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Homosexuality & Politics in the 21st Century

miles0624

Wrath of Fire
Is Portman coming out in favor of gay marriage now any different than Obama coming out in favor during the election?

I would have more respect for him if he changed before his son turned gay, or if he kept to his principles. I never like the "this is the way I feel until it happens to me thing." Its good that he changed. I just don't like the way he did it.
 

Sadib

Time Lord Victorious
Is Portman coming out in favor of gay marriage now any different than Obama coming out in favor during the election?

Obama came out in support of gay people. Portman came out in support of only his son.
 

BigLutz

Banned
Obama came out in support of gay people. Portman came out in support of only his son.

Did Obama come out really for gay people? It is known they were planning to roll it out for the greatest possible political effect. He also choose the least controversial choice and that would lead to gay marriage bans in many if not most states. On the other hand we have been wondering if this may kill Portman's career.
 

Sadib

Time Lord Victorious
Did Obama come out really for gay people? It is known they were planning to roll it out for the greatest possible political effect. He also choose the least controversial choice and that would lead to gay marriage bans in many if not most states. On the other hand we have been wondering if this may kill Portman's career.

Who are they? Are you referring to the democrats? Do you think Obama speaks for all democrats and this was all some sort of political ploy by the democrat hive mind? That's really cynical of you.
 

BigLutz

Banned
Who are they? Are you referring to the democrats? Do you think Obama speaks for all democrats and this was all some sort of political ploy by the democrat hive mind? That's really cynical of you.

They being Obama and his senior campaign staff ( Not all Democrats were involved in the planning of the Obama Campaign ), when Biden came out in support of Same Sex Marriage earlier last year, it was revealed that the Campaign had orchestrated the perfect time for Obama to provide his endorsement for maximized political effect later in the campaign season, and that because Biden had gone on ahead with out approval, the campaign had to kill that idea and do a hasty announcement from Obama. Seriously stop over reading my posts.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/10/us-usa-campaign-obama-evolution-idUSBRE84900B20120510
 
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Sadib

Time Lord Victorious
They being Obama and his senior campaign staff ( Not all Democrats were involved in the planning of the Obama Campaign ), when Biden came out in support of Same Sex Marriage earlier last year, it was revealed that the Campaign had orchestrated the perfect time for Obama to provide his endorsement for maximized political effect later in the campaign season, and that because Biden had gone on ahead with out approval, the campaign had to kill that idea and do a hasty announcement from Obama. Seriously stop over reading my posts.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/10/us-usa-campaign-obama-evolution-idUSBRE84900B20120510

Again. Why are you so cynical? Why does Obama's support for marriage equality have to some sort of calculated plan to manipulate people into voting for him? Does Portman also have a hidden agenda for supporting marriage equality?
 

BigLutz

Banned
Again. Why are you so cynical? Why does Obama's support for marriage equality have to some sort of calculated plan to manipulate people into voting for him? Does Portman also have a hidden agenda for supporting marriage equality?

Because one was carefully designed to be rolled out right in the middle of Campaign Season, and the other was not? If Obama really had decided to support Gay Marriage, he could have done it years ago, he could have done it when he was facing Hillary and the polls were not on his side with the issue during his first Presidential Run. Instead he did a tap and dance on the "evolving" front, designed to end perfectly at the height of his re-election campaign.
 

Sadib

Time Lord Victorious
Because one was carefully designed to be rolled out right in the middle of Campaign Season, and the other was not? If Obama really had decided to support Gay Marriage, he could have done it years ago, he could have done it when he was facing Hillary and the polls were not on his side with the issue during his first Presidential Run. Instead he did a tap and dance on the "evolving" front, designed to end perfectly at the height of his re-election campaign.
"If Portman really supports gay marriage. Why didn't he support it before? Hmmmmmmmmm?" You're not making a lot of sense here by penalizing someone for supporting gay marriage just because they didn't support it when you wanted them to.
 

BigLutz

Banned
"If Portman really supports gay marriage. Why didn't he support it before? Hmmmmmmmmm?" You're not making a lot of sense here by penalizing someone for supporting gay marriage just because they didn't support it when you wanted them to.

I am penalizing some one when they are engaging in a blatantly political posturing on Gay Marriage. Lets look at the timeline, Obama when campaigning in a VERY Liberal district in 1996 said that he, and I quote: “I favor legalizing same-sex marriages,and would fight efforts to prohibit such marriages,” He then comes on to the national scene in 2004 and suddenly does not support Gay Marriage. And then after he gets into office he is "evolving" AGAIN meant to perfectly coordinate with the Democratic National Convention.

Now I can take some one being against it, having a change of heart.

What I can't take is someone being for it, then against it, then for it again but decides to coincide being for it when the polls have shifted and he needs the Gay Community to help him win.

The fact that they were going to make his announcement at a political event IN THE HEART OF THE CAMPAIGN SEASON is enough to penalize him for what was a nakedly political move.
 
