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How do you expect the writers to go about writing the 8th gen?

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
The female leads need more battles that are not interrupted or incomplete, without any DEM or cheap wins, and also don't involve Team Rocket in them.

Ash also needs less battles except for gym battles, trials, or whatever, and the league. He doesn't need any more than that imo.

The females' battles always feel oddly plot armoured since XY, like the writers have started to take exception to them losing or getting their cute Pokemon roughed up too much, thus them often being curb stomps or cut off in some way before they start losing the upper hand. It's difficult to really boost the girls' experience as battlers when they're never really put in pressured enough situations.

With that said, it's not like most of the females are battle focused since XY anyway, besides the bigger climaxes, making them do half assed battles on a regular basis feels forced in.
 

Remix2

Well-Known Member
It would be cool if the anime was like the mangas, no Ash, Pikachu & TRio, only the regional male & female game protagonists. But I guess, they wanted to keep the formers because they're more recognizable for the kids.

I won't lie to you, but I started to struggle watching the recent SM episodes, not saying the past series are better or anything. I think the slaptick comedy & slice of life start to wear off, not to mention the lack of battles.

Same here, I felt that way after they botch the af arc and went into a black hole of emptiness afterward.
 
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DatsRight

Well-Known Member
For what it's worth, SM seems to be upping the number of battles recently, what with the Ula Ula arc, and the upcoming two episodes. Even before then the Marowak limelight episode and the infamous Dewpider episode had some battle focus.
 

Yuugis Black Magician

Namaikina Imouto
Sun & Moon is about being caught up in the flow of life in the Pokemon world. We see this really pronounced in Episodes #21 and #79. It's about slowing down and enjoying nature. Whether the next series has a different agenda or not, this element is something not previously tackled in a consistent manner in previous series, so there's still room to expand that theme for a few more years.
 

LilligantLewis

Bonnie stan
what's the point?

I like them more than episodes with no battles at all.

I'm not a battle junkie

well I am lol. To each their own :)

boring training episodes back in DP.

What exactly do you mean by this? Was it something about DP's training episodes specifically that were boring to you, or are you implying that training episodes have ceased since DP. Because if it's the latter, I heartily disagree.

Just off the top of my head, without even doing any deep digging to find ones I've forgotten, these are all great examples of training episodes since DP:
BW16, BW32, XY17, XY38, XY85, XY&Z23, and even SM15, the last of which I loved so much that I made it my official "location" on my Serebii profile here. So training episodes have far from ceased since DP. And i still love them. I don't dislike all of SM, just a lot more of its episodes than I did in previous generations.

Ash also needs less battles except for gym battles, trials, or whatever, and the league. He doesn't need any more than that imo.

my goodness how depressing :(
 

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
Well the training episodes vary. I do admit I enjoy focus on training and earning boosts over just DEM-ing it all the time. I think the issue is that the way they train for a move isn't always as entertainingly set up. SM015 was a good exception because it revolved around a unique technique by Ash and also had a lot of cute bonding throughout, it was another cool example of 'Ash taking any random junk and making it fun by sheer character', which is something they should try more. It shown an eccentric funny technique that few but Ash would think of and I think that strengthens his competence as a trainer.

A few episodes are kinda generically set up however, just the Pokemon repeating and spamming moves until they get it right. Litten's Flame Charge episode pretty much just recycled the 'butt shake' montage from SM015, if to almost parody levels of over the topness to make it a funny rehash. Some of the 'senpai' episodes in SM are rather cute in handling though, eg. the bubble training with Popplio to control Hydro Vortex.

I suppose Litten's Fire Fang training was an okay compromise, in that we saw him trying to master it through the course of two episodes, both through interactions with either Stoutland or his new trainer, but he mastered it during the crisis that made the main bulk of the last episode (emphasis on 'mastering' it, it wasn't a DEM).
 

Leonhart

Imagineer
MORE BATTLES!

I normally don't watch the anime for the battling aspect, but I do want to see more high-stakes battles in the next saga, especially tournaments.
 

p96822

Evolve me please
How they use the Pokemon in Sun and Moon seem kind of lazy. I know that Pokemon Sun and Moon are being comitic with this season, but they need to make more episode about the Pokemon and them growing.
 

AshxSatoshi

Ice Aurelia
Honestly I don’t mind Sun and Moon’s lack of battle when it’s not taken to extremes. Like for me Ash not battling every episode doesn’t phase me. Despite me dissing the AF foundation I did like how Lillie’s fear was a result of Post Trumatic Stress Disorder because it proves you can make good Pokémon related plots without battling. However it’s ridiculous that we are in 70 episodes in and Mallow Lana Soph and Lillie have yet to have 4 or more battles.
 

Pokegirl Fan~

Liko>>>>>Ash
Honestly I don’t mind Sun and Moon’s lack of battle when it’s not taken to extremes. Like for me Ash not battling every episode doesn’t phase me. Despite me dissing the AF foundation I did like how Lillie’s fear was a result of Post Trumatic Stress Disorder because it proves you can make good Pokémon related plots without battling. However it’s ridiculous that we are in 70 episodes in and Mallow Lana Soph and Lillie have yet to have 4 or more battles.
I agree, the companions need more battles and I don't really think we need to see Ash battling as much anymore. It gets boring after a while when he's hogging most of the battles and still loses where it matters the most.
 

p96822

Evolve me please
My biggest issuse with Pokemon Sun and Moon is that they really don't make Pokemon have episodes toward themself. And before you say that Ash's Lycanroc had personally focus episode well it more of it's more said about Rockruff as a species of its kind then his own character. There no really focus on the Pokemon being characters this time around. Like Lycanroc and Torracat's relationship is more of a background thing then a being in the for foreground. If they had an episode of Lycanroc and Torracat interacting it own episode. Exploring how their relationship grows
 

satopi

Life doesn’t end, …it changes.
I still feel like even if the characters aren't born bred battlers, they should battle when they have to. It shouldn't be that they get zero/barely any battles all because they aren't the battling type. That's a lame reason with barely any substance/evidence to back it up other than the lack of battles they've been put in or they don't have a battle centric goal. You don't have to be into it to do it. Battling has always been an essential part of life in the Pokemon universe. It's one of the reasons why these characters who aren't battlers are lacking development and spotlight. It feels like it's being treated as a disability in a sense... and none of them have even hesitate or expressed a disdain for battling. They just let Ash/Kiawe/Lana handle it.
What exactly do you mean by this? Was it something about DP's training episodes specifically that were boring to you, or are you implying that training episodes have ceased since DP. Because if it's the latter, I heartily disagree.
I mean it as I said it, I thought the training episodes, specifically when a Pokemon took the whole episode trying to master a move like Staraptor perfecting Brave Bird or a Pokemon struggling with their new evolved form, were boring. At the time, I didn't want to see Ash thinking up an idea on how to fix the move Brave Bird, said Pokemon building up to it, seeing them take on that plan, figuring out the exact problem, and doing almost the same thing over and over again ala trial and error until it got better, which it did. Actually, I hated seeing the training but absolutely loved the result of it like it was worth the time and effort of showing us how they resolved the issue instead of clearing it off screen.

(Though it's been a while since I seen DP so this is mostly memories clogging my judgement.) I think DP spent a good amount of it's time focusing on on screen training. Training episodes are important to show but my issue (I'm solely talking about DP) was that it wasn't entertaining to watch. I wasn't too invested in seeing Ash train his Pokemon into fixing their issue unless it quenched my interest like Chinchar/Monferno's struggle with Blaze. I think the training episodes post DP have improved greatly since I never had an issue with it in terms of enjoyment factors, afterwards. Telling and not showing it's progress all of a sudden is much worse than having an entire episode dedicated to only training even if it isn't the most intriguing to watch. Sorry if I wasn't clear.
 

lolipiece

Pictured: what browsing Serebii does to a person
Staff member
Moderator
My biggest issuse with Pokemon Sun and Moon is that they really don't make Pokemon have episodes toward themself. And before you say that Ash's Lycanroc had personally focus episode well it more of it's more said about Rockruff as a species of its kind then his own character. There no really focus on the Pokemon being characters this time around. Like Lycanroc and Torracat's relationship is more of a background thing then a being in the for foreground. If they had an episode of Lycanroc and Torracat interacting it own episode. Exploring how their relationship grows

Lycanroc is the entire reason Torracat even evolved.

If it didn't do the butt wiggling, they never would have came up with the idea to teach it Flame Charge.
 

p96822

Evolve me please
Lycanroc is the entire reason Torracat even evolved.

If it didn't do the butt wiggling, they never would have came up with the idea to teach it Flame Charge.

I'm not taking about that. I'm talking about having an episode focusing on Lycanroc and Torracat's relationship
 

DatsRight

Well-Known Member
While I think the downplayed use of Pokeballs means there's still a lot of interaction this series, I admit we don't see a lot of episodes the Pokemon themselves are the main focus, though there are odd exceptions like Litten's intro episodes and Poipole's debut. We also don't have nearly as many dynamics between teams, in earlier series we at least got stuff like Clemont's Chespin and Serena's Pancham, or Pikachu with nearly all of the female trainer's 'baby' Pokemon, but this series they only seldom branch out of their own teams. Pikachu with Togedemaru and to a much lesser degree Rowlet with Steenee are about the only exceptions, and even those aren't used as much.

I do like the more developed 'sibling' dynamic that occurs within those teams, but I do admit their could be more. I will give credit however that SM has yet to demote any Pokemon after they evolved. It's easy to think big Pokemon like Lycanroc and Turtonator would have been reduced to drones who only appear to battle in any series beforehand, but they take part in the fun as much as everyone else.

It doesn't help the Pikachu shorts have been cancelled.
 

LilligantLewis

Bonnie stan
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