc without taking any damage (though in this case there's an argument that Lycanroc received enough damage from punching Ash's Lycanroc from counter from the attack (though maybe not really, if it was bite, only accelerock) to actually counter with, unlike the first one, where Lycanroc avoided getting hit completely.
Which leads to the last one, which like I said before could be legitimate based of the force of Accelerock hitting Lycanroc's fist while it counters, but that's a little debatable.
Ash's usage of counter however, while not possible in the games (due to strict technical limits of the turn based fighting game mechanic, that forces a pause in the action so you can select the next attack, something that logically shouldn't happen in the anime, which has a more free flowing turn based fighting style) is probably the most legitimate usage of counter of all the counters that were used. Because Ash's Lycanroc received damage then countered that damage to Gladion's Lycanroc.
So if Ash had plot armor, Gladion mostly had strictly anime logic on his side, which was kind of annoying. Sure maybe the anime can get away with counter reflecting what would be the appropriate damage, or maybe anime logic says that all the damage a Pokemon received prior to using counter qualifies as well as what would be damage from an incoming attack. But when you look at it from that perspective, Ash's Lycanroc's counter would've technically been the most powerful counter in the battle, since Ash only had his Lycanroc use counter AT that point.
Either way I think the counters were fine, annoying because Gladion shouldn't have been able to use counter most of the time he used it, without some weird logic but its whatever, they chose it to work like it did. And maybe Ash's Lycanroc shouldn't have taken so much damage, though with the first point, it's not like Ash's Lycanroc should've received THAT much damage even if it was reflected, so maybe they just exaggerated the pounding Ash's Lycanroc took from those counters just to put Ash in a tight spot.
Or maybe Ash's Lycanroc was running on pure adrenaline and shocked Gladion's Lycanroc so much with that last counter, that was why Gladion's Lycanroc fainted. Would make sense if the Pokemon's mental state somewhat dictated how the battle goes , Ash's Lycanroc wanting to give it all, pushes beyond its normal limits. Gladion's Lycanroc not doing so well but believes it can win, so when it got countered at that last point, it probably shocked Gladion's Lycanroc and then slamming against the wall hard like it did, could've easily been more than enough to cause it to faint, perhaps if its mental state was different, it could've survived? But its hard to guess with an entirely scripted show.
Either we accept its a scripted show entirely and just have to shrug our shoulders and accept certain things, or we just have to assume in-universe, these Pokemon are capable of feats that go WAY beyond just how many hit points and stats a Pokemon has.
People complain Ash had plot armor, yet they don't realize Gladion technically cheated thanks to the writers.
Counter.
Counter is not a move that you can just randomly use and it works. It only works if you the Pokemon have actually taken damage and you reflect that damage double.
The first time Gladion's Lycanroc used Counter, it was legitimate, because Ash's actually hit Gladion's (though it kind of happened at the same time). The 2nd time, the big one, Gladion's Lycanroc completely avoided the damage taken and used counter, but counter what? Lycanroc never received damage from anything AT that point in time, since Lycanroc used a different move since receiving the last bit of damage it received.
The next time, after confusion wore off, same issue, Lycanroc immediately countered Ash's Lycanroc without taking any damage (though in this case there's an argument that Lycanroc received enough damage from punching Ash's Lycanroc from counter from the attack (though maybe not really, if it was bite, only accelerock) to actually counter with, unlike the first one, where Lycanroc avoided getting hit completely.
Which leads to the last one, which like I said before could be legitimate based of the force of Accelerock hitting Lycanroc's fist while it counters, but that's a little debatable.
Ash's usage of counter however, while not possible in the games (due to strict technical limits of the turn based fighting game mechanic, that forces a pause in the action so you can select the next attack, something that logically shouldn't happen in the anime, which has a more free flowing turn based fighting style) is probably the most legitimate usage of counter of all the counters that were used. Because Ash's Lycanroc received damage then countered that damage to Gladion's Lycanroc.
So if Ash had plot armor, Gladion mostly had strictly anime logic on his side, which was kind of annoying. Sure maybe the anime can get away with counter reflecting what would be the appropriate damage, or maybe anime logic says that all the damage a Pokemon received prior to using counter qualifies as well as what would be damage from an incoming attack. But when you look at it from that perspective, Ash's Lycanroc's counter would've technically been the most powerful counter in the battle, since Ash only had his Lycanroc use counter AT that point.
Either way I think the counters were fine, annoying because Gladion shouldn't have been able to use counter most of the time he used it, without some weird logic but its whatever, they chose it to work like it did. And maybe Ash's Lycanroc shouldn't have taken so much damage, though with the first point, it's not like Ash's Lycanroc should've received THAT much damage even if it was reflected, so maybe they just exaggerated the pounding Ash's Lycanroc took from those counters just to put Ash in a tight spot.
Or maybe Ash's Lycanroc was running on pure adrenaline and shocked Gladion's Lycanroc so much with that last counter, that was why Gladion's Lycanroc fainted. Would make sense if the Pokemon's mental state somewhat dictated how the battle goes , Ash's Lycanroc wanting to give it all, pushes beyond its normal limits. Gladion's Lycanroc not doing so well but believes it can win, so when it got countered at that last point, it probably shocked Gladion's Lycanroc and then slamming against the wall hard like it did, could've easily been more than enough to cause it to faint, perhaps if its mental state was different, it could've survived? But its hard to guess with an entirely scripted show.
Either we accept its a scripted show entirely and just have to shrug our shoulders and accept certain things, or we just have to assume in-universe, these Pokemon are capable of feats that go WAY beyond just how many hit points and stats a Pokemon has.
