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Hmm, a clever title? Maybe OU RMT help please!

Discussion in 'Older Gen RMT' started by infernape100, Feb 15, 2013.

  1. infernape100

    infernape100 Well-Known Member

    So yeah I'm not very good at titles, but that doesn't matter!
    This is an offensive OU team for Pokemon Showdown that i recently put together and would like help with. You may remember my rain team from not so long ago, but i felt like a change!
    Here are some videos of me using the team:
    There's only two for now because PS decided it didn't want to save the others but i have won two more. I'll post more videos so you can see how i use the team and its biggest flaws soon!

    So here is my team:

    Terrakion@Choice Band
    -Close Combat
    -Stone Edge

    This was the first poke I chose. When looking through possible pokes to build a team around I came across this guy and was like YES what a beast. An epic attack stat, great speed and epic offensive typing. I decided to go Choice band because I wanted it to hit hard – REAL HARD. The two STABs provide deadly coverage with X-scissor handling psychics and Equake for electric types. The Evs are too boost sweeping prowess and I thought Jolly over Adamant to get a little extra speed rather than attack.

    Natural Cure
    -Ice Beam
    -Rapid Spin

    When going through ‘Checks and Counters’ for Terrakion I found that Starmie could take a fair few of them on, and besides I need a spinner on this team and this is my favorite spinner. It is a pretty standard Starmie with Surf for STAB and BoltBeam as coverage with Rapid Spin to clear the way for others who are entering. EVs are to boos power, Jolly is the necessary nature – not much more to say.

    Heatran@Air Balloon
    Flash Fire
    -Fire Blast
    -Earth Power
    -Hidden Power (Ice)
    -Stealth Rock

    So, Scizor was still a big issue at this point so I decided to go with Heatran. Fire Blast is my STAB of choice and doesn’t miss as much as I expected. Earth Power deals some nice damage to most things that resist my STAB. HP Ice is coverage, it can hit dragons and switching Landorus and Gliscor. Stealth Rock had to be on my team somewhere so I thought I’d slot it in here. My Air Balloon keeps away the OHKO from Equake and allows me to switch in on them. Timid gives me extra speed – I thought the SpAtk was already big enough after my EVs.

    Dragonite@Choice Band
    -Fire Punch

    Now almost every team needs a dragon and this one has Dragonite. Outrage boosted by STAB and Choice Band does EPIC damage, with the next two moves providing great coverage. ExtremeSpeed allows me to get in those important priority attacks and it hits fairly hard, too. Multiscale is obvious, though I don’t have roost to keep using it. Jolly to make it that much faster (plus Choice Band boosts my attack enough), and EVs increase the sweep.

    -Drill Peck

    Now I felt I needed something that could take hits and set up Spikes – who better than Skarmory! Spikes Roost and Whirlwind work beautifully together to deal damage to opponents that might be annoying me and Drill Peck is my attacking move so I don’t get any recoil damage. Leftovers can keep it alive to spike and all that. Sturdy means I can get some spikes up without perishing to a T-bolt or something. EVs keep it alive.

    Natural Cure
    -Giga Drain
    -Heal Bell

    I thought I could still do with some help dealing with things such as Gastrodon and other water tanks so I chose Celebi for this, plus it has Heal Bell so it can be my cleric, also I had a physical wall so now I needed something specially defensive.. Giga Drain is my STAB of choice as it does good damage and heals me. U-Turn can do damage and get my sweepers out after a Heal Bell. Recover keeps it alive and Heal Bell is to help my sweepers to sweep. EVs, nture and Leftovers all help the Bulk.

    Any sort of help whatsoever would be much appreciated thanks all!
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2013
  2. Superpower22

    Superpower22 Member

    Just two minor things: Change starmie's nature to timid. Jolly lowers special attack, and we don't want that!
    And two, any poke with defensive EVs should use HP EVs instead. Gives more bulk on both sides. For example, Heatran has 252 SP.def EVs, which will be more useful as 252 HP EVs.
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2013
  3. McDanger

    McDanger This is my design

    Pretty nice team, like superpower said, timid on starmie
    here is a threat list for your them

    Landorus i, he can OHKO everyone except skarmory whos a 2hko and celebi if its not carrying u turn. As you stand the best way is to suicide dragonite to extreme speed it or have terrakion come in and try to KO it with stone edge, both are 2hkos.

    Sun teams seem to be a threat that have mixed venusaur, if heatrans ballon is broken hes a OHKO to earthquake, then he can do a lot of damage especially if its a LO 4 attacker, as it can hit everyone for neutral damage. Again dragonite is the best chance here as venisaur doesnt like strong priorities.