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Sadib

Time Lord Victorious
I am penalizing some one when they are engaging in a blatantly political posturing on Gay Marriage. Lets look at the timeline, Obama when campaigning in a VERY Liberal district in 1996 said that he, and I quote: “I favor legalizing same-sex marriages,and would fight efforts to prohibit such marriages,” He then comes on to the national scene in 2004 and suddenly does not support Gay Marriage. And then after he gets into office he is "evolving" AGAIN meant to perfectly coordinate with the Democratic National Convention.

Now I can take some one being against it, having a change of heart.

What I can't take is someone being for it, then against it, then for it again but decides to coincide being for it when the polls have shifted and he needs the Gay Community to help him win.

The fact that they were going to make his announcement at a political event IN THE HEART OF THE CAMPAIGN SEASON is enough to penalize him for what was a nakedly political move.
I could say that Obama might have actually changed his mind about his opinion on homosexuality several times, but then I would sound like a certain other member who claims there are people whose sexualities can flip flop, and that would just be disingenuous. What the hell Obama?
 

Eterna

Well-Known Member
I could say that Obama might have actually changed his mind about his opinion on homosexuality several times, but then I would sound like a certain other member who claims there are people whose sexualities can flip flop, and that would just be disingenuous. What the hell Obama?

Obama, like all politicians, has two different opinions on the same issue.

He probably has his own opinion on Gay marriages and the LGBT public in general, and then he has his public opinion which he uses depending on the situation he is in. It was deemed that supporting the LGBT community in the past election was a worthwhile thing to do, therefore he now supports gay marriage. If supporting gay marriage would have come with too much backlash he wouldn't have supported it. This is hardly a new thing in Politics.

It actually doesn't matter what he really thinks anyway, if he says he supports gay marriage then he is obligated to at least makes some improvements on the issue lest he and his party face backlash on the issue.

Personally though, I do believe he supports it. He doesn't really seem like the type who wouldn't.
 

BigLutz

Banned
Obama, like all politicians, has two different opinions on the same issue.

He probably has his own opinion on Gay marriages and the LGBT public in general, and then he has his public opinion which he uses depending on the situation he is in. It was deemed that supporting the LGBT community in the past election was a worthwhile thing to do, therefore he now supports gay marriage. If supporting gay marriage would have come with too much backlash he wouldn't have supported it. This is hardly a new thing in Politics.

It actually doesn't matter what he really thinks anyway, if he says he supports gay marriage then he is obligated to at least makes some improvements on the issue lest he and his party face backlash on the issue.

Personally though, I do believe he supports it. He doesn't really seem like the type who wouldn't.

Which is why I honestly believe Portman showed more political courage than Obama, as well as Cheney, both of them could have faced a backlash from their base. Obama waited till he felt at least somewhat secure before trotting out his view.
 

WizardTrubbish

much more beastly
Which is why I honestly believe Portman showed more political courage than Obama, as well as Cheney, both of them could have faced a backlash from their base. Obama waited till he felt at least somewhat secure before trotting out his view.

This is true, Portman and Cheney had nothing to gain on coming out in favor, while Obama only had to gain in coming out.
 

WizardTrubbish

much more beastly
There was a black pastor who told everyone to not support Obama for being pro-gay marriage.

Chances are, if you're not going to vote for Obama because he supported gay marriage, you weren't going to vote Democrat in the first place.
 

Succubus

Member
I love the gays! I myself find girls and boys becoming aroused by me....

In terms of politics, I am FOR gay marriage. People his is an issue analogous to the civil rights movement, and the women's suffrage movement. What we need is for the old, republican, closeted white men in DC to die off so the seats can be filled with people from our generation (people who right now would be in their 20's). Change WILL come, it is only a matter of time. Society has evolved so much just within the last 20 years--- I guarantee you that almost everyone, no matter how conservative, personally knows a gay person. Something that could not be said even 10 years ago. It also helps to have homosexuality be prevalent in pop culture and media (Glee & Anderson Cooper)
 

Byzantine

Well-Known Member
Well, with the Supreme Court set to hear arguments about the DOMA in a couple days any last points to be made first?
 

miles0624

Wrath of Fire
As I said before, the pastor was for Obama before. Some African Americans are also extreme homophobes.

This was actually true. The majority of African American voters are against gay marriage as all the polls suggested. However, it probably didn't hurt him because they were just looking at Mitt V.s. Obama. Instead of their actual values and future.
 

WizardTrubbish

much more beastly
Well, with the Supreme Court set to hear arguments about the DOMA in a couple days any last points to be made first?
I just want to say that I have really high hopes for this. I'm keeping my fingers crossed and I have faith that the court will finally overturn Prop 8 and DOMA. Looking at some of the Justices voting record, I think we may just have enough support on the Court to pass this.

The majority of African American voters are against gay marriage as all the polls suggested.

Polling disagrees with you
 
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