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How does the Pokemon XY series compare to other anime in-general?

Discussion in 'Pokémon Animé Discussion' started by shoz999, Dec 31, 2018.

  1. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    What do you mean by one-sided? Because I consider Paul's rivalry to be one-sided so I think you may have a different opinion.
     
    LilligantLewis likes this.
  2. Jeal

    Jeal Well-Known Member

    When one of the two is completely destroyed by the other. Paul never defeated Ash's entire team without losing a pokémon.
     
  3. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    Are you saying Sawyer is one-sided or Paul is one-sided? Or both?
     
  4. mehmeh1

    mehmeh1 Well-Known Member

    when you think about it, sawyer is really a prodigy, in the time it took ash to get 2 gym badges he went from rookie to being able to match an ash that went through 6 regions+2 archipelagos+BF (I've seen him being called a late-bloomer, but it was still his first journey, while it was ash's 8th)
     
  5. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    I also liked how his learning strategies evolved over time. He learned a lot from Ash who was like a mentor and a rival to him.
     
    Twilight-Kun likes this.
  6. Jeal

    Jeal Well-Known Member

    I'm saying that the rivalry of Ash and Sawyer is one-sided.
     
  7. mehmeh1

    mehmeh1 Well-Known Member

    yeah, my one problem with the rivalry is that ash didn't really learn much from him (in the usual "mentor also learns from student" way), but the other way was still really well handled
     
    shoz999 likes this.
  8. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    But how does that say Sawyer is one-sided? If anything you kind of proved that Paul is overall a plot-device, a vehicle to serve as an antithesis to Ash and not his own character.
     
  9. Jeal

    Jeal Well-Known Member

    One-sided because Sawyer never came close to defeating Ash before the league. His pokémon(aside of his starter) always were defeated easily.

    What's the problem in Paul being a antithesis? That's what makes their rivalry so great. Do you think the same about Silver?
     
  10. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    Did Sawyer always lost to Ash? I thought there was one time he won. Well, I can see where that's coming from.

    As for Paul. The thing is that's just it. That's pretty much his only selling point, he's an antithesis who mocks Ash's beliefs and that's really it until the last-minute change. Silver is different, way different from Paul. Anyone can tell you that and that him being simply an "antithesis" is heavily understating the fact of how much of a complicated character he is. Whereas Paul's only real character background stems from his brother losing to Brandon, which again I don't really understand how one loss is a plausible reason for him to change to a Pokemon breeder so late after so many achievements and wins considering that Ash and Dawn, much younger than him, are both determined and their losses made them even stronger early on.
     
  11. AuraChannelerChris

    AuraChannelerChris Final Destination me, you *****.

    Mostly because Ash had a brain fart thinking he was the one with Greninja.

    I looooooooove how everyone took that win SO seriously and tried to make Sawyer into this horribly strong trainer because of that.
     
  12. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    He's horribly strong if you understand the basics of competitive lol.
     
  13. Jeal

    Jeal Well-Known Member

    One time, because Ash was distracted.

    I'm talking about game Silver. Game Silver and Paul are not so different.
     
    Spider-Phoenix likes this.
  14. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    Game Silver and Paul are VERY different.
     
  15. Jeal

    Jeal Well-Known Member

    Why? They have the same way of thinking.
     
  16. AuraChannelerChris

    AuraChannelerChris Final Destination me, you *****.

    I understand how OP Mega Charizard X is.

    Who cares about strategy when blind brute force is all you need.
     
  17. ash&charizardfan

    ash&charizardfan Humanity's greatest soldier

    Game silver has far more interesting backstory than paul especially his connection with giovanni, adventures handled it well, the only main similarity between both of them is that both of them think strength is more important than bonding.
     
  18. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    Just making an assumption here but it sounds like you don't seem to understand Silver's overaching journey and why he's one of the most interesting characters of the entire Pokemon mythos. Silver is a boy who grew up when his father left him alone. Unlike the protagonists where people theorize the fathers are too busy or have left their families, we actually know this happened to Silver. Silver's father is Giovanni, the leader of Team Rocket. According to the Adventures manga at least, we know Giovanni loves his son but what the manga and the games have in common is that Giovanni puts his ambitions almost always first and family second. Giovanni disbands the organization because he feels that he failed to put his men to good use and leaves Silver. This of course leaves Silver as hateful and vengeful to Team Rocket and by extension he hates his father. Several years later, he feels that he can do everything by himself and sees Pokemon as tools but for a different reason, Team Rocket.

    Paul is different. He's the younger brother of a talented Pokemon Trainer who won badges and is later competing against the Battle Frontier. He's a big-shot and he won all six Frontier Symbols except one. Brandon defeats him and this causes him to make a different career choice which I don't really think makes a lot of sense. This in turn causes Paul to want to be stronger, not because of some villainous organization but because he witnesses what looked liked weakness from his own brother. It's similar to how Giovanni lost to Red I know but the thing is. They are so different in terms of execution. Paul's brother's loss to Brandon caused his brother to look for a new career choice which is honestly again, I don't understand. Giovanni is the self-proclaimed strongest trainer. His goal is to become the strongest Pokemon trainer, the Pokemon Master until he loses at the hands of a ten year old. This is a huge blow to Giovanni's ego and he decides to disband Team Rocket but not permanently as it is a step to Giovanni's return to Team Rocket. Giovanni still aims to become the boss of a criminal organization, he's not actually letting one boy stopping him. What we saw was just a setback whereas they never made it clear if Paul's brother would ever return to becoming a Pokemon trainer. However it's due to this sensisble setback that Giovanni decides to train and plan for the future again and this in turn leads to abandoning his son, Silver which he has more of a reason to be angry than Paul. Silver was literally abandoned by his father, Paul wasn't by his brother. That's the key difference which leads up to Silver's hatred for his father and Team Rocket whereas Paul has no real hate in his brother, just disappointment.

    Also besides the fact that Silver has ties to Team Rocket as the son of Giovanni making him an extremely important character to the Pokemon mythos and Paul doesn't really participate in the Team Galactic conflict, there's also how Silver's "redemption" is executed. It's given more substance and detail as early as the Radio Tower scene where Team Rocket makes one last move. Silver loses to you, the player, again and starts to wonder if everything he was doing to his Pokemon was wrong and it's later fully executed before the Pokemon League happens. Paul doesn't really start to be more like a friend to his Pokemon until he loses during the Pokemon League and even then it feels incomplete, unsatisfactory. We see at the Pokemon League that Paul has finally changed and it ends there with Paul leaving. We don't see any more character development from there on out in how he treats his Pokemon further. We just see him leave and that's it. This is part of the reason why Paul feels like an antithesis because his "change" ends so shortly. Whereas Silver is much different. We actually see him progress more of a character during the post-game, especially in the remakes which makes his character development feel more satisfactory but even established thanks to his Crowbat.

    So to sum it up. Silver and Paul are VERY different characters in both not only in the huge differences but even in the similarities they are executed very differently.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2019
  19. Jeal

    Jeal Well-Known Member

    So, he decides to treat pokémon like garbage because his daddy issues? Great.
     
  20. shoz999

    shoz999 Do you play competitive bro?

    Child abandonment is a real issue dude.
     
    FlygontheRavager likes this.

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