    Garchomp is a big threat as skarmory is its only counter. It can go through between earthquake and a draon move and KO everyone bar celebi, the pixie is so bulky. If it has fire fang tho its a problem. Dragonite can live a +0 outrage i think, but fails to outspeed so he cant come in and kill it.

    The last major threat i see is calm mind keldeo because they run hp ghost/bug whick after some boost, i think 1-2, it can OHKO celebi. He can alternate between hydro pump and secret sword and do alot of damage overall to your team. Here the best answer depends on its HP, ice will murder dragonite, but starmie can somewhat wall it, ghost and ice celebi can force it out as well as dragonite, and bug is just dragonite.

    I see a problem overall with revenge killing as your only way is extreme speed dragonite, i suggest choice scarf on terrakion to help with this.
    Also to help counter some of the threats i mentioned, i would switch starmie or skarmory out for life orb mamoswine because he can OHKO +1 dragons via ice shard, landorus and with rocks up, thuderus therian, who looks like he can cause problems. Plus tho starmie spins, dragonite is the only one that really benefits from it, and both seem to do the least for your team
  4. infernape100

    infernape100 Well-Known Member

    right thanks both of you for the comments. Starmie should be Timid, i just typed the wrong one (stupid me). As for heatran he only runs 4EVs in SpDef not 252, though i will change them to HP, on smogon it did say to put them in SpDef though...
    mcdanger, thank you very much for that post it helped a lot so i think i will try Mamoswine over Starmie first and then Skarmory when i next get the chance and post videos of the results (if showdown lets me)
    EDIT: just done some battle using mamoswine, sadly showndown still wasn't letting me share the videos, but i do have some and so have updated the first post. He was not as effective as i had hoped but good nonetheless. I will try him some more but I might try using him instead of Dragonite what do you think?
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2013
  5. Hey, this is a pretty cool team! It definitely has a lot of the basics covered, and you have some pretty nice synergy. However, there are a few problems I think I might be able to help you with.

    LO Alakazam is pretty dangerous. Nothing here outspeeds it, so if it can get a Substitute up, it has a great shot at killing something or doing heavy damage. Celebi is a pretty decent check to it, but it can be 2HKO'd by Shadow Ball after Stealth Rock about 40% of the time.

    Shell Smash Cloyster with Hydro Pump basically 6-0s you completely with Stealth Rock down. Thankfully, it can only really set up easily on Dragonite and Terrakion locked into X-Scissor or Earthquake.

    BU Conkeldurr is pretty dangerous; only Skarmory can escape a 2HKO from it at +1, and it doesn't do much back. Terrakion and Heatran can do a lot of damage to it, but it can heal that back with Drain Punch. Starmie is your best shot, but a +1 Conkeldurr will actually beat Starmie with the combination of Drain Punch + Drain Punch + Mach Punch from full health. Dragonite does a lot of damage to it as well before it can use Ice Punch. All in all, it probably won't 6-0, but it's still a threat.

    SubDisable Gengar is a jerk. Only Heatran and Starmie can hope to break its Sub and keep damaging it after Disable, and they both take heavy damage or are KO'd by Shadow Ball or Focus Blast. Skarmory can Whirlwind it out if Brave Bird is disabled, but it's 2HKOd by Focus Blast.

    DD Gyarados is kinda bad. Skarmory can take a hit pretty well, though, so you might be able to beat it with offensive pressure and Stealth Rock.

    A well-played mixed Hydreigon can blow holes in your team. Everything is 2HKOd by Draco Meteor + one of its other moves besides Celebi, who is still 2HKOd by Fire Blast

    Specs Latios is similarly dangerous when it's spamming Draco Meteor as nothing on your team takes less than 50% damage from it. Heatran takes the least damage but is OHKOd by Surf and has no means of healing off the Draco Meteor damage anyway. Celebi has the best shot against it, but it's usually 2HKOd by Draco Meteor with SR and sometimes without.

    TR Reuniclus looks annoying as well. It OHKOs half the team, 2HKOs Dragonite and Skarmory, and it usually 2HKOs Celebi with Shadow Ball after Stealth Rock. It's not an enormous problem, though, since you might be able to beat it by playing carefully with Dragonite and Celebi.

    CB Terrakion forces you to play a deadly guessing game with its STABs whenever it comes in. Something will probably die if you mispredict against it. The best course of action right now is to switch to Celebi and Skarmory to bait the STAB and then switch to either Dragonite or your own Terrakion depending on what it uses.

    SubSD Terrakion can also be kinda bad. It probably won't sweep since Skarmory can take a hit and phaze it out, but you should still be careful around it.

    As mcdanger mentioned, Landorus-I can be a real problem. Celebi ordinarily would manhandle it, but those running U-turn are a major problem.

    If Heatran loses its Air Balloon, DD Dragonite and DD Salamence become huge problems. At that point, QD Volcarona can also be a hassle, but it does have a hard time getting past CB Dragonite.

    Choice Specs Tornadus in the Rain can be a real pain for your team to switch into. Everything is OHKOd by Hurricane except Heatran (OHKOd by Focus Blast) and Skarmory (2HKOd by Focus Blast). In fact, if Heatran and Skarmory fall to about half health, Tornadus might just sweep through you with Hurricane with SR down.

    Okay, now for a couple of changes to fix this stuff! First, I recommend that you run Chansey over Celebi.

    Chansey @ Eviolite
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature
    -Heal Bell
    -Seismic Toss

    This set should do well in taking over the main job of Celebi as the primary special buffer of the team, as well as the team cleric. Chansey also handles Tornadus, Alakazam, Latios, Hydreigon, Reuniclus, and Landorus-I pretty well, so those threats will be handled much more effectively.

    I also recommend that you replace your current Starmie set with a bulky spinner set.

    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP / 32 Def / 224 Spd
    Timid Nature
    -Rapid Spin

    This set will give you a decent switch-in to CB Terrakion to replace Celebi, since even Stone Edge will fail to OHKO. Many people run Psyshock > Psychic, but I recommend you run Psychic to give your team a much better answer to Conkeldurr. There's enough speed here to outspeed Tornadus as well, which gives you a little extra insurance against that. The extra bulk and survivability will also help you to spin more consistently over the course of the match, which Dragonite really appreciates.

    I also agree with mcdanger that you should run Scarf > Band of Terrakion. This will give you a better answer to things like DD Gyarados, Salamence, and Dragonite, as well as a little extra something for QD Volcarona. You can also beat opposing Terrakion without having to rely on winning a speed tie. In addition, run Rock Slide > Earthquake. Earthquake doesn't cover much, and Rock Slide will give you a more reliable answer to an opposing DD/QD sweeper than Stone Edge, in case they absolutely have to die at the risk of you getting swept if you miss.

    On Skarmory, run an EV spread of 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD instead of your current one. With a Pokemon like Skarmory, it's more beneficial to maximize HP before defenses, and this will optimize your physical bulk (which works great with Chansey). Many people run like 24 speed for Timid Wobbuffet or something, but I've never really seen the use in that.

    There's one more suggestion you could try, although it's not necessary. With Celebi gone, you lose a great answer to random Water attacks. Now, you should be fine between Chansey, Dragonite, and Starmie, but in case you miss that bulky Water resist, you could try a Power Whip / Leech Seed / Protect / Spikes Ferrothorn (standard EV spread and stuff) over Skarmory. This would give you that Water resist, maintain your Spikes user, and also give you something to pretty much completely shut down any DD Gyarados as a bonus. This will also give you a decent check for Cloyster, in case that ever gets to be a problem. Again, it's not completely necessary, but it might be something to keep in mind.

    Well, that's about it. I hope that helps! ^_^
  6. infernape100

    infernape100 Well-Known Member

    Thanks very much Jesusfreak94, your rate has been very helpful!
    I had no idea how much of a threat they could all be but now i do so I will certainly try that both suggestions when i am a little more awake
    As for chansey, i was wondering weather it is necessarily to run both softboiled WISH wish, could the former not be replaced by substitute or protect if i wanted to heal Chansey? I am not an expert though, i was just wondering.
    On Starmie i was wondering how important the Psychic actually is because it menas that i'm without a proper Ice type attack if i don't use Mamoswine as suggested by mcdanger.
    I am rather tentative about getting rid of Skarmory as Whirlwind has been useful, but once i might try out Ferro once i've sorted out the rest of the team.
    Thank you very much for the rat, are there any other things to be pointed out??
    EDIT: while chansey has been good for my team the new starmie set hasn't really helped me out as a lot of the things i would have taken out with starmie through Ice Beam or T-bolt i can't anymore and with my poor prediction skills and knowledge of the metagame he is still dying fairly quickly. I am missing the water attack taker so will try ferrothorn when i next get the chance to go on showdown
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2013

